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Tyronene + Tyromix + Pansterone Mixed Results

Discussion in 'Pharmaceutical Drugs' started by Bart1, Aug 1, 2018.

  1. Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    Hi there,

    I'm about three months into peating, still learning everyday and came to the conclusion that I'm very hypothyroid. I first began implementing eating more peatlike, I felt a little bit better but I knew I had to start with thyroid. After a session with an endocrinologist who said there was nothing wrong with me I knew I had to start self medication.

    I started with Pansterone 4 drops topically. It improved my libido and energy a lot. I increased to 2x 4 drops a day but then I think a started to get some high cortisol symptoms, some weird cushing like things, a got a bit of a lump on the back of my neck, it feels thick and I got some achy pain under my armpits. I don't feel enlarged glands or anything but these are strange things, although I do remember this feeling from a couple of years ago.

    I went back to 4 drops Pansterone and started with Tyronene in the day and Tyromix in the evening. I felt very relaxed on Tyronene and also Tyromix, libido increased even more also better mood. I felt warmer and my heart rate increased a bit. The only thing now is that my sleeping which was already bad went worse. I wake up at night feels like high adrenaline. I take some milk with salt and honey but I still don't have a deep sleek and wake early with stress like symptoms.

    So it seems my cortisol problem is getting worse. I was under the impression that T3 should lower cortisol, as wel as pansterone. I increased my calorie intake, I feel I'm on the right path but something is not going well. Can somebody point me in the right direction ?
     
  2. James ardagna

    James ardagna Member

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    somewhere I think Peat says that t4 will lower adrenaline, however, thyroid hormone will make you more sensitive to adrenaline as the stress hormones over time give way to the supplemental thyroid as the driver of metabolism.
     
  3. ecstatichamster

    ecstatichamster Member

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    I think there is a transition period for this. For me, T3 and T4 didn’t help me until I had lowered my stored PUFAs through some episodes of no fat or very low fat.

    You might try waking up and taking a little T4 and T3 and going back to sleep.
     
  4. OP
    Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    thanks for your replies. Indeed I was thinking the same thing, the body probably needs time to adjust to the new situation. I'm not that fat btw. I'm 1.86m and now I weigh about 79 kilo's. I was loosing quite some weight and I think muscle mass. It seem to stabilize now. I think I also lost a lot of water, due to increase of salt intake, I had some edema around my ankles. My liver health seems to improve as wel. Although sometimes when I take the pansterone I get a bit dizzy for a couple of minutes. Pregnonelone convert partly into Progesterone, which can convert in Cortisol, is that something I need to watch out for ?
     
  5. TripleOG

    TripleOG Member

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    You found success with topical or oral Tyronene/Tyromix?

    Things started falling into place when I lowered fat, cut starch, and stayed active. There was definitely a sensitivity to adrenaline when I first started messing with thyroid. Cup of salted OJ at bedside helped.
     
  6. James ardagna

    James ardagna Member

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    I think haidut has covered the topic of pregnenolone and its lowering effect on cortisol, or should I say normalising effect. the key is to realise that you are getting your body to switch from stress hormone driven metabolism to thyroid metabolism. this should be done slowly (Danny roddy has some good guidelines on his patreon site) as their will be adjustments for your body to make (such as being more sensitive to adrenaline and probably other hormones as well). things like coffee are good for your liver but will possibly drive adrenaline high until the thyroid metabolism takes over.
     
  7. OP
    Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    I take it orally. currently 2 drops of tyronene during the day and in the evening 1 drop of Tyromix.

    I feel a bit stressed, but when I take tyronene I relax almost immediatly, temps and heart rate increase a bit.

    About Tyromix, my reserve T3 was in the upper reference range when I took a blood sample before I started with Tyromix. Could taking Tyromix with the T4 result in higher cortisol to block the extra T4 it is getting ?
     
  8. OP
    Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    Yes you're absolutely right but it's a bit scary :( The last couple of weeks I seem to be losing muscle mass/weight. My muscles feel very spongy. I think this is my liver having trouble with managing insulin ? After my morning shake (OJ,Milk,Cane Sugar, Gelatin, Sugar, Salt) I feel that my muscle feed up a bit and that they have more volume but during the day it's gone. My skin feels very thin I can feel tendons. Maybe this is also because I lost some water retention ?
     
  9. Wagner83

    Wagner83 Member

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    You report high stress symptoms and the thin skin was recently described by haidut as a sign of high cortisol (transparent, too thin). I'd consider ditching the supplements and eating solid foods rather than liquid. Gelatin can be an issue as well. You're already quite low in kg, how much calories do you eat? Perhaps pushing metabolism when already really lean and underfed can be problematic.
     
  10. OP
    Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    This is what I eat generally, but to be honest probably won't make this everyday, it's hard for me to get to 3000+ calories, unless I eat more fat and sugar... Should I add more sugar in my liquids ? Can I eat something solid like oats or buckwheat flakes , they have phyto estrogens right ?
     

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  11. OP
    Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    Really worried about my health. My skin got very thin and my muscles feel very spongy. How could these supplements create this situation?

    I tested my cholesterol; it’s around 175. Low cholesterol means bad liver health? My blood liver functions are good. Could low cholesterol cause increase of cortisol when I take thyroid and pregnenolon?

    Could taking to much thyroid to fast cause a thyroid storm? I had a swollen neck which seems to have shrunken. Could to much stuff be secreted and gave resulted in increased stress hormones?

    Could taking thyroid + pregnenolone with vitamin/mineral deficiency increase cortisol?

    What can I do best? I dropped supplements except for 1 drop of tyromix spread out over the day with some juice
     
  12. alywest

    alywest Member

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    How have you been testing thyroid, especially since you're supplementing? Temps and pulse? If your cholesterol is actually low it's unlikely that you are hypothyroid at this point, and you actually might be driving yourself to hyperthyroidism, which also can result in low energy, weight loss, etc. I would reduce the supps and do the temps and pulse until you feel that you have reached a good point with them, and then start taking something like stressnon (pregnenolone only). and then slowly add in the pansterone one drop at a time. Ideally you should be able to take the full 15 drops per day to get some androgenic effects. Pregnenolone should help reduce stress reactions when taken alone, and the better thyroid function should help your body excrete excess cortisol. Also, pregnenolone should help fill in for the lower cholesterol as a basic material to make all the other steroids.
     
  13. OP
    Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    Thaks for your reply. My temps and pulse are really low. I have a high RT3 which indicates a conversion issue. Everytime I take pansterone, I feel good for half an hour but after that not so great. As if it’s partly used. Still figuring out why I have high cortisol. I’m thinking I have SIBO.
     
  14. alywest

    alywest Member

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    Again I wouldn't take pansterone until you get to the point where you are not having cortisol or stress reactions. Remember, pansterone also has DHEA in it which can go in many different directions. Find a pregnenolone supplement, like stressnon or a powder with high purity, like heath natura. But in the meantime, perhaps the ratio of t4 to t3 you are taking isn't working for you. It might not be good to take as much t3 as you are. Maybe just try the tyromix alone, and then try to eat things with selenium to ensure you are converting it to t3.
     
  15. alywest

    alywest Member

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    I also want to add that thiamine HCI, magnesium carbonate and niacinamide have really helped me sleep better. B1 helps increase CO2 levels, which lower adrenaline. Also, glycine in the form of collagen or gelatin in bone broth would be really useful for you while you recover and restore some liver glycogen. Bone broth is a lot cheaper, and it's a lot better when you add something like chicken feet to the pot to increase gelatin content. Putting apple cider vinegar in the pot helps pull minerals from the bones, as well. Eggshell calcium is good, too, just don't take too much. It can actually help lower endotoxin, so that's a bonus.
     
  16. OP
    Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    @alywest Thanks very much for the tips. I have diluted the thyroid so that I can take smaller doses. But still I feel adrenaline pumping through my body. Now two months later I'm almost 20 pounds heavier! :jawdrop: I'm in doubt if it is water retention or fat (probably both). I have increased my sugar, salt and calorie intake. I haven't eaten much sugar in the years before Peat inspired eating. From may till august I actually lost a bit of weight. I suddenly gained a lot of weight. I'm also using Cypro and I understand that you can gain weight from that. I think I have a serious gut problem. Could that be the cause of high stress ? one of my main problems is vertigo/light headed feeling.
     
  17. jitsmonkey

    jitsmonkey Member

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    If you're dosing thyroid and you're not tracking pulse and temp (waking / pre-post feedings) you're doing it wrong.
     
  18. OP
    Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    Yes I am tracking pulse and temp. However, even the lowest dose gives me such a stress response. I have tried it a couple of times to hold on for two weeks but it isn't working for me I'm afraid.
     
  19. alywest

    alywest Member

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    Yeah, you probably have quite a bit of endotoxin which leads to serotonin, etc. I would work on getting CO2 up with thiamine or bag breathing, and then work on cleaning the system. Do you do the carrot salad or at least a carrot or two daily? Some people swear by activated charcoal in a large dose once or twice a week to keep endotoxin manageable. I also like using famotidine because it seems to really help my gut, by lowering serotonin. Look it up on the forum for more information. Taurine could also help you immensely by helping to restore glycogen in the liver, which should help reduce adrenaline, especially during the night when blood sugar runs low. If you gained weight you possibly are consuming too much sugar too fast, sugar is good, but you need to have it slowly over time. Raising the blood sugar too quickly isn't good, and can result in insulin resistance. Niacinamide can help with insulin resistance, as can aspirin. If you take aspirin make sure you also take a quality K2 supplement.
     
  20. OP
    Bart1

    Bart1 Member

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    Yes I have really weird symptoms, some neurological stuff. I do the carrot salad. Once or twice a week some activated charcoal. Both seem to give me some relief. I will try some of your suggestions, thank you very much!
     
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