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Tips On How To Work With A Conventional Dr. Without Conflict?

Discussion in 'Ask For Help or Advice' started by PowertothePeatple, Dec 4, 2018.

  1. Lilac

    Lilac Member

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    To the Original Poster, since you say the condition is not life-threatening... I would definitely e-mail Ray. Then, if your daughter is not doing this already, I would implement all the standard Peat advice. Liver, egg yolks, sun, red light, aspirin, carrot salad. Maybe her body can overcome this and you will not need the doctors any longer.

    The cyst appeared on an airplane trip. Does this suggest anything to anyone?

    Good luck.
     
  2. burtlancast

    burtlancast Member

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    Couldn't agree more with jitsmonkey, although most people still are under the illusion medicine wants them good.

    It's not easy to take charge of the conversation in the doctor's office when one hasn't already gone through the disillusionment phase with medicine.

    Now, as for the daughter of Powertothepeatple, have you considered topical black salve or iodine ?

    They're totally harmless to apply to the skin and could work wonders in your case.
     
  3. Queequeg

    Queequeg Member

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    I think all this talk about going to war and guns blazing can be good advice but I dont think it applies to the situation the OP is in. His daughter doesn't have a life threatening condition and therefore there is no duty to treat. Previous Doctors have been quick to pass his daughter on to the next specialist because of the specifics of her condition. How much quicker would they be to turf her to the next guy if the OP tries to pull a John Q. The other recommended approaches of politically adept persuasion by obtaining the relevant published research on the dangers of contrast would be much more effective in obtaining a proper diagnosis without poisoning his daughter.

    Now if his daughter was in a life threatening situation and proper but non conventional treatment methods were refused, then it would make more sense to bring out the inner Denzel.

    Here is the 60 minutes piece on one such situation that was talked about in @tankasnowgod's video link and a good example for when total war may be needed.
     
  4. jitsmonkey

    jitsmonkey Member

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    Idealistic idea from someone with likely little or no experience with the matter.
    How do you think doctor encounters BECOME life threatening???
    They begin with trust given to the wrong people at the wrong time
    EVERY doctor encounter is life or death.
    Have you never heard the axiom "Fox guarding the hen house"
    And you cleverly cited John Q. and guns a blazin exactly THE OPPOSITE way I recommended them be used.
    You can be perfectly civil and at war simultaneously.
    Even better when you go to war without letting your enemy know you're at war... you now have the advantage.
    At no point did I say you should betray your own understanding by tipping off the doc.
    Its a MINDSET.
    being able to read and comprehend should be a pre-requisite to posting.
     
  5. Queequeg

    Queequeg Member

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    Yes, Im sure you do a great job disguising your John Q. MINDSET when you go to war. Good luck in life with that Clausewitz attitude of yours.
     
  6. jitsmonkey

    jitsmonkey Member

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    Actually its served me quite well as well as a few loved ones and friends who wouldn't be here without it.
    You keep on keepin on with that sheeplistic reading comprehension. If you're ever in the cross hairs
    (after you realize it too late) feel free to hit me up I'll help advocate for you in spite of your terrible advice. (and in spite of your idiotic assumptive Clausewitz reference just simply because you don't like a 3 letter word)

    I'd go as far to say you don't like my choice of words or approach because you struggle to stand up for yourself and the prospect of needing to do that is daunting. I don't say this to be mean I say it to simpy acknowledge that its ok. You absolutely can do it and if you can't, then find someone who can. Because your "trust the fox" approach will fail. Guaranteed.


    Its actually quite easy to be polite and respectful and clean their clock simultaneously.
    Without a voice raised or a vein even bulging. That's what happens when you stand your ground and are certain the ground is in fact yours. It becomes "guns a blazin" when there's fear involved. No need when you're the one calling the shots and everyone in the room (read the doc) is clear on that.
     
  7. Queequeg

    Queequeg Member

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    Dude, I think you may be suffering from PTSD from all your battles in the ER. This is a very different situation than what you are drawing your conclusions from. And just to let you know I have proven more than capable of handling whatever healthcare situation I or my family may be in. You are the proverbial hammer seeing everything as a nail. Time to broaden your tool kit.
     
  8. jitsmonkey

    jitsmonkey Member

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    So you never did hear the story of the Fox and the henhouse?
    that's surprising but I'll buy it.
    I don't know what you mean by PTSD and Hammers
    You think war involves guns and blood and screaming.
    Maybe for the military.
    But as with all things CONTEXT matters
    Its a mindset
    I've never been anything but polite and respectful to any of the doctors I've ever spoken to.
    Never hit one, yelled at one, threatened one, just normal human conversation.

    I just made sure they knew who was it charge and who was making the decisions.
    I treat them exactly the same way I treat the plumber or the refrigerator repair man.
    "Tell me what you want to do and I'll decide if that's what gets done"
    I don't need to present them with research or a reasonable argument or whatever. There's no debate to be had. The plumber doesn't debate me if I say I don't want a repair. He says Ok and he leaves. The doctor recommends X and I decide if we do X and I make it clear that's how
    the information flow happens. If that means we leave to do research and come back that's what we do. If that means we find a new doc. That's what we do. The doc is just a mechanic/diagnostic nothing more. He/she is a tool to be used not an authority to be impressed or negotiated with. I don't even care if the doc answers my questions. I'll get answers elsewhere. The doc is an over-confident, over-educated trade school graduate. Nothing more.

    I'm not sure what you think I'm suggesting but I'm certain you have no clue
    and your advice will get somebody killed.

    Every doctor's visit is a threat
    approached any other way is pure reality denying madness.
    Yes the threat changes based upon venue ie. GP checkup vs hospital er
    but it is a THREAT nonetheless and to ignore that or act as if that threat
    does not exist is somewhere between moronic and reckless.
     
  9. Queequeg

    Queequeg Member

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    Im not going to waste anymore time arguing the point that you can get what you want without being a **** about it, especially given your penchant for ad hominems, SHOUTING, and hysterics.
    Sourdough gave you some good advice. Maybe one day when you mellow a bit you may actually appreciate it.
     
  10. jitsmonkey

    jitsmonkey Member

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    A routine visit to a general practio
    as I said you're both going to get someone killed.
    please stop.
    and yes I find the topic of the largest religion in the world killing people recklessly and you knucklehead apologists advocating for them HYSTERICAL
    An MD is just an over educated over confident trade school graduate.
    They deserve the same respect and kindness you'd offer any other human being and nothing more.
    As I said you have no clue what you're talking about.

    ps - the highlight of all this for me is you being offended by my all caps of a few words for emphasis. sorry to have triggered your sensitive soft side. smh.
     
  11. jitsmonkey

    jitsmonkey Member

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    I was not suggesting in any way that anything I'd experienced was worse than anyone elses.
    I was suggesting that the advice given clearly was not from an experienced individual and I stand by that.

    I'm not angry at all. I just take this topic very seriously.
    I don't think in a setting where someone's life/health is on the line
    trying to open a closed mind is the best course of action.
    I think making sure the over confident over educated trade school grad knows their place
    is the best and most efficient course of action to make sure the patient gets the best result.
    And yes good communication is critical at making that happen.
    We are at least in agreement on that.

    Your erroneous assumption is you are going to try to get the doc on your side. In the majority of cases I think you will fail.
    Hence my approach is simply to assume I'm not going to get that result and bypass the need for their agreement/approval.
     
  12. Queequeg

    Queequeg Member

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    That wasn't me being offended, that was me ridiculing you and your inability to have a civilized discussion without resorting to temper tantrums.
     
  13. jitsmonkey

    jitsmonkey Member

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    sorry, I wasn't interested in having a discussion with you
    you don't know what you're talking about
     
  14. Queequeg

    Queequeg Member

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    Sure, that's why you were the first to reply to me directly. Seems like you wanted to have a discussion but just dont have the social skills to maintain it. Again, good luck with that me against the world attitude.
     
  15. OP
    PowertothePeatple

    PowertothePeatple Member

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    Thanks. Yes. I did decide to send him a note. And I mentioned the flight just because flying seems like an unusual enough of an circumstance to mention it.
     
  16. OP
    PowertothePeatple

    PowertothePeatple Member

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    I am not familiar with either black salve or iodine as a therapy however I did have her apply vitamin k for a few weeks but it didn't change anything.
     
  17. tankasnowgod

    tankasnowgod Member

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    I'm not sure there is a way to convince a doctor without some sort of conflict. But, if instead of thinking about convincing a doctor, you might be better off trying to find a doctor whose views are inline with yours. This might take some extra time and research, but my guess is that it will be worth it. You could start by calling the MRI imaging place, and see if there are any doctors that refuse to use contrast dyes. Maybe see if there is an ultrasound imaging clinic in your area, and ask what doctors refer their patients. You could also look on healthgrades.com to see if former patients give testimonials that line up with what you're looking for. This is probably a better use of your time and energy than trying to convince a doctor.
     
  18. burtlancast

    burtlancast Member

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    Well, i never experienced such situations in Europe.

    I've yet to meet a doctor considering himself in wartime/ medical universities teaching their students "wartime" medicine.

    What i did experience were arrogant, ignorant individuals with over-inflated egos praying on the vulnerable and weak-minded for their own personal gratification.
     
  19. Regina

    Regina Member

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    Good rant! and insights!
     
  20. Hugh Johnson

    Hugh Johnson Member

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    You are missing the point. Modern medicine was alledgedly developed for battlefield use where there are clear problems, such as infected wounds and bullets inside people. The solution there is obvious, and something the doctors can easily help with.

    In chronic conditions a different attitude would be needed. One that is patient, exploratory and subtle. The problems we mostly face these days can't just be cut away and simply giving people pills is unlikely to work either. The arrogance and overconfidence you see are an attitude suited for battlefield conditions, but not for healing people with chronic issues. It's about how the profession functions, not what the individual doctors have experienced.
     
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