Thyroid Panel Results. Help/advice

[Soren]

So I just received my mothers Thyroid Panel and I am not entirely sure what to make of it.

TSH: 9.320
T4 Free: 0.78
Thyroxine Total T4: 5.9
T3 Free 2.71
T3 Reverse 12.9
T3 Update 32.0
T7 1.9

A little background, she is in her late 50s and has been on NDT in the form of Nature Throid for a few years and is currently on a dose of 2 grains. She has Parkinson's disease has under gone stem cell therapy, and takes a number of other supplements. 10,000iu Vitamin D, 4000 iu Curcumin, CoQ10, resveratrol, Vitamin C, Alpha Lipoic Acid ( I have recommended she stop some of these)

While on NDT she has lost a significant amount of weight but has an increased amount of belly fat. I think that the NDT has been doing more harm than good because her basic diet has not increased to meet the nutritional needs of a faster metabolism. She has a constant cough (which may be due to serotonin from the Parkinsons).

I do not know much about Thyroid Panels but I know that there are studies that show anything about 2 is unhealthy so a TSH of 9.320 sounds very high. Seems to me that for someone taking 2 grains of NDT the TSH should be lower and the free t3 and t4 should be higher.

Any help would be very much appreciated. Thanks.

 

[theLaw]

While on NDT she has lost a significant amount of weight but has an increased amount of belly fat. I think that the NDT has been doing more harm than good because her basic diet has not increased to meet the nutritional needs of a faster metabolism. She has a constant cough (which may be due to serotonin from the Parkinsons).

I would suggest increasing her calories significantly with something dense like ice cream or cheesecake.

I'm willing to bet that she's underfed, so the thyroid is just making is worse.

Sometimes for family members damage-control is the best you can do to help. If you replace pufa with sat fat, increase her sugar intake, and make sure she has something to clean out the gut on a regular basis, that would help.

 

[Soren]

I would suggest increasing her calories significantly with something dense like ice cream or cheesecake.

I'm willing to bet that she's underfed, so the thyroid is just making is worse.

Sometimes for family members damage-control is the best you can do to help. If you replace pufa with sat fat, increase her sugar intake, and make sure she has something to clean out the gut on a regular basis, that would help.

Thanks yea that is what I've been telling her for ages. That she is chronically under nourished. I have already laid out a plan for her that includes activated charcoal 3 times a week to help clean out the gut.

 

[theLaw]

Thanks yea that is what I've been telling her for ages. That she is chronically under nourished. I have already laid out a plan for her that includes activated charcoal 3 times a week to help clean out the gut.

You could also just use standard antibiotics, MB, or carrot salad daily. AC might be a challenge.

 

[Soren]

You could also just use standard antibiotics, MB, or carrot salad daily. AC might be a challenge.

Why do you say that AC might be a challenge? MB i'm a bit weary of because of the increase in Serotonin which i believe is a big factor in PD

 

[Insaneacinamide]

Have you listened to Ray's Endocrinology (part 1) Parkinson's KMUD interview? One of his best interviews IMO.


Has she done a sleep study test? You log her sleep with something like a fitbit? She could be having bad sleep.

 

[theLaw]

Why do you say that AC might be a challenge? MB i'm a bit weary of because of the increase in Serotonin which i believe is a big factor in PD

That's a good point about MB, because proper dosing could be a problem.

AC at effective doses (1-4T) can be a chore to digest for some people. The capsules are basically useless.

Perhaps carrot salad might be your best bet.

Also, a high-quality BCAA sup might go a long way to helping her improve digestion/assimilation and lower serotonin:

Depleting Serotonin With BCAA

Shop

 

[Soren]

Have you listened to Ray's Endocrinology (part 1) Parkinson's KMUD interview? One of his best interviews IMO.


Has she done a sleep study test? You log her sleep with something like a fitbit? She could be having bad sleep.

I haven't heard that one yet. Thanks for the link. Not sure what her sleep is like. What do you mean by a sleep study, just to see if she is getting her 8 hours or quality of sleep?

 

[Insaneacinamide]

I haven't heard that one yet. Thanks for the link. Not sure what her sleep is like. What do you mean by a sleep study, just to see if she is getting her 8 hours or quality of sleep?

Sleep study that checks for things like for sleep architecture/levels, apnea/breathing.
Does she take any sleep medication? She wake up refreshed or mention her sleep is good/bad?
She might have restless leg syndrome, which can effect sleep also.
Restless legs syndrome - Wikipedia

Also, forget to mention Haidut mentioned in a Roddy interview that he feels Resveratrol is estrogenic.

 

[Soren]

Sleep study that checks for things like for sleep architecture/levels, apnea/breathing.
Does she take any sleep medication? She wake up refreshed or mention her sleep is good/bad?
She might have restless leg syndrome, which can effect sleep also.
Restless legs syndrome - Wikipedia

Also, forget to mention Haidut mentioned in a Roddy interview that he feels Resveratrol is estrogenic.

I think she sleeps ok but I'll ask her and see if I can monitor it somehow. Yea i agree with Resveratrol told her to stop taking it.

 

[Wagner83]

Travis made quite a few posts on Parkinson's disease and other degenerative conditions, here onwards : Caffeine And Progression Of Parkinson Disease: A Deleterious Interaction With Creatine
Smoking And Tobacco Use
Hydrogenated CO may not be a good idea: Coconut Oil Leads To Dementia?

 

[Soren]

That's a good point about MB, because proper dosing could be a problem.

AC at effective doses (1-4T) can be a chore to digest for some people. The capsules are basically useless.

Perhaps carrot salad might be your best bet.

Also, a high-quality BCAA sup might go a long way to helping her improve digestion/assimilation and lower serotonin:

Depleting Serotonin With BCAA

Shop

Is that 1-4 tablespoons? Do you have any thoughts on her particular levels of thyroid hormone? Aside from her TSH being high I'm pretty lost.

 

[Soren]

Travis made quite a few posts on Parkinson's disease and other degenerative conditions, here onwards : Caffeine And Progression Of Parkinson Disease: A Deleterious Interaction With Creatine
Smoking And Tobacco Use
Hydrogenated CO may not be a good idea: Coconut Oil Leads To Dementia?

Wow that creatine caffeine one is shocking. All those bodybuilding preworkouts might be a bit of problem.

Although on further reading it seems to be not entirely conclusive. Seems like the issue is more relevant to those already taking levadopa (which my mother is not). Still not going to be recommending creatine to her any time soon i think.

 

[Soren]

Anyone have any thoughts on the Thyroid results I posted?

Very much appreciate all the advice with regards to Parkinson's disease but I'm really trying to understand what these different levels mean. I'm pretty sure that a TSH of 9 is unhealthy but other than that I am a bit unsure.

I have a lot of theories and educated guesses but aside from that I would really appreciate some feedback as to what the results indicate/what should be a healthy range to aim at. I know Ray has said below 2 for TSH but in terms of Reverse t3 for example I have no clue. I didn't even know what T7 was. From what I've read it is the level of t3/t4 update. But I have no idea if her numbers in the context of everything else are good, bad, ok, terrible?

 

[theLaw]

Is that 1-4 tablespoons? Do you have any thoughts on her particular levels of thyroid hormone? Aside from her TSH being high I'm pretty lost.

Yes, 1-4 Tbsp.

Thyroid is just too tricky, so I think that simple experimentation is probably best.

 

[aguilaroja]

I'm pretty sure that a TSH of 9 is unhealthy...

One thing to double check is if your mother’s supplements include biotin as an ingredient. If so, have her stop the biotin for a few days and re-test:
Biotin Can Distort Thyroid Lab Testing

 

[Soren]

One thing to double check is if your mother’s supplements include biotin as an ingredient. If so, have her stop the biotin for a few days and re-test:
Biotin Can Distort Thyroid Lab Testing

Thanks for this I read this yesterday while browsing the forum's. She does take biotin which is unfortunate because it throws her results into some doubt. What I wish I new is by how much biotin can influence her results. If she has a TSH of 9 but she is taking biotin is it really 8, 4, 1 who knows?

 

[aguilaroja]

... If she has a TSH of 9 but she is taking biotin is it really 8, 4, 1 who knows?

My recollection of the studies is that the distortion of TSH was observed but there is no established "correction factor". Even a fairly small dose of biotin can bump TSH. The most accurate thing to do is re-test.
Since your mother is using considerable vitamin D with other metabolic influences, it might be good to check serum vitamin D with upcoming lab tests, and perhaps other vitamin D related testing, depending on cooperation from the clinician.
The vitamin D3 (cholecalciferol) levels are a... | Ray Peat Forum

 

[Dotdash]

"Stop the Thyroid Madness" website gives good information on thyroid panel lab results, how to interpret, and what the best range of numbers is based on the many lab results of those contributing data to the website. There is a formula for measuring the RT3 to see if it is abnormal.

 

[Soren]

"Stop the Thyroid Madness" website gives good information on thyroid panel lab results, how to interpret, and what the best range of numbers is based on the many lab results of those contributing data to the website. There is a formula for measuring the RT3 to see if it is abnormal.

Thanks for the tip i'll check them out.