The Reason Behind Coronavirus Deaths In Italy

Jeemmy

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So I'm an Italian currently following lots of streams of information about the virus since TOO MANY things are really strange at the moment. Well, I came after something really big. This guy in the video (unfortunately it is in Italian) is looking for answers and he is in contact with a med student and his father, pneumologist for more than 40 years. They heavily criticized the current therapy used in Italy, bringing the case of a friend of his, went to the hospital for severe pneumonia. Fortunately he was treated by antibiotics, which saved him since his pneumonia was not viral. HOWEVER, before the coronavirus test, this guy was given this oxigen "helmet" which seems to be the standard practice now in Italy. Well, the guy nearly died during his sleep, fortunately he had still good oxigenation of the brain and was able to wake up and throw away this helmet after screaming for help without anyone hearing him. The point of the student and his father is that probably most of the people are currently dying for respiratory arrest due to oxigen/co2 imbalances produced by these helmets, which is why in Italy we have more deaths but less intensive therapy cases. Add up the facts that they use antiviral drugs when most of the pneumonia are due to bacterial origin because people are positive to coronavirus tests and there you have all these deaths. Video:
 

RealNeat

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So I'm an Italian currently following lots of streams of information about the virus since TOO MANY things are really strange at the moment. Well, I came after something really big. This guy in the video (unfortunately it is in Italian) is looking for answers and he is in contact with a med student and his father, pneumologist for more than 40 years. They heavily criticized the current therapy used in Italy, bringing the case of a friend of his, went to the hospital for severe pneumonia. Fortunately he was treated by antibiotics, which saved him since his pneumonia was not viral. HOWEVER, before the coronavirus test, this guy was given this oxigen "helmet" which seems to be the standard practice now in Italy. Well, the guy nearly died during his sleep, fortunately he had still good oxigenation of the brain and was able to wake up and throw away this helmet after screaming for help without anyone hearing him. The point of the student and his father is that probably most of the people are currently dying for respiratory arrest due to oxigen/co2 imbalances produced by these helmets, which is why in Italy we have more deaths but less intensive therapy cases. Add up the facts that they use antiviral drugs when most of the pneumonia are due to bacterial origin because people are positive to coronavirus tests and there you have all these deaths. Video:


sounds like @ecstatichamster experience. Without the helmet.

"I am not sure I had covid-19. I think I had a very, very bad flu like illness. I have since learned that the H1N1 flu this year has been the worst in many years."
 
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Jeemmy

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I'm convinced that all the symptoms are probably due to common pneumonias, which occur every year, covid-19 is just one of the many virus we have sitting in our body doing basically nothing...
 
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I was sicker than I have ever been in my life, before getting the pneumonia, but I rapidly got better when I began the losartan and cyproheptadine. I think in hospitals you get very old frail people with many health problems, and they get oxygen, one really bad thing. They get ventilation, another really bad thing. And the treatment kills them.

Nobody, and I mean nobody that I am aware of, in the medical field, every talks about the necessity to maintain adequate/high-ish CO2 levels. Lacking this necessary foundational knowledge of how we breathe, they act on the erroneous assumptions that a person who isn't oxygenating well needs more oxygen and they don't realize that the oxygen kills without enough CO2.

That is why people who get into the hospital for some viral disease that is overwhelming them, often die.
 

Giraffe

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That is why people who get into the hospital for some viral disease that is overwhelming them, often die.
Just watched a news report from New York. Don't know what to make of the news... if anything is reliable at all... Anyway ... the ER doctor said, that if a patient comes in with 'Covid-19 symptoms' and a chest scan that looks like 'Covid-19' they assume that he is infected with SARS-CoV-2. It takes three days to get the test results from the laboratory.
 
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Just watched a news report from New York. Don't know what to make of the news... if anything is reliable at all... Anyway ... the ER doctor said, that if a patient comes in with 'Covid-19 symptoms' and a chest scan that looks like 'Covid-19' they assume that he is infected with SARS-CoV-2. It takes three days to get the test results from the laboratory.

sounds like it’s true.
 
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@Jeemmy check out the thread Giraffe linked to, an New York City ICU doctor seems to make a similar point that you raise about the misuse of ventilation.
It's interesting how his video has quickly gotten views - when it was first posted it was around 7k (mar 31-apr 1), now its at 70k.


At 0:55 in his new video, he mentions what could be wrong with the ventilation:
 
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Jeemmy

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Thanks @foodandtheworld, I saw the videos and it makes sense. The thing I see in Italy is that in Lombardy, the biggest and most advanced region, deaths are like 4-500% of last year's regardings respiratory diseases, while in the other regions they are less than 100%, I've seen physicians making videos of empty hospitals converted to support the virus spread which will probably never come there. It is very strange, when the guy in the videos says it's different from what ever we treated before I think that there is something in the environment which adds up to the virus and causes these strange symptoms, since I cannot explain the huge difference in numbers between regions in Italy.
 

Gone Peating

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Thanks @foodandtheworld, I saw the videos and it makes sense. The thing I see in Italy is that in Lombardy, the biggest and most advanced region, deaths are like 4-500% of last year's regardings respiratory diseases, while in the other regions they are less than 100%, I've seen physicians making videos of empty hospitals converted to support the virus spread which will probably never come there. It is very strange, when the guy in the videos says it's different from what ever we treated before I think that there is something in the environment which adds up to the virus and causes these strange symptoms, since I cannot explain the huge difference in numbers between regions in Italy.

Smog in certain parts of Italy is the worst in Europe.
 

nwo2012

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Lombardy has the highest population of any region in Italy. It has a high % of elderly. It is one of the most polluted areas in Europe.
Lombardy always has the highest number of deaths for respiratory diseases in Italy.
Add this to the points in the OP and it's a recipe for disaster.
 

Fon

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I read that the parts of italy hardest hit are also the areas with the highest # of Chinese immigrants. Apparently italy has the biggest population of Chinese immigrants of any country in the world. Many Chinese were flying back and forth unknowingly spreading it. Due to the suppression of info by the Chinese Gov. Anyone in italy care to weigh in on this?
 
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As far as Google says Lombardy has various altitudes from sea level 120 a couple of thousand meters. Could be interesting to see if most victims were on higher altitude, according to that doctor from NY covid19 resembles altitude sickness. On other hand Wuhan is on sea level. Who knows.
 

RealNeat

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As far as Google says Lombardy has various altitudes from sea level 120 a couple of thousand meters. Could be interesting to see if most victims were on higher altitude, according to that doctor from NY covid19 resembles altitude sickness. On other hand Wuhan is on sea level. Who knows.
I supposed "victims" would be in lower altitudes as they are not acclimated. After looking at a world map of altitude however, I'm not sure a connection exists. However there is one connection that is blatant, poor metabolic function and hypothyroidism makes it harder for people to acclimate at altitude.
 

charlie

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@Jeemmy check out the thread Giraffe linked to, an New York City ICU doctor seems to make a similar point that you raise about the misuse of ventilation.
It's interesting how his video has quickly gotten views - when it was first posted it was around 7k (mar 31-apr 1), now its at 70k.


At 0:55 in his new video, he mentions what could be wrong with the ventilation:

Bombards body language does a read on the teleprompter doctor.

 

SOMO

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Bombards body language does a read on the teleprompter doctor.



I think it's quite clear the doctor had a script, but this in and of itself is nothing malicious or evil.

A script helps keep people on track and ensures you only stick to the points you want to speak about, in addition to avoiding redundancy.
 

Curiousman

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Link between air pollution and coronavirus mortality in Italy could be possible

A group of scientists has found another small piece in the puzzle of understanding COVID-19. Looking for reasons why the mortality rate is up to 12% in the northern part of Italy and only approx. 4.5% in the rest of the country, they found a probable correlation between air pollution and mortality in two of the worst affected regions in northern Italy.
 

Giraffe

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Link between air pollution and coronavirus mortality in Italy could be possible

A group of scientists has found another small piece in the puzzle of understanding COVID-19. Looking for reasons why the mortality rate is up to 12% in the northern part of Italy and only approx. 4.5% in the rest of the country, they found a probable correlation between air pollution and mortality in two of the worst affected regions in northern Italy.
related thread: One Of Europe's Most Polluted Areas Accounts For Most Of Italy's 'Corona Death': The Po Valley
 

blob69

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Many are beginning to suspect the ventilators, and Germany seems to be treating patients differently:

"The other question that needs to be asked is whether there is something about Germany’s treatment of coronavirus victims that has resulted in a lower death rate. That is how Dr Thomas Voshaar, a lung specialist who runs a clinic in the town of Heinsberg in North Rhine-Westphalia sees it. In an interview with the Frankfurter Allegmeine, he speaks of how he has treated 29 patients without suffering a single death so far. It isn’t testing that makes the difference, he says – he doesn’t even bother with the tests because he finds them unreliable. Instead, he gives suspected Covid-19 patients a CT scan of their lungs in order to assess the extent of damage – and then treats them occasionally.

What he doesn’t do, he says, is rush to put patients on a ventilator. In fact, only one of his patients so far has been given this form of treatment. It is best avoided for as long as possible, he says, because the machines exert too much pressure on the lungs, and the air supplied is too rich in oxygen. That can lead to patients dying of collapsed lung. He says he was astounded at the extent to which ventilators have been used to treat patients in Italy.

It backs up what critical care specialist Matt Strauss wrote here last week: that however much store politicians have put into their supply, ventilators are no panacea for coronavirus and indeed are themselves injurious to a patient’s health."

Is Germany treating its coronavirus patients differently? | The Spectator
 

moss

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As a previous poster mentioned high % of elderly population, Japan is first closely followed by Italy and the other suggestions that have been posted.
There were also the usual 3 direct weekly flights from Wuhan to Milan that I believe continued for awhile during the intial stages when Covid 19 started to appear (migrant slave textiles factories both in Wuhan and Milan.....)
and having lived in Italy there is an irrevence amongst the Italians, something I like, but may well have cost lives as a result.
 
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