Vitamin B1 Dosage

Kray

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Yes, I remember reading that, too (which is why I think he suggests boiling the yeast and only drinking the water from it?). I suppose since this supplement is only liquid too, maybe estrogen is not an issue. Anyway, thanks so much for the practical advice for an alternative. Just curious- did you look at the forms of the B vitamins on the link I gave? I just wonder if they're acceptable, other than the bacteria or estrogen issue.

Again, thanks for the feedback. :)
 

Ulla

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I think Peat said in the past the Brewer's yeast was estrogenic, but was high in B vitamins. I don't remember him recommending either way (for or against). You can pose yours and mine questions to the manufacturer, but in the meantime if you search Amazon (or even Google) for things like "Liquid vitamin B complex" you'll find many other alternatives that do not have bacteria and/or yeast as ingredients.

Is that really problematic?
I started drinking it 1,5 month ago every morning (1 tsp) for B vitamin requirements. And now I read that thing about being estrogenic :oops:
And I just bought another pack, lol
 

haidut

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@haidut
Do you still take Vitamin B1 in such high doses?

No, I don't as I have no need for it. Nowadays I take B1 occasionally if I feel exhausted after a hard day at work.
 

Broken man

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Taking just B1 without the B complex and niacinamide just gives me an energy rush but it does not affect motivation. So, I've had days where I felt like I could walk/run with an unnatural ease but if I didn't feel desire to do it I wouldn't. The B complex contains B6, which in some people acts like prolactin antagonist and dopamine agonist (there are studies showing both effects in humans). So, taking the B complex on top of B1 gives me that desire/motivation to do things and B1 the necessary energy to do it. Without the B complex I just super relaxed and do things with ease...if I get around to anything at all. Taking also the B complex makes me want to do things as well. Thus, it's pretty helpful for long study sessions and boring weeks at work.

Hello, do I need to supplement with B-complex? I saw your thread about B12 and B5 being pro cancer. So could I take only B1,B2, B3, B6, biotin or its better take all of them because of deficiencies?
 

haidut

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Hello, do I need to supplement with B-complex? I saw your thread about B12 and B5 being pro cancer. So could I take only B1,B2, B3, B6, biotin or its better take all of them because of deficiencies?

I think it is best to get vitamins from food and most people do get enough folic acid, panthothenic acid and B12 that way. Energin as a supplement is usually most helpful for people trying to control lipolysis or need a boost for exercise or mental activity like exams, etc.
 

freyasam

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I found this thread and thought I'd add some info.

Couple of things. First, no need to take the "fat soluble" alternatives like benfothiamine and sulbuthiamine. They are both synthetic and both are mostly sourced from China and there have been several cases of poisoning. In addition, there are no studies that show these types of B1 are superior to the normal thiamine hydrochloride. The vendors would have you believe otherwise, but the only true fat soluble vitamin B1 is called allithiamine and only allithiamine has been shown to be absorbed without limit in every organ. Benfo and Sulbu absorb preferentially in the liver and there is data that the body treats them like poison and tries to excrete them. If you want allithiamine you can get it from VitaminShoppe:
http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/p/cardiova ... es/cv-1075

Now, back to the regular thiamine. It's used intravenously to help alcoholics avoid getting the Wiernicke-Korsakoff syndrome but for a long time there were concerns that oral thiamine hydrochloride is not absorbed beyond a few milligrams. To answer those concerns, there was a study done in 2012 to test the absorption and it turned out it is absorbed just fine in doses up to 1500mg at once:
Pharmacokinetics of high-dose oral thiamine hydrochloride in healthy subjects

If you read the study you will see that the half life is approximately 10 hours and peaks occur at 4 hours. So taking 1500mg every 4 hours seems to be able to maintain high plasma concentrations, which is what is needed for lowering lactate and converting carbs into ATP. Ionically, this dosage adds up to about 6000mg-8000mg a day and that is what has been used to treat Alzheimer's and other forms of dementia:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8251 ... 00m,isrctn

As you can see there was a positive effect on AD at doses 6g-8g a day.
As far as I am concerned, 1500mg three times a day for a total of 4500mg gives me an uninterrupted flow of energy. However, I also add a B-complex with 5mg of B6, 10mg of Riboflavin, and 1000mcg of B-12. Also, I throw in a 500mg of Niacinamide. So the whole combo is what gives me the all-day energy surge, taking just B1 at the dose I mentioned gives me about 70% of the effect.
If you need more info on B1 just ask. I have been experimenting with it a lot.

Haidut, do you know if mononitrate B1 is just as good as B1 Hcl?
 

Arnold Grape

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Haidut, do you know if mononitrate B1 is just as good as B1 Hcl?
Same: I would like to know what people prefer. When you hear anecdotes about people using mononitrate, it's often in the context of taking like once a week or as you would a fat soluble. I think that I have better experiences with Hcl.
 

ddjd

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Same: I would like to know what people prefer. When you hear anecdotes about people using mononitrate, it's often in the context of taking like once a week or as you would a fat soluble. I think that I have better experiences with Hcl.
Still no answer?
 

Amazoniac

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- Kinetics of thiamin and thiamin phosphate esters in human blood, plasma and urine after 50 mg intravenously or orally

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- Vitamins (3-11-010244-7) | Wilhelm Friedrich

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- The Vitamins: Fundamental Aspects in Nutrition and Health - Gerald F. Combs and James P. McClung

"Thiamin is very sensitive to sulfites, which cleave its two ring systems;[8] this reaction can result in the loss of thiamin from sulfite-treated foods, even at low storage temperatures."

[8] "To yield (6-amino-2-methylprimid-5-yl)methanesulfonic acid and 5-β-hydroxyethyl-4-methylthiazole."​

"It is clear that rumen microbiome is an important source of thiamin for ruminants. However, because rumen microbes can reduce sulfate to sulfite, high dietary levels of sulfate can have antithiamin antagonistic effects for ruminants."

"Thiamin is also sensitive to oxidation by ROS generated by UV light and ionizing radiation []."

"o- and p-Hydroxypolyphenols (e.g., caffeic acid, chlorogenic acid, tannic acid)[10] in ferns, tea, and betel nut react with thiamin to oxidize the thiazole ring yielding the nonabsorbable form thiamin disulfide[.]"

[10] "These and related compounds are found in blueberries, red currents, red beets, Brussels sprouts, red cabbage, betel nuts, coffee, and tea."​

"Some plant flavonoids (e.g., quercetin, rutin) have been reported to antagonize thiamin[.]"

"Hemin[11] in animal tissues is thought to bind the vitamin."

[11] "Ferriprotoporphyrin, the nonprotein, Fe3+-containing portion of hemoglobin."​
 

Jessie

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When I experimented with B1 the hcl stuff worked great for me. I agree that high dosage is necessary if you want a profound suppression of lactate, roughly 500-600mgs 3x daily. Pairs great with a serotonin antagonist. Main thing is making sure you get a high quality pure product. LifeGivingStore and PureBulk offer pure thiamine. Idealabs and Health Natura have really good B-complex products.
 

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