Unsure If NDT Is Helping

[danjodingo]

Hello people,

I'm currently on 3 grains and have been for quite a while but am still having many symptoms such as; cold feet, chronic fatigue, anxiety, low mood, brain fog and just general malaise.

My blood-work shows my T3 is at the very top of the range, T4 the middle and TSH extremely suppressed.

Pulse/temps are generally about 60BPM/36.4C(96.8F) on waking and picking up a bit later on in day, although could be slightly higher.

Have been transitioning to pro-metabolic nutrition for the past few months, which definitely feels more satisfying than my previous lowish-carb paleo style diet (albeit with lots of 'cheat days' lol).

So basically im unsure of whether to increase NTD or try adding in some T3 to see if that helps. Or maybe this is all unrelated to thyroid... I have no idea. As my blood-work looks pretty good and my pulse/temps aren't too bad after the morning I don't know whether I need anymore but I also seem to have thyoidy type symtpoms...

If anyone has any insights or thoughts on where to go from here i'd be very greatful.

Thanks!

 

[Hans]

Hello people,

I'm currently on 3 grains and have been for quite a while but am still having many symptoms such as; cold feet, chronic fatigue, anxiety, low mood, brain fog and just general malaise.

My blood-work shows my T3 is at the very top of the range, T4 the middle and TSH extremely suppressed.

Pulse/temps are generally about 60BPM/36.4C(96.8F) on waking and picking up a bit later on in day, although could be slightly higher.

Have been transitioning to pro-metabolic nutrition for the past few months, which definitely feels more satisfying than my previous lowish-carb paleo style diet (albeit with lots of 'cheat days' lol).

So basically im unsure of whether to increase NTD or try adding in some T3 to see if that helps. Or maybe this is all unrelated to thyroid... I have no idea. As my blood-work looks pretty good and my pulse/temps aren't too bad after the morning I don't know whether I need anymore but I also seem to have thyoidy type symtpoms...

If anyone has any insights or thoughts on where to go from here i'd be very greatful.

Thanks!

Perhaps you can check rT3. If it's high then its blocking your T3.
Do you have gut issues?

 

[danjodingo]

Perhaps you can check rT3. If it's high then its blocking your T3.
Do you have gut issues?

Cool, I'll look into that. I have done that in the past and was okay but not for over a year.

Yeah on and off I get bloating + stomach pain, nothing major though. Have had functional tests and no pathogens but very high levels of yeast.

 

[danjodingo]

I forgot to add that I deal with hot flashes sometimes too and when I've tried to increase thyroid I think it increases the flashes (although hard to tell as it fluctuates from day to day anyway). But my body temp won't be high and I'll still have the cold feet with the hot flashes, so I'm not not sure if they're thyroid related.

 

[Connor888]

Following this thread.. ~ I'm on 5 grains myself but still feel cold and have anxiety. So frustrating.

 

[danjodingo]

Following this thread.. ~ I'm on 5 grains myself but still feel cold and have anxiety. So frustrating.

Yeah it's such a pain.

 

[Peatful]

Hello people,

I'm currently on 3 grains and have been for quite a while but am still having many symptoms such as; cold feet, chronic fatigue, anxiety, low mood, brain fog and just general malaise.

My blood-work shows my T3 is at the very top of the range, T4 the middle and TSH extremely suppressed.

Pulse/temps are generally about 60BPM/36.4C(96.8F) on waking and picking up a bit later on in day, although could be slightly higher.

Have been transitioning to pro-metabolic nutrition for the past few months, which definitely feels more satisfying than my previous lowish-carb paleo style diet (albeit with lots of 'cheat days' lol).

So basically im unsure of whether to increase NTD or try adding in some T3 to see if that helps. Or maybe this is all unrelated to thyroid... I have no idea. As my blood-work looks pretty good and my pulse/temps aren't too bad after the morning I don't know whether I need anymore but I also seem to have thyoidy type symtpoms...

If anyone has any insights or thoughts on where to go from here i'd be very greatful.

Thanks!

Welcome -

I have insights and thoughts because this happened to me.
You pretty much answered your own question btw.

I was so damaged from restrictive eating - digestively and metabolically- that the thyroid I was taking was causing more stress because I was revving the engine but had no gas in the tank.
You see this objectively with the very low morning temps. Cold extremities. Anxiety. Etc.
As well as the suppressed TSH.

Use food as your medicine.

As for me- I no longer need thyroid or any supplements. And if I do- they are used briefly, to be just that- a supplement to my diet- not a daily addiction (I meant to say addition but im keeping it as addiction).

 

[Lollipop2]

Welcome -

I have insights and thoughts because this happened to me.
You pretty much answered your own question btw.

I was so damaged from restrictive eating - digestively and metabolically- that the thyroid I was taking was causing more stress because I was revving the engine but had no gas in the tank.
You see this objectively with the very low morning temps. Cold extremities. Anxiety. Etc.
As well as the suppressed TSH.

Use food as your medicine.

As for me- I no longer need thyroid or any supplements. And if I do- they are used briefly, to be just that- a supplement to my diet- not a daily addiction (I meant to say addition but im keeping it as addiction).

So you simply increased the quantity of food and this healed your body from needing NDT? Did you pay attention to quality of food as well?

 

[Peatful]

So you simply increased the quantity of food and this healed your body from needing NDT? Did you pay attention to quality of food as well?

At the beginning I increased food and went the whole food kinda orthorexic route. Was still restrictive because it was “good” “nutritious” “whole” food.
I wasn’t getting better.

For me- when I let go. No more supplements. No more good versus bad food- is when my body began to heal.
To warm up. To rebuild.
Hormones balancing.
Calming down the chaos. (Migraines. Hot flashes. Scent auras. Malaise. Erratic temps. Non existent digestion. Periocular dermatitis. Telogen effluvium. Tinnitus. Etc.)

The last piece was/is my digestion.

Don’t know if that answers your question.

 

[Lollipop2]

For me- when I let go. No more supplements. No more good versus bad food- is when my body began to heal.
To warm up. To rebuild.
Hormones balancing.
Calming down the chaos. (Migraines. Hot flashes. Scent auras. Malaise. Erratic temps. Non existent digestion. Periocular dermatitis. Telogen effluvium. Tinnitus. Etc.)

Interesting. I think it will be telling your long term experience with this strategy. I wonder if overtime your body will crave homemade, fresh, organic, low PUFA food? I myself made great strides eating food - homemade, organic, fresh (not from packages) low PUFA, medium oxalate foods. For example I make my own homemade Einkorn sourdough bread, chicken enchiladas, pan friend chicken in butter and ghee, roasted broccoli, homemade onion rings made in pan with ghee and butter, quiches, etc, etc.

 

[danjodingo]

Welcome -

I have insights and thoughts because this happened to me.
You pretty much answered your own question btw.

I was so damaged from restrictive eating - digestively and metabolically- that the thyroid I was taking was causing more stress because I was revving the engine but had no gas in the tank.
You see this objectively with the very low morning temps. Cold extremities. Anxiety. Etc.
As well as the suppressed TSH.

Use food as your medicine.

As for me- I no longer need thyroid or any supplements. And if I do- they are used briefly, to be just that- a supplement to my diet- not a daily addiction (I meant to say addition but im keeping it as addiction).

Thanks for the insights, Peatful.

So as I heal my metabolism with diet, I should be able to taper off the NDT? Or, are they just making things worse and if be better off tapering off now?

 

[Peatful]

Thanks for the insights, Peatful.

So as I heal my metabolism with diet, I should be able to taper off the NDT? Or, are they just making things worse and if be better off tapering off now?

my limited opinion only- is it depends on-why are you “hypothyroid “.

A true hypothyroid person will probably always benefit from conservative added support.

My Hashimoto's and thyroid problems were from a stressed chaotic undernourished body.

From your brief intro above- id say food as medicine will heal you and tapering now can start the healing process.
Go slow.
Keep a log if that helps you. (For me- it didn't because I was too messed up in the head with over a decade plus of severe restriction).

It was a ton of trial and error for me- but our bodies are amazing and always looking for balance and health. Hence why you are feeling malaise, anxiety, etc. - its letting you know its out of balance.
Hope this helps.

 

[danjodingo]

my limited opinion only- is it depends on-why are you “hypothyroid “.

A true hypothyroid person will probably always benefit from conservative added support.

My Hashimoto's and thyroid problems were from a stressed chaotic undernourished body.

From your brief intro above- id say food as medicine will heal you and tapering now can start the healing process.
Go slow.
Keep a log if that helps you. (For me- it didn't because I was too messed up in the head with over a decade plus of severe restriction).

It was a ton of trial and error for me- but our bodies are amazing and always looking for balance and health. Hence why you are feeling malaise, anxiety, etc. - its letting you know its out of balance.
Hope this helps.

Noted. Thanks for the advice and encouragement

 

[mostlylurking]

Maybe my recent experience will provide some insight. I've been on 3 grains of NDT for 6 years. I was doing pretty well, lost some weight, no inflammation, clear headed, my Peaty diet and the NDT had made me 15 years younger.

Then last summer I got a bladder infection. They gave me Bactrim for the infection. It made me feel horrible and I quit after 6 days (4 days early). I haven't been healthy ever since. Four months later, I had all the hypothyroid symptoms again in spades. I gained 20 pounds and the inflammation was horrendous. I got my thyroid numbers checked. My T3 was too high, outside of the range. My doctor lowered the prescription by half a grain and scheduled me for tests in 30 days. I couldn't believe I had all my old symptoms and my T3 was too high.

So I started reading on line. I learned that Bactrim is a goitrogen. It also blocks thiamine. I read that this doesn't just resolve itself on its own after stopping the Bactrim. I also read that if you suspect you have a thiamine deficiency you can simply take some thiamine and see what happens. I had been taking about 75 mg/day of thiamine for a long time. I took 300 mg to test. My temperature shot up from 98 degrees to 99 degrees in about 45 minutes and my inflammation disappeared instantly. So I had a clue what to do but it didn't keep working.

I emailed Dr. Peat; he responded and said to eat raw carrot and cooked mushrooms. So I got really serious about doing that every day. I kept reading. Evidently the antibiotic had really damaged my gut (no pain, who knew?) and I learned that you can't absorb nutrients, including thiamine and magnesium, if your gut's damaged. And you need thiamine and magnesium to heal the gut. So for the past 2 weeks I've been sort of mega dosing thiamine and magnesium. And drinking lots of OJ for the potassium.

I was worried that all that magnesium wasn't what I should be doing to a damaged gut. So I backed off the magnesium for one day. And I ate a tiny bit of really ripe golden sweet pineapple at dinner. I woke up at 2:00 AM in inflammation hell. So I studied on line some more and learned that if you supplement thiamine without magnesium you increase serotonin. And pineapple is serotonergic too so I had done a double whammy to myself. Won't do that again.

I've been doing the high dose thiamine and the magnesium for about 2 weeks and I am a LOT better. After eating the pineapple I thought I needed to go to a neurologist for an IV of thiamine but now my head has cleared out and the tight band
around my head is gone. I'm going to stick with this for a while longer.

I suspect that I've been borderline in trouble with a thiamine deficiency for a very long time. The Bactrim made it worse. Increasing my sugared coffee and learning how to make really good gummies (gelatin, sugar, fruit juice, lemon juice) got me into real trouble.

links of interest: Vitamin B1, anti-estrogenic, pro-DHT, anti-serotonin, pro-dopamine » MENELITE
and Thiamine and Thyroid: 3 Hidden Thyroid Benefits You Don’t Want to Miss

Hope this was helpful.

 

[danjodingo]

Thanks for that, very interesting.

I'm not sure if its that solution for me though, one of my supplements has a decent amount of B1 and I also take magnesium.

None the less, I'm glad you're feeling better.

 

[Vileplume]

At the beginning I increased food and went the whole food kinda orthorexic route. Was still restrictive because it was “good” “nutritious” “whole” food.
I wasn’t getting better.

For me- when I let go. No more supplements. No more good versus bad food- is when my body began to heal.
To warm up. To rebuild.
Hormones balancing.
Calming down the chaos. (Migraines. Hot flashes. Scent auras. Malaise. Erratic temps. Non existent digestion. Periocular dermatitis. Telogen effluvium. Tinnitus. Etc.)

The last piece was/is my digestion.

Don’t know if that answers your question.

Thanks for sharing this. I love posts like this because I have developed very orthorexic behaviors that I’m very afraid to let go of. What would you say to someone who has yet to “let go” due to fear of weight gain?

 

[Peatful]

Thanks for sharing this. I love posts like this because I have developed very orthorexic behaviors that I’m very afraid to let go of. What would you say to someone who has yet to “let go” due to fear of weight gain?

Im so glad you reached out.
Thank you for letting us know.

You are ahead of the curve if you know you are undernourished or orthorexic. So you are probably more than half way there.

Are you tired of being sick and or stressed?
Are you tired of not knowing what if feels like to be free?
When was the last time you were carefree and full of energy?
Can you imagine life without the unsaid rules of restrictive eating and exercise?

Let the “fear”of where you will go if you don't get better motivate you.
If it doesn’t- then you may not be ready just yet- but all it takes is that one first step- more of a minds choice - and then healthier behaviors will follow.

Know and surrender to the fact that its going to suck. That its going to feel foreign to anyway of living that we have chosen prior- be it decades like me or even a year of keto etc.

There is almost an identity crisis you kind of go through.
I know I sure did. But with purpose.
And I owed no one an explanation.

Don’t lose sight of the goal.
You will feel so empowered and full of life and peace.

Lastly, inbox me anytime. Seriously.
Im a mom and I work- but I will always get back to you.

You’ve got this; whenever you’re ready. Best to you.

 

[Vileplume]

Im so glad you reached out.
Thank you for letting us know.

You are ahead of the curve if you know you are undernourished or orthorexic. So you are probably more than half way there.

Are you tired of being sick and or stressed?
Are you tired of not knowing what if feels like to be free?
When was the last time you were carefree and full of energy?
Can you imagine life without the unsaid rules of restrictive eating and exercise?

Let the “fear”of where you will go if you don't get better motivate you.
If it doesn’t- then you may not be ready just yet- but all it takes is that one first step- more of a minds choice - and then healthier behaviors will follow.

Know and surrender to the fact that its going to suck. That its going to feel foreign to anyway of living that we have chosen prior- be it decades like me or even a year of keto etc.

There is almost an identity crisis you kind of go through.
I know I sure did. But with purpose.
And I owed no one an explanation.

Don’t lose sight of the goal.
You will feel so empowered and full of life and peace.

Lastly, inbox me anytime. Seriously.
Im a mom and I work- but I will always get back to you.

You’ve got this; whenever you’re ready. Best to you.

Thanks, @Peatful. I appreciate everything you write on this forum, because it always contains evident love.