Unlisted ingredients in commercial orange juices (FDA not required to label)

[Xemnoraq]

I'm starting this thread as some inspiration from a podcast Georgi was on, he mentioned that he sent various foods that we all consume regularly to a lab to have them analyzed for impurities which resulted in some surprising findings such as silica/endotoxin/fecal matter in various dairy products etc.
Since i don't have access to a lab this prompted me to look further in to some of the Peat inspired foods we consume on a daily basis,

I noticed that when i would consume large amounts of orange juice i would get very serotonergic symptoms similar to if i had ingested carageenan, irritation, stress, anxiety, highly inflamed gut, i had been on an almost COMPLETELY liquid diet and starch free for almost 2 years because the gut issues were that bad.

As i looked further into orange juice i found out they have ingredients that are likely irritating and allergenic, however they are not required to be labelled on the package because they don't go beyond what the FDA determines an appropriate limit.
-------------------------------------------
These mystery ingredients consist of:
Flavour packets to re-flavour the orange juice after its been sitting in storage for so long
and unknown enzymes (which reminds me of the allergenic microbial enzymes in cheese
Silica is also likely present
(And as well as some of the plastic endocrine disruptors as they generally come in plastic containers)
-------------------------------------------
Here is a link made by @Dan Wich (kudos to him) that confirms which orange juice brands contain these unlisted potentially harmful ingredients,

Orange juices with/without flavor packs and pulp-dissolving enzymes - Toxinless

List of orange juice brands with and without flavor packs and pulp-dissolving enzymes.

www.toxinless.com

And so i was drinking simply orange thinking it was a higher quality orange juice which i then found out was owned by the major coca cola company ?‍
-------------------------------------------

So, the last part i want to add (because i want to keep this short and sweet)
is that i decided to completely cut out all commercial OJ brands (and OJ in general because there are no homemade brands available to me currently)
and ironically enough, i repeat IRONICALLY ENOUGH
I can perfectly digest starch again every single day with little to no symptoms whatsoever, i've been eating potatoes almost every single day, rice as well, and scallops (which would give me huge irritation before) its as if everything just completely cleared up day and night which then arises the question,

How many of us, that are consuming these garbage brands of OJ in excessive amounts, how many of us might just be poisoning ourselves with these unlisted irritants? And how many of our problems might be caused or simply remedied simply by cutting out these irritants in our diet and replacing it with freshly squeezed OJ.

If you consider the fact that irritants such as carageenan/silica etc. not only damage the intestine, but cause dysbiosis, and allow large amounts of endotoxin to flood the bloodstream as a result, then it would only be rational to assume that whatever these mystery ingredients consist of, combined with possible silica contamination AND the amount of estrogenic plastic particles that get consume in large amounts because we all drink so much orange juice, then, it would be rational to assume that those low end orange juices even tropicana could be absolutely destroying gut function and causing the buildup of endotoxin and FFA's and the accumulation of plastics could be destroying our health and maybe even responsible for a good deal if not for some people, all of their gut problems.

For me, simply removing these irritants from my diet allowed me to go from being so inflamed in the gut that i wouldn't have the energy to get out of bed at times to being able to consume starches, scallops etc. every day in large quantities with no inflammation, and no feeling of being flooded with endotoxin/serotonin/cortisol etc. just that alone allowed me to eat foods like a normal human being again, as simple as just removing the irritants from the diet that disrupt gut function, cause inflammation and the resulting flooding of endotoxin/serotonin/cortisol,

it seems like we can't even trust these orange juice brands anymore either,

What are your takes on this guys and girls? anybody else remove commercial orange juice and get reversal of symptoms day and night like me? is anybody else aware of what these flavour packets or enzymes they treat it with consist of? does anybody know anything we don't know? such as the level of silica or BPA's contaminated in these plastic containers? and how large amounts that we drink OJ in could be leading to the accumulation of these things?

Let's have a discussion, i'd love to hear everyones input ?

 

[rr1]

I'm starting this thread as some inspiration from a podcast Georgi was on, he mentioned that he sent various foods that we all consume regularly to a lab to have them analyzed for impurities which resulted in some surprising findings such as silica/endotoxin/fecal matter in various dairy products etc.
Since i don't have access to a lab this prompted me to look further in to some of the Peat inspired foods we consume on a daily basis,

I noticed that when i would consume large amounts of orange juice i would get very serotonergic symptoms similar to if i had ingested carageenan, irritation, stress, anxiety, highly inflamed gut, i had been on an almost COMPLETELY liquid diet and starch free for almost 2 years because the gut issues were that bad.

As i looked further into orange juice i found out they have ingredients that are likely irritating and allergenic, however they are not required to be labelled on the package because they don't go beyond what the FDA determines an appropriate limit.
-------------------------------------------
These mystery ingredients consist of:
Flavour packets to re-flavour the orange juice after its been sitting in storage for so long
and unknown enzymes (which reminds me of the allergenic microbial enzymes in cheese
Silica is also likely present
(And as well as some of the plastic endocrine disruptors as they generally come in plastic containers)
-------------------------------------------
Here is a link made by @Dan Wich (kudos to him) that confirms which orange juice brands contain these unlisted potentially harmful ingredients,

Orange juices with/without flavor packs and pulp-dissolving enzymes - Toxinless

List of orange juice brands with and without flavor packs and pulp-dissolving enzymes.

www.toxinless.com

And so i was drinking simply orange thinking it was a higher quality orange juice which i then found out was owned by the major coca cola company ?‍
-------------------------------------------

So, the last part i want to add (because i want to keep this short and sweet)
is that i decided to completely cut out all commercial OJ brands (and OJ in general because there are no homemade brands available to me currently)
and ironically enough, i repeat IRONICALLY ENOUGH
I can perfectly digest starch again every single day with little to no symptoms whatsoever, i've been eating potatoes almost every single day, rice as well, and scallops (which would give me huge irritation before) its as if everything just completely cleared up day and night which then arises the question,

How many of us, that are consuming these garbage brands of OJ in excessive amounts, how many of us might just be poisoning ourselves with these unlisted irritants? And how many of our problems might be caused or simply remedied simply by cutting out these irritants in our diet and replacing it with freshly squeezed OJ.

If you consider the fact that irritants such as carageenan/silica etc. not only damage the intestine, but cause dysbiosis, and allow large amounts of endotoxin to flood the bloodstream as a result, then it would only be rational to assume that whatever these mystery ingredients consist of, combined with possible silica contamination AND the amount of estrogenic plastic particles that get consume in large amounts because we all drink so much orange juice, then, it would be rational to assume that those low end orange juices even tropicana could be absolutely destroying gut function and causing the buildup of endotoxin and FFA's and the accumulation of plastics could be destroying our health and maybe even responsible for a good deal if not for some people, all of their gut problems.

For me, simply removing these irritants from my diet allowed me to go from being so inflamed in the gut that i wouldn't have the energy to get out of bed at times to being able to consume starches, scallops etc. every day in large quantities with no inflammation, and no feeling of being flooded with endotoxin/serotonin/cortisol etc. just that alone allowed me to eat foods like a normal human being again, as simple as just removing the irritants from the diet that disrupt gut function, cause inflammation and the resulting flooding of endotoxin/serotonin/cortisol,

it seems like we can't even trust these orange juice brands anymore either,

What are your takes on this guys and girls? anybody else remove commercial orange juice and get reversal of symptoms day and night like me? is anybody else aware of what these flavour packets or enzymes they treat it with consist of? does anybody know anything we don't know? such as the level of silica or BPA's contaminated in these plastic containers? and how large amounts that we drink OJ in could be leading to the accumulation of these things?

Let's have a discussion, i'd love to hear everyones input ?

I've had to cut out commercial OJ. It causes the mucus in my nose to become so thick and stringy that it's almost impossible to blow out.

 

[gaze]

why would OJ manufactures add silica? what use would that have for them? I think more likely is irritation from unripe oranges, almost no OJs are 100% ripe. I also suspect some of them add in citric acid without labeling it

 

[Xemnoraq]

why would OJ manufactures add silica? what use would that have for them? I think more likely is irritation from unripe oranges, almost no OJs are 100% ripe. I also suspect some of them add in citric acid without labeling it

silica isnt confirmed but when Georgi had the dairy products sent to a lab he mentioned silica was a common contaminant if i recall, i dont think silica is something they would add but i think its something that can make its way in, and ive considered that too that they could be adding citric acid, in fact that could be a possible ingredient in those flavour packs, and if thats the case, citric acid has the risk of heavy metal contamination so thats not good

 

[gaze]

silica isnt confirmed but when Georgi had the dairy products sent to a lab he mentioned silica was a common contaminant if i recall, i dont think silica is something they would add but i think its something that can make its way in, and ive considered that too that they could be adding citric acid, in fact that could be a possible ingredient in those flavour packs, and if thats the case, citric acid has the risk of heavy metal contamination so thats not good

i think the silica in milk comes from the added vitamins in dairy. silicon dioxide is common as a vitamin supplement, which would get into the milk. i don't think they would add it into OJ unless it has some special preservative property which i don't think it does. and yea, the citric acid seems to be allergenic in of itself unrelated to heavy metals. it makes me sneeze and gives me a runny nose when i eat something with it

 

[Xemnoraq]

i think the silica in milk comes from the added vitamins in dairy. silicon dioxide is common as a vitamin supplement, which would get into the milk. i don't think they would add it into OJ unless it has some special preservative property which i don't think it does. and yea, the citric acid seems to be allergenic in of itself unrelated to heavy metals. it makes me sneeze and gives me a runny nose when i eat something with it

interesting, so your suggesting the silica in milk likely comes from the impurities in the added vitamin A & D? ive always been concerned about that and wish i could find milk without additives, do you have any sources you know off hand i can read through on that, id love to find out more because this is interesting i never considered that it might come from the added vitamins thanks for sharing i appreciate that!

 

[Broken man]

Ye, this is perfect, thank you for this thread. The thing is that cheeses, coffee, meat, youghurts and other foods are also full of bad things.

 

[gaze]

interesting, so your suggesting the silica in milk likely comes from the impurities in the added vitamin A & D? ive always been concerned about that and wish i could find milk without additives, do you have any sources you know off hand i can read through on that, id love to find out more because this is interesting i never considered that it might come from the added vitamins thanks for sharing i appreciate that!

Added vitamins to milk -- I contacted my local milk company and I have info | Ray Peat Forum

 

[TheBeard]

I just had some low temperature pasteurized milk from the same company I buy raw milk from.
Same A2 grass fed organic milk, non homogenized.

But because it was pasteurized, it had an incredibly burnt taste, that was aweful.

I'm never drinking any other milk than raw milk. I'd rather not drink milk if I can't find any.

 

[Perry Staltic]

Don't know if they're still doing it, but the rest stops on I-75 in Florida used to sell fresh squeezed orange juice that was made on the spot. It was delicious. Part of the reason, I'm sure, it tasted so good, was because they squeezed whole oranges with the peel. Which meant that we were getting dosed with who knows what residual pesticides/fungicides in the peel. I have no idea if any commercial OJ manufacturers do that.

 

[Dave Clark]

One possible source of silica in citrus: file:///C:/Users/freec_000/Downloads/86333-Article%20Text-108201-1-10-20150921.pdf

 

[livesimply]

interesting, so your suggesting the silica in milk likely comes from the impurities in the added vitamin A & D? ive always been concerned about that and wish i could find milk without additives, do you have any sources you know off hand i can read through on that, id love to find out more because this is interesting i never considered that it might come from the added vitamins thanks for sharing i appreciate that!

I live in Delaware and they sadly prohibit the sale of all raw milk. I buy Maple Hill Grassfed Whole Milk (Milk - Maple Hill) which has no added vitamins. Yes, it's ultra-pasteurized but it's the best I can find.

 

[schultz]

I don't have a problem with juice myself. I try to pick brands that taste sweet and "fruity", not acidic and weird. The best juice I've had is freshly squeezed. It tastes completely different than commercial orange juice. But it's expensive and it is not always available, or it is but they've used unripe fruit to make it so it tastes bad. So I get it seasonally.

I'm starting this thread as some inspiration from a podcast Georgi was on, he mentioned that he sent various foods that we all consume regularly to a lab to have them analyzed for impurities which resulted in some surprising findings such as silica/endotoxin/fecal matter in various dairy products etc.

I don't find it surprising that they would find endotoxin considering how ubiquitous it is. Bacteria are everywhere. If you sanitize something, the endotoxin will still be there even though the bacteria have died. We all breath in endotoxin everyday. I'm not sure eating endotoxin is even a problem. Maybe in huge amounts?

Small amounts of fecal matter wouldn't be that surprising also considering where the udder is on a cow. Cows have messy poops. Goats are a lot cleaner.

Silica could come from the added vitamins like someone mentioned?

 

[koky]

let's not be shy - just name brands that cause problems!

 

[Fred]

I'm pretty sure the chemical flavor packets are not allowed in organic OJ. Whole Foods 365 Organic pulp-free is good, as is Uncle Matt's. Always get pulp-free, as the pulp is enzymatically treated.

 

[BearWithMe]

Anyone knows if this is allowed in Europe? I have spent like 4 hours researching it and I have found very little info.

 

[meatbag]

>Do you think canned not from concentrate juice is ok or should it be avoided?

(ray)If it's in glass it might be o.k. Even the so-called pulp-free juices now might have been processed with enzymes to liquefy pulp.

>What about commercial pulp-free OJ in a plastic container like florida's natural brand?

(ray)If it separates into an orange-colored sediment and a nearly clear supernatant, it's probably natural, but even the so-called pulp-free juices now often contain the enzyme-solublized pulpy refuse.
Ray Peat Email Advice Depository
-
So I guess it can be helpful to watch if it seperates into the distinctive layers. If it doesn't it probably has stuff like the enzymes added to it

 

[BearWithMe]

>Do you think canned not from concentrate juice is ok or should it be avoided?

(ray)If it's in glass it might be o.k. Even the so-called pulp-free juices now might have been processed with enzymes to liquefy pulp.

>What about commercial pulp-free OJ in a plastic container like florida's natural brand?

(ray)If it separates into an orange-colored sediment and a nearly clear supernatant, it's probably natural, but even the so-called pulp-free juices now often contain the enzyme-solublized pulpy refuse.
Ray Peat Email Advice Depository
-
So I guess it can be helpful to watch if it seperates into the distinctive layers. If it doesn't it probably has stuff like the enzymes added to it

This is very useful, thank you!

 

[Dr. B]

I just had some low temperature pasteurized milk from the same company I buy raw milk from.
Same A2 grass fed organic milk, non homogenized.

But because it was pasteurized, it had an incredibly burnt taste, that was aweful.

I'm never drinking any other milk than raw milk. I'd rather not drink milk if I can't find any.

which brand is this?
im unsure of the low temp pasteurization cuz its 145 degrees for 30 minutes whereas regular pasteurization is 161 degrees for 15 seconds.

interesting, so your suggesting the silica in milk likely comes from the impurities in the added vitamin A & D? ive always been concerned about that and wish i could find milk without additives, do you have any sources you know off hand i can read through on that, id love to find out more because this is interesting i never considered that it might come from the added vitamins thanks for sharing i appreciate that!

not impuruties but the silica might be an anti caking agent.
any milk without added vitamins should be fine but preferably organic. if your in the US only whole milk can legally be sold without fortified vitamins. the vitamin mixes contain propylene glycol,polysorbate 80, sometimes sunflower oil, silica, maybe carrageenan.
also many orange juices do add calcium or vitamin d to them which would explain silica. I think an organic orange juice like whole foods store brand should be fine? I noticed the non organic orange juices have a very sour tart taste whereas the organic OJ at whole foods and costco has a much sweeter, better taste.

 

[Dr. B]

I'm pretty sure the chemical flavor packets are not allowed in organic OJ. Whole Foods 365 Organic pulp-free is good, as is Uncle Matt's. Always get pulp-free, as the pulp is enzymatically treated.

im curious what uncle matts flash pasteurization method is, how does it differ from like whole foods organic OJ pasteurization...

I live in Delaware and they sadly prohibit the sale of all raw milk. I buy Maple Hill Grassfed Whole Milk (Milk - Maple Hill) which has no added vitamins. Yes, it's ultra-pasteurized but it's the best I can find.

there has to be something at a whole foods or similar store which isnt ultra pasteurized? probably priced similar to maple hill. isnt delaware close to pennsylvania.