Vitamin A Stimulates Testosterone Production

haidut

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I know some people here are trying to raise testosterone and have even asked Peat about it. Peat responded long the lines of "increase vitamin A and thyroid". It looks like he is right (again) about the vitamin A part. This study shows that both retinol and retinoic acid stimulated testosterone production but surprisingly retinol was more effective, whatever that may mean. I will try to get the full study tomorrow and get some numbers on dosage that can reach the in-virto concentrations used in this study.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2916988

"...Adult rat Leydig cells, purified by Percoll density gradient centrifugation, were used to determine the effect of retinol and retinoic acid on steroidogenesis. It was found that both retinoic acid and retinol stimulated testosterone production. Although retinol was less potent than retinoic acid, retinol had the greater efficacy. When these retinoids were tested in the presence of a maximal dose of LH, it was found that retinol inhibited LH-stimulated testosterone synthesis whereas retinoic acid had no similar effect. These results demonstrate for the first time that retinol and retinoic acid have a direct effect on Leydig cell steroidogenesis in culture suggesting that retinoids play a role in the maintenance and regulation of Leydig cell function."
 
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Hey haidut, is it a bad idea to supplement retinol if calluses have a very slight orange tint? The only place I really notice it is on my palms. Is some orange tint nomral or could I be storing excess carotene?
 
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haidut

haidut

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InterrogaOmnia said:
Hey haidut, is it a bad idea to supplement retinol if calluses have a very slight orange tint? The only place I really notice it is on my palms. Is some orange tint nomral or could I be storing excess carotene?

I'd wait a week to see if the orange disappears and only add retinol if the orange color dissipates. It could very well be a sign of accumulated carotene as Peat says.
 

Koveras

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haidut said:
post 76369 "...it was found that retinol inhibited LH-stimulated testosterone synthesis."

Confused about this part...

Inhibits LH-stimulated testosterone synthesis but also stimulates testosterone synthesis (in the absence of LH??).

Don't have access to the full study right now.
 
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haidut

haidut

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delicinq said:
post 118403
haidut said:
post 76369 "...it was found that retinol inhibited LH-stimulated testosterone synthesis."

Confused about this part...

Inhibits LH-stimulated testosterone synthesis but also stimulates testosterone synthesis (in the absence of LH??).

Don't have access to the full study right now.

This was only when they tried it in combination of a maximum dose LH, which is not a physiological condition. High LH would mean high estrogen as well and it is known that retinol inhibits LH. And yes, some substances can increase testosterone synthesis without affecting LH/FSH. Vitamin K2 (MK-4) and taurine are two such substances.
 
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Dean

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I think I've been experiencing this effect. I've been taking 30-50k iu's for a while and am definitely feeling more assertive. Unfortunately, I haven't found anything to improve my mood any--so the assertiveness isn't very constructive right now. I'm going to try large doses of pregnenolone. Progesterone doesn't seem to be helping, if anything its the opposite. Maybe I never had low t and it was just a matter of high estrogen blocking/masking the testosterone. Lowering estrogen with progesterone has only unleashed the t? Maybe pregnenolone would provide a more "rounded" effect?

Anyway, as an aside, I think vitamin a has also boosted my thyroid significantly. No cold hands and feet this time of year for the first time in my nearly 50 years. I think the tyromax I just started taking may be overkill even.
 

Dean

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ecstatichamster said:
post 118444 does sugar improve your mood Dean?

Well, more sugar/calories helps take the edge off, but I can't say it improves my mood really. I have taken copious quantities of sucrose before ( in my early days of Peating) and with enough can evoke a state of giddiness-- which isn't all that constructive either.
 
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I'd wait a week to see if the orange disappears and only add retinol if the orange color dissipates. It could very well be a sign of accumulated carotene as Peat says.

Calluses have still remained a very slight orange color. I don't have much acne, but my hair and skin are very oily. My dandruff is baaaaad. Supplemental retinol still not a good idea?
 

EIRE24

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Calluses have still remained a very slight orange color. I don't have much acne, but my hair and skin are very oily. My dandruff is baaaaad. Supplemental retinol still not a good idea?

I always thought that vitamin A was suppose to stop oily skin and help with dandruff. How much were you supplementing? Have you tried eating liver?
 
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I haven't been supplementing because I've been unsure if I needed it. But I've taken 25000 iu the past few days and I'm thinking it's doing some good things.
 
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Well I started taking it with 5000iu vitamin d3 and a few hundred iu's of vitamin e. Also taking k2, but I've been taking it for a while. So maybe I can't pin it all to vitamin a. I've been missing work for several days because of fatigue and depression. After taking the combination, I've noticed my mood and energy have improved for the most part. Appetite has increased and i feel warm consistently. I think my forehead is feeling a bit less oily.
 

EIRE24

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Well I started taking it with 5000iu vitamin d3 and a few hundred iu's of vitamin e. Also taking k2, but I've been taking it for a while. So maybe I can't pin it all to vitamin a. I've been missing work for several days because of fatigue and depression. After taking the combination, I've noticed my mood and energy have improved for the most part. Appetite has increased and i feel warm consistently. I think my forehead is feeling a bit less oily.

Cool, I'm guessing this is haiduts supp you are using, estroban? I have that too, may just start giving it a go again
 

NathanK

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This was only when they tried it in combination of a maximum dose LH, which is not a physiological condition. High LH would mean high estrogen as well and it is known that retinol inhibits LH. And yes, some substances can increase testosterone synthesis without affecting LH/FSH. Vitamin K2 (MK-4) and taurine are two such substances.
I havent read the full study, but unlike MK4 that does not affect LH, it sounds like it is acting like an LH analogue and stimulating cholesterol->T synthesis independent of LH.

How might you think could affect HPTA feedback if it inhibits LH? I dont recall reading any anecdotal experiences here, do you think this could be another candidate for testicular application along with MK4 and DHEA/preg?

I realize this in vitro, but what relation does retinol or retinoic acid have with retinyl acetate like in your product?
 
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haidut

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I havent read the full study, but unlike MK4 that does not affect LH, it sounds like it is acting like an LH analogue and stimulating cholesterol->T synthesis independent of LH.

How might you think could affect HPTA feedback if it inhibits LH? I dont recall reading any anecdotal experiences here, do you think this could be another candidate for testicular application along with MK4 and DHEA/preg?

I realize this in vitro, but what relation does retinol or retinoic acid have with retinyl acetate like in your product?

Yes, vitamin A increases expression of the LH "receptor" in lower concentrations (and decreases it in high). So, the Leydig cells would be able to synthesize more T with less LH circulating around.
Mechanism Of Action Of Retinoic Acid And Retinol On Lh Receptor Induction And Progesterone Synthesis In Granulosa And Luteal Cells.

Vitamin A would be great as an addon to scrotum application but given the ability to decrease LH expression in high concentrations, the dose would have to be very carefully calculated. Retinyl acetate is a pro-drug for retinol and retinol is a pro-drug for retinoic acid, which activates the retinoic acid receptor (RAR). As you can see form the study above retinol can also have a direct effect on LH expression but it was weaker than retinoic acid.
 

NathanK

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Yes, vitamin A increases expression of the LH "receptor" in lower concentrations (and decreases it in high). So, the Leydig cells would be able to synthesize more T with less LH circulating around.
Mechanism Of Action Of Retinoic Acid And Retinol On Lh Receptor Induction And Progesterone Synthesis In Granulosa And Luteal Cells.

Vitamin A would be great as an addon to scrotum application but given the ability to decrease LH expression in high concentrations, the dose would have to be very carefully calculated. Retinyl acetate is a pro-drug for retinol and retinol is a pro-drug for retinoic acid, which activates the retinoic acid receptor (RAR). As you can see form the study above retinol can also have a direct effect on LH expression but it was weaker than retinoic acid.
Any specific therapeutic rage from the paper is a little suspect, but they do leave this nugget.

"...While it is difficult to compare
in vitro conditions to the normal i__En vivo environment, the levels of
retinoids used in these studies are close to those found in normal serum..."

This statement and the attached paper leads me to believe that sufficient Vit A applied non local to the testes region is just as efficacious any direct placement. Testicles and kidneys hoard Vit A in A deficient diets and supplementation relieves this need. What is undeniable is the roles vitamin A plays in spermogenisis and T production.

If anybody can find this I think it would be helpful in knowing more:
Appling, D.R. and Chytil, F. (1981) Endocrinology 108, 2120-2123
 

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LukeL

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Yes, vitamin A increases expression of the LH "receptor" in lower concentrations (and decreases it in high). So, the Leydig cells would be able to synthesize more T with less LH circulating around.
Mechanism Of Action Of Retinoic Acid And Retinol On Lh Receptor Induction And Progesterone Synthesis In Granulosa And Luteal Cells.

Vitamin A would be great as an addon to scrotum application but given the ability to decrease LH expression in high concentrations, the dose would have to be very carefully calculated. Retinyl acetate is a pro-drug for retinol and retinol is a pro-drug for retinoic acid, which activates the retinoic acid receptor (RAR). As you can see form the study above retinol can also have a direct effect on LH expression but it was weaker than retinoic acid.

@haidut any ideas on dosing Vitamin A on the scrotum?
 

Stryker

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@haidut any ideas on dosing Vitamin A on the scrotum?
wow strange coincidence..
i picked up some retinyl acetate powder 3 days ago and dissolved it in 90% dmso 10% ethanol .
using similar droppers to haidut it works out to be around 605IU per drop , ive been applying 2 drops either side of scrotum for 2 days now.

unfortunately i cant really afford any saliva/blood hormone testing atm but i shall report on any subjective effects
 

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