Thyroid Panel - What Does Reverse T3 Show?

austin06

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I have been on NDT for 10+ years largely self-medicating, although current Dr. okay with it and recently did tests and first time I've done Reverse T3 but don't know much about results. I have adjusted my dose down from a high of 4 grains per day to a current 2 to 2.5. I have gone as low as 1 grain, but anything below 2 grains I get strange tight chest pains (mostly at 1 grain) and depression below 2 grains. I recently tried Tyronene 1 drop in a.m. with 1 grain thyroid and didn't really feel great. I am also dealing with some weight gain and, for the first time in my life, elevated blood pressure. Need to address those 2 things asap . Am 4 years in menopause with no issues and been doing a Peat approach for 1 year but ate more that way for years anyway. Want to optimize thyroid and lose weight. Supps are K, E, A, Aspirin - used to take a lot but have backed off recently.

Free t3 5.2 (2.2 to 4.2)
Free T4 .79 (.80 - 1.90)
TSH .056 (.400- 4.100)
Reverse T3 10. (9.0 to 27)
 

EIRE24

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I would try adding in just Tyronene and seeing if it bring down the reverse T3.
 
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austin06

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Thank you. What's level should I be shooting for? In calculating the free t3/rt3 ratio, it looks like the result is 52. It says ratios should be "2" or higher. How much higher? Less than 10?

Besides getting retested, what results am I looking for? More energy? Weight loss? Lower blood pressure? Thank you again.
 

Ella

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Your ft3 is over the range and ft4 is below. Perhaps you are overconverting t4?? This may explain why rt3 is low. Your tsh is well below 2 so I don't think thyroid is the issue here.

Have you checked thyroid antibodies?

I would not be looking at lowering rt3 as it is at the lower end of the range.

Do you know what your parathyroid hormone is doing and vitamin d status. Are you getting plenty of sunshine?

What are u doing with your diet? Calcium??
 
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austin06

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Thank you. I had to look some of this up.

They did not check my antibodies recently, but my last test several years ago (which I just pulled out) came back high (1.4 on a scale of (0 to .9) . I'm not sure why this was not discussed more with me at the time. I seem to recall Hashimotos being mentioned, but since almost all hypo falls under this category I did not pay much attention.

My most recent blood work shows Calcium in the normal range. My D is on the lower end of the range and I am trying to get more direct sunlight during peak times. My diet is Peaty and has been for awhile. I do know I probably need to eat more.

I have stopped taking almost all supplements because I feel like I "react" to a lot of things lately.

The antibodies concern me though. I have not been feeling "right". In addition to the above my digestion has been too fast (frequent elimination) and I sometimes feel a fullness in my neck and chest. I also had what I thought was a panic attack last week and ended up in the walk in ER. I was flushing with a rapid heartbeat and high blood pressure. Thought I was having a heart attack, EKG showed otherwise. They referred me back to my regular Dr. and mentioned possible adrenal issues (the Dr. really didn't know I think).

I am going to go back into the Dr. and request an antibody test.
 

Ella

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I would not worry too much about the antibodies. We are only looking at a number and it does not help us much. Antibodies are the clean up crew. They are just doing their job. You need to work out why your thyroid gland is inflamed. This is huge, as it can be from heavy metals, nutritional deficiencies like vit. d, and many more, infections, from teeth, or gut, LPS, viruses like herpes, epstein barr etc. the list is endless. Basically an inflammatory millieu. A good structured diet, regular eating and routine lifestyle, sunshine and being in nature goes a long way.

I would investigate your your parathyroid hormone PTH as this will give clues on calcium and vitamin d. I do not suggest supplementing vitamin d. Just sun exposure is enough to correct correct many issues. If blood pressure is high then you are doing something stupid with your diet. Inadequate alkaline minerals. Are you getting adequate calories? Blood pressure is the easiest to fix. It is a no brainer. With the amount of thyroid you are taking you need adequate calories to support increased metabolism.

I would suggest if you are in a position to do so, is to take a holiday to a hot climate where you could sun bake. Make sure you test PTH before and after your holiday. Recheck your RT3 and see what difference it makes. Make sure that you are on a well structured diet before you leave and are able to continue while on holiday.
Makes sense being 4 yrs postmenopausal will increase weight? Estrogen entering menopause is a huge problem and yes adrenals need to take over once ovaries shut down.

Females these days enter this period of life already burnt out. I know, been there; learnt the hard way. Thyroid can help, however if there is inflammation in the thyroid, you will also be releasing thyroid hormone from the gland and adding to what you are currently supplementing.

If your food transits quickly and from your other symptoms, then there is too much thyroid hormone and I would definately not supplement T3. Peat has always stated that if you supplement thyroid hormone, then you need to support it with a good diet.

Have you been tracking pulse and temperature to guide thyroid supplementation?

What you are doing with your diet? Have you removed or reduced those inflammatory amino acids.

If you are eating fruit in exchange for starches, milk, seafood and liver, gelatin, then I don't understand why you are not able to lose weight.

Check your cortisol levels and perhaps progesterone or pregnenolone may help. Be sure to eat regular small meals.

R u doing the grated carrot?
 
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austin06

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Thank you. The holiday in a hot climate, while not possible right now, is something I've known intuitively would be very good for me. Working on that.

I am having my PTH checked next week. I am wondering about hyperparathyroidism as well. My mother and my Aunt both had small growths on their thyroid glands. I also see that the ER Doc where I had the panic attack recommended testing for pheochromocytoma. So they suspected adrenal and/or thyroid issues.

Both of those raise blood pressure - which would explain, why, after having normal blood pressure it is elevated.

I do daily carrot and my diet and eating have been much, much better after starting Peat. I make sure I'm eating small meals. The only thing I do not eat is liver and I just ordered some Cod livers and liver pills.

- Main thing - yesterday afternoon and now this a.m. I had two more "attacks". They were not as bad as the first in large part because I know I am not having a heart attack.

I have a persistent feeling of fullness in my neck and throat and a strange feeling of fullness in my chest and upper stomach. When it comes on I feel spacey, get red streaks on my cheeks, feel like I'm going to vomit, have to urinate a lot, get some wheezing and get a headache at the back of my neck. When it passes I feel very tired and my hands and feet get freezing. It is either adrenals, thyroid or both.

The only commonality with these attacks is (a) coming in from the outdoors after about 30 minutes - there has been persistent, extremely high pollen here for weeks and (2) taking some thyroid and having some milk.

Both times eating something lessened some of the symptoms and this a.m. I got some minerals in, took zinc and boron and had some pomegranate juice and I feel much better, but "off". I am reducing thyroid by a lot until I get this figured out.

I also have a root canal in a back tooth that may be cracked and does need to come out. Maybe that should happen first, but I do need to check into both of the conditions mentioned above.

Stress plays a huge roll. I am coming off of almost 5 years of caring for elderly parents and lots of financial stress because of it. My husband was recently diagnosed with a very rare genetic illness. I've often said that laying on a beach for 3 months would fix both of us. I'm determined to fix these things and get my health back. Right now I feel too young to be dealing with these issues and it's kind of depressing.
 

benaoao

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I'm not familiar with the lab ranges you're giving, but reverse t3 is very interesting and you will be able to calculate the free T3 / rT3 ratio which is what thyroid specialists seem to be favoring these days.

Your TSH and free t4 are too low by the way. I think your doctor should be able to help you and monitor the treatment better. If not, change doc.
 

Ella

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Lazing in the sun at the beach and being pampered is just what you need. I know the stress of elder care. Just when you think the kids don't need you as much, your get hit with looking after parents. They are more stressful than kids. Sorry to hear about your hubby. It is a wonder that women make it into their senior years with all this caring for others. Unfortunately, there is little or no time to care for ourselves.

Sorry about the blood pressure comment. Pheochromocytoma is rare and blood pressure is excessively high.

Are you getting spikes over 200?

Have you been diagnosed via, urine, ultrasound or MRI? You want to be bloody well sure you are dealing with a tumour.

My mother went through the same ordeal over her blood pressure. She must have been around 50. Her blood pressure has been a nightmare ever since I was a young girl. The dr said if I didn't convince my mother to take her bp meds she would have a stroke. My mother is 85 this year and still not taking any bp medications. They suspected an adrenal tumour secreting adrenaline responsible for her bp. They were wrong. However they did find dried up nodules in her thyroid on aspiration. The high adrenaline in my mother was due to her pathological relationship with food. This is why I get so narky about blood pressure. Preparing food for herself was simply to much to ask. She would run the whole day on coffee and bread.
Her bp would reach 220/110. She was convinced that this was her bp and she was born this way. I could have slapped her silly. If she did have a stroke, I'd have to look after her. Interesting though, when she came to stay with me, often months at a time; she would arrive with these high bps and by the time I had fed her regular meals by the clock (lots or OJ, Milk, gelatin, liver & oysters) her bp would drop as low as 125/70. I think the lowest was 117. No matter how many times I showed how easy it was to control her bp, as soon as she returned to her home, she was back to coffee and eating poorly. Can't teach an old dog new tricks. I wish everything was so easy to fix.

Have you tried salt on your tongue when you feel an attack coming on. Salt will bring the adrenaline down.

I would also be concerned about a Vitamin C deficiency as it is rapidly used up. Vitamin C is a required cofactor in the synthesis of norepinephrine via the hydroxylation of dopamine by the dopamine-beta-mono-oxygenase enzyme.

Both times eating something lessened some of the symptoms and this a.m. I got some minerals in, took zinc and boron and had some pomegranate juice and I feel much better, but "off". I am reducing thyroid by a lot until I get this figured out.

The fact that you felt better on eating is revealing. I would not worry about losing weight and would focus on getting nutrient dense food in. I would be careful with zinc as you don't know what other deficiencies may be present. Seafood is wonderful for getting all the minerals. Boron is wonderful for the parathyroid gland and for vitamin D, hormones and minerals.

I would focus on food sources for minerals and nutrients. Caring for your parents and husband probable left you with little time to feed yourself adequately. Stress rapidly expends minerals. Food worked beautifully for my mum. She is still climbing trees, pruning and digging her garden. She is a crazy lady in the garden. She will run herself down, then return to my home, refuel and then she is off again. She only needs me when she has throughly exhausted herself.

Are you tracking pulse and temperature?

Is the adrenaline keeping pulse rate elevated?

Testing before you have your meal and then 30 minutes after your meal, you can gauge whether adrenaline is high. If pulse rate goes down 30 mins. after meal, then adrenaline was elevating pulse.

Your TSH is close to zero as Ray advocates, however your free T4 is low. This tell us that the pituitary senses that there is adequate T4. What we don't know is how much of the T4 is bound to protein. The bound T4 is inactive and under the influence of estrogen, more T4 will be bound giving an impression of an artificial low T4.

Your t3/rt3 ratio is 55 which is good and means thT4 is being converted more to t3 active hormone than to rt3 inactive.

I would be careful in coming off your thyroid meds. Use temperature to titrate. Your rt3 indicates you are OK.

Target the reduction of estrogen to reduce the amount of bound T4. BTW pomegranite juice is estrogenic even though it has anti-aromatase activity. I love pomegranite syrup and grow them however, I can't get Ray's voice in the back of my head saying "an estrogen is an estrogen, is an estrogen, no matter how weak it is". Thanks Ray.

Have you considered progesterone to help detox estrogens.
 
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austin06

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I'm not familiar with the lab ranges you're giving, but reverse t3 is very interesting and you will be able to calculate the free T3 / rT3 ratio which is what thyroid specialists seem to be favoring these days.

Your TSH and free t4 are too low by the way. I think your doctor should be able to help you and monitor the treatment better. If not, change doc.

Thank you. As was mentioned in the other post, my FT3/RT3 ratio is 5, which is good (I finally figured it out after reading elsewhere). I'm not sure I agree about the tsh - it could come up a bit - but it's been even lower before and it's pretty much suppressed. Has been for years. I have been self treating based on how I feel and blood tests for 10+ years. Although I think my dosage could be lowered a bit on ndt, the ft3 makes me feel my issues right now are not my thyroid.
 
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austin06

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Lazing in the sun at the beach and being pampered is just what you need. I know the stress of elder care. Just when you think the kids don't need you as much, your get hit with looking after parents. They are more stressful than kids. Sorry to hear about your hubby. It is a wonder that women make it into their senior years with all this caring for others. Unfortunately, there is little or no time to care for ourselves.

Sorry about the blood pressure comment. Pheochromocytoma is rare and blood pressure is excessively high.

Are you getting spikes over 200?

Have you been diagnosed via, urine, ultrasound or MRI? You want to be bloody well sure you are dealing with a tumour.

Have you considered progesterone to help detox estrogens.

Thank you. We don't have children (multiple miscarriages long ago - obviously issues for awhile). Starting in 2011 and dealing with long, slow, declines with two parents - Lewy-Body dementia in one and congestive heart failure in another and now the last parent was just moved here from another state and has increasing health problems and need for help. It takes a huge toll. My husband is doing very well, thankfully,.

It was suggested I be tested for Pheochromocytoma by the ER doc, but I think they had no idea what was going on - bp has always been normal to low until a few months ago. It has spiked to 190/100, maybe higher. I frankly think given the rareness of this illness it's unlikely.

Yes. Temps normal to slightly low. Pulse is normal, but definitely elevated when I get an "episode". I'll check the 30 min bf and after, but it seems like I get reactions with rapid hb randomly. Happens sometimes when asleep.

I have an incredibly difficult time with progesterone - after a few days I get huge anxiety, depression, bloating - makes me feel crazy and, yes, I have tried progest-e and a half a dozen different kinds over the years. Probably need it and having estrogen unbind based on symptoms. I just can't handle that with the other things.

-Update - almost went to the ER again yesterday. Felt awful and had two new episodes over the course of the day. Rapid heart rate, strange spacey feeling, red cheeks, suddenly feel nauseous, headache at base of neck, neck feels very thick and tight, wheezing, bloating in stomach, especially upper stomach w/ strange pains and frequent loose bowel movements, chills after, feel hot when it comes on. I did not take my blood pressure because I just couldn't deal with that. I feel sick/blah and off during these.

I don't think it's my thyroid. This has been going on since Feb on and off, but now is becoming more frequent and more severe. I thought that it's either food or supplement related. I stopped all supplements weeks ago. I thought is was gluten (suddenly) - I only eat it very occasionally. It's not gluten. Thought it was corn masa - nope. Thought is was gelatin, then dairy, milk, OJ, vitamin C. I've gotten so I'm afraid to eat or take anything, but I am making sure I am eating. I did not do milk in coffee this a.m. but had fruit and eggs. So far I feel okay, not great.

I woke up at 5 a.m. with the need to have a bowel movement - this also happens on and off. I sleep 9 hours but now feeling fatigued. I'm getting plenty of salt. Last night after eating (white fish, tomatoes and well-cooked broccoli) I became very bloated - again in my upper stomach area.

I have a Dr. appt tomorrow and am asking for tests for possible parathyroid disease. Otherwise I don't really know. I just know something is way off and I went from feeling good/fine, to dealing with this just a few months ago.

Any possibility this is from a food born illness? The only thing that stands out is that I had some scant blood in my stool a few times right before all of this started several months ago. That never happened again but an acupuncturist I had been seeing over those past few months, thinks a lot of these symptoms may have been from a food born illness. I don't know. But something is way off.
 
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austin06

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Ella,

I read through this a few more times and I want to thank you so much for all of this detailed information. I've written down notes and am going to track temps and pulse more carefully as well as pay attention to eating, foods and some supplements. .

- I did go to the Dr. yesterday for a follow up and had a similar "attack" while there - my blood pressure was extremely elevated, my vision strange, my neck really thick and tight and I was dizzy with an elevated HB. Thankfully the Nurse Practitioner is really good and understands more about thyroid than anyone I've ever gone to. At the end of us talking and me telling her all my symptoms, etc., she said "You know, it really sounds like hyperthyroid." Last week I had dropped back on my thyroid dose but had gone back up, taking smaller doses throughout the day. Yesterday, about an hour before my appt. in the afternoon, I took a small dose (I always take it sublingually) shortly after I felt a flutter in my throat and my pulse pick up. This continued on until I got to the Dr. (I also think I developed white coat syndrome).

The result of the visit-
- The Dr. did feel a nodule in the left side of my neck and ordered an ultrasound for an "enlarged thyroid".
- She redid all blood work on thyroid AND ordered tests for calcium and PTH.
- She ordered the 12 hour urine test for Pheochromocytoma to rule it out.
- She ordered a stress test.
- She prescribed a beta blocker to bring bp down (and probably calm adrenals).

What I've done-
- made an appt on Friday for a consult on the removal of my cracked and infected wisdom tooth (the Dr. is a specialist in cavitation).
- tracking blood pressure and pulse and temps
- lowering thyroid meds - I feel I am definitely having hyper reactions
- have not started beta blockers - want to lower thyroid some first - even after Dr. appt at home I had a very hard time calming myself - I definitely am in a high cortisol place - I also feel bloated after this happens and yestday eveing had a feeling of aching on both sides of my pelvis around the area of my ovaries (which are almost non-existent now) - don't get the gastro-connection at all. Is it adrenals?
- Wondering if I have developed an anxiety disorder because of my age and stress. I feel wiped out the day after I have one of these episodes.
- Going back to acupuncture this week - I think that was helping me tremendously with stress and adrenals.
- Meditating and cutting back on coffee for now.

BTW, I was tested positive for Epstein- Barr many years ago, but I thought we all have that and have never looked into it.

I suppose a goiter would explain hyper symptoms. I am also wondering if it's possible that a Peat type diet improved my thyroid function to the point that I do not need as much thyroid. I honestly rarely ate fruit and never had much dairy before peating. I also ate a lot more starches. I wonder it these three things alone have improved thyroid function. I also read on here about a few people turning hyper even with a tsh below 1.

Bottom line, I can't afford most of the above as I have a high deductible on my insurance and I'm pretty sure the tests will be out of pocket. I am going to attempt to somehow do the ultrasound and the wisdom tooth. With my husband's health issues (which are being very well controlled) and the state of health insurance + being self employed, I just have to try to fix a lot of this on my own.

Thanks again. Your advice is invaluable. And thank you to the poster who mentioned the root canal.
 

Ella

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Lewy-Body dementia in one and congestive heart failure in another and now the last parent was just moved here from another state and has increasing health problems and need for help. It takes a huge toll. My husband is doing very well, thankfully,.

I know too well the stress of being a carer. I am trying to recover from looking after my mother-in-law with dementia, heart failure and restricted mobility. I would rather endure mutiple births than the ordeal of elder care. Dementia seems to be a god-send for the sufferer. Each morning they wake and it is a bright new day. All that happened previously is completely wiped. Yet the carer does not forget and is still trying to recover from all the challenges of the previous day. Exhaustion is an under-statement. Mind you, she wasn't even my mother. Before she came into my household, I was already struggling to recover my health. Going into menopause was tragic for me. My body was unrecognisable. Thank god she is in age-care, and I have been trying hard to recover.

It has spiked to 190/100, maybe higher. I frankly think given the rareness of this illness it's unlikely.

My mother's was consistently over 190/100. Only when she stayed with me and was fed well did it come down. The fact she was being looked after, gave her a sense of security and safety that she did not have after my father passed away. Living on her own was depressing and isolating for her. I am grateful that she is exceptionally healthy and active, considering her peers are in age-care, demented and on a long list of prescription medication. Her old dr told her he refused to see her if she did not take bp meds.

Yes. Temps normal to slightly low. Pulse is normal, but definitely elevated when I get an "episode". I'll check the 30 min bf and after, but it seems like I get reactions with rapid hb randomly. Happens sometimes when asleep.

It sounds more like blood sugar dips or poor ability to store glycogen and/or depletion of glycogen stores. This is why it is so important to eat every 3 hours to try and keep blood sugar levels even.

I have an incredibly difficult time with progesterone - after a few days I get huge anxiety, depression, bloating - makes me feel crazy and, yes, I have tried progest-e and a half a dozen different kinds over the years. Probably need it and having estrogen unbind based on symptoms. I just can't handle that with the other things.

I remember when I first tried progesterone having the same sorts of reactions. It made me crazy too. I was definately estrogen dominant coming into menopause and probably all my teenage and adult life. I took pregnenolone which really helped deal with the stress. It was life-saving or me. It allow me to push my body to cope with exercise and physical work. I was able to rebuild my ability to walk again after not being able to walk for nine months. I no longer have any pain in my knees and feet. I had never heard of feet pain as being a symptom of menopause. I never experienced the usual complaints of menopause like night sweats or hot flushes. I wondered why I was so different.

The orange juice, gelatin, seafood, liver, fruit, milk and coffee and no starches helped to reduced estrogen and adipose tissue. I lost a lot of weight.

I can't drink orange juice and coffee any more as I get symptoms of estrogen deficiency. We that is what I think now. I am still trying to get my head around it. But I think losing weight just caused a whole lot of other issues. I think liberating free fatty acids into the system is an absolute nightmare. My focus now is to increase my lean muscle mass so I burn fat more efficiently at rest.

This menopause phase is definately uncharted waters and its a wake up call that we need to take more care of ourselves than others. I am definately not coming back as a female next time around. There is no-one to look after us.

I seem to tolerate progesterone without any issues now.
I don't think it's my thyroid. This has been going on since Feb on and off, but now is becoming more frequent and more severe.

With stress the whole system is affected, we can't simply point to one gland as being at fault. Every organ, gland and cell will be disturbed. Stress is not only emotional, physical but also lifestyle, nutritional deficiencies, dehydration, sleep, exercise etc.

Last night after eating (white fish, tomatoes and well-cooked broccoli) I became very bloated - again in my upper stomach area.

Perhaps change to more easily digestible foods. White rice in a gelatin broth. You may not be making sufficient stomach acid to breakdown the protein in the fish. Fish is also higher in PUFAs which is not ideal. I would switch to oysters or shellfish. I would reserve higher protein meals for my lunch time meal as stomach acid is optimal between noon and 2pm.

Any possibility this is from a food born illness? The only thing that stands out is that I had some scant blood in my stool a few times right before all of this started several months ago.

If you are not producing adequate stomach acid and if you are high in estrogen, you will also have insufficient bile salts to aid proper digestion. All foods will be problematic. Gelatin broth helps with proper digestion.

I would check B12 & B6 levels as B12 will be low if stomach acid is low. B12 is also required for proper thyroid function along with other B-vitamins, minerals; iodine, selenium, copper, iron, manganese and vitamins.

Peat does say that thyroid supplementation requires a good diet. I think it is best to have a supportive diet and lifestyle to optimise thyroid function.

I think T3 maybe useful when your Reverse T3 is high, however I found it to come down by increasing calories, reducing stresses such as over exercising and inflammation. I have also seen TSH come down just by tackling gut endotoxins.

In your case RT3 is low, not high however, your free T4 is low. This is the unbound T4 in the blood and what’s available to your body for use. If you were hyperthyroid then we would expect high freeT4 which is not the case here. Your free T3 is on the high side, so you would not want to supplement T3 but instead supplement with T4. The most common problem when supplementing straight T4 is the risk of having it convert to Reverse T3. Your RT3 is low indicating that the cells are permissible to more T4. When T4 is low we would expect the pituitary gland to be screaming for more T4 by ramping up the signal via TSH.

Your tsh though, is low and occasionally, a low TSH may result from an abnormality in the pituitary gland, which prevents it from making enough TSH to stimulate the thyroid which is defined as secondary hypothyroidism.

When dealing with a low-functioning pituitary - Hypopituitarism, is not only involved with regulation of TSH but many other hormones like prolactin, sex hormones, growth hormones and cortisol.

With your history of infertility, then I would investigate this path.

Pituitary Disorders

Vitamin B12 deficiency common in primary hypothyroidism. - PubMed - NCBI

Last week I had dropped back on my thyroid dose but had gone back up, taking smaller doses throughout the day. Yesterday, about an hour before my appt. in the afternoon, I took a small dose (I always take it sublingually) shortly after I felt a flutter in my throat and my pulse pick up.

Have you investigated just straight T4 cytomel. I would explore this option with your dr and whether low functioning pituitary might be the cause. If you are carrying a lot of weight, sometimes cushing-like features may be a give-away clue.
Pseudo-Cushing Syndrome: Overview, Causes and Complications, History and Physical Examination

Hypopituitarism: Causes, Symptoms, and Treatment

made an appt on Friday for a consult on the removal of my cracked and infected wisdom tooth (the Dr. is a specialist in cavitation).

Wise decision, one less stress for the immune system.

had a feeling of aching on both sides of my pelvis around the area of my ovaries (which are almost non-existent now) - don't get the gastro-connection at all. Is it adrenals?

Ovary are still functional after menopause unless these have been removed.

Removal of the ovaries after menopause also impacts a woman’s hormonal balance. The statement that is often told to patients – “you are in menopause, your ovaries are not doing anything anyway” is certainly NOT true. After menopause, our ovaries are still responsible for producing 50% of our androgens. Furthermore, new hormones and factors are identified every day, so there is probably a wealth of other hormones that our ovaries make after menopause which we have not identified yet.

http://thecenterforoptimalhealth.or...ement-therapy/ladies--keep-your-ovaries-.html

Ovaries that continue to produce even small amounts of female and male hormones will help to maintain bone strength, preventing osteoporosis and fractures, a major cause of disability and death in older women.

Professional Commentary - OvaryResearch.com
All organ systems are connnected, yes adrenals will be overworked and if you have a low functioning pituitary for whatever reason your ability to make hormones will be further reduced and stress hormones will increase.

Meditating and cutting back on coffee for now.

I love coffee but it has never loved me, however now it is definately not good for me. Tea is no good for me either. Tea is high in fluoride so I have to be really careful not to drink too much. It intereferes with my iodine and iron levels.

BTW, I was tested positive for Epstein- Barr many years ago, but I thought we all have that and have never looked into it.

A possible link between the Epstein-Barr virus infection and autoimmune thyroid disorders

I know one family completely incapacited by this virus. The children recovered but parents had ongoing chronic fatigue. The virus remains latent however, once you become compromised then it is reactivated to resume further damaged.

I am also wondering if it's possible that a Peat type diet improved my thyroid function to the point that I do not need as much thyroid. I honestly rarely ate fruit and never had much dairy before peating. I also ate a lot more starches. I wonder it these three things alone have improved thyroid function. I also read on here about a few people turning hyper even with a tsh below 1.

I am certain a pro-thyroid diet will improve function which is wise to tackle diet first and then see what is needed.

I have been wondering the high T3 because I also have high T3, low RT3 and free T4 at the lower end of the range, however, my tsh skyrocketed as I started to lose weight.

Elevated T3 levels can indicate thyroid issues, such as: Graves’ disease, hyperthyroidism,painless (silent) thyroiditis,thyrotoxic periodic paralysis, toxic nodular goiter.

High T3 levels might also indicate high levels of protein in the blood. In rare cases, these elevated levels could indicate thyroid cancer or thyrotoxicosis.So having high free T3 is not good.

I think as did lots of fruit, sugar, OJ, liver, coffee; all anti-estrogenic substances; estrogen was released intracellularly increasing into circulation. This may have resulted in bound T4, signalling pituitary to produce more T4. This is the only way I can explain the Low Reverse T3. I only see high RT3 in others and never low. I also tested very low in iodine even though I eat plenty shellfish. I tried seaweed and some supplemental iodine and it also caused severe reactions. I have been supplementing T4 which Peat says is the safest means of increasing iodine and I find now I can tolerate seaweed without causing terrible pain in my neck and head and kidneys.

I am going to attempt to somehow do the ultrasound and the wisdom tooth. With my husband's health issues (which are being very well controlled) and the state of health insurance + being self employed, I just have to try to fix a lot of this on my own.

It is a blessing that your husband is under control which should free you to focus on your health issues bit by bit. The testing is horribly expensive which only confirms we need to focus on good nutrition, clean wholesome foods, sleep, rest, sunshine and lots of laughter. It is a constant work in progress and as we age. Unfortunately, society does not allow us to slow down. In youth, we never had to think how to optimise the body, it just did everything right and it was predictable. Whole new ball game once menopause hits. Society wants us to do a 180 degree of what our bodies want and need.

Keep us updated with your results.
Best.
 
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A

austin06

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Sep 4, 2017
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Thank you so much for such a detailed and thoughtful response!

So sorry to hear about your mother-in-law. All of this certainly hits us at a time when we seem least ready to deal with it and need to be doing some intense self-care. And it is very good that your mother is doing so well - I got from both my mother and mother-in-law that living alone was not good after a certain point and certainly contributes to a decline in health in many cases. It’s interesting about your mom’s blood pressure - I’ve always thought that we all have a different “normal”. It's so much better to still be feeling relatively good at that age and certainly less of a worry for you.

I have now been off of all NDT a week. I felt very well and more focused and energetic until a few days ago - got tons done at work, exercised. Then two nights in a row I woke up at 3 a.m. despite doing a bit of sugar milk before bed and some OJ to try to get back to sleep. I had anxious feelings and would drift back off but then would jerk back awake again. HB was noticeable but not terribly elevated. Last night slept okay with the help of Benadryl.

Yesterday and today I've had the same kind of off day. Main symptoms are: thick feeling neck and throat, thicker sensation swallowing, frequent bowel movement in a.m., numbness and tingling in hands, tiredness and lack of focus, headache, felling warmer and easily startled (which I really noticed grocery shopping). By this time I bet that all thyroid is out of my system so maybe I am getting hypo/hyper symptoms...? These feelings come and go.

Tracking temps and pulse, temps are actually up - I never got to 98.6 even on NDT and temps are around this even when waking. Pulse is much more even and consistent at around 80-90.

These are the results from my most recent blood work and tests - thyroid is pretty much the same:

Calcium 9.7 (8.5 to 10.5) elevated

Calcium Iodized 5.45 (4.7 to 5.9) elevated

Intact PTH 70 (11-67) high

Free t3 5.4 (2.2 - 4.2)

Free T4 .82 (.80 - 1.90)

TSH .859

My Thyroid ultrasound came back with the following
Screenshot 2018-05-11 14.56.14.png
. I don’t know if this suggests some issues with the thyroid gland, but no nodules were present.

I retrieved my records online and it looks like the Dr. marked everything “normal”. Then called in a prescription for 30 mg of Armour thyroid (?). I’m still off all thyroid.

It has been suggested to me by several people that based on the PTH that I should be seeing a specialist for possible Hyperparathyroidism (Normocalcemic) so I have an appt back with the Dr. on Monday to get a referral to either an endochronologist or a surgeon. This could explain a lot of symptoms, I think.

I have MTHFR so your point about B12 is very valid. Even when feeling okay, all Bs can make me feel anxious, so I mostly avoid them. I also have COMT which apparently makes it hard for me to breakdown and process Bs, iron (and estrogen). But I did used to take a methylated B12 occasionally. I also wonder about Ferratin levels and Iron.

The thyroid is a puzzle, but your thoughts about T3 sound accurate. But if I look at the symptoms of Graves and hyperthyroidsim I can check off almost all now. I wonder about t4 only as well. I sure feel like I need something and maybe what I am feeling is hypothyroid - so confused! I have NDT I could try, but I am way too afraid of my blood pressure shooting up.

I had a Dr. put me on iodine many years ago and I felt amazing for a week until I didn’t. I’ve tried it since and it really makes me feel hyperthyroid.

I am not terribly overweight, but I look more like a bloated/fat thin person. I am less bloated since stopping thyroid. I was always very naturally thin until I took prozac after my first miscarriage and then I blew up and did look like I had Cushings. I stopped, lost most of the weight, but my metabolism (or liver) never recovered.

My infertility was all miscarriage related. I got pregnant more easily than anyone I ever knew. That was never an issues until I turned 41. Interestingly, I also recently went to have a routine pelvic exam. I have a polyp so the Dr. did an ultrasound. She said my uterus was tiny (almost the size of the polyp) - lots of scar tissues from surgeries, but she said based on the size of it, I most likely could never had a full pregnancy and there was probably a vascular issue. I had many exams by a number of Dr.s during that times, so don't know if that is true. But on top of everything else, she suggested a hysterectomy to remove both the polyp and uterus (and leave the ovaries).

Will update on how things go Monday. Not feeling very well - have not taken blood pressure as I am chicken. I’ll do it though as if it is high I have a beta blocker to bring it down. It may be parathyroid and getting T4 up (as well as iron, Bs, diet, etc.).

I truly appreciate all of the fantastic help. I will review your info more closely.

I hear you about someone taking care of us. I feel fortunate that my Pisces husband (Sun and Moon) is very much a caregiver although it takes a toll on him. His recent diagnosis was polycythemia vera due to a genetic defect - quite rare. He luckily has few symptoms, they caught it early and it can be managed, usually, for years (hopefully a cure found soon). He has weekly phlebotomies to get his red blood cells down (makes way to many) and get his risk of clots and stroke down. There is a chemo drug that many take daily that seems to work very well, but he wants to try to avoid that for now. Me not feeling well is certainly bad timing as he just did the caretaking thing with his Dad and we now have his mom nearby (and needing more every day).

We are headed to the beach for three precious days - too short, but it will be lovely.
 

BingDing

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Joined
Nov 20, 2012
Messages
976
Location
Tennessee, USA
I would suggest a somewhat broader viewpoint. Being replete in vitamins and minerals may be just as important as thyroid levels; it is the interactions of many different variables (chemicals) that determine how we feel. There are lab tests that provide a pretty good idea of these, if you can find a provider that doesn't require a doctor's order they are not too expensive. Here in Tennessee there is a company "Any Lab Test Now" for example.

Deficiencies in magnesium and vitamin D are very common, for example. Getting the lab work done is the only way to know what you need. Once those fundamentals are satisfied you might be able to get a better idea of what the thyroid levels mean, and how best to self medicate. I would be very surprised if correcting vitamin and mineral deficiencies did not change your experience and improve your health in general.

Warm regards, BD
 

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