Troubleshooting Foamy Urine

ironfist

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Ray Peat sees urine foam from a hormonal standpoint, having to do with high estrogen..But that does not apply to me.

And pretty much all conventional doctors, aligned with the Talmudist Google search engine, will tell you it is a kidney problem. All the time. No ifs and buts.

And it will be about the kidney dysfunctional based on its inability to keep protein, especially albumin, from being excreted.

So they pretend to verify this by measuring your eGFR. GFR means the glomerular filtration rate, which is quite simply the same as kidney filtration rate. Using a nebulous formula (of course it's based on 'science') involving serum creatinine, age, sex, and race. Based on this, you will know if your kidneys are okay or not. With you unaware that you are healthy, you maybe stricken thinking you have chronic kidney disease, from a scale of 1 to 5, the higher the worse your kidney is.

All because you're serum creatinine is high, and it is high because you excrete albumin.

And not because something is wrong with your kidneys. But because as a result of high albumin excretion, your blood volume is low, and because of that, your serum creatinine is high.

And blood volume is low because your blood has low albumin. And low albumin holds on to less salt, and less salt attracts less water into plasma, leading to low plasma volume and low blood volume.

Albumin is excreted by perfectly healthy kidneys, only because the albumin excreted is oxidized albumin. Albumin is oxidized because albumin is the main antioxidant outside our cells, and albumin protects us from oxidative stresses going on to keep our tissues from being destroyed by oxidative stress.

So watch out! Knowing this keeps voodoo doctors from destroying your kidneys through their voodoo drugs.

There's a lot of misinformation here.

Kidneys do not excrete protein normally.

Protein are like serrations that damage the filters in the kidney when they pass through. The more this happens, the more damage your kidneys get. This damage is (normally) irreversible. If you have protein in your urine, you probably have some level of kidney disease. It doesn't matter if you disagree with "Talmudist Google" on this, because this is how kidneys perform.

I am unaware why you believe eGFR is not a real thing. It's a lab of kidney filtration. There is an entire group of people over on r/kidneydisease who will take issue with everything you said.

With this considered, not all foamy urine is protein. There are videos on youtube of people with foamy urine checking their samples and showing negative.
 

yerrag

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There's a lot of misinformation here.
No, merely correcting the widespread misinformation you swallow hook line and sinker. Haven't you gone thru the COVID hoaxing and learned nothing from it?

Open your eyes. Open your mind.

Ever ask why people told they have kidney disease get worse even after taking their drugs? Is it possible the drugs themselves are making the condition worse progressively?

Ever ask why people on BP medication end up with kidney problems, even as the doctors will scare patients into BP medication because they make this story up about high BP causing kidney issues?


There's a lot of misinformation here.

Kidneys do not excrete protein normally.
Who said otherwise?

Oxidized albumin getting thru the kidney filters is just naturally what happens when the ionic charges in the oxidized albumin make it pass thru the kidney filters. Albumin that isn't oxidized, however, don't get past the kidney filters.


Protein are like serrations that damage the filters in the kidney when they pass through. The more this happens, the more damage your kidneys get. This damage is (normally) irreversible. If you have protein in your urine, you probably have some level of kidney disease. It doesn't matter if you disagree with "Talmudist Google" on this, because this is how kidneys perform.
I pass a lot of oxidized albumin thru urine. I should be a kidney dialysis patient by now following your belief system.

Perhaps if you're talking about myoglobin from muscle breakdown from excessive weightlifting destroying kidneys, you may be right.

But oxidized albumin isn't myoglobin. In the same way not all fish are white sharks. Don't oversimplify unless you're a simpleton.


I am unaware why you believe eGFR is not a real thing. It's a lab of kidney filtration. There is an entire group of people over on r/kidneydisease who will take issue with everything you said.
You've been bluepilled as most are.

Think critically. Don't follow the crowd just because. You must believe in majority hive mind thinking. Go ahead. Its your life.


With this considered, not all foamy urine is protein. There are videos on youtube of people with foamy urine checking their samples and showing negative.
Agreed. Keep this up.
 

yerrag

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Altar worshippers of the convenient eGFR formula based on serum creatinine, age, sex, and race,

use the 24hr urine creatinine clearance test. Most likely, insurance won't pay for this.

This way, you have at least something useful to gauge your kidney health in terms of a better representation of your kidney health using filtration rate as basis.

It doesn't use age nor race as basis. Which is really.stupid anyway.

Say, my creatinine levels stay constant as I get older, why would my eGFR lower when I'm 70 compared to when I'm 30?

That's why it's called.an eGFR because it's an estimate. But what use is an estimate when it can be off by so much?

The creatinine clearance test does a better job of it. Based on serum creatinine and amount of creatinine excreted in urine over a 24hr period. However, it tends to overestimate GFR by about 20 percent so I divide the result by 1.2

Kidney produces creatinine and so this accounts for the overestimation.
 

ironfist

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Oh boy.

eGFR no longer uses race in the calculation.

eGFR can be (more accurately) estimated by cystatin-c measurement.

eGFR is frequently lowered disproportionately in everybody who eats a lot of protein, athletes, and weight lifters.

I know this forum is pretty fringe but saying people on kidney medication experience kidney problems due to the medication is pretty wacky.

eGFR is ESTIMATED GFR. Having a real GFR requires kidney biopsy.
 

yerrag

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eGFR no longer uses race in the calculation.
Lets take that out, leaving crea, sex, and age.

How can 2 people with same creatunine, sex, and age have the same eGFR without accounting for their health status. One is sick, the other healthy and they have the same eGFR?

And yes, you say that is an estimate. Yet this is what is generally used. And I already gave you another way to calculate it that is more accurate, and yet you had to muddy this up by suggesting doing a biopsy, which really is very invasive and costly, and hardly more accurate.

OH BOY!

eGFR can be (more accurately) estimated by cystatin-c measurement.
How so?

Its just like another fruit to a smoothie and charging double for it lol

If you want to add a term to give you street cred, it would help to explain it with some detail.

Just don't bandy something out to make you sound like you know something.


eGFR is frequently lowered disproportionately in everybody who eats a lot of protein, athletes, and weight lifters.
So eating less protein makes for higher eGFR numbers, right?

Funny that you buy into this hogwash.

You're into this nonsense of chasing numbers. Eating less protein doesn't improve the filtration rate of kidneys, it just lowers the body's rate of producing creatinine because the body produces less creatine from having less amino acids to produce creatine.

Got that?

Oh boy!


I know this forum is pretty fringe but saying people on kidney medication experience kidney problems due to the medication is pretty wacky.
Wacky! You made my day.
 

yerrag

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On another note, I have started to make mybown suppositories using cocoa butter and essential oils (not the PUFAs of course). Initial impressions are that foam has markedly subsided. But it will take more time to see the salutary effects inbthe form of lower creatinine, lower BP, lower wbc, better ECG, better acid base balance, less joint pains, more hair, more libido yada yada.
After using the suppositories for a few days, I can say using the suppositories indeed eliminate the foaming in my urine.

But when I added the use of a supplement (Endocalyx Pro), for a few days, the foam returned, and the foaminess kept getting progressively worse.

When I stopped using Endocalyx Pro, while continuing the use of the suppository, the foam disappeared shortly after.

I also saw a mild arthritic soreness on my right knee, when I climb up stairs, disappear. This I attribute to the disappearance of bacterial enzymes which converts proteins into proteins that the immune system converts into proteins that the immune system considers foreign, and the pain felt is from the effect of the immune system attacking these proteins that accumulate in joints.

I may just have to use the suppositories without Endocalyx Pro for a week or two, to see the effects of using it for a longer time, to see whether the disappearance of foam will last, and to see if this leads to a lowering of my BP.

This will strengthen my suspicion that the foam is oxidized albumin, and that oxidized albumin results from the need by the body to use albumin as an antioxidant to counter the oxidative stress resulting from spillover ROS resulting from phagocytic action to destroy periodontal bacteria in my blood vessels.

I suspect my vessel walls contain plaque that harbor dormant bacteria that become active as plaque continually lyses, and this creates a continual source of bacteria that the body has to continually work on destroying. This is a continual drain on my albumin stores, and contributes to my high blood pressure. As adequate albumin is needed to maintain adequate blood volume, and adequate blood volume is needed to maintain regular blood pressure.

The Endocalyx Pro, taken to improve blood flow especially at the capillaries, increases the lysing of plaque, and while this is something desirable, its intake also increases the presence of bacteria in blood, and worsens the foaminess of urine as well as worsen my high BP condition.

Yet it is needed, so I have to find a suitable pulsing schedule to use Endocalyx Pro complement with my use of suppositories, so that I could lower the periodontal bacteria in my internal system to where it becomes negligible but at a rate where the antibacterial action of the essential oils from my suppositories is adequate to destroy the bacteria that is released from the lysing action of Endocalyx Pro. This way, no phagocytic action is needed to destroy the bacteria released from lysing, and albumin can be conserved, and gradually will lead to restoration of adequate blood volume and subsequently lead to the lowering of blood pressure to normal levels.
 

Vinny

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After using the suppositories for a few days, I can say using the suppositories indeed eliminate the foaming in my urine.

But when I added the use of a supplement (Endocalyx Pro), for a few days, the foam returned, and the foaminess kept getting progressively worse.

When I stopped using Endocalyx Pro, while continuing the use of the suppository, the foam disappeared shortly after.

I also saw a mild arthritic soreness on my right knee, when I climb up stairs, disappear. This I attribute to the disappearance of bacterial enzymes which converts proteins into proteins that the immune system converts into proteins that the immune system considers foreign, and the pain felt is from the effect of the immune system attacking these proteins that accumulate in joints.

I may just have to use the suppositories without Endocalyx Pro for a week or two, to see the effects of using it for a longer time, to see whether the disappearance of foam will last, and to see if this leads to a lowering of my BP.

This will strengthen my suspicion that the foam is oxidized albumin, and that oxidized albumin results from the need by the body to use albumin as an antioxidant to counter the oxidative stress resulting from spillover ROS resulting from phagocytic action to destroy periodontal bacteria in my blood vessels.

I suspect my vessel walls contain plaque that harbor dormant bacteria that become active as plaque continually lyses, and this creates a continual source of bacteria that the body has to continually work on destroying. This is a continual drain on my albumin stores, and contributes to my high blood pressure. As adequate albumin is needed to maintain adequate blood volume, and adequate blood volume is needed to maintain regular blood pressure.

The Endocalyx Pro, taken to improve blood flow especially at the capillaries, increases the lysing of plaque, and while this is something desirable, its intake also increases the presence of bacteria in blood, and worsens the foaminess of urine as well as worsen my high BP condition.

Yet it is needed, so I have to find a suitable pulsing schedule to use Endocalyx Pro complement with my use of suppositories, so that I could lower the periodontal bacteria in my internal system to where it becomes negligible but at a rate where the antibacterial action of the essential oils from my suppositories is adequate to destroy the bacteria that is released from the lysing action of Endocalyx Pro. This way, no phagocytic action is needed to destroy the bacteria released from lysing, and albumin can be conserved, and gradually will lead to restoration of adequate blood volume and subsequently lead to the lowering of blood pressure to normal levels.
Quite interesting, yerrag! I hope you`re onto something, fingers crossed!
 

yerrag

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I'm sorry to ask but can you describe how you doing suppositories? Thanks
I used a mold which I bought from Amazon. A set of 4 molds makes 24 suppositories. It costs around $25

I use cocoa butter as the carrier oil, and add a blend of essential oils. I used Robert Tisserand's The Art of Aromatherapy and Kurt Schnaubelt's Advanced Aromatherapy as guide.

The blend is an art though. By that I mean it is subjective, how many drops I use of each essential oil begins with I learn of the starting blend to begin with, and as I go along I am able to reformulate.

If I feel sleepy, for example, I may reduce a certain essential oil. And if I feel some irritation in my around my anus, I could try sleeping prone at night to keep the oil blend from leaking out. I could also change how often I use the suppository from say twice a day to just once. Or I could lessen the drops used of some oils that are topical irritants, though oils like cinnamon and clove and oregano are very effective antimicrobials and removing such oils can reduce the potency.

To go slow and formulate conservatively and to refrain from rushing to get immediate results would be helpful. I once tried using two suppositories in one night, and I ended up with watery stools.

Tisserand has another book on the safety of EOs and it would be nice to have, as knowing the gotchas ahead of time keeps us from unpleasant surprises. Using clove oil and Methylene Blue together caused me momentary paralysis because they both are MAO inhibitors, for example.

Then observe. I note urine frequency, foaming, BP, perfusion index, and I monitor my nightly spO2 with a graph using an O2Ring. This gives me feedback, although I still have a hard time making sense of the data. I am less like Ray Pest in that I am more data-oriented and using feel doesn't cut it for me.
 

kozakl

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Then observe. I note urine frequency, foaming, BP, perfusion index, and I monitor my nightly spO2 with a graph using an O2Ring. This gives me feedback, although I still have a hard time making sense of the data. I am less like Ray Pest in that I am more data-oriented and using feel doesn't cut it for me.

Thanks, what about foamy? still in remission? how long remission is hold on?
 

yerrag

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Thanks, what about foamy? still in remission? how long remission is hold on?
Foam is gone whenever I use the suppository. I think microbes are killed without using too much of my immune system, especially phagocytosis. And my spO2 chart for the night looks nicer with less drops in spO2. My blood pressure would be lower as well.

But this is temporary as I have a shitload of periodontal microbes constantly coming online into the bloodstream.

So I will need to keep using the suppositories like I am using a maintenance drug. Until the supply of bacteria from plaque is exhausted.
 

kozakl

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Quite interesting, yerrag! I hope you`re onto something, fingers crossed!
Hello Vinny, do you have still have foamy in urine? do you found way to fix this?
I also suffering for foamy urine, not sure what is cause... I had few times urine and blood i labs my gfr is really high (about 115) and never had any protein in urine but I get batteries in urine result ;/
 

Vinny

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Hello Vinny, do you have still have foamy in urine? do you found way to fix this?
I also suffering for foamy urine, not sure what is cause... I had few times urine and blood i labs my gfr is really high (about 115) and never had any protein in urine but I get batteries in urine result ;/
Hi kozakl, yes I still have it. No idea what is causing it and what to do about it, but as much as I`m aware in my case, it`s not connected with kidneys. I hope @yerrag will figure it out, lol!
 

kozakl

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Hi kozakl, yes I still have it. No idea what is causing it and what to do about it, but as much as I`m aware in my case, it`s not connected with kidneys. I hope @yerrag will figure it out, lol!
Thanks for your answer, can you tell:
- how test you did to check foamy is not related to kidneys?
- you tried change diet? you have still foamy if you dont eat fat or stop eating for 14-18 hours?
- if you sitting on toilet or urine hit side of toilet, there are still foamy?

thank You.
 

Vinny

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Thanks for your answer, can you tell:
- how test you did to check foamy is not related to kidneys?
- you tried change diet? you have still foamy if you dont eat fat or stop eating for 14-18 hours?
- if you sitting on toilet or urine hit side of toilet, there are still foamy?

thank You.
1. Went to nephrologist and did some tests - creatinine and don`t remember what else... a couple of times, spread in time. No indications for kidney problem so far.
2. I tried changes in diet but it didn`t make a difference so far. For unknown yet reasons it disappears sometimes, but these are rare moments.
3. Yes.
 

kozakl

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1. Went to nephrologist and did some tests - creatinine and don`t remember what else... a couple of times, spread in time. No indications for kidney problem so far.
2. I tried changes in diet but it didn`t make a difference so far. For unknown yet reasons it disappears sometimes, but these are rare moments.
3. Yes.

Thanks!
But is sound a bit different than my case, I never had foamy when sitting etc, it was one of reason why I don't know when foamy started, because in history I very often did pee on sitting...

In my case diet do big change, I have big foamy after eating milk or medium foamy after eating fat products (margarine is killer for me).
usually when I eat sandwiches, potatoes or lean meat foamy gone or is very small (disappear second after I end pee), I tried vit b3 (niacin, 50mg per day) but I dont see any result still when I eat milk I see foamy but I start niacin 3 day ago... maybe too short period of time...
I tried also quercetin and hard too say it works, maybe foamy is a bit smaller when eating fat... not sure but again I will not buy because I'm not sure it even works...

One thing I think maybe can be important is that one last year I eat a lots turmeric with pepper 3x times per day, my labs always were great (liver also), but I read foamy can be from bile, and I know turmeric increase work of bile maybe it is any clue?

Foamy is really nightmare so I don't eat any milk products or fat...
anyone have any idea what going on in my body?
 

yerrag

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Hi kozakl, yes I still have it. No idea what is causing it and what to do about it, but as much as I`m aware in my case, it`s not connected with kidneys. I hope @yerrag will figure it out, lol!
Still figuring things out.

I would see foam disappear a few days using one thing and just when I feel it's worth sharing the foam god would intervene and I would see foaming again.

Life is cruel lol
 

bornamachine

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When I came back form the hospital a year ago, after having taken some Tylenol, and in a much weaker state, I got severely poisoned by breathing some "simple green" cleaner, for the first time I noticed the urine froth that I have not seen before, during this time I also got a bad craving to drink raw eggs (the yellow) and to eat some raw onion.
I recovered in the next week or so, and my wife did some research and came across an antioxidant called glutathione, apparently without it we would all age, oxidize and die in short order, that's how important it is, infusions that work cost in the thousands of dollars if not tens and orally it's basically useless because your body needs to make its own, she read following, one of the greatest raw building blocks for glutathione is raw egg yolk (must be raw) and raw onion.

Pretty amazing

Btw I haven't noticed any froth since
 

yerrag

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Still figuring things out.

I would see foam disappear a few days using one thing and just when I feel it's worth sharing the foam god would intervene and I would see foaming again.

Life is cruel lol
@bunny Right after I wrote the post I examined the data I have and I found out a few things that may be critical to my foam elimination project.

So, without more specifics other than about getting the right blend of essential oils, I may get much to tackling my urine foaming issues. I'd know in two weeks.

But my context is microbial, and to be more specific, periodontal.

When I came back form the hospital a year ago, after having taken some Tylenol, and in a much weaker state, I got severely poisoned by breathing some "simple green" cleaner, for the first time I noticed the urine froth that I have not seen before, during this time I also got a bad craving to drink raw eggs (the yellow) and to eat some raw onion.
I recovered in the next week or so, and my wife did some research and came across an antioxidant called glutathione, apparently without it we would all age, oxidize and die in short order, that's how important it is, infusions that work cost in the thousands of dollars if not tens and orally it's basically useless because your body needs to make its own, she read following, one of the greatest raw building blocks for glutathione is raw egg yolk (must be raw) and raw onion.

Pretty amazing

Btw I haven't noticed any froth since
Amazing!

About the raw eggs, the only reason keeping me from eating raw eggs in what I understand to be a component of raw eggs, called avidin, which is said to bind to biotin and cause biotin deficiency. I heard a podcast at One Radio Network recently and this guest whom Pat Timpone would call Ren (for Raw Egg Nationalism) state that the the science on it isn't well proven.

Still, I'm hesitant on eating raw eggs.

Otherwise, I would be putting raw eggs in a Mexican coke bottle and shaking it, and drinking it. Long ago, in the Philippines, it was popular to do that with a local cola drink.
 

Vinny

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About the raw eggs, the only reason keeping me from eating raw eggs in what I understand to be a component of raw eggs, called avidin, which is said to bind to biotin and cause biotin deficiency. I heard a podcast at One Radio Network recently and this guest whom Pat Timpone would call Ren (for Raw Egg Nationalism) state that the the science on it isn't well proven.

Still, I'm hesitant on eating raw eggs.

Otherwise, I would be putting raw eggs in a Mexican coke bottle and shaking it, and drinking it. Long ago, in the Philippines, it was popular to do that with a local cola drink.
Isn`t avidin present in the egg whites only?
 

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