The Key To Low Body-fat, Regardless Of Diet/Exercise?

strawberry6977

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I hope that one day people realize that the key to good health is doing whatever you want and enjoy, have fun when eating, while being reasonably active so that calories are kept in balance. Instead of force feeding yourself sticking to what some cult deemed to be good healthy foods or safe macros or whatever. It’s always a lot of fun to read neurotic nutrition-wannabe-experts who are baffled that people that DGAF have better hair, mood, libido, energy.... “But they eat all that cholesterol - animal fat - PUFA - starch - sugar - insert low quality studies on the latest fad diet’s bogeyman .....!”.

Time to give less f*cks...
I agree with you on many levels here. :): I want to be to at a place of this. I was drawn to Peat to heal my metabolism, among other bodily system functions. Once achieving that, I want to eat reasonably healthy with an overall umbrella of DGAF! haha In other words, just live life and enjoy it (including various cuisines and gourmet delicacies of food - I am a foodie at heart with a bit of southern biscuits and gravy mixed in). I certainly dont want to be like my husband who shoves a triple-patty cheeseburger with large fries into his gullet then washes it down with a Texas-sized shake daily (not joking), but I believe in a healthy balance and just living life (DGAF), if that makes sense.
 

strawberry6977

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You drink several Lattes a day. Well:
Some 16-ounce Latte contains 40 grams of sugar. That's 2.84 tablespoons (not teaspoons, but tablespoons), which is on par with eating two Twinkies. That's a lot of sugar to be slurping down, even if you DO consider your latte to be a dessert rather than a drink.
How Much Sugar Is in Your Starbucks Drunk?

Unless you get your honey directly from a beehive, all honey sold anywhere is 50% High Fructose Corn Syrup. I mentioned in another post that the FDA permits honey with up to 50% HFCS to be considered pure honey. Therefore and thereby:
HFCS and sugar have been shown to drive inflammation, which is associated with an increased risk of obesity, diabetes, heart disease, and cancer. In addition to inflammation, excess fructose may increase harmful substances called advanced glycation end products (AGEs), which may harm your cells.
6 Reasons Why High-Fructose Corn Syrup Is Bad for You

Also HCTZ in your BP med increases blood sugar.
High Blood Sugar? It Could Be a Side Effect of These Medications - GoodRx.

It is possible that hydrochlorothiazide increases the production of glucose from the liver, and because beta-blockers limit the absorption of glucose into cells, the use of these medicines in tandem can raise glucose levels significantly enough to cause diabetes.
What is the Connection Between High Blood Sugar and High Blood Pressure? | Everyday Health

Also research HCTZ's role in high Cortisol, which leads to high blood sugar, among other things.
Wow, PaulJacob! I thought HCTZ would be a good thing since it's a diuretic, I never even thought about it doing something of the opposite in regards to blood sugar, cortisol, and weight! Thank you for pointing this out, I will dig more into this! I thought the Lisinopril I was on was making me retain water/fat...I was reading many people it did that to, so I switched to a diuretic in January from being on Lisinopril for 13 years. (Mind you, I was diagnosed with hypertension when I was 25 years old and thin as a rail and was in gymnastics, didnt make sense to them why I had it considering I was so thin and active with no family history of it, they ran every test known to man and just gave up and said "take this pill for the rest of your life...")

In regards to lattes and honey, let me clarify (sorry I didnt before). I make my own lattes at home. I use organic fresh-ground coffee, the A2 grassfed 2% milk with a splash of A2 cream, then add unheated raw local honey (straight from the hive, as best as possible anyway). I only have 2 lattes a day since its basically half milk half coffee.
 

pauljacob

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In regards to lattes and honey, let me clarify (sorry I didnt before). I make my own lattes at home. I use organic fresh-ground coffee, the A2 grassfed 2% milk with a splash of A2 cream, then add unheated raw local honey (straight from the hive, as best as possible anyway). I only have 2 lattes a day since its basically half milk half coffee.
Way to go, strawberry6977!
 

mostlylurking

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Thank you!!! It is so great having others from different health walks, education, research, etc give me help and feedback! I have spent lots of time reading Dr Peats work, lurked around on this Forum for many months reading various topics as well. I am still wet behind the ears when it comes to Thyroid. As I said, about 7 years ago years ago I went to an Endocrinologist and had "normal labs", so she dismissed me to another doctor to find out what was going on with me - that doctor then ran tons of tests and finally advised me as having Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (aka: psychosomatic = anti-depressants, which I didnt want to take!) From then on, I had moved on to other things because I had "normal labs" and labeled as "nothing is truly wrong with me". A few months ago I started taking thyroid herbs and iodine, just to make sure I had all the proper levels - regardless of blood tests...and nothing really improved. I am happy I found Dr Peat advises for people to take their temperatures, that is a step that has started me to take another look at my Thyroid (regardless of blood-work). I think it's interesting to note Dr Wilson's work as well, since it has help people (oddly I fit the majority of the symptoms as well as of Irish AND American Indian decent - of which survived famines). I figure it can't hurt to try the sustained-release T3 meds to see if it is "eureka" for me. I ordered the Desiccated Bovine Thyroid, I wont start it yet until I get my labs drawn tomorrow (for my annual with my hormone doctor). I'm wondering now (with your appreciated reply) whether or not I should try a bottle of the desiccated thyroid first, then try the T3 (I imagine it'll take some time for my doctor to figure out a compound prescription anyway). Or just wait and go straight for the T3 (we all assume prescriptions tend to be more direct and more powerful, although in some situations it isnt always the case).

Sorry for the delay in responding. I've been down for the count for several months and was not functioning. More about that later. It is important to find a doctor who will work with you to get your thyroid medication "optimized". Persistence helps because the doctor isn't going to go to the effort unless you keep telling him you feel awful. Here's how this works: the dr. puts you on a little NDT and then takes blood about 6 weeks later to check your numbers. Then the dr. increases the dose of NDT. This happens multiple times. Each time, you feel great for a couple of weeks and then you don't anymore, because your adrenaline goes down in response to the increased thyroid. If you are hypothyroid your adrenaline is high so that you can function. As your med increases your adrenals pump out less adrenaline. At some point, your thyroid med is high enough so the adrenals relax and stop killing themselves pumping out adrenaline all the time. At this point, you have "optimized" the thyroid med dose and you are running on a high oxidative metabolism instead of relying on adrenaline.

I'm in the USA and take Acella brand natural desiccated thyroid. It is a prescription and is strictly regulated by the FDA. Acella works hard to make sure that the amount of thyroid is exactly correct in their product. This isn't easy. I am confident that I am getting the medication that I am supposed to be getting. It's my understanding that the powers that be have made it illegal to sell thyroid products that actually contain T3 and T4 in them unless they are regulated by the FDA. I could be wrong, but that's what I've read.

a new thyroid site with doctors!! see here: ThyroidChange

about being down for the count:
Maybe my recent experience will provide some insight. I've been on 3 grains of NDT for 6 years. I was doing pretty well, lost some weight, no inflammation, clear headed, my Peaty diet and the NDT had made me 15 years younger.

Then last summer I got a bladder infection. They gave me Bactrim for the infection. It made me feel horrible and I quit after 6 days (4 days early). I haven't been healthy ever since. Four months later, I had all the hypothyroid symptoms again in spades. I gained 20 pounds and the inflammation was horrendous. I got my thyroid numbers checked. My T3 was too high, outside of the range. My doctor lowered the prescription by half a grain and scheduled me for tests in 30 days. I couldn't believe I had all my old symptoms and my T3 was too high.

So I started reading on line. I learned that Bactrim is a goitrogen. It also blocks thiamine. I read that this doesn't just resolve itself on its own after stopping the Bactrim. I also read that if you suspect you have a thiamine deficiency you can simply take some thiamine and see what happens. I had been taking about 75 mg/day of thiamine for a long time. I took 300 mg to test. My temperature shot up from 98 degrees to 99 degrees in about 45 minutes and my inflammation disappeared instantly. So I had a clue what to do but it didn't keep working.

I emailed Dr. Peat; he responded and said to eat raw carrot and cooked mushrooms. So I got really serious about doing that every day. I kept reading. Evidently the antibiotic had really damaged my gut (no pain, who knew?) and I learned that you can't absorb nutrients, including thiamine and magnesium, if your gut's damaged. And you need thiamine and magnesium to heal the gut. So for the past 2 weeks I've been sort of mega dosing thiamine and magnesium. And drinking lots of OJ for the potassium.

I was worried that all that magnesium wasn't what I should be doing to a damaged gut. So I backed off the magnesium for one day. And I ate a tiny bit of really ripe golden sweet pineapple at dinner. I woke up at 2:00 AM in inflammation hell. So I studied on line some more and learned that if you supplement thiamine without magnesium you increase serotonin. And pineapple is serotonergic too so I had done a double whammy to myself. Won't do that again.

I've been doing the high dose thiamine and the magnesium for about 2 weeks and I am a LOT better. After eating the pineapple I thought I needed to go to a neurologist for an IV of thiamine but now my head has cleared out and the tight band
around my head is gone. I'm going to stick with this for a while longer.

I suspect that I've been borderline in trouble with a thiamine deficiency for a very long time. The Bactrim made it worse. Increasing my sugared coffee and learning how to make really good gummies (gelatin, sugar, fruit juice, lemon juice) got me into real trouble.

links of interest: Vitamin B1, anti-estrogenic, pro-DHT, anti-serotonin, pro-dopamine » MENELITE
and Thiamine and Thyroid: 3 Hidden Thyroid Benefits You Don’t Want to Miss

Hope this was helpful.
 

strawberry6977

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I also read that if you suspect you have a thiamine deficiency you can simply take some thiamine and see what happens. I had been taking about 75 mg/day of thiamine for a long time. I took 300 mg to test. My temperature shot up from 98 degrees to 99 degrees in about 45 minutes and my inflammation disappeared instantly. So I had a clue what to do but it didn't keep working.
I'm so sorry about your own health struggles...I'm glad, however, that you are figuring it out and moving in a forward direction. :):

I appreciate the insight. I am of course on the typical Peat supplements (especially to help the metabolism hum along). I've been on T3 (Cytomel) for almost a month now...I titrated up to a high dose, now I'm titrating down (it's a cycle that is training the thyroid to convert T3 on its own, via Wilson's Temperature Syndrome protocol). I wasnt feeling good at all on the high doses, although I dont know many who would feel OK with 75mcg of T3...or maybe I just had to get my body used to it, not sure - but the headaches, super high heart-rate, etc - I couldnt hang more than a few days on that high dose. I seem to have no bad side effects on about 45-50mcg range.

I do take a B-complex supplement that has B1 Thiamine in it, but I looked at it and it only has 10mg (100% of RDA). I was focusing on the B3 (Niacinamide) and the B12. I wonder if the liver capsules I take have some B1 in it...

As today would have it, I'm in a desperate place now. I look and mentally feel awful...it doesnt help that now my husband is noticing enough to say something about it - at this point, I dont blame him - he looks like the perfect human specimen and I look like miss piggy now (not trying to be facetious, I'm serious). I go from being athletic and thin to "average American looking" to NOW looking like a busted can of biscuits in my jeans (and I DONT want to go buy bigger jeans since I dont want to "settle" here). I've gotten worse since being Peaty. I also lost my motivation to workout - it's odd. I do some, but I used to workout 6-days a week earlier this year. Some of this is my body revolting to the change in diet and adding sugar back, some of it is what I've been struggling with for 8 years since my last son was born (inability to lose weight and lose it somewhat easily). I know muscle burns fat, but the golden question is how do I continue to build muscle if I am not flogging myself in the gym (thus causing more hormonal, thyroid, adrenal damage) - there's gotta be a highly effective yet shorter workout to do to accomplish this building of muscle and keeping the fat burning furnace going. (If anyone reading this has insight on the workout, please let me know).

FTR, I have tried low-fat Peaty, I've tried eating more or eating less, I've tried the minimal Peaty diet (only OJ, Milk, Coffee, Eggs, Carrot Salad)... I didnt do the "minimal diet" very long because it made me physically feel awful and bad headaches, and of course it stressed me out not having any sort of variety. It's driving me crazy trying everything, I'm to a point where I want to do a drastic diet, but I keep telling myself it's not sustainable - I'll just either be miserable for the rest of my life having to eat like that forever or gain the weight back. I want to stay Peaty, I just dont have YEARS to rehabilitate my metabolism naturally... Perhaps if I add some actual workout regimen (rather than just "winging it" a few days a week), that might help - I just need to figure out what that is and looks like.
 

keytothecity

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Joined
Dec 5, 2020
Messages
204
I'm so sorry about your own health struggles...I'm glad, however, that you are figuring it out and moving in a forward direction. :):

I appreciate the insight. I am of course on the typical Peat supplements (especially to help the metabolism hum along). I've been on T3 (Cytomel) for almost a month now...I titrated up to a high dose, now I'm titrating down (it's a cycle that is training the thyroid to convert T3 on its own, via Wilson's Temperature Syndrome protocol). I wasnt feeling good at all on the high doses, although I dont know many who would feel OK with 75mcg of T3...or maybe I just had to get my body used to it, not sure - but the headaches, super high heart-rate, etc - I couldnt hang more than a few days on that high dose. I seem to have no bad side effects on about 45-50mcg range.

I do take a B-complex supplement that has B1 Thiamine in it, but I looked at it and it only has 10mg (100% of RDA). I was focusing on the B3 (Niacinamide) and the B12. I wonder if the liver capsules I take have some B1 in it...

As today would have it, I'm in a desperate place now. I look and mentally feel awful...it doesnt help that now my husband is noticing enough to say something about it - at this point, I dont blame him - he looks like the perfect human specimen and I look like miss piggy now (not trying to be facetious, I'm serious). I go from being athletic and thin to "average American looking" to NOW looking like a busted can of biscuits in my jeans (and I DONT want to go buy bigger jeans since I dont want to "settle" here). I've gotten worse since being Peaty. I also lost my motivation to workout - it's odd. I do some, but I used to workout 6-days a week earlier this year. Some of this is my body revolting to the change in diet and adding sugar back, some of it is what I've been struggling with for 8 years since my last son was born (inability to lose weight and lose it somewhat easily). I know muscle burns fat, but the golden question is how do I continue to build muscle if I am not flogging myself in the gym (thus causing more hormonal, thyroid, adrenal damage) - there's gotta be a highly effective yet shorter workout to do to accomplish this building of muscle and keeping the fat burning furnace going. (If anyone reading this has insight on the workout, please let me know).

FTR, I have tried low-fat Peaty, I've tried eating more or eating less, I've tried the minimal Peaty diet (only OJ, Milk, Coffee, Eggs, Carrot Salad)... I didnt do the "minimal diet" very long because it made me physically feel awful and bad headaches, and of course it stressed me out not having any sort of variety. It's driving me crazy trying everything, I'm to a point where I want to do a drastic diet, but I keep telling myself it's not sustainable - I'll just either be miserable for the rest of my life having to eat like that forever or gain the weight back. I want to stay Peaty, I just dont have YEARS to rehabilitate my metabolism naturally... Perhaps if I add some actual workout regimen (rather than just "winging it" a few days a week), that might help - I just need to figure out what that is and looks like.
I suggest you go back to enjoying life and see what that does to you. The goal should be to make eating, sports etc. enjoyable, and not see every aspect of your life through a self-improvement lense. This will increase dopamine and make you more active in itself.

For workouts I suggest weights. You can add cardio back in once you are more robust again metabolically.

And idk about taking all those supplements.

peat diet only works in specific contexts, do not obsess over it. It’s honestly more about some ideas to implement.

Do not eat fat + sugar together.
 

Peatful

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Dec 8, 2016
Messages
791
I am fairly new to Peating (started appx 4 months ago). Even prior, I have been off/on trying to put the pieces of the puzzle together to figure out "what is the key to low body-fat in people, regardless of diet or exercise - or even trying?" I know it isn't just one thing. Some factors are: gender, body type, metabolism, age, hormones, how well your body handles stress, etc. I'm even convinced it's personality type - naturally energetic folks seem to keep busy, keep moving, to where they naturally keep a higher metabolism.

What made me research to answer my ponderings are 2 things: 1st, I was skinny - too skinny (size 0-2) 5'1", 105-110 lbs, without ANY effort see my 6-pack abs, definition of my back muscle, etc...I would even go thru spurts of working out, then not...and I could eat ANYTHING I wanted to, although I had a reasonably healthy diet. All this until until I got pregnant @ age 30. Then my diet and cravings went to hell in a handbasket - I was hungry constantly and made the mistake of eating whatever I wanted. About a year after baby, I then put-forth effort, I was able to lose weight with a healthy diet and regular exercise. Then, I got pregnant again @ age 35, after which I havent been able to successfully keep the body-fat off. I was able to put on good muscle from working out, even more-so recently (I'm now 43 years old), but there's a stubborn layer of fat covering my abs and my hips/butt...it's so frustrating.

2nd form of thought I've been pondering is my husband. He has always eaten literally anything and loads of it (not even healthy) - pizza, pasta, breads, candies, ice-cream, cakes, fast-food, etc - does not gain an ounce of bodyfat. And he 41, stays muscular without even formally going to a gym - he just has lots of energy, has big biceps and 6-pack abs - I want to strangle him. haha I attributed it to him being a mesomorph with lots of testosterone. So, 3 years ago I went to a hormone doctor and started on testosterone and progesterone (since both according to my bloodwork levels were in the toilet). It helped my estrogen dominance, but I still struggle with shedding my bodyfat around my waist and hips/butt (everywhere else I'm skinny - my face, arms, legs). I even resorted to abdominal liposuction 2 years ago (after I tried HRT with no miracle success)...still didnt help.

I tried every diet, every exercise method, detox, etc. Then 4 months ago I found Ray Peat's eating/living method and I figured out (at least part of the issue) is I wrecked my metabolism and my digestion by trying all the various diets, even "healthy" ones. Peat's method of eating makes sense and I love it, I like not counting calories or stressing (hello Cortisol) over logging every piece of food for macros. No more cravings, I don't eat as much (snacking isn't as prevalent), etc. What is making me want to cry is the fact that I am bloating up in my stomach and hips more, I can barely fit in my pants - I've gotten to a point where I'm going to have to go buy bigger pants, and that I find is unacceptable. Yes, there are positive's in how I'm feeling and sleeping (and the breath of fresh-air on eating intuitively with no cravings or feelings of deprivation for once), but if I have to go buy bigger pants - that's where I draw the line. But I dont want to give up, especially since I've read many Posts throughout this Forum about stomach weight gain / bloating when beginning to eat Peat-style. Ever since I started Peating, I oddly have lost my passion to workout, it's odd. Perhaps it's my body healing, perhaps getting used to this way of eating, maybe both. I will force myself to workout here and there, but mainly I walk, stretch, do trigger point release, and do resistance training a few times a week. Last week I started reducing my fat intake, so I went from whole milk to 2% milk. I drink only A2 grassfed milk and eat raw grassfed cheese, grassfed unpasturized non-homogenic cottage cheese with mangos. I drink organic flash pasturized pulp-free not-from-concentrate OJ (always drank with collagen). On a rare occasion I'll eat some organic peppermint ice-cream (with only basic ingredients). I always eat my protein's with fruit, although lately I rarely eat muscle meat, but when I do it's a small portion of steak without the fat, or grassfed ground beef, or shredded chicken breast...sometimes potatoes, rice, or squash. Rarely homemade sourdough bread with a dash of olive oil and salt/pepper. Last week I had a hankering for mozzarella with tomatoes and olive oil. I also drink a shake before bed of basic ingredient grassfed casein with cacao and honey with fresh carrots, MCT/coconut oil, and honey. I take liver via capsules daily, along with other vitamins to fill any gaps. By and large I've lost my appetite, it's weird.

Back to my ponderings: I've been racking my brain this week trying to figure out the key or secret to how some people (including myself, once-upon-a-time) can literally eat what they want, even exercise only here and there - and still remain thin, skinny, low body-fat, etc..?!

Why is it so stinkin' hard to lose mid-section/hip bodyfat?! At this point since I've tried EVERYTHING it's driving me nuts trying to figure out! I mean, I know I'm now over 40 (although I know plenty of thin people over 40); but my hormone therapy that has been keeping my hormones in balance (supposedly), healthy eating (even Peat-style), and taking cortisol-reducing herbs along with breathing techniques and stretching, I sleep like a baby, even take digestive enzymes incase my body isn't liking all of the dairy. I also take supplements such as DIM (and Calcium D-Glucarate, which is surprisingly Peat-approved via a Podcast interview) to help block/detox estrogen, methylated B-complex, D3 & K2 with olive oil base, Vitamin E, Lysine, Butyrate (instead of what I used to take of probiotics), Cranberry extract, Vitamin C & citrus-peel extract, magnesium, potassium, and as I said the liver capsules. (I take the magnesium and potassium mainly because I'm on HTZ diuretic pill due to my hypertension I've had since I was 25 for no reason, it drains my potassium/mag levels) I drink electrolyte water to flush any toxins out, and I drink several coffee lattes with sugar/honey daily, of course OJ with collagen. So, a month ago I started taking liver detox pills due to thinking my liver was sluggish and packing on the pounds in my mid-section. Then I started taking my morning temp which is low @ 96.04-70, so I ordered dessicated thyroid to try. I also use a muscle roller on my "fat areas" to try and push the toxins/estrogen/PUFA out; I went for 2 sessions of manual lymphatic drainage massage over the last few weeks...which helped drain some water weight, God-willing some toxins/estrogen/PUFA stuck in my tissues. Now I've scheduled a colonic hydrotherapy session for Monday to see if I need to flush some endotoxins, better my digestion, and increase my nutrient absorption.

I know according to Peat (and others) it can take years to fix your metabolism, and some time to flush endotoxins and heal your liver/digestion to then lose this fat / bloating / water weight build-up, but I don't have that kind of time right now. I am patient (heck, I've been trying everything under the sun for 8 years now to find what works for my specific body), but as I said - I draw the line at having to buy new bigger pants! Any thoughts on my "pondering" about the habits/secrets/keys to those who can stay thin without even trying? And any help or ideas on how I can quickly shed some of this "Peat weight"?
You have under eaten and over exercised most of your adult life (30+) would you say?
Restrictive with food post children?

I haven’t read everything in this thread- but it sounds like basic broken metabolism from clean eating and over exercise- then the adrenals take over- pump out cortisol- deplete you of progesterone...
Plus- the natural stress of pregnancy- then caring for and nurturing children is a giant giant stress.

ive been where you are btw.

inbox me if you’re ready.
if you want to continue this conversation publicly - im fine with that too- its just so many women arent truly ready until they hit bottom.
The good news: Our bodies are extremely resilient and are constantly looking for balance and health.
best to you.
 
Last edited:

mostlylurking

Member
Joined
May 13, 2015
Messages
519
I'm so sorry about your own health struggles...I'm glad, however, that you are figuring it out and moving in a forward direction. :):

I appreciate the insight. I am of course on the typical Peat supplements (especially to help the metabolism hum along). I've been on T3 (Cytomel) for almost a month now...I titrated up to a high dose, now I'm titrating down (it's a cycle that is training the thyroid to convert T3 on its own, via Wilson's Temperature Syndrome protocol). I wasnt feeling good at all on the high doses, although I dont know many who would feel OK with 75mcg of T3...or maybe I just had to get my body used to it, not sure - but the headaches, super high heart-rate, etc - I couldnt hang more than a few days on that high dose. I seem to have no bad side effects on about 45-50mcg range.

I do take a B-complex supplement that has B1 Thiamine in it, but I looked at it and it only has 10mg (100% of RDA). I was focusing on the B3 (Niacinamide) and the B12. I wonder if the liver capsules I take have some B1 in it...

As today would have it, I'm in a desperate place now. I look and mentally feel awful...it doesnt help that now my husband is noticing enough to say something about it - at this point, I dont blame him - he looks like the perfect human specimen and I look like miss piggy now (not trying to be facetious, I'm serious). I go from being athletic and thin to "average American looking" to NOW looking like a busted can of biscuits in my jeans (and I DONT want to go buy bigger jeans since I dont want to "settle" here). I've gotten worse since being Peaty. I also lost my motivation to workout - it's odd. I do some, but I used to workout 6-days a week earlier this year. Some of this is my body revolting to the change in diet and adding sugar back, some of it is what I've been struggling with for 8 years since my last son was born (inability to lose weight and lose it somewhat easily). I know muscle burns fat, but the golden question is how do I continue to build muscle if I am not flogging myself in the gym (thus causing more hormonal, thyroid, adrenal damage) - there's gotta be a highly effective yet shorter workout to do to accomplish this building of muscle and keeping the fat burning furnace going. (If anyone reading this has insight on the workout, please let me know).

FTR, I have tried low-fat Peaty, I've tried eating more or eating less, I've tried the minimal Peaty diet (only OJ, Milk, Coffee, Eggs, Carrot Salad)... I didnt do the "minimal diet" very long because it made me physically feel awful and bad headaches, and of course it stressed me out not having any sort of variety. It's driving me crazy trying everything, I'm to a point where I want to do a drastic diet, but I keep telling myself it's not sustainable - I'll just either be miserable for the rest of my life having to eat like that forever or gain the weight back. I want to stay Peaty, I just dont have YEARS to rehabilitate my metabolism naturally... Perhaps if I add some actual workout regimen (rather than just "winging it" a few days a week), that might help - I just need to figure out what that is and looks like.
I think you need to stop with the Dr. Wilson ideas and move on to Broda Barnes. Sorry but I think what you are doing with the T3 is insane. You do not understand what you are doing. Please read the Broda Barnes book here: Amazon product . Also please read the Ray Peat articles here: Programmable Search Engine . Also please read Danny Roddy's blog post here: https://www.patreon.com/posts/14839477

The thyroid does not convert T4 to T3, the liver does. The liver gets lugged down and can't do the conversion if you happen to be female and contain estrogen. Progesterone can help. See Ray Peat's articles here: Programmable Search Engine

If you are deficient in thiamine and do something to exacerbate that problem, like drink some coffee or have something that contains sugar, you will feel horrible. Your body is trying to tell you something, you need to listen to your body. Unfortunately, the Peaty diet that you describe contains NO thiamine foods (unless you are eating liver). Dr. Peat does say that if you consume more sugar then you will need to supplement thiamine. I believe somewhere he suggests that 90 mg daily is a safe dose. This dose worked for me until I damaged my ability to use thiamine via antibiotics; they damaged my gut and ability to absorb thiamine. I now find that I need to take a much greater amount of thiamine (and magnesium) in order to keep the lactic acid low. I did not stop drinking orange juice or putting some fructose in my milk. I did cut back my coffee with cream and 2 tablespoons of sugar. I have no idea how long I will need to supplement thiamine at this high dose. But my symptoms tell me that I am on the right track.

About the exercise: Try walking. If you can only do 6 minutes, do that. If you can comfortably do more, great! If you hurt really bad later, assume it is lactic acid buildup and suspect a thiamine deficiency. Address the thiamine deficiency before adding exercise. Lactic acid is dangerous stuff. Get a roller and roll your muscles to wake them up before doing any exercises. Exercises with 5 pound weights are good. The goal is to build some muscle. Then take a walk, make it as long as is enjoyable. Do not attempt to break any time records. If you can't carry on a conversation while you walk you are pushing yourself too hard.

Focus on functional movement rehabilitation type exercises. Look into exercises with Therabands. I got lucky and found a good chiropractor who also specializes in functional movement rehabilitation. I was a wreck from what my hypothyroidism and broken metabolism had done to my connective tissue. My chiropractor put together a set of exercises for me which helped me to safely recover as I was working with my endocrinologist to optimize my thyroid supplementation.

Optimizing my thyroid supplementation took 9 months. You cannot do this on the fly on your own. You need to faithfully record your pulse and temperature to know what's happening. You need a doctor to order the blood tests and tweak your medication. It's not a 30 day thing. Your body goes through stages of lowering your adrenaline and using the thyroid hormones instead. Each stage takes a few weeks. Then the adrenaline goes down and you feel crappy again and then you increase your thyroid medication. Eventually you get to the point where your adrenals are happy and quiet and you are running on thyroid hormones and good oxidative metabolism.
 

rsandy

Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2020
Messages
28
A low set-point.

Consistently low stress hormones, a happy, stimulating life, and strategic exercises deployed at potentially low levels (15 minutes 3 x per week) to encourage a very low set point of bodyfat.

Balanced hormones, no health problems, vibrant health = lean body.
 

DawN

Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2016
Messages
85
Most here will want to scalp me for that, but drop the salt, I mean really avoid every food which contains it, and you will see for yourself. Drop also the sugar, I mean the crystaline poison out of the laboratory, it‘s really useless at all.

From reading your initial post you have a fundamental discipline for sports, very valuable, so combine the zero-salt diet with, say, 10 min. Rope skipping in the morning, fasted, drink at least 3 liters a day (no it will not flush out nutrients from your body, your organism is smarter then you think it is), switch from „balanced meals“ to tactical eating, like 2 hours pause after fruit, a least 4 hours pause after meat (go for the lean cuts) and so on.
To polish this up with a specific exercise you could try stomach vacuums, they really changed the game for me, just think how many nerves are rooting from your belly button, done every morning they will better your digestion, change your whole outlook of the world and yourself, and maybe even surprise you in an unexpected way...

and going fasted to bed over the course of a week is my recipe for lots of more surprise...
 

AndrogenicJB

Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2021
Messages
220
You eat a high fat, high carb diet right now. I ate that way when I first discovered Peat and I got fat eating that way. I see mainly 2 problems with it: 1) too appetizing, especially after eating a restricted diet, which will lead to overeating and 2) insulin resistance induced by the randle cycle.

So I'd go for a high protein (low/non fat dairy, lean meat, gelatin] and high carb [fruits and starches, doesn't really matter as long as you digest both of those well]. In the end it comes down to a calorie deficit if you want to lose weight, but cutting out fat will also make that easier because it's so calorie dense.

Thyroid could potentially also help you out, your low temps point to that. I'm not convinced desiccated thyroid is reliable (although there might be some effective products out there), I'd rather go straight for either synthetic T3 or a T3/T4 combo. You could probably get it prescribed by a doctor instead of getting it somewhere from the grey market.
If trying to avvoid mixing carbs and fat, can you eat fat on its own or does it need to be eaten with protein?
 

schultz

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2014
Messages
2,559
HFCS and sugar have been shown to drive inflammation, which is associated with an increased risk of obesity, diabetes, heart disease, and cancer. In addition to inflammation, excess fructose may increase harmful substances called advanced glycation end products (AGEs), which may harm your cells.

Sugar doesn't drive inflammation.

PUFA and endotoxin drive inflammation (mainly) and PUFA's produce significantly more AGE's than sugars do.

'The so-called "advanced glycation end products," that have been blamed on glucose excess, are mostly derived from the peroxidation of the "essential fatty acids." The name, “glycation,” indicates the addition of sugar groups to proteins, such as occurs in diabetes and old age, but when tested in a controlled experiment, lipid peroxidation of polyunsaturated fatty acids produces the protein damage about 23 times faster than the simple sugars do (Fu, et al., 1996).'
 

Nicole W.

Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2016
Messages
405
I'm so sorry about your own health struggles...I'm glad, however, that you are figuring it out and moving in a forward direction. :):

I appreciate the insight. I am of course on the typical Peat supplements (especially to help the metabolism hum along). I've been on T3 (Cytomel) for almost a month now...I titrated up to a high dose, now I'm titrating down (it's a cycle that is training the thyroid to convert T3 on its own, via Wilson's Temperature Syndrome protocol). I wasnt feeling good at all on the high doses, although I dont know many who would feel OK with 75mcg of T3...or maybe I just had to get my body used to it, not sure - but the headaches, super high heart-rate, etc - I couldnt hang more than a few days on that high dose. I seem to have no bad side effects on about 45-50mcg range.

I do take a B-complex supplement that has B1 Thiamine in it, but I looked at it and it only has 10mg (100% of RDA). I was focusing on the B3 (Niacinamide) and the B12. I wonder if the liver capsules I take have some B1 in it...

As today would have it, I'm in a desperate place now. I look and mentally feel awful...it doesnt help that now my husband is noticing enough to say something about it - at this point, I dont blame him - he looks like the perfect human specimen and I look like miss piggy now (not trying to be facetious, I'm serious). I go from being athletic and thin to "average American looking" to NOW looking like a busted can of biscuits in my jeans (and I DONT want to go buy bigger jeans since I dont want to "settle" here). I've gotten worse since being Peaty. I also lost my motivation to workout - it's odd. I do some, but I used to workout 6-days a week earlier this year. Some of this is my body revolting to the change in diet and adding sugar back, some of it is what I've been struggling with for 8 years since my last son was born (inability to lose weight and lose it somewhat easily). I know muscle burns fat, but the golden question is how do I continue to build muscle if I am not flogging myself in the gym (thus causing more hormonal, thyroid, adrenal damage) - there's gotta be a highly effective yet shorter workout to do to accomplish this building of muscle and keeping the fat burning furnace going. (If anyone reading this has insight on the workout, please let me know).

FTR, I have tried low-fat Peaty, I've tried eating more or eating less, I've tried the minimal Peaty diet (only OJ, Milk, Coffee, Eggs, Carrot Salad)... I didnt do the "minimal diet" very long because it made me physically feel awful and bad headaches, and of course it stressed me out not having any sort of variety. It's driving me crazy trying everything, I'm to a point where I want to do a drastic diet, but I keep telling myself it's not sustainable - I'll just either be miserable for the rest of my life having to eat like that forever or gain the weight back. I want to stay Peaty, I just dont have YEARS to rehabilitate my metabolism naturally... Perhaps if I add some actual workout regimen (rather than just "winging it" a few days a week), that might help - I just need to figure out what that is and looks like.
I feel your pain. I had a similar trajectory after adopting Peat principals. Interesting to note, after I gained 20 lbs overnight (it seemed, anyway) I can basically eat what ever I want without gaining weight now. I can’t lose weight either, even if I go with a much lower caloric intake. I can’t figure it out either tbh and I have been reflecting on this situation for 4 years now.

I’m hesitant to say this out loud because I don’t want it to be true, but I am wondering if a healthy body is more resilient against attempts at weight gain or weight loss... unless you resort to pretty extreme measures. I know I feel good inside my body but beyond that I don’t think its being very cooperative at my attempts to lower weight. It seems steadfastly determined to maintain this weight. The good news is I don’t really worry about weight gain anymore, it seems like I’m immune to that. Whereas in the past, too many deserts, drinks, chips etc... definitely would have an impact. If this ends up being what it‘s going to be going forward then the last resort is self-acceptance I guess.😊
 

milkboi

Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2018
Messages
1,402
Location
Germany
If trying to avvoid mixing carbs and fat, can you eat fat on its own or does it need to be eaten with protein?
If you want to eat fat on its own you can do that (can’t imagine someone wanting to do that though - snacking on olive oil or butter?) although the metabolic effects will last a while, so it‘s more practical to just limit fat. You don‘t have to completely cut out fat btw. I eat rice with chicken and 10g of olive oil as a daily staple for example. Everything under 15g should be fine
 

AndrogenicJB

Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2021
Messages
220
If you want to eat fat on its own you can do that (can’t imagine someone wanting to do that though - snacking on olive oil or butter?) although the metabolic effects will last a while, so it‘s more practical to just limit fat. You don‘t have to completely cut out fat btw. I eat rice with chicken and 10g of olive oil as a daily staple for example. Everything under 15g should be fine
my macros are 450g carbs, 75 fat, 130 protein. For breakfast I would have a shake of about 220 grams of carbs 72g protein 75g fat. Even though I'm 17 do you think the randle cycle would be a problem here, I like to have all my fat intake in the morning. My sources are olive oil. mct powder and grass fed butter
 

GelatinGoblin

Member
Joined
Apr 15, 2020
Messages
786
Most here will want to scalp me for that, but drop the salt, I mean really avoid every food which contains it, and you will see for yourself. Drop also the sugar, I mean the crystaline poison out of the laboratory, it‘s really useless at all.

From reading your initial post you have a fundamental discipline for sports, very valuable, so combine the zero-salt diet with, say, 10 min. Rope skipping in the morning, fasted, drink at least 3 liters a day (no it will not flush out nutrients from your body, your organism is smarter then you think it is), switch from „balanced meals“ to tactical eating, like 2 hours pause after fruit, a least 4 hours pause after meat (go for the lean cuts) and so on.
To polish this up with a specific exercise you could try stomach vacuums, they really changed the game for me, just think how many nerves are rooting from your belly button, done every morning they will better your digestion, change your whole outlook of the world and yourself, and maybe even surprise you in an unexpected way...

and going fasted to bed over the course of a week is my recipe for lots of more surprise...
changed the game for your adrenals
 
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