Tough / Rough Childhood Shortens Lifespan By Up To 75%

haidut

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The study was done with baboons, but given how closely related they are to humans I think the results are a lot more pertinent than rat stress studies, which btw have been shown to translate pretty well to humans.
A wild baboon usually lives for up to 45 years. So, the fact that some of the baboons with rough childhood lived to only 9-10 years of age is quite depressing, and should be an eye-opener for anybody who thinks that genes are what determined lifespan or health.
The little good news in this study is that it IS possible to overcome that childhood adversity, even though the scientists are not sure what those protective factors may be.

http://phys.org/news/2016-04-rough-childhoods-ripple-effects-wild.html

"...People who experience childhood abuse, neglect and other hallmarks of a rough childhood are more likely to develop heart disease, diabetes and other health problems later in life, even after the stressful events have passed, previous research shows. A new study from Duke University, the University of Notre Dame and Princeton University finds that wild baboons that experience multiple misfortunes during the first years of life, such as drought or the loss of their mother, grow up to live much shorter adult lives. Their life expectancy is cut short by up to ten years compared with their more fortunate peers. The results are important because they show that early adversity can have long-term negative effects on survival even in the absence of factors commonly evoked to explain similar patterns in humans, such as differences in smoking, drinking or medical care, said Jenny Tung, an assistant professor of evolutionary anthropology and biology at Duke who co-authored the study. The findings, scheduled to appear online April 19 in Nature Communications, come from a long-term study of 196 wild female baboons monitored on a nearly daily basis between 1983 and 2013 near Amboseli National Park in southern Kenya."

"...For baboons, like humans, the tougher the childhood, the higher the risks of premature death later in life. Young females that experienced just one or no adverse events—a group the researchers nicknamed the "silver spoon kids"—generally lived into their late teens and early twenties, whereas those that endured three or more often died by age nine. The "bad luck" babies not only lost more than ten years off their adult lives, they also had fewer surviving offspring. "It's like a snowball effect," said co-author Elizabeth Archie, associate professor at the University of Notre Dame."

"...Some researchers studying the effects of childhood stress on adult health in humans pin the blame on differences in medical care or risky behavior. People who had troubled childhoods, the thinking goes, are more likely to turn to drugs, alcohol or other coping mechanisms that are bad for their health. But wild baboons don't smoke or binge on junk food, and they don't carry health insurance. This supports the idea that differences in lifestyle and medical care are only part of the story, said co-author Susan Alberts, professor of biology at Duke."

"...Baboon females that experienced the most misfortune in their early years were also more socially isolated as adults, suggesting that social support may also be at play. Together with study co-author Jeanne Altmann of Princeton, the team plans to investigate how some baboons manage to overcome early adversity. It could be that those who form and maintain supportive relationships as they grow older are better able to survive and thrive, Archie said."
 

bzmazu

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I'm more proof...but I'm a fighter. I'm already "hard to dead" as they say here in Belize.
 

Greg says

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'Adverse childhood experiences exponentially increase not only the risk of addiction, but cancer, mental health issues, heart disease, EDs, suicide and early death. There is a real connection between our childhood and how that impacts our adult behaviours.' - Gabor Mate

'Stress early in life can impair learning, cause aggressive or compulsive behavior, learned helplessness, shyness, alcoholism, and other problems.' - Ray Peat
 

lindsay

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That is a very interesting (albeit depressing) study. But I think variables would be really difficult to gauge with humans. Looking at my own family, I feel that the baby boomer generation is incredible weak in comparison to previous generations (and more likely to hinge on every word their doctor speaks to them) - the previous generation likely had more hardship in childhood than the said baby boomers. My great Pepere lived until the age of 94 and only died because he gave up. He'd been through at least two major world wars, drank, smoke and ate out of cans a lot. In comparison, two of his grandchildren have already passed on at much younger ages, despite having far less exterior stresses and never having been to war.

I'm not saying that going through a traumatizing event like war is a good way to strengthen an individual (and it has proved terrible for many), but I do think that there is a sort of resilience built up through hardship - though I think the children/spouses of parents at war suffer greatly. My other grandfather lived to be 94 as well and grew up starving during the great depression, as his family had recently immigrated to the US, and he lost his mother in childhood. I had a very good upbringing and little hardship in comparison to both my grandparents and have had far more health and mental struggles. Then again, the women on both sides of my family did not live too long in comparison to their spouses, so I think men and women are totally different in this respect.

Still, it's a very interesting study and definitely warrants noting that childhood is very important. Also, I think another thing that's hard to gauge are all the internal stressors passed onto children nowadays. I often wonder how the birth control effects following generations, as well as PUFA and other stressors that we may not think about on a daily basis.
 

Drareg

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He spoke about demethylating agents before for these cases, I'm not sure long term how kids can move beyond this, Peat also spoke about generations have to pass in a better environment for the epigenetics to reverse. I'm not sure thyroid alone is going to clear it up?Will help though, Peat mentioned novocaine.

It's cruel the suicide rate at the moment, the male suicide attempts after the age of 40 is alarming.

Unmet expectations as Nicole's Foss mentioned, she is spot on, this is an epidemic waiting to happen for those born after 1980 in the west styled cultures in particular.
Ignorance was bliss, now social media stuffs others heavily edited lives in your face continually,copy and paste success styled life by Tony Robbins et al, the success zeitgeist.

I'm guessing the stress hormones also effect attractiveness, so terrible parenting,stress hormones during teens leads to asymmetrical features rendering you less attractive to the opposite sex, add to the mix a culture that says financial power and beauty is all that matters, in fact it never says that directly does it? It's always the unspoken agenda quite literally branded to your brain.
 

bzmazu

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That is a very interesting (albeit depressing) study. But I think variables would be really difficult to gauge with humans. Looking at my own family, I feel that the baby boomer generation is incredible weak in comparison to previous generations (and more likely to hinge on every word their doctor speaks to them) - the previous generation likely had more hardship in childhood than the said baby boomers. My great Pepere lived until the age of 94 and only died because he gave up. He'd been through at least two major world wars, drank, smoke and ate out of cans a lot. In comparison, two of his grandchildren have already passed on at much younger ages, despite having far less exterior stresses and never having been to war.

I'm not saying that going through a traumatizing event like war is a good way to strengthen an individual (and it has proved terrible for many), but I do think that there is a sort of resilience built up through hardship - though I think the children/spouses of parents at war suffer greatly. My other grandfather lived to be 94 as well and grew up starving during the great depression, as his family had recently immigrated to the US, and he lost his mother in childhood. I had a very good upbringing and little hardship in comparison to both my grandparents and have had far more health and mental struggles. Then again, the women on both sides of my family did not live too long in comparison to their spouses, so I think men and women are totally different in this respect.

Still, it's a very interesting study and definitely warrants noting that childhood is very important. Also, I think another thing that's hard to gauge are all the internal stressors passed onto children nowadays. I often wonder how the birth control effects following generations, as well as PUFA and other stressors that we may not think about on a daily basis.
Very important comments...interesting discussion this. Thanks Haidut, for bringing it up. We are all suffering in s0me way...why are some of us more resilient than others?
 

milk_lover

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it IS possible to overcome that childhood adversity
When my cousin (male) was little his parents divorced twice and had always internal problems at home. He grew up weaker than my other cousins. He has always struggled in school and he gets sick easily and does not love sport and adventure. What can be done to reverse the situation he is in? I love him dearly and he's only 18 years old.
 

Drareg

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Very important comments...interesting discussion this. Thanks Haidut, for bringing it up. We are all suffering in s0me way...why are some of us more resilient than others?

Those more resilient probably didn't have the a huge level of stress in childhood, their stress was probably brought on by contemporary culture or some other stress in adulthood.

The kids who were abused physically and mentally are treated the same as the above, they still can get more stress on top of the childhood, very few get out and live the dream,most of the times we only here these stories.
I think there a different levels of abuse also.

More than anything it points to love,translated roughly it means a desire to give, this is as vital as oxygen and water for the kid.
The mice that get more licks as infants are more resilient to stress for example, the licks are affection and epiegenitally modify them.
 

bzmazu

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When my cousin (male) was little his parents divorced twice and had always internal problems at home. He grew up weaker than my other cousins. He has always struggled in school and he gets sick easily and does not love sport and adventure. What can be done to reverse the situation he is in? I love him dearly and he's only 18 years old.
We have everything we need inside us for peace and happiness...look into the teachings of the Dalai Lama and Buddha...it's not a religion...it's a way of life...you have to want to find the answer though.
 
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He can save you...

 

bzmazu

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He can save you...

Expecting someone to save you?...won't work.

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them" ...Albert Einstein
 
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Expecting someone to save you?...won't work.

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them" ...Albert Einstein

If your unconscious can release cortisol when you are hungry, why can't your conscious eat LSD when you are in trouble? There is not really much difference.
 

Drareg

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He can save you...


The results are impressive, I want to try it someday but it's difficult to access. It's currently proving very successful in his home country.(legal therapeutic settings.) This was a dream of his, to see it used legally for mental health with a trained individuals on hand, I think these sessions ongoing in Switzerland will take psychiatry to whole other level.

Do you genuinely think it would work for terrible childhood experiences? some people have being treated horrifically bad.
It's important to note that Hoffman was quoted as saying it should not be abused as it could lead to people believing life is just chemicals which can have terrible effects itself. What's your take on it?
 

Simonsays

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When my cousin (male) was little his parents divorced twice and had always internal problems at home. He grew up weaker than my other cousins. He has always struggled in school and he gets sick easily and does not love sport and adventure. What can be done to reverse the situation he is in? I love him dearly and he's only 18 years old.

Be there for him, unlike his parents.

There is hope

Not in your Genes, by Oliver James Oliver James | The official website

Using a mixture of famous and ordinary people, Oliver James drills deep down into the childhood causes of our individuality, revealing why our upbringing, not our genes, plays such an important role in our wellbeing and success. The implications are huge: as adults we can change, we can clutch our fates from predetermined destiny, as parents we can radically alter the trajectory of our childrens’ lives, and as a society we could largely eradicate criminality and poverty.

Not in Your Genes will not only change the way you think about yourself and the people around you, but give you the fuel to change your personality and your life for the better.


Think Ray would agree.
 

Tarmander

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One thing I notice, possibly as a result of the belief in genetics, is that people as children don't seem to be "built" up like they used to. There is a period in childhood of building energy, structure, reserves of youthful substances, etc. the longer this period is, the more it is supported, and the later puberty is, the more resilient the adult. This process of building takes energy though, and patience.

But these days, kids are rushed to adulthood. Put into enclosed spaces, trained to work monotonously, almost as if the adults can't stand the feeling; that they just must transfer the burden to their children as fast as possible.
 

jaguar43

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I think Ray Peat thinks that individualism is responsible for the suicide rates.


I think that professor's theory is a good example of rigid thinking. Utah is unique in the (young) age structure of its population, meaning very rapid population growth, and the region has been known for its ideological and political conservatism. When I lived in Montana, I noticed that people from the mountain states had a culture of extreme individualism, militarism, and authoritarianism.

Suicide is so highly influenced by culture that information from just one or two nations can very easily produce associations that are misleading--more cultures have to be considered. In the US, sparse population and Republican party affiliation happen to be associated with suicide and higher altitude, and religious affiliation and military experience are other relevant factors that are unevenly distributed. War-related investment has been a major factor in the rate of population growth in certain states. Countries with the highest suicide rates, Lithuania, Guyana, Sri Lanka, have generally low altitudes; countries with a high average altitude, Mexico and Bolivia, have low suicide rates. The average age at which suicide occurs varies greatly in different places and times"

-Ray Peat
 

Xisca

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The little good news in this study is that it IS possible to overcome that childhood adversity, even though the scientists are not sure what those protective factors may be.

"...Baboon females that experienced the most misfortune in their early years were also more socially isolated as adults, suggesting that social support may also be at play. Together with study co-author Jeanne Altmann of Princeton, the team plans to investigate how some baboons manage to overcome early adversity. It could be that those who form and maintain supportive relationships as they grow older are better able to survive and thrive, Archie said."

It is a pity that researchers do not communicate more.
It is already known that SOCIAL ENGAGEMENT is what counts most to gain resilience (=overcome).
Have a look at Porges polyvagal theory.

Social engagement comes from the vagal nerve = para-sympathic system, which is helped by co2 and good metabolism.

They mention snow ball effect, because indeed, a baby relies on the nervous system of the mother during the time she develops his full own nervous system (6 month old for humans)
 

Xisca

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That is a very interesting (albeit depressing) study. But I think variables would be really difficult to gauge with humans. Looking at my own family, I feel that the baby boomer generation is incredible weak in comparison to previous generations (and more likely to hinge on every word their doctor speaks to them) - the previous generation likely had more hardship in childhood than the said baby boomers. My great Pepere lived until the age of 94 and only died because he gave up. He'd been through at least two major world wars, drank, smoke and ate out of cans a lot. In comparison, two of his grandchildren have already passed on at much younger ages, despite having far less exterior stresses and never having been to war.

I'm not saying that going through a traumatizing event like war is a good way to strengthen an individual (and it has proved terrible for many), but I do think that there is a sort of resilience built up through hardship - though I think the children/spouses of parents at war suffer greatly. My other grandfather lived to be 94 as well and grew up starving during the great depression, as his family had recently immigrated to the US, and he lost his mother in childhood. I had a very good upbringing and little hardship in comparison to both my grandparents and have had far more health and mental struggles. Then again, the women on both sides of my family did not live too long in comparison to their spouses, so I think men and women are totally different in this respect.

Still, it's a very interesting study and definitely warrants noting that childhood is very important. Also, I think another thing that's hard to gauge are all the internal stressors passed onto children nowadays. I often wonder how the birth control effects following generations, as well as PUFA and other stressors that we may not think about on a daily basis.

It is known that during wars, people who stay in the war zone do better than the ones that are "safe" away. The difference is that the one that are away are imagining what is happening and react by imagination. It is also known how people gather and develop cooperation to get the necessary co-regulation.
Co-regulation is saving. Animals, even fish in a pond, stay together HOURS after an earthquake or a strong wildfire.
I was brought up feeling that war was "good" for social contact, as I could not see around me all the GOOD things my mother talled me about what my grand-father was doing, and how much social behaviour was arising from this difficult period.

Then, when we think some people had much less exterior stress, we might not know what is more stressing!
Speed is stressing because it leaves us with uncompleted movements, that is why car accidents are more stressful than what it seems.

Yes I agree about resilience buildt up through hardship.
IF it does not come before a few months old, if the parents are supportive, if the hardship comes from outside the known persons, and there are more ifs...
When the hardship comes from a family member, the saving point can be the support of another family member, like a grand-parent.
 
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