Upcoming Thyroid Surgery

[renz]

hi All,

My name is Renaee and I am posting for the first time here, hoping for support, guidance and friendship too. I am 47 year old woman, living in Australia with my 10 year old daughter and partner.

I have loosely followed the work of writers influenced by Ray Peat’s work since 2011, starting with Matt Stone, then Joey Lott, EastwestHealing, Danny Roddy, and more recently a woman local to my home city of Melbourne, Emma Sgourakis.

Despite following the over all ‘ray peat’ principals that I have learnt and applied from these writers, my health took a turn for the worse in the beginning of 2015, and after a very rocky couple of years in 2015 and 2016, where I got severe depression and anxiety, I am now faced with the prospect of a partial thyroidectomy to remove a 5cm by 4cm goiter on my thyroid gland, as well as having recently been diagnosed with a condition that is a complication of my asthma, called Allergic Broncho Pulmonary Aspergilliosis (an allergy and infection by the Aspergilius fungi).

The lump on the thyroid was not tested with a Fine Needle Aspiration for cancer, as my surgeon said it would be too large to be conclusive and would need to many jabs, and he also said that even if it was benign, that he would still recommend removing it surgically, as it would continue to grow, at my age 47, which is young to have such a growth apparently. I came back euthyroid for the blood work meaning normal, and do not have any of the other usual symptoms that Drs check for.

The surgery has been held off however, until I get on top of the lung infection.

My surgeon also said that based on the type of nodule, round, mobile, some calcification, and a single nodule, not multiple, there is a 10% chance it is cancer.

When I found this out in November last year, I consulted with Josh of EastWesthealing, and started food and temp logging, and trying to ‘fine tune’ things to bring my temps up, but currently cannot get morning temp much over 35.2 C. Though by the end of the day i sometimes manage to bring it up to 36.5 at the highest.

I have been doing the morning carrot salad, making huge quantities of broth, eating shellfish/oyster, eating lots of good quality dairy, OJ in the morning and different times during the day. However I still do eat a fair amount of starch, as I find that I cannot get enough calories in without it, and will wake during the night if I stick to the more strict ray peat style of eating. I have found Joey Lott’s book on ‘the ray peat survival guide’ very helpful in this regard, as a reminder that nothing will slow metabolism more than overall calorie restriction. However I am extremely strict in avoiding all kinds of obvious PUFAs, and the starch I do eat is good quality and well prepared to get rid of phytates (coconut rice, some sourdough, masa corn) and I always eat some pineapple with it as well to get the fructose in.

Anyway.. As the prospect of going under the knife draws closer - I feel more convinced that it is not necessary and that I don’t want to have the surgery. I want to know if there are any other ‘no brainer’ things that I should be doing/taking or who I could ask for more help?

I do regular swimming and yoga, and don’t feel I have any particular stress in my life now, however as mentioned I did experience extreme and ongoing depression and anxiety/insomina that started in winter of 2015 and did not let up for about a year with gradual lessening intensity. (I also was on an SSRI unfortunately) The start of 2015 was also when I first developed the cough and worsening of asthma that has resulted in the current condition.

This was a very long post - I hope some one may be able to share any wisdom, insights or suggestions. I know there are no quick or easy answers out there and maybe this info is far to vague, but I just felt I owed it to myself to post and see what kind of feedback could come my way.

Many thanks,
Renaee.

 

[Herbie]

Hi Renaee, I am also an Australian on member here.

Im no doctor and I don't know the answers but I have some questions which may lead you to answers.

The lungs and the liver are connected, so perhaps look in that direction.

Do you swim in the ocean, salt water pool or chlorine? (chlorine can be problem)

When you swim do you inhale through your nose of mouth?

I think yoga is ok.

Do you take Naturally desiccated thyroid? or synthetic t3?

Have you looked into cyprohepdatine? sold as periactin OTC in Australia. Ive read that it has been used to help with negative post ssri symptoms and great posts about it on here, it may be worth looking into.

Have you contacted Ray personally? Do you read the articles on his website? Practitioners can be of good help but sometimes reading Ray's articles, new things can pop out and open up new thinking about problems and listening to audio interviews can be very provoking in a new direction, not sure if you have gotten into that or not.

I think the approach to the Ray Peat diet is that there is no diet because his recommendations are very nuanced and contextual and others have taken his work out of context.

This forum is full of great resources and people. Onwards and upwards!

 

[Diokine]

as a reminder that nothing will slow metabolism more than overall calorie restriction

I don't agree with this. Nothing will slow metabolism more than inflammation. I've begun to see a lot of things as causing persistent allergic type reactions, which I think in your case is pretty clear. Some things that are very important for resiliency are vitamins ADEK and a healthy bowel, all leading to proper cortisol response and sleep patterns. I would suspect some type of persistent gut inflammation that coincided with your depression and asthma. For whatever reasons, I've found peaceful time outside in bright sunlight is one of the best therapies.


from Dr. Peat -

Yeah, eating the right balance at each feeding - some sugar, some protein and some fat - and having small meals is usually easy on the intestine. Some people feel they have to eat for theoretical nutrition, rather than for hunger. And if you force yourself to eat when you're not hungry, that can lead to stress and sluggishness of your intestine

 

[renz]

hello to you both and thank you for replies.

With lungs and liver connected, I know with learning from EW the most important thing was to teach the liver to store gylcogen, hence balance blood sugar and reduce the stress response from adrenals, and yes this meant eating small regular meals of sugar/protein and fat, but i would also add in a small amount of starch for satiety at some of those meals.

Over all my digestion I thought was my strongest point, just my respiratory system that is terrible, but given the respiratory issues is an allergy/inflammation one, then might also be allergy from food, nut just from this airborne fungi.

I swim in chlorine, and this was a big part of my recovery, regular relaxing breath stroke (head under and then up to breath through mouth, or head above water to breath through nose), followed by relaxing spa and sauna. i have heard negatives about chlorine, but thought the positives in this instance out weighed it? . At the moment I am favoring the yoga practice, which I do about 40 minutes daily and do in the sun in the late afternoon.

I do not take any supplement or hormones presently, this was one of the reasons that i wanted to consult with a 'pro' in this area, as I felt I just did not know enough about it to self medicate. Like wise with the cyprohepdatine, have not heard of it. When I went to EastWest, this was one of the first things I asked about, but told it would be chaotic to put supplements into my body where it is now, until the fundamentals are improved, which i agreed with?

I have started to listen to some of the generative energy podcasts, and have read some of ray's articles, but this is a new thing for me as I try to get more answers now. I feel in some ways that it is like going down a rabbit hole and not sure if I want to! hence I thought paying a consultant who makes this stuff their living was better option for me but now I think that I do need to have a better understanding.

Benjamin - would you mind if I messaged you and ask more about Australia specific info like where you might source certain foods and the supplements? And also about the red light man.

thanks again - Renaee.

 

[denise]

Did something traumatic happen at the start of 2015? It seems like that's so often the case when health takes a sudden nosedive. I know it was for me.

As for your goiter, how long have you been monitoring it? Is it growing quickly? In 2013, I discovered that I had a goiter but it was growing down rather than out (so you couldn't tell just by looking at me) and was growing so quickly and getting so large that my doctor was afraid it would eventually either block my trachea or impinge on my aorta, either of which could be deadly (it was already pushing my trachea to the side--and I was 40 at the time, so I had many years left for it to keep growing). If not for these two things (growing quickly and in a dangerous place) I would have resisted surgery indefinitely (I did resist for 2 years). In 2015, I had a partial thyroidectomy. Fortunately I still have part of my right lobe left, but it's not functioning well enough on its own, so I have to supplement. If I had had access to IdeaLabs thyroid meds sooner, I probably would have stalled longer on the surgery to see if they would help.

 

[Herbie]

hello to you both and thank you for replies.

With lungs and liver connected, I know with learning from EW the most important thing was to teach the liver to store gylcogen, hence balance blood sugar and reduce the stress response from adrenals, and yes this meant eating small regular meals of sugar/protein and fat, but i would also add in a small amount of starch for satiety at some of those meals.

Over all my digestion I thought was my strongest point, just my respiratory system that is terrible, but given the respiratory issues is an allergy/inflammation one, then might also be allergy from food, nut just from this airborne fungi.

I swim in chlorine, and this was a big part of my recovery, regular relaxing breath stroke (head under and then up to breath through mouth, or head above water to breath through nose), followed by relaxing spa and sauna. i have heard negatives about chlorine, but thought the positives in this instance out weighed it? . At the moment I am favoring the yoga practice, which I do about 40 minutes daily and do in the sun in the late afternoon.

I do not take any supplement or hormones presently, this was one of the reasons that i wanted to consult with a 'pro' in this area, as I felt I just did not know enough about it to self medicate. Like wise with the cyprohepdatine, have not heard of it. When I went to EastWest, this was one of the first things I asked about, but told it would be chaotic to put supplements into my body where it is now, until the fundamentals are improved, which i agreed with?

I have started to listen to some of the generative energy podcasts, and have read some of ray's articles, but this is a new thing for me as I try to get more answers now. I feel in some ways that it is like going down a rabbit hole and not sure if I want to! hence I thought paying a consultant who makes this stuff their living was better option for me but now I think that I do need to have a better understanding.

Benjamin - would you mind if I messaged you and ask more about Australia specific info like where you might source certain foods and the supplements? And also about the red light man.

thanks again - Renaee.

In theory eating small meals of fat,carbs and protein but in reality it becomes too rigid and lead to further problems instead of eating to taste or feelings as from my experience can lead to more stable levels of energy. Let your hair down a bit and find balance that way. Ray's approach is opposite of authoritarian military style diet.

Its controversial with the chlorine but It might be worth having a break and seeing if your lungs get better. Breathing through the mouth depletes Co2 from the body and is very important for the respiratory system and temperature and Ray recommends breathing into a brown paper bag for 1-2minutes a few times a day to bring the co2 levels back up, there is a lecture on youtube that he presents about co2.

Im not 'pro' in anything but if you want to bring temps up and get thyroid working again then its your best bet as diet alone hasn't been adequate enough and not sure if your taking thyroid surrogates like drinking coffee, coca cola, aspirin, etc? (You will read about everyone wanting Mexican coke for the cane sugar but in Australia all the original coca cola is cane sugar and same as mexican)

If you end up having to get the surgery you will most likely need to take thyroid anyway to make up for whats missing so that you don't rely on other glands.

As for self diagnosing, there is a lot in our media lately shaming people for self diagnosing and I do understand that there are circumstances where people drink green smoothies with some aggressive tumour after a quick google search and advice from the latest health blogger and die as a result of not having a surgery but you can read Broda Barnes book: 'Hypopthyroidism the unsuspected illness' which teaches you all about testing yourself and knowing weather or not to take 1 grain of NDT. If your in regular contact with the medical establishment then you wouldn't be partaking in risk taking behaviour.

Ray has said that when we used to eat the whole animal that we would get a grain of thyroid worth each day (1 tablet of pigs thyroid is 1 grain) People eat chicken necks, fish heads, etc for thyroid. If there is one supplement that would be reasonably safe then its NDT.

Im aware that Josh isn't keen on supplements and I think its a safe approach for his own safety and because of his philosophy.

I think your already in the rabbit whole.

Yeah sure you can message me.

 

[biggirlkisss]

if your looking to get temps up then bright sunlight would help with breaks using incandescence light to detox from uv. I'm considering ordering a very bright led light and replace that with the incandescence. You get 6 times more brightness the catch is there more blue light and it costs around 170 dollars but the lumens are over 20000 I have to try it to see if it works out but I have my hopes up.

 

[beachbum]

Im 53 now with thyroid nodules but when I was 20 years old I had a goiter was on thyroid. I am not on thyroid anymore and no more goiter. The nodules are new. Just want to throw that out there.

 

[renz]

Did something traumatic happen at the start of 2015? It seems like that's so often the case when health takes a sudden nosedive. I know it was for me.

As for your goiter, how long have you been monitoring it? Is it growing quickly? In 2013, I discovered that I had a goiter but it was growing down rather than out (so you couldn't tell just by looking at me) and was growing so quickly and getting so large that my doctor was afraid it would eventually either block my trachea or impinge on my aorta, either of which could be deadly (it was already pushing my trachea to the side--and I was 40 at the time, so I had many years left for it to keep growing). If not for these two things (growing quickly and in a dangerous place) I would have resisted surgery indefinitely (I did resist for 2 years). In 2015, I had a partial thyroidectomy. Fortunately I still have part of my right lobe left, but it's not functioning well enough on its own, so I have to supplement. If I had had access to IdeaLabs thyroid meds sooner, I probably would have stalled longer on the surgery to see if they would help.

Hi Denise - if I can message you too that would be great! I think I really just wanted to have some communication with people who have been through or are facing the same thing that I have to come. I can't talk more at the moment at work, but will be in touch as would like to ask about the IdeaLabs and learn from your journey through health best wishes, renaee.

 

[renz]

Im 53 now with thyroid nodules but when I was 20 years old I had a goiter was on thyroid. I am not on thyroid anymore and no more goiter. The nodules are new. Just want to throw that out there.

Does this mean that the goiter went away on it's own accord? thanks.

 

[beachbum]

Does this mean that the goiter went away on it's own accord? thanks.

Yes. While on thyroid meds. I am not on them anymore. I also had a biopsy and it was benign. I personally believe its all about inflammation, that's my own opinion.

 

[renz]

Yes. While on thyroid meds. I am not on them anymore. I also had a biopsy and it was benign. I personally believe its all about inflammation, that's my own opinion.

thankyou - that is v interesting to know.

 

[denise]

Hi Denise - if I can message you too that would be great! I think I really just wanted to have some communication with people who have been through or are facing the same thing that I have to come. I can't talk more at the moment at work, but will be in touch as would like to ask about the IdeaLabs and learn from your journey through health best wishes, renaee.

You're more than welcome to message me privately. I'm not sure how much of my own journey will be relevant for you, but I totally understand just wanting to find someone who's been in the same boat before who understands where you're coming from.

 

[renz]

Yeah sure you can message me.[/QUOTE]

Hi Benjamin, tried to message you, but it said your privacy settings would not allow?

 

[Herbie]

Yeah sure you can message me.

Hi Benjamin, tried to message you, but it said your privacy settings would not allow?[/QUOTE]

I think you have to choose to 'follow' me in order to message me.

 

[lollipop]

Hi Benjamin, tried to message you, but it said your privacy settings would not allow?

I think you have to choose to 'follow' me in order to message me.[/QUOTE]
@BenjaminBullock actually that is not true. It is your privacy setting. I screen shot it for you:

 

[tankasnowgod]

With regards to goiter, did you do any tests for iodine? Traditionally, goiter has been caused by iodine deficiency. I know Ray doesn't usually recommend iodine, and certainly not in the huge doses that the iodine doctors use, but he's stated that 150mcg is a safe amount (though it might be a bit different with goiter). Here's some quotes that functional alps have- The Myth of Iodine Deficiency: An Interview with Dr. Ray Peat – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)

 

[Herbie]

Thanks Lisa

 

[lollipop]

Thanks Lisa

 

[renz]

With regards to goiter, did you do any tests for iodine? Traditionally, goiter has been caused by iodine deficiency. I know Ray doesn't usually recommend iodine, and certainly not in the huge doses that the iodine doctors use, but he's stated that 150mcg is a safe amount (though it might be a bit different with goiter). Here's some quotes that functional alps have- The Myth of Iodine Deficiency: An Interview with Dr. Ray Peat – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)

Many thanks - i was out to a dinner with a woman last night who told me she had a severe iodine definciency and had been putting the 'orange paint' on her skin.
I will follow up on the link you sent. My next stop for reading, to start with more basics, is on the website, stop the thyroid madness, as I really don't know enough about it in terms of medication, and I need to cover the basics first.