The vaccine is probably only as bad (or a little worse) than the supposed virus

[tankasnowgod]

i think both sides, the militant covid people and the doomsday vax people, are both too sensational.

I'd tend to agree with this. There are lots of people predicting that hundreds of millions of the vaxxed will die this winter, but so far, no solid evidence of this sort of increase in death. This event would truly be staggering, no way to cover it up. I still think the so called vaccines are useless (proven with their own trial data), and dangerous (and shown by skyrocketing VAERS reports), but it looks like another insult to health that the vast majority will survive (at least, with the initial series, even the first few boosters).

i was just pointing out the anti vax hypocrisy.

I don't see any hypocrisy. There is no proof that SARS-Cov-2 exists. And even if it does, the tests spit out an overwhelming majority of false positives, at 97% or more. And you can never pinpoint an infection time for any "case."

But we have real world proof of people getting injected with so called "vaccines." You can get the injection down to the day, hour, minute, maybe even second in some cases. It's like comparing car accident deaths to Bigfoot deaths. Obviously, there is evidence of car crashes and fatalities, but there is little evidence of Bigfoot.

 

[mrchibbs]

obviously they are all connected, as they all mysteriously started happening in 2020.

I've read the accounts of people on the vaccine long haulers subreddit. the symptoms are the same as those of "normal" long haulers. Tachycardia/POTS, extreme brain fog/fatigue, amenorrhea, and many others. Can you name a common symptom of either that ISN'T seen in the other?

I think there is more here that meets the eye. How do we know if all these symptoms started mysteriously happening in 2020? I'm not saying something exists or doesn't outright but aside from the spring 2020 excess mortality in nursing homes after the WHO and media sent everyone in a state of alarm, it's difficult to find clear cut excess mortality anywhere.

Knowing what we know from Ray, is it not highly possible that the unprecedented measures and the accompanying stress, along with the could have caused much of the symptoms people associate with ''long covid''? Several recent reports/study on ''long-covid'' found that the symptoms were not associated with prior ''sars cov-2'' infection.

Contrary to the current narrative, loss of smell/taste is not a unique symptom. I spent much of my childhood/teenage years ridden with colds/flu and I experienced long lasting loss of taste/smell on several occasions.

I think it's highly plausible that the constant anxiety from the hysteria, along with social isolation, staying indoor and eating fast food worsened the otherwise normal flu symptoms millions experience every year. There is substantial research highlighting the anti-metabolic and immunity lowering effects of social isolation.

Now with the mass vaccination campaign there is a clear signal of widespread side effects and lethal consequences. It is no coincidence that there is now a push to normalize cardiovascular problems in young people and in the general population as a consequence of the psychological distress of the pandemic measures. Clearly the shots are causing significant adverse reactions in many people.

 

[LeeLemonoil]

Check the thread out where @Giraffe tagged me. The doctors4covid ethics put out some info. Sinovac seems to be the best of the lot.

I'd always opt for a ead-virion but Sinovac or Covaxin arent avilable in Europe

 

[Kram]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but:

"Our immune systems produce these antibodies in response to both vaccination and natural infection with Covid. However - though the researchers do not say so explicitly, possibly because doing so would be politically untenable - spike protein antibody levels are MUCH higher following vaccination than infection. Thus the downstream response to vaccination may be more severe."

"A large Israeli study found spike protein antibody levels about four times as high in vaccinated as infected people. At the same time, vaccine-generated antibodies wane far more quickly, dropping up to 40 percent a month compared to 5 percent a month for naturally generated antibodies."

A frightening new potential explanation for vaccine-driven myocarditis and other problems

Researchers in the New England Journal of Medicine raise the possibility of an uncontrolled autoimmune response to the coronavirus spike protein that may last indefinitely

alexberenson.substack.com

 

[LeeLemonoil]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but:

"Our immune systems produce these antibodies in response to both vaccination and natural infection with Covid. However - though the researchers do not say so explicitly, possibly because doing so would be politically untenable - spike protein antibody levels are MUCH higher following vaccination than infection. Thus the downstream response to vaccination may be more severe."

"A large Israeli study found spike protein antibody levels about four times as high in vaccinated as infected people. At the same time, vaccine-generated antibodies wane far more quickly, dropping up to 40 percent a month compared to 5 percent a month for naturally generated antibodies."

A frightening new potential explanation for vaccine-driven myocarditis and other problems

Researchers in the New England Journal of Medicine raise the possibility of an uncontrolled autoimmune response to the coronavirus spike protein that may last indefinitely

alexberenson.substack.com

Thanks thts highly intriguing and concerning. @Ivysaur - we discussed it. A "dumbfounded" antibody response that the organisms quickly tries to keep in check

 

[BobbinTook]

Monster difference. First, there is zero doubt that people are getting injected with SOMETHING. And you can trace it back to a very specific time. Within the day at least, the hour in the vast majority of cases. Possibly down to the minute. And before that, we know they weren't injected with what they are calling the "Covid Vaccines."

But, there is zero proof that SARS-Cov-2 even exists. There was never an isolation. I have yet to see a paper from the original Chinese Scientists. No health department has a sample, despite over 100 FOI requests. The tests are surrogate tests, that don't test for ANY virus, and can be easily manipulated. 100% of symptoms overlap with the Common Cold and Flu. Plus, every symptom is involved in dozens, if not hundreds of other conditions.

Human 2019-nCoV Isolate | EVAg

Virus: Infectious cellculture supernatant of human 2019-nCoV (Virus, Cultivable virus)

www.european-virus-archive.com

Does this satisfy the criteria in your opinion? I'm not in disagreement on the bulk of it, nor necessarily this.. just curious, this is not an attempt to prove you wrong. If there are isolates and one is to make an argument based on the belief that there are not and are then proven wrong, then the rest of the argument could lose a lot of weight. Perhaps the cell culture part makes it not an isolate? If that is the case are any viruses truly isolated? Forgive my ignorance on the matter..

Arguing existence or origin/novelty does seem a bit like an unwinnable battle and given that there are plenty of arguments such as PCR fraud that seem much less disputable, it might end up detracting from those.

 

[Mauritio]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but:

"Our immune systems produce these antibodies in response to both vaccination and natural infection with Covid. However - though the researchers do not say so explicitly, possibly because doing so would be politically untenable - spike protein antibody levels are MUCH higher following vaccination than infection. Thus the downstream response to vaccination may be more severe."

"A large Israeli study found spike protein antibody levels about four times as high in vaccinated as infected people. At the same time, vaccine-generated antibodies wane far more quickly, dropping up to 40 percent a month compared to 5 percent a month for naturally generated antibodies."

A frightening new potential explanation for vaccine-driven myocarditis and other problems

Researchers in the New England Journal of Medicine raise the possibility of an uncontrolled autoimmune response to the coronavirus spike protein that may last indefinitely

alexberenson.substack.com

Thanks . Would you make a thread about this ?
This is important and hasn't been mentioned to my knowledge .

 

[Lollipop2]

I'd always opt for a ead-virion but Sinovac or Covaxin arent avilable in Europe

The Austrian doctor who posted earlier on this thread said he and his family took it. It must be in EU. Are you in Germany?

 

[JudiBlueHen]

Human 2019-nCoV Isolate | EVAg

Virus: Infectious cellculture supernatant of human 2019-nCoV (Virus, Cultivable virus)

www.european-virus-archive.com

Does this satisfy the criteria in your opinion? I'm not in disagreement on the bulk of it, nor necessarily this.. just curious, this is not an attempt to prove you wrong. If there are isolates and one is to make an argument based on the belief that there are not and are then proven wrong, then the rest of the argument could lose a lot of weight. Perhaps the cell culture part makes it not an isolate? If that is the case are any viruses truly isolated? Forgive my ignorance on the matter..

Arguing existence or origin/novelty does seem a bit like an unwinnable battle and given that there are plenty of arguments such as PCR fraud that seem much less disputable, it might end up detracting from those.

Interesting. For 2000 euro you can buy a "live" cultivable vial of sars-cov2 virus, in a culture medium. The entire genome is listed. Collected 28 January 2020 in Germany. Does this prove anything?

 

[tankasnowgod]

Human 2019-nCoV Isolate | EVAg

Virus: Infectious cellculture supernatant of human 2019-nCoV (Virus, Cultivable virus)

www.european-virus-archive.com

Does this satisfy the criteria in your opinion? I'm not in disagreement on the bulk of it, nor necessarily this.. just curious, this is not an attempt to prove you wrong. If there are isolates and one is to make an argument based on the belief that there are not and are then proven wrong, then the rest of the argument could lose a lot of weight. Perhaps the cell culture part makes it not an isolate? If that is the case are any viruses truly isolated? Forgive my ignorance on the matter..

I don't know how it's "isolated" when they used at least two forms of foreign genetic material in there. And possibly had some contamination from the human they got the sample from.

It supposedly use "Production Cell Line" Vero E6. That's African Green Monkey Kidney Cells.

Growth and Maintenance of Vero Cell Lines

Vero cells are derived from the kidney of an African green monkey, and are one of the more commonly used mammalian continuous cell lines in microbiology, and molecular and cell biology research. This unit includes protocols for the growth and maintenance ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Then, check out their culture medium-

Culture Medium: DMEM (Dulbecco's Modified Eagles Medium) (PAA, Cölbe, Germany) with 4.5 g/L Glucose (PAA) supplemented with 10% Foetal Bovine Serum (PAA), 1% Penicillin/Streptomycin 100 x concentrate (Penicillin 10000 U/mL, Streptomycin 10 mg/ mL) (PAA), 1% L-Glutamine 200 mM, 1% Sodium Pyruvate 100 mM (PAA), 1% MEM nonessential amino acids (NEAA) 100 x concentrate (PAA) - Subculture routine: Detachment with an EDTA/trypsin mixture (PAA) - Split Ratio: Split 1:10 twice a week

Why are they adding "Foetal Bovine Serum" to an "isolate?" And then, why would they add antibiotics? Is it not sterile in the first place? Why are they adding trypsin, an enzyme that helps to digest protein?

As far as the "genetic sequence," what did they sequence? Human DNA? Bovine DNA? Monkey DNA? Some other contaminant DNA?

There's also the issue that this was taken in Germany in January of 2020. This entire "Pandemic" storyline rests on the idea that a "Novel Corona Virus" originated in Wuhan, China, in December 2019, and then spread to the world, necessitating extreme medical experimentation..... in March of 2020.

Arguing existence or origin/novelty does seem a bit like an unwinnable battle and given that there are plenty of arguments such as PCR fraud that seem much less disputable, it might end up detracting from those.

Maybe, but if you show that the "isolate" isn't really an isolate, it strengthens other arguments, like the PCR fraud, even more. It's proven that that PCR can be manipulated based on cycle count. There is no way it can detect "viral load," as that in itself is pretty much an oxymoron.

But if there was no isolated sample to calibrate the test to in the first place........ then what would testing even mean?

 

[Grapelander]

Seems just as risky and very close to the brain...

Exactly. The nasal formulations will be full-on nano-scale. I already noticed that in other proposed nasal Rx's.
Best to avoid anything nano as it can lodge anywhere in the body.
2016: Hydrogel nanoparticles and nanocomposites for nasal drug/vaccine delivery
The rapid mucociliary clearance of the drug-loaded nanoparticles can cause a reduction in bioavailability percentage after intranasal administration. Thus, research efforts have considerably been directed towards the development of hydrogel nanosystems which have mucoadhesive properties in order to maximize the residence time, and hence increase the period of contact with the nasal mucosa and enhance the drug absorption.

 

[Grapelander]

a problem I see with the people who think the vax is a doomsday event, is that they attribute every death near the time of vaccine as being caused by the vaccine, yet to them any death with positive covid is never caused by covid but always something else like a misdiagnosis, co morbidity, heart attack, the vents, treatments, etc.

for example, someone takes vaccine, 10 days later they have a heart attack, all the heavy anti vax people say the vax killed him.

but someone gets covid, 10 days in has a heart attack, and they say he was just obese and it wasn't covid.

or if they have long covid, they're just hypothyroid, but if they're post vaccine injured, it was the vaccine and not cause they're also hypothyroid.

it's like they want all the covid deaths to be fake, and all vaccine deaths to actually be vaccine deaths. they're mainly fueled by an ideology and they'll view things in certain ways to reaffirm it

im not pro vax , but that's just my 2c observing the discourse, including the post vaccine death thread on this forum. I largely agree both covid and vaccine can do damage in weakened people. if i had to choose one Id still opt for the whole virus chinese one even with the aluminum, although i won't be getting any

Anytime I am told I have a choice between two alternatives I know I am being manipulated (vax/anti-vax; mask/anti-mask; left/right).
Most situations have innumerable alternatives.
Look at Dr. Peter McCullough - he tells folks to be aware of C19 shot - and yet he got his annual flu shot.
It's not about taking sides or compromising. You should never compromise with someone who is lying.

False Dilemma
Definition:
A limited number of options (usually two) is given, while in reality there are more options. A false dilemma is an illegitimate use of the "or" operator.
Examples:
(i) Either you're for me or against me.
(ii) America: love it or leave it.
(iii) Either support gun confiscation or have the government provide everyone with his own private nuclear warhead, you decide which one.
Proof:
Identify the options given and show (with an example) that there is an additional option.
So the additional options may be natural immunity; early treatment, prophylaxis, avoidance, doing nothing, etc. Not just vax/anti-vax.

 

[Kris]

what is the difference between astrazeneca and mRNA vaccines? anyone knows?

 

[tankasnowgod]

Look at Dr. Peter McCullough - he tells folks to be aware of C19 shot - and yet he got his annual flu shot.

Even if you are a believer in traditional vaccines, there was plenty of evidence (since February!) that the so called "Covid Vaccines" were more dangerous than regular vaccines. And even True Vaccine Believers knew there were risks to experimental vaccines (at least they did prior to 2019).

In March, Anthony Colpo wrote this article detailing how the "Covid Vaccines" were 74-96 times deadlier than recent Flu Vaccines-

CDC Data Shows COVID-19 Vaccines are Far Deadlier than Regular Influenza Vaccines

As I've noted in previous articles, the new COVID-19 vaccines are rapidly accumulating a disturbing number of adverse event and death reports on the US and UK databases. These reports are submitted by medical personnel and members of the public who suspect a vaccine injection contributed to or...

anthonycolpo.com

You don't have to be "Anti-Vax" to question or reject the Covid shots. You could be Anti-mRNA. Or Anti-EUA Drug. Or Anti-Tyranny. Or Anti-poorly tested drug.

 

[tankasnowgod]

what is the difference between astrazeneca and mRNA vaccines? anyone knows?

AZ is a "viral vector" drug. Also, AZ didn't get EUA in the US, despite the US Federal Government basically promising them at least a billion dollars if they could fake up similar evidence to Pfizer. I still don't know what AstraZenica did to have to sit in the corner with a dunce cap on in the US. Their drug seems to be just a problematic and deadly as everyone else's!

Authorities Are Lying Through Their Teeth About the Deadly AstraZeneca COVID-19 Vaccine

As you are no doubt aware, the new AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine is currently at the centre of an ongoing global ***t storm. Heralded as a life saver, it has since become far more famous for taking lives instead of saving them. In the UK alone, between 4 January 2021 and 7 March 2021, the...

anthonycolpo.com

The AstraZeneca COVID-19 Vaccine: Leaving a Trail of Death & Destruction in Europe, UK and Australia

Warning: This article contains strong language. If you are offended by naughty words that rhyme with truck and toolkit, please close this page now. Two days after receiving the Oxford-AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine, Australian Federal Health Minister, Greg Hunt, was admitted to hospital with a...

anthonycolpo.com

The Appalling Science and Conflicts of Interest Behind the Oxford-AstraZeneca COVID-19 Vaccine

In the West, three drugs currently dominate the COVID-19 vaccine limelight: The Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna mRNA drugs, and the Oxford-AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine. The latter, as the name indicates, is the result of a collaboration between Oxford University and multinational drug giant...

anthonycolpo.com

 

[LeeLemonoil]

The Austrian doctor who posted earlier on this thread said he and his family took it. It must be in EU. Are you in Germany?

It isn’t available. And if you were tk vacc yourself with it, you would not get a vax-certificate here for taking Sinovac.

 

[Andman]

J&J is only one shot and it’s vector seems safer - is even „Life-extending“ in fruitfulness. The vector, not there plasmid

yeah, thats what they said here in Austria too - just one shot of J&J and youre free

many of my friends bought it and got the jab, only to be informed that they need to get another one until 03.01.22 or theyre counted as unvaxxed again

dont comply

 

[Kris]

so AZ is a little less harmful than mRNA vaccines? Or the same ***t?

there is one issue that confuses me. Some members here believe in existence of 'virus' and others don't. I had this discussion in the thread I posted 'the controversy of germ theory'. Ok, you get a flu. It cannot be treated it with antibiotics, because it is a virus. Basically, when they do not see bacteria being culprit to 'infection', they call it 'virus'. I don't believe in viruses, but i am wondering how they can identify different DNA particles that are associated with particular illness. It makes no sense that non-alive particles of DNA would have any investment in invading our body and reproducing in our cells, this idea seem ludicrous. RP seems to believe in Viruses, by the way. What causes 'covid infection'? Is it 5G or there is an actual virus. I think, unless these things are cleared, all that discussion about covid is pretty much meaningless.

 

[yerrag]

Anytime I am told I have a choice between two alternatives I know I am being manipulated (vax/anti-vax; mask/anti-mask; left/right).
Most situations have innumerable alternatives.
Look at Dr. Peter McCullough - he tells folks to be aware of C19 shot - and yet he got his annual flu shot.
It's not about taking sides or compromising. You should never compromise with someone who is lying.

False Dilemma
Definition:
A limited number of options (usually two) is given, while in reality there are more options. A false dilemma is an illegitimate use of the "or" operator.
Examples:
(i) Either you're for me or against me.
(ii) America: love it or leave it.
(iii) Either support gun confiscation or have the government provide everyone with his own private nuclear warhead, you decide which one.
Proof:
Identify the options given and show (with an example) that there is an additional option.
So the additional options may be natural immunity; early treatment, prophylaxis, avoidance, doing nothing, etc. Not just vax/anti-vax.

++

It's not even IVM or vaccination.

IVM is relatively better, albeit by magnitudes. But it doesn't work for everyone. When it doesn't work, should one regret not getting vaccinated? Not at all.

By medical media censorship, many are not aware of the very effectiveness of artemisia annual or artemisinin. nor of the use of chlorine dioxide.

 

[Herbie]

so AZ is a little less harmful than mRNA vaccines? Or the same ***t?

there is one issue that confuses me. Some members here believe in existence of 'virus' and others don't. I had this discussion in the thread I posted 'the controversy of germ theory'. Ok, you get a flu. It cannot be treated it with antibiotics, because it is a virus. Basically, when they do not see bacteria being culprit to 'infection', they call it 'virus'. I don't believe in viruses, but i am wondering how they can identify different DNA particles that are associated with particular illness. RP seems to believe in Viruses, by the way. What causes 'covid infection'? Is it 5G or there is an actual virus. I think, unless these things are cleared, all that discussion about covid is pretty much meaningless.

I’m paraphrasing Ray from the last interview with Danny. They made it in Fort Detrick and leaked out and the US soldiers took it to Wuhan for the military games in which they performed very poorly and then we know the rest.