Update-how I Made Thyroid Supplements To Work

mouse

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Feb 25, 2014
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Why do i feel cold of i try to go no starch?
Dairy + any juice=cold
Meat only=better, but still cold
Meat+juice=cold

I never did like pure sugar, or sugar plus juice... still... ?

Do I need more sugar? Or why would i feel cold?

Have you found a solution for this issue? I have a similar problem.
 

mouse

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Feb 25, 2014
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No, have you tried super high salt, like above 10-15 grams a day?

I can't take that much, it aggravates my histamine issues, and beyond a few grams a day, it doesn't make any difference anyways. But potassium makes me very very cold.

My current suspicion is that it is related to some sort of blood sugar regulation issue. Something like postprandial syndrome seems closest, where catecholamine release raises blood sugar but causes peripheral vasoconstriction. Wikipedia says it can be related to dysautonomia. Also EGCG helped for a couple days until it ran out of something. EGCG has an effect on vasoconstriction downstream from insulin release, apparently insulin causes both dilation and constriction through different simultaneous pathways: Vascular and Metabolic Actions of the Green Tea Polyphenol Epigallocatechin Gallate Another maybe relevant hint is that hyperinsulinism, which can cause vasoconstriction, can be aggravated by protein. I'm not married to these ideas but that's what I'm thinking nowadays.
 

mouse

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Feb 25, 2014
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How is the combo meat+white rice @mouse ?
Could be great I think

I find that eating too much meat or vegetable protein aggravates the cold feet issue.. actually, digestive enzymes too, which is at least consistent. Some amino acids aggravate it (glutamine, glutamate, histidine, lysine, arginine, l-alanine etc) others have no effect (taurine, threonine, tyrosine, phenylalanine, beta-alanine). White rice doesn't make it worse but doesn't resolve it either. I tried adding sugar to my meals and I didn't feel worse or better, except a couple occasions where I had stopped taking chromium and it felt like hyperglycemia (feeling off, but warm extremities for half an hour). But chromium by itself doesn't help or hurt the cold feet issue, so I don't think it's a normal insulin sensitivity issue. hba1c is 5.1-5.4.
 

Dino D

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Nov 14, 2017
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335
I can't take that much, it aggravates my histamine issues, and beyond a few grams a day, it doesn't make any difference anyways. But potassium makes me very very cold.

My current suspicion is that it is related to some sort of blood sugar regulation issue. Something like postprandial syndrome seems closest, where catecholamine release raises blood sugar but causes peripheral vasoconstriction. Wikipedia says it can be related to dysautonomia. Also EGCG helped for a couple days until it ran out of something. EGCG has an effect on vasoconstriction downstream from insulin release, apparently insulin causes both dilation and constriction through different simultaneous pathways: Vascular and Metabolic Actions of the Green Tea Polyphenol Epigallocatechin Gallate Another maybe relevant hint is that hyperinsulinism, which can cause vasoconstriction, can be aggravated by protein. I'm not married to these ideas but that's what I'm thinking nowadays.
Have you tried to eat real salty and fatty meat, with a bit of rice or potatoes, and then liquid sugar/
I find that eating too much meat or vegetable protein aggravates the cold feet issue.. actually, digestive enzymes too, which is at least consistent. Some amino acids aggravate it (glutamine, glutamate, histidine, lysine, arginine, l-alanine etc) others have no effect (taurine, threonine, tyrosine, phenylalanine, beta-alanine). White rice doesn't make it worse but doesn't resolve it either. I tried adding sugar to my meals and I didn't feel worse or better, except a couple occasions where I had stopped taking chromium and it felt like hyperglycemia (feeling off, but warm extremities for half an hour). But chromium by itself doesn't help or hurt the cold feet issue, so I don't think it's a normal insulin sensitivity issue. hba1c is 5.1-5.4.

What is warming in your opinion?
 

mouse

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Feb 25, 2014
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Have you tried to eat real salty and fatty meat, with a bit of rice or potatoes, and then liquid sugar/


What is warming in your opinion?

So far magnesium, fmn (b2), salt and copper have helped, however they only help up a little, meaning they aren't fixing the actual problem. EGCG temporarily helped.

Strong negative effects from creatine, b1, ribose, zinc, b12, p5p, tmg, lithium, iodine, selenium, calcium, potassium, carnitine (alcar, fumarate), alpha lipoic acid, malate/malic acid, borage oil, glutamine, glutamate, histidine, lysine, arginine, l-alanine, yohimbine hcl >10mg (to be expected).

Milder negative effects from vit k, vit d, methionine, estriol/estradiol if excessive, boron, paba, vanadium, glycine, choline bitartrate.

No effect from manganese, molybdenum, b5, vit a, vit e, chromium, progesterone, dhea, methylfolate, niacinamide, niacin (disregarding flush), biotin, iron, vit c, fish oil, flax oil, pork fat, big hunks of hard cheese, lecithin (despite negative effect from alcar and choline bitartrate), coq10, ubiquinol, beta-alanine, threonine, taurine, ornithine, phenylalanine, tyrosine, 5-htp, tryptophan, theanine, pregnenolone, gaba, butyrate.

Some things actually increase my waking core body temperature but aggravate vasoconstriction (e.g. b1, zinc), others drop body temperature and aggravate vasoconstriction (creatine, carnitines), most do not affect temperature (surpisingly iodine and selenium).
 

Dino D

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Joined
Nov 14, 2017
Messages
335
So far magnesium, fmn (b2), salt and copper have helped, however they only help up a little, meaning they aren't fixing the actual problem. EGCG temporarily helped.

Strong negative effects from creatine, b1, ribose, zinc, b12, p5p, tmg, lithium, iodine, selenium, calcium, potassium, carnitine (alcar, fumarate), alpha lipoic acid, malate/malic acid, borage oil, glutamine, glutamate, histidine, lysine, arginine, l-alanine, yohimbine hcl >10mg (to be expected).

Milder negative effects from vit k, vit d, methionine, estriol/estradiol if excessive, boron, paba, vanadium, glycine, choline bitartrate.

No effect from manganese, molybdenum, b5, vit a, vit e, chromium, progesterone, dhea, methylfolate, niacinamide, niacin (disregarding flush), biotin, iron, vit c, fish oil, flax oil, pork fat, big hunks of hard cheese, lecithin (despite negative effect from alcar and choline bitartrate), coq10, ubiquinol, beta-alanine, threonine, taurine, ornithine, phenylalanine, tyrosine, 5-htp, tryptophan, theanine, pregnenolone, gaba, butyrate.

Some things actually increase my waking core body temperature but aggravate vasoconstriction (e.g. b1, zinc), others drop body temperature and aggravate vasoconstriction (creatine, carnitines), most do not affect temperature (surpisingly iodine and selenium).
Have you tried eating lets say 800gram or more of carbs from starch per day... with some salt and fat... or 800g of carbs from sugar but not liquid, dried fruits, maybe candy and so?? I see youre very precise in your work, but maybe it is about the amounts of food or sups you take... mybe you overthink or judge to soon, by observing changes in hours or in one day, not a weak or a month... so high carbs, high salt, some fat and consistance... also have you tried going suplement free...
 

Vins7

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Feb 23, 2020
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It would be a good experiment! Even if you eat more meat to increase calories, if at the end of the day your calcium to phosphate ratio is around 1:1, you're good.
We should have a good Calcium to phosphate ratio. The main source of Calcium is dairy and the main of phosphate is meat, but What about if milk gives me digestive issues and mucus...?
How can I have a good Calcium to phosphate ratio? I live milk and cheese but I think I should avoid them fue to my digestive health.
 

rei

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Aug 6, 2017
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Cold without starches is probably due to bad glycogen storage ability, liquid carbs come and go very quickly. Another possibility is that liver is overwhelmed and gets stressed from having to suddenly deal with an onslaught of fructose.

Consuming the juice at a slow pace over the whole day might help, but is terrible for teeth.
 
Last edited:

Beastmode

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Feb 7, 2017
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I've tried this experiment a few times and it definitely makes a difference in overall energy for me.

I'm seeing this thread at a good time as my body has been asking to get off starches again. Currently I have about a cup of white rice per day.

I've found that beet root feels good, but I'm wondering if Peat would consider that in the starch group.

White button mushrooms (cooked,) swiss chard (cooked) and beet root seem to help replaces the typical carbs like potatoes and bread for me.
 

jet9

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Mar 5, 2018
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I have been taking 5mcg T3 three times daily and a 1/4+1/8 Cynoplus before sleep since the last few months.
With these amounts, my highest temperature was 36.6 C° during the day and my waking temperature around 36C°- very low. My pulse rate was in the 50's 60's.

About a month ago I removed all starches-potatoes, rice and sourdough rye bread; and all vegetables from my diet, except occasional kale broth. What I eat: animal protein-meat incl. organ meat, seafood, milk and cheese, eggs, gelatin, fruits, OJ, honey and coffee. Nothing else.
Since the change, on the same amount of thyroid supplements my pulse rate is between 75-80 and my temperature is 37C° during the day. My energy levels are great.
cinderella hi, do you still have success with this approach?
 

Recoen

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Jun 8, 2020
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starch is an easy target for microbial growth whereas fat is not, in fact considering the entire system it induces (chylomicrons, bile acids, specific fatty acids, liver detoxification, endotoxin binding) fat is anti-microbial. Furthermore, I think once bacteria are able to capitalize on the starch, they produce bacterial endproducts that lower overall metabolism. I notice after a few days of chronic starch consumption my body temp drops and so does my appetite, whereas when I initially eat starch I get massive spikes in temperature (I think this is becuase of the massive increase of glucose without the bacterial endproducts forming yet).

I think this may be partly why I had a hard time on no starch. If you have a potential endotoxin/ bacteria issue when you drop starches do they start dying off, releasing the endotoxin? I still don’t completely see the connection to why this causes my blood sugar to go low though. I know I’m also wasting ketones and my urine pH dropped to 5.5.

Maybe the increased LPS -> an increase in serotonin -> an increase in glycolysis -> lactic acid? If that’s the case would increasing the raw carrot salad from once to maybe 2x/3x per day for a while be helpful? Or something else? I definitely had an increase in serotonin issues - more agreessive, less patient, muted affect other times, loose stool, muscle twitches (also from the lactic acid).
 

CLASH

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Sep 15, 2017
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In my experience I havent had die off symptoms from dropping starch. If anything the symptoms in the past that I had, decreased when stopping starch. I will stipulate that some people tolerate starches well; there is a degree of individuality.

I'm not sure of the entire context of your question, as I'm pretty sure my post is relatively old here. With that said I will say that not eating enough fat when removing starch can cause issues like drastic blood sugar swings, as the body becomes more insulin sensitive and burns through the sugar rapidly. Another thing that can easily drop blood sugar is food allergies and intolerances in my experience. For example I dont tolerate oranges or orange juice very well at all, so when I drink it I actually get adrenaline rushes and sweat profusely. This is all despite its supposed anti-stress effects, plant compounds, health benefits, etc.
 

Korven

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May 4, 2019
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These are very interesting findings, thanks for sharing @cinderella . I also get better temps and lower adrenaline on a diet of fruits, raw honey and animal products. I am curious 1.5 years later, are you still doing well on a starch free diet? And do you still benefit from supplementing thyroid?
 
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