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Vitamin A Is Anti-Estrogenic

Discussion in 'Scientific Studies' started by haidut, Dec 19, 2014.

  1. haidut

    haidut Member

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    Unlike all the other studies I have seen this is an in vivo study, so it provides some guidelines on dosage. The
    human equivalent dosage would be in the range of 200,000 - 250,000 IU of all-trans-retinoic acid (which is a metabolite of retinol). That is on the high end, but note that the treatment was for only one day. As such, higher doses of vitamin A can probably be used relatively safely as a quick way to bring estrogen under control in a day or two. Combining this with a higher dose of vitamin E will probably have additive effects, and you can add vitamin K2 but make you sure you take it at least 6-8 hours after taking vitamin E to avoid interference with absorption of either vitamin.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17161848

    "...EE increased uterine weight and the coinjection of ATRA with EE significantly suppressed this effect 3 and 24 h after treatment. mRNA expression was examined during this 24-h period and the mRNA expression levels of estrogen receptor alpha (ER alpha), retinoic acid receptor beta (RAR beta), retinoid X receptor gamma (RXR gamma) and cellular retinol-binding protein I (CRBP I) were found to have significantly increased in the ATRA+EE group compared with those in the EE group. This is the first report on the antiestrogenic activity of ATRA determined using an in vivo adult rat uterotrophic assay. The up-regulation of RAR or RXR mRNA expression level was probably responsible for the antiestrogenic activity of ATRA."
     
  2. narouz

    narouz Member

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    thanks, haidut!
     
  3. Kasper

    Kasper Member

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    But in estroban you combine vitamin E and K2 right, are you sure it is better to take it separately?
     
  4. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    In the doses used in EstroBan there is no evidence that vitamin E and K2 inhibit each other's absoprtion. The interference happens at much higher doses when one of the vitamins fully saturates the transport mechanism in the body, which is presumed to be the same for both vitamins. So, if one vitamin is taken in too high a dose it will inhibit the absorption other one if taken at the same time. So, Estroban is safe.
     
  5. lexis

    lexis Member

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  6. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I think Ray somewhere that quercetin was mutagenic or estrogenic or both. I don't remember exactly but you can search his site and the forum. But if it is helping you, then I guess it is worth taking (short term).
     
  7. Spondive

    Spondive Member

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    So how much retinol should one take to be equivalent to retinoic acid?
     
  8. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I don't know, but if you Google a bit for the conversion ratio I am sure you will find something. For now, you can try with the same dosage for retinol and see how it affects you. It would be best if one someone can do a blood test while taking it, but in the absense of that I think water retention would be a good surrogate for estrogen levels.
     
  9. Spondive

    Spondive Member

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    Thanks Haidut. On a different subject by adjusting my t3 dose I can get water off or reduce edema. I seem to retain more water with a higher ratio of t4/t3
     
  10. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I am not surprised. All the people that I know who took Synthroid (pure T4) had issues with water retention. Only after switching to Armour or taking aromatase inhibitors did their water problems subside.
     
  11. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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    Any idea why the oedema happens with supplementary t4?

    I think i also see this with higher doses of non standardised ndt (nutrimeds) which would perhaps suggest too much t4 compared to t3. But it could be due to another weak nutritional link, often more vit A seems to help here too.
    thanks
    Sheila
     
  12. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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  13. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    This thread seems to suggest the conversion efficiency is about 10%, so you'd need 10 times more retinol (2,000,000 IU) to get the 200,000 IU retinoic acid. That is a very high amount, so I'd stick to no more than 200,000 IU of retinol instead.
    http://biology.stackexchange.com/questi ... -tretinoin
     
  14. superhuman

    superhuman Member

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    Where can i buy the best vitamin A? where i get the most vit A for my money
     
  15. Kasper

    Kasper Member

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    I use estroban for vitamin A,D, E and K2: https://squareup.com/market/idealabs-llc

    I now take 16 drops with very good results @haidut. For some reason it seems to cure my toenais fungus. First I would put it on my toes, but with high doses internally it seems to have similar effects. Do you think 16 drops is too much for long term ?
     
  16. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I would not know if it is too much since you need to check your blood levels of those vitamins. The only vitamin that Ray cautioned against explicitly is vitamin A, since without adequate vitamin E it can suppress thyroid function. But EstroBan has vitamin E so I am hoping it answers Ray's concerns. Also, at 16 drops per day I think you are still consuming only 200% of vitamin RDA. Again, a blood test would probably reveal where you stand on vitamin levels.
     
  17. answersfound

    answersfound Member

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    I always thought there was too much Vitamin A fear around here. Is it safe to say that one should increase Vitamin A intake until dandruff disappears? I currently take 25,000 IU per day and it has eliminated acne, but dandruff still lingers. Many have mentioned p5p and zinc which I have also tried, but it has not fixed the dandruff issue.
     
  18. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    There are studies on PubMed showing that at least 100,000 IU of oral vitamin A were needed to cure dandruff in some people. You may wan to ask foru member (and admin) Charlie about his experience with vitamin A and dandruff.
     
  19. answersfound

    answersfound Member

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    Okay. So did they have to stay at 100k IU....or did they come down after it was eliminated.
     
  20. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    The studies I have seen used 100,000 for a month and then went down to 20,000 IU daily for another month and then just went back to whatever is in the food.
     
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