Use & Avoidance Of Herbs, Essential Oils, Plant Extracts,

[Nicole W.]

Do you use something else (not an essential oil) that might have a nice smell and can be used daily?
As I wrote above, I wanna use tallow as a moisturizer, and i'm looking for something that smells nice to use with it.
The tallow doesn't stink but it's not nice either.

Yes. I do although I have not written about it here before. I use a product I make myself based on an Ayurvedic preparation called

Do you use something else (not an essential oil) that might have a nice smell and can be used daily?
As I wrote above, I wanna use tallow as a moisturizer, and i'm looking for something that smells nice to use with it.
The tallow doesn't stink but it's not nice either.

Yes I do use something on my face daily that smells nice, although I have never written about it here. I make and use a product based on an Ayurvedic preparation called Shata-Dhauta-Ghrita, otherwise known as 100 Times Washed Ghee.
This is a somewhat obscure product for skin that has remarkable benefits if you are willing to take the time and effort to produce it. In Ayurveda, it is often “medicated” with herbs to treat specific conditions. When not medicated, it’s just a terrific moisturizer/refiner for the skin. It behaves as a gentle retinol. I have been making it for several years and it has been great for me. The basic recipe contains just two ingredients: organic grass fed ghee and water. As the name implies, it is washed or rinsed 100 times. This is very labor intensive. It takes about 12 hours for me to make a batch. It is a tedious process but it’s the best product I have ever used on my face so it’s worth it to me. I make it for friends and family and sell to some local ladies who have problem skin such that they have not been able to use commercial products. Once the ghee has been washed 100 times, it becomes a virtually odorless, light emulsion which sinks beautifully into the skin leaving so residue or heavy “ face cream” feeling. At the end of the process, I add either rose, orange blossom ( neroli), mint or jasmine WATER. Never essential oils.
In Ayurveda, it is said that washed ghee penetrates all 7 layers of the dermis so I take this to mean that it acts as a solvent. I have been cautious about adding things in due to this although I do experiment from time to time.

 

[Light]

Yes. I do although I have not written about it here before. I use a product I make myself based on an Ayurvedic preparation called

Yes I do use something on my face daily that smells nice, although I have never written about it here. I make and use a product based on an Ayurvedic preparation called Shata-Dhauta-Ghrita, otherwise known as 100 Times Washed Ghee.
This is a somewhat obscure product for skin that has remarkable benefits if you are willing to take the time and effort to produce it. In Ayurveda, it is often “medicated” with herbs to treat specific conditions. When not medicated, it’s just a terrific moisturizer/refiner for the skin. It behaves as a gentle retinol. I have been making it for several years and it has been great for me. The basic recipe contains just two ingredients: organic grass fed ghee and water. As the name implies, it is washed or rinsed 100 times. This is very labor intensive. It takes about 12 hours for me to make a batch. It is a tedious process but it’s the best product I have ever used on my face so it’s worth it to me. I make it for friends and family and sell to some local ladies who have problem skin such that they have not been able to use commercial products. Once the ghee has been washed 100 times, it becomes a virtually odorless, light emulsion which sinks beautifully into the skin leaving so residue or heavy “ face cream” feeling. At the end of the process, I add either rose, orange blossom ( neroli), mint or jasmine WATER. Never essential oils.
In Ayurveda, it is said that washed ghee penetrates all 7 layers of the dermis so I take this to mean that it acts as a solvent. I have been cautious about adding things in due to this although I do experiment from time to time.

Thank you for your answer, it sounds fantastic.

 

[Nicole W.]

Thank you for your answer, it sounds fantastic.

Of course.

 

[Nicole W.]

I forgot to mention that if anyone wanted to try making this preparation, that using cold brewed coffee or green tea at the end are also nice additions, especially for those that do not care for flower scents. Both coffee and matcha are beneficial topically for skin.

 

[ljihkugft7]

Yes. I do although I have not written about it here before. I use a product I make myself based on an Ayurvedic preparation called

Yes I do use something on my face daily that smells nice, although I have never written about it here. I make and use a product based on an Ayurvedic preparation called Shata-Dhauta-Ghrita, otherwise known as 100 Times Washed Ghee.
This is a somewhat obscure product for skin that has remarkable benefits if you are willing to take the time and effort to produce it. In Ayurveda, it is often “medicated” with herbs to treat specific conditions. When not medicated, it’s just a terrific moisturizer/refiner for the skin. It behaves as a gentle retinol. I have been making it for several years and it has been great for me. The basic recipe contains just two ingredients: organic grass fed ghee and water. As the name implies, it is washed or rinsed 100 times. This is very labor intensive. It takes about 12 hours for me to make a batch. It is a tedious process but it’s the best product I have ever used on my face so it’s worth it to me. I make it for friends and family and sell to some local ladies who have problem skin such that they have not been able to use commercial products. Once the ghee has been washed 100 times, it becomes a virtually odorless, light emulsion which sinks beautifully into the skin leaving so residue or heavy “ face cream” feeling. At the end of the process, I add either rose, orange blossom ( neroli), mint or jasmine WATER. Never essential oils.
In Ayurveda, it is said that washed ghee penetrates all 7 layers of the dermis so I take this to mean that it acts as a solvent. I have been cautious about adding things in due to this although I do experiment from time to time.

I use tallow but definitely going to try this! Thanks.

With regard to using rose water as the fragrance, does this hinder the “shelf life” of the DIY tallow or ghee cream?

 

[Nicole W.]

I use tallow but definitely going to try this! Thanks.

With regard to using rose water as the fragrance, does this hinder the “shelf life” of the DIY tallow or ghee cream?

No, not at all. I’d say it improves the shelf life substantially. I recommend using food grade rose water. The type of rose water used in middle eastern cuisine vs. the type of rose water produced in Bulgaria that is used more for cosmetic purposes. I also use orange blossom water which is essentially neroli fragrance. That is my personal favorite. Sometimes I mix them. Men who use my product seem to respond better to mint. I have also used super concentrated coffee and matcha tea. They both work great. The mint water has an astringency that is good for male skin, which tends to be oilier. I have not tried this method on tallow by the way.

Not sure if I mentioned this before, but Ayurvedic practitioners sometimes utilize a copper pot when preparing this cream. The idea is that the cream absorbs some copper which then supports skin health when applied. I have tried this and I have to say, its tricky. Your cream can turn out smelling very coppery and I wasn’t entirely sure the preparation was safe for long term use. I will say that it clears blemishes up pretty quickly though. I just was never sure of how much copper I was absorbing and it scared me a little when the effects were so immediate.

 

[Can]

I think the biggest problem with essential oils is that people do not understand how to use them correctly. Aromatherapy is a branch of herbal medicine and as such should be used cautiously and judiciously. Read some books on the subject before introducing them into your healing protocol. There are some oils that are fairly benign and have mostly positive effects and there are some that are so potent, that when used inappropriately, will literally put you in the hospital.
My rule of thumb, first and foremost, is to never use an essential oil for more than a two week period. After that the risk of sensitization becomes a real possibility and you probably won’t be able to use that essential oil ever again. Because of this I never put essential oils in face creams or body products that I use daily.
Also, I always cringe when someone says X essential oil is estrogenic. It may have that quality to some extent... but along with it’s other actions, tends to be healing. Essential oils are not one dimensional. They impart many actions on the body, not just one. They are adaptogenic in nature and can be incredibly therapeutic. Don’t dismiss them out of hand just because you’re afraid of they may estrogenic. You should only be using them short term anyway.
Also, if an essential oil doesn’t smell good to you then don’t use it. I think just by scent alone our body can have a dialogue with a substance and know whether it would be beneficial.
My favorite essential oils are:
Myrrh ( neat) for healing bites or small wounds
Helicrysum for burns or irritation
Palmarosa for itching or fungal issues
Neroli for hormone and mood balancing
Eucalyptus for colds or respiratory issues.

An extremely sensible & sane approach.

 

[Can]

If a scent bothers you, I wouldn't use it.

Also, if an essential oil doesn’t smell good to you then don’t use it. I think just by scent alone our body can have a dialogue with a substance and know whether it would be beneficial.

I think this approach is true even for food. One can analyze a food analytically and based on that can come to a conclusion intellectually whether that food is good and worth eating or not, but what sense does it make to forego this process of analytical thinking if the food doesn't agree with you when you actually eat it? Or maybe you try to avoid certain foods because of, again, intellectual reasoning, but for some reason your body really seems to crave it - should you avoid that food like a pest, even if your appetite signals that it is worth pursuing?

I am not saying that one should succumb to one's instincts and appetites on a whim all the time. Our intellect and cognition are part of us, just as much as our intuition, and thus we should use these faculties to assess and evaluate our choices. But similarly, we also have our instincts and intuitions for a reason, and shouldn't dismiss them either. All of our human faculties should work together in a balanced and harmonious relationship, as clichéd as that might sound. And I tend to believe that our intuition is a more important faculty than our intellect, so going by gut feeling tends to be closer to ideal than going by reason alone imo.

 

[Nicole W.]

I think this approach is true even for food. One can analyze a food analytically and based on that can come to a conclusion intellectually whether that food is good and worth eating or not, but what sense does it make to forego this process of analytical thinking if the food doesn't agree with you when you actually eat it? Or maybe you try to avoid certain foods because of, again, intellectual reasoning, but for some reason your body really seems to crave it - should you avoid that food like a pest, even if your appetite signals that it is worth pursuing?

I am not saying that one should succumb to one's instincts and appetites on a whim all the time. Our intellect and cognition are part of us, just as much as our intuition, and thus we should use these faculties to assess and evaluate our choices. But similarly, we also have our instincts and intuitions for a reason, and shouldn't dismiss them either. All of our human faculties should work together in a balanced and harmonious relationship, as clichéd as that might sound. And I tend to believe that our intuition is a more important faculty than our intellect, so going by gut feeling tends to be closer to ideal than going by reason alone imo.

In recent years, I have relied on intuition more and more for my dietary choices. I now just eat what sounds good and have mostly abandoned any effort to be strictly “Peaty”, because ultimately, I found it boring, limiting and unsustainable.
This is after YEARS of avoiding this or that food, always doing a type of mental gymnastics when creating recipes that will adhere to the dietary “guidelines” and avoid the pitfalls.
Looking back, it seems dumb to have made such an effort. I think I missed out on some pretty amazing food/dishes/cuisines because, you know…I drank the Peatarian koolaid.
I still generally avoid seed oils, fried stuff, and packaged food (because I never liked it anyway) but I have happily brought nuts, pork, chicken, salads, bread and other starches into back into my life because they taste delicious and are absolutely nutritious. Sometimes I have a donut and as far as I can tell, I am not the worse for wear.

When you avoid certain foods you avoid the specific nutrients (and combination of nutrients) within. Every food has benefit and detriment, when you exclude a food you lose both.

Every healthy person I have known that has lived into very old age has:
1. Never heard of Ray Peat or his ideas.

2. Has eaten everything in moderation, sometimes drank and smoked in moderation, and mostly lived a simple life without extreme stress.

3. Did not obsess over or micromanage their dietary choices.

4. Did not condemn themselves for consuming any particular food.

I do not think G-d designed us to be fragile beings. We have mechanisms within us to compensate for PUFA, heavy metals, radiation and other poisons.
I just refuse to over think my diet anymore, or limit it to the extent that I’m rotating through the same 10 foods over and over.
This is ridiculous behavior and I am done.

It was a fun experiment but in the long run proved to have diminishing returns both physically and psychologically for me.

 

[Dave Clark]

These look interesting, and maybe safe to use: Top 3 Essential Oils to Balance Hormones Naturally - Dr. Axe
Rosemary is supposed to help speed the deactivation of estrogen in the liver: Modulation of estrogen and epidermal growth factor receptors by rosemary extract in breast cancer cells - PubMed
Sandalwood is supposed to increase testosterone, and balance hormones when use with frankincense.

 

[Inaut]

These look interesting, and maybe safe to use: Top 3 Essential Oils to Balance Hormones Naturally - Dr. Axe
Rosemary is supposed to help speed the deactivation of estrogen in the liver: Modulation of estrogen and epidermal growth factor receptors by rosemary extract in breast cancer cells - PubMed
Sandalwood is supposed to increase testosterone, and balance hormones when use with frankincense.

Big fan of thyme oil and it’s pro progesterone effects (apparently)

 

[Dave Clark]

Big fan of thyme oil and it’s pro progesterone effects (apparently)

Yes. And, I suppose due to the eugenol, clove oil would be another good essential oil: Structure-based design of eugenol analogs as potential estrogen receptor antagonists

Researchers discovered that eugenol increased apoptosis (planned cell death, lacking in cancer cells). It also decreased the protein coding gene E2F1 (also known as survivin). Eugenol also inhibited the rapid growth of these cells. It inhibited onco-proteins known to be highly expressed in breast cancer cells and tissues, both in vitro (test tubes) and in vivo (inside the body). Eugenol was found not to be toxic to normal, healthy cells. For women with estrogen-receptor positive breast cancer looking for natural anti-estrogen products, clove essential oil provides one other exciting benefit. A 2012 study revealed that eugenol not only exhibited growth inhibition and promoted apoptosis (as described in the previous study) but also exhibited an ability to act as an antagonist to estrogen. Researchers found eugenol “to have compounds that have similar or even better affinities to ER than tamoxifen and its metabolites.”

 

[Inaut]

Yes. And, I suppose due to the eugenol, clove oil would be another good essential oil: Structure-based design of eugenol analogs as potential estrogen receptor antagonists

Researchers discovered that eugenol increased apoptosis (planned cell death, lacking in cancer cells). It also decreased the protein coding gene E2F1 (also known as survivin). Eugenol also inhibited the rapid growth of these cells. It inhibited onco-proteins known to be highly expressed in breast cancer cells and tissues, both in vitro (test tubes) and in vivo (inside the body). Eugenol was found not to be toxic to normal, healthy cells. For women with estrogen-receptor positive breast cancer looking for natural anti-estrogen products, clove essential oil provides one other exciting benefit. A 2012 study revealed that eugenol not only exhibited growth inhibition and promoted apoptosis (as described in the previous study) but also exhibited an ability to act as an antagonist to estrogen. Researchers found eugenol “to have compounds that have similar or even better affinities to ER than tamoxifen and its metabolites.”

I think there’s some synergistic effects with the two together

My “deodorant” is alcohol, baking soda, a few drops of clove and thyme oil.

My “toothpaste” is baking soda, clove and thyme oil.

 

[Can]

In recent years, I have relied on intuition more and more for my dietary choices. I now just eat what sounds good and have mostly abandoned any effort to be strictly “Peaty”, because ultimately, I found it boring, limiting and unsustainable.
This is after YEARS of avoiding this or that food, always doing a type of mental gymnastics when creating recipes that will adhere to the dietary “guidelines” and avoid the pitfalls.
Looking back, it seems dumb to have made such an effort. I think I missed out on some pretty amazing food/dishes/cuisines because, you know…I drank the Peatarian koolaid.
I still generally avoid seed oils, fried stuff, and packaged food (because I never liked it anyway) but I have happily brought nuts, pork, chicken, salads, bread and other starches into back into my life because they taste delicious and are absolutely nutritious. Sometimes I have a donut and as far as I can tell, I am not the worse for wear.

When you avoid certain foods you avoid the specific nutrients (and combination of nutrients) within. Every food has benefit and detriment, when you exclude a food you lose both.

Every healthy person I have known that has lived into very old age has:
1. Never heard of Ray Peat or his ideas.

2. Has eaten everything in moderation, sometimes drank and smoked in moderation, and mostly lived a simple life without extreme stress.

3. Did not obsess over or micromanage their dietary choices.

4. Did not condemn themselves for consuming any particular food.

I do not think G-d designed us to be fragile beings. We have mechanisms within us to compensate for PUFA, heavy metals, radiation and other poisons.
I just refuse to over think my diet anymore, or limit it to the extent that I’m rotating through the same 10 foods over and over.
This is ridiculous behavior and I am done.

It was a fun experiment but in the long run proved to have diminishing returns both physically and psychologically for me.

I very much agree with what you are saying. I think what you described is a very healthy and sane approach to eating and to life. If I am not mistaken, even Ray himself said somewhere that the people he knew who got the oldest, didn't worry too much about nutrition and ate a pretty standard diet (including a lot of non-Peaty foods). I certainly fall short of this myself, and sometimes still overanalyze my food choices, but I made huge improvements, like you, in not being too analytical compared to my former self, and I am learning to listen to my body more than to my intellect. I remember gulping down olive oil, moringa powder and other things a few years ago, which tasted absolutely obnoxious to me, just because I thought I was doing myself a favor - yuck!

 

[Nicole W.]

I very much agree with what you are saying. I think what you described is a very healthy and sane approach to eating and to life. If I am not mistaken, even Ray himself said somewhere that the people he knew who got the oldest, didn't worry too much about nutrition and ate a pretty standard diet (including a lot of non-Peaty foods). I certainly fall short of this myself, and sometimes still overanalyze my food choices, but I made huge improvements, like you, in not being too analytical compared to my former self, and I am learning to listen to my body more than to my intellect. I remember gulping down olive oil, moringa powder and other things a few years ago, which tasted absolutely obnoxious to me, just because I thought I was doing myself a favor - yuck!

Haha, I have done those things on occasion myself. I think it must be the journey we all take to learn what does and does not benefit us.

 

[Can]

I think it must be the journey we all take to learn what does and does not benefit us.

Agreed. I am glad I made those and decisions and had those experiences, even though I would not want to have them again, as they helped bring forth the person that I am now. We all make 'mistakes' which turn out to be necessary for our development in the end.

 

[healthiswellth]

a family member has been giving her 6 year old son Mary Ruth organics “attention and focus” supplement with the following ingredients:

rganic Proprietary Blend Astragalus Root, Wood Betony Herb, Ginkgo Leaf, Eleuthero Root, Gotu Kola Herb, Rhodiola Root, Licorice Root, Lavender Flower, Spearmint Leaf', Passionflower Leaf.

1 ml

Do you think the lavender flower is as potent and estrogenic as the oil— he has some trouble paying attention in school so she is trying natural stuff and behavior modification techniques to help... I want to let her know if this has a strong potential to feminize or create hormonal in balance since he is so young

 

[healthiswellth]

Is spearmint also particularly problematic?

 

[healthiswellth]

She said something the other day that has me worried that it might be linked to this ...she said he overreacts and cries about everything. He makes a mountain out of a molehill...this behavior is fairly recent ~less than a year

 

[Lejeboca]

a family member has been giving her 6 year old son Mary Ruth organics “attention and focus” supplement with the following ingredients:

rganic Proprietary Blend Astragalus Root, Wood Betony Herb, Ginkgo Leaf, Eleuthero Root, Gotu Kola Herb, Rhodiola Root, Licorice Root, Lavender Flower, Spearmint Leaf', Passionflower Leaf.

1 ml

Do you think the lavender flower is as potent and estrogenic as the oil— he has some trouble paying attention in school so she is trying natural stuff and behavior modification techniques to help... I want to let her know if this has a strong potential to feminize or create hormonal in balance since he is so young

This formula is definitely for adults. Ginkgo is typically for aging memory, eleuthero is for a mature person.
And 1 ml is definitely a large dose. I'd be worried about Licorice the most in terms of estrogenic effects. Hence current crying and overracting.

More information is needed for what to give him instead for trouble to concentrate. How is is his digestion? sleep? At any rate, I'd try to improve concentration by diet first. To antidote that Blend (and current crying and overrating) a bit of camomile probably could help.