The Good, the Bad and.... the questions

Discussion in 'Ask For Help or Advice' started by Carac, Jul 11, 2013.

  1. Carac

    Carac Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2013
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    I have only been doing Peat-style for a short period of time. Almost 3 weeks. Just was introduced to the DRoddy website June 22nd. (Actually I find SOME of Peats own articles easier to read than some of Roddy's.) So, I am very new... but I think I have tried very hard... please chime in with advice.

    I am 46 (next month). Female. Historically low BP and pulse. Low cholesterol and low tryglicerides. Have had difficulties with my menstrual cycle, sleeping, all my life I have been "a sweater", had TERRIBLE headaches/nausia and especially when I was pregnant with my daughter, been depressed, been suicidal, an alcoholic, bulimic, anorexic (was not good at this -- I love to eat!), a caloric counter, an over exerciser, etc... I have seen many naturopaths/homeopaths/alternative health care practitioners. I have gotten better with each modality. Better movement thru Z-Health, Meditation thru binarial beats with Centerpointe and holosync. Etc, etc. As of about 2 years ago, I am feeling pretty well. I am sure I am leaving out some other therapies, but you get the idea. I want to be better.

    With Peat-style (I know this is not a great discription) lifestyle, I was hoping to balance hormones, which at this age, must need some balancing, right? LOL I am currently about 30 pounds overweight and have been most recently doing a lot of vegetable juicing. Wheat grass made me feel really good -- I thought -- until reading Peat...

    Here's what I have incorporated in my little time of Peating:
    raw carrot -- i usually dip it in a drop of oil/tbs vinegar/pinch salt/pinch sugar
    coffee -- gelatin/cream/sugar (this is a new thing for me -- I have NEVER drank coffee until 2 wks ago)
    mineral water -- I have ALWAYS been a huge water drinker (non-carbonated) -- I started drinking the mineral water because I missed h2o
    fresh oj/2%milk
    pecorano/romano cheese -- and some other cheeses
    lamb (once)
    shrimp (once)
    daisy cottage cheese
    pears from a jar
    Virgil's Root Beers
    poached eggs
    Kerrigold butter
    coconut oil
    mortons canning/pickling salt
    No Grains (until I cheated last night with Girl Scout cookies)
    baking soda for washing my hair/body
    oil pulling
    honey
    ice cream
    cherries
    watermelon
    a couple of potatoes sliced and baked with coconut oil/butter
    magnesium oil in a spray topically
    epsom salt bath once

    So, the Good...
    I am sleeping better -- deeper -- less sweating
    I am thinking better -- less short term memory loss
    I like sugar :)
    I like using baking soda for body wash -- no more BO :)
    Bag breathing is okay -- but I don't really notice anything
    temp has gone up from 97's to low 98's
    BPM increased from 56/57 to 58

    the Bad...
    I have gained @3 pounds & inches
    my tummy is bloated
    my skin is a bit splotchy and of course puffy, like I said
    I think there is more cellulite tummy/thigh
    I have bowel movements each day, but they are strained
    I probably eat too many calories (I used the conometer once)... I hate to count calories
    I wake up with puffy fingers and eyes
    what I liked about being -- sort of-- vegan was not eating anything with a face or a mother (although I did sparsely)


    My Goals:
    To balance hormones --& lose the extra weight
    To be able to exercise more than 12-15 minutes without being sick in bed with a headache the next day, even though doing the exercise feels fine at the time (and I am in no way overdoing what I am doing -- my body right now does not like certain movement). I want to get back to an active lifestyle.


    the Questions...
    why isn't the Peat-style worried about eating oysters/shrimp/liver, though they are very critical of toxins (I am too) in products and in the way the animal protien in fed (grass fed)?

    Teeth: Does the oil pulling keep your teeth from getting stained by the coffee/coke?
    and I still have silver fillings one half of my mouth -- other side I had them replaced. Could this be causing any problems?

    Am I correct in trying to dial in the food before I add any supplements? I have been trying to do one before the other. Really, all of the threads on the hormones are over my head. I will have to really dig in and try to gain a better understanding before I go there...

    Should I look into the light therapy before the supplements? I have been reading the posts on that too...

    I think that's it for now, I know it's alot -- it feels like a lot...

    Thanks in advance for any input --
     
  2. Rayser

    Rayser Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2013
    Messages:
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    I am 46 (next month). Female. Historically low BP and pulse. Low cholesterol and low tryglicerides. Have had difficulties with my menstrual cycle, sleeping, all my life I have been "a sweater", had TERRIBLE headaches/nausia and especially when I was pregnant with my daughter, been depressed, been suicidal, an alcoholic, bulimic, anorexic (was not good at this -- I love to eat!), a caloric counter, an over exerciser, etc...

    Have you read Ray Peat's articles on progesterone? You might want to consider supplementing progest-e-complex. What you describe sounds a lot like heavy estrogen dominance. I have had headaches, nausea, stomach cramps, PMS, heavy sweating, eating problems, depression since puberty. The symptoms disappeared completely after supplementing thyroid and progesterone.

    With Peat-style (I know this is not a great discription) lifestyle, I was hoping to balance hormones, which at this age, must need some balancing, right?

    At any age I suppose.

    LOL I am currently about 30 pounds overweight and have been most recently doing a lot of vegetable juicing. Wheat grass made me feel really good -- I thought -- until reading Peat...

    Yes, I would be really careful with juices. Some people don't have problems with apple juice but I stick to orange juice and grape juice and cherry juice.

    Here's what I have incorporated in my little time of Peating:
    raw carrot -- i usually dip it in a drop of oil/tbs vinegar/pinch salt/pinch sugar
    coffee -- gelatin/cream/sugar (this is a new thing for me -- I have NEVER drank coffee until 2 wks ago)
    mineral water -- I have ALWAYS been a huge water drinker (non-carbonated) -- I started drinking the mineral water because I missed h2o

    Hm, maybe you want to try orange juice instead? I know how big this is. I have been drinking about 4 litres of water a day before I started to read Ray Peat. It caused me lots of trouble. Especially the puffiness and cellulite I don't experience without drinking water. This is strictly my personal experience but I have found I need to balance one litre of water with 2 to 3 EXTRA table spoons of salt every day. Otherwise I get edema. If you need CO2 (which we all need) I suggest you do bag breathing.

    fresh oj/2%milk
    pecorano/romano cheese -- and some other cheeses
    lamb (once)
    shrimp (once)

    Make sure the shrimp are not aqua culture. Otherwise they don't contain selenium and eating them does more harm than good.

    daisy cottage cheese
    pears from a jar
    Virgil's Root Beers

    Don't know about root beer. I notice puffiness after drinking it.

    poached eggs
    Kerrigold butter

    Careful - they now have a kind which contains rape seed oil. I'm not a huge Kerrigold fan anymore. I now use Austrian mountain butter.


    coconut oil

    Refined?

    mortons canning/pickling salt
    No Grains (until I cheated last night with Girl Scout cookies)

    I love cookies. I make them with Masa Harina and raisons. Taste great.

    baking soda for washing my hair/body
    oil pulling

    Okay, don't know much about this scientifically. I use baking soda to rinse after drinking coffee and juices. My teeth are very white since I brush them with baking soda.

    honey
    ice cream

    This is a potential way of getting fat fast. If you manage to eat one or two spoons - great. I can't so I only eat ice cream on rare occasions.

    cherries
    watermelon
    a couple of potatoes sliced and baked with coconut oil/butter
    magnesium oil in a spray topically

    I am not a fan of magnesium supplements. If you drink a litre of orange juice every day, you will not need it. If you feel you do need extra, I suggest you take baths with epsom salt and/or use magnesium citrate orally. But it might be bad for your stomach in the long run.

    epsom salt bath once

    So, the Good...
    I am sleeping better -- deeper -- less sweating
    I am thinking better -- less short term memory loss
    I like sugar :)
    I like using baking soda for body wash -- no more BO :)
    Bag breathing is okay -- but I don't really notice anything
    temp has gone up from 97's to low 98's
    BPM increased from 56/57 to 58

    That's very, very low. Are you sure that's right? Ray Peat recommends a pulse around 90 if I remember correctly. I feel best with 100 but sometimes it's higher. I would watch the pulse closely and focus on avoiding PUFA and getting enough coconut oil. You might need thyroid supplement eventually.

    the Bad...
    I have gained @3 pounds & inches

    I don't mean to sound dismissive but 3 pounds?

    my tummy is bloated

    Try eating carrot salad before you go to sleep.

    my skin is a bit splotchy and of course puffy, like I said

    I think the edema might be connected with too much water and too little salt. You might want to consider using 1 to 3 table spoons of salt every day extra and check again after a week. Plus make sure to use enough sugar (ripe fruit is best) to lower cortisol. Milk is great, too.

    I think there is more cellulite tummy/thigh

    Yes, I notice that in summer when I drink too much water and don't use enough salt.

    I have bowel movements each day, but they are strained

    Have you heard of cascara sagrada? Ray Peat wrote and article about it.You might want to think about tetracycline in very small dosages, too.

    I probably eat too many calories (I used the conometer once)... I hate to count calories

    Yes, I hate that, too. But you might want to count the calories for a few days. You get a feeling for it after that and don't need to count anymore. For a while I was worried because I didn't lose any weight. I noticed then that I was eating 2.600 kcal a day. I now eat about 1.800 to 2.000 and I lost weight quickly.

    I wake up with puffy fingers and eyes
    what I liked about being -- sort of-- vegan was not eating anything with a face or a mother (although I did sparsely)


    My Goals:
    To balance hormones --& lose the extra weight

    Ray Peat suggests you can lose weight by getting the necessary kcal from drinking milk and orange juice and eating carrots and eggs. If I were you I would focus on balancing hormones first and getting healthy and then I would concentrate on the weight loss. It's so much easier when your metabolism is good.

    To be able to exercise more than 12-15 minutes without being sick in bed with a headache the next day, even though doing the exercise feels fine at the time (and I am in no way overdoing what I am doing -- my body right now does not like certain movement). I want to get back to an active lifestyle.

    There are some things you can do which are good but I wouldn't exercise right now. The extra stress is obviously too much for at the moment. Go for walks if you can. Exercise can produce a hyperthyroid state for a short time. That might be why it makes you feel good.


    the Questions...
    why isn't the Peat-style worried about eating oysters/shrimp/liver, though they are very critical of toxins (I am too) in products and in the way the animal protien in fed (grass fed)?

    As far as I know everybody is concerned about that. I only eat veal liver from animals who were fed organically. I don't eat shrimp often and I never eat anything from aqua culture. The same goes for oysters. I never eat oysters without drinking Coca-Cola to avoid the iron content. But sometimes you have to weigh the benefits against the adverse effects. There is no better source for copper and zinc than oysters, no better source for vitamin A and the B vitamins and copper than liver, no better source for selenium than shrimp or cod or shell fish (if not from aqua culture). We still live in a flawed world. To live without flaws would involve space travel.


    Teeth: Does the oil pulling keep your teeth from getting stained by the coffee/coke?
    and I still have silver fillings one half of my mouth -- other side I had them replaced. Could this be causing any problems?

    Silver? Really?

    Am I correct in trying to dial in the food before I add any supplements?

    Absolutely.

    I have been trying to do one before the other. Really, all of the threads on the hormones are over my head. I will have to really dig in and try to gain a better understanding before I go there...

    Should I look into the light therapy before the supplements? I have been reading the posts on that too...

    No, I would read the articles on aspirin and coconut oil and progesterone. I think they are not too hard to understand. Don't try to do everything at once. One step after the other is just fine. They are all steps in the right direction.

    I think that's it for now, I know it's alot -- it feels like a lot...

    Thanks in advance for any input --[/quote]
     
  3. j.

    j. Guest

    Rayser, wan't grape juice estrogenic?

    And I thought magnesium citrate was bad because of the "citrate" part, doesn't it convert to citric acid?
     
  4. OP
    Carac

    Carac Member

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    Messages:
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    Thanks Rayser. I will try to implement the food changes you suggest. And the ice cream only on occassion is probably spot on! HAHA Hey, I knew this sounded too good to be true! :) The one day I did use the cronometer I was at 1600 calories, but I had more after, I just didn't plug them in. I assume I was over 2000 that day.

    When you say, "I have had headaches, nausea, stomach cramps, PMS, heavy sweating, eating problems, depression since puberty."
    It's good to know you have had some similar symptoms. Often, I feel like no one "gets" it. Sorry for your struggle tho!

    I'm sort of hesitant to try the progest-e-complex -- I have read a bit about it here, but if I am getting the ice cream thing wrong, I could go REALLY wrong with that... just saying, I don't know what I am doing... I am trying to absorb everything, but there's a lot to take in. Do you really think I could figure it out?

    Very interesting thoughts about the exercise producing a state of hyperthyroid... again, possibly spot on here too. I can walk all day long with the kids, at the zoo, or a carnival, outside market, whatever... no problems the next day. But when I try to walk/jog for 30 mins. I feel crappy for 2-3 days AFTER.

    So Silver? Really? that's bad? maybe I said the wrong thing maybe they are not silver? they are the old probably 25-28 yr old filings...

    Oh yes, I have been taking 1/2 of 325mg aspirin (minimum fillers) diluted in a tiny sip of water before bed most nights. Have not noticed anything from this one way or the other.

    Have you heard of cascara sagrada? Ray Peat wrote and article about it.You might want to think about tetracycline in very small dosages, too.
    I have heard on here of te casacara, not the tetracycline. Again, my un-scientific mind is assuming this is too much to comprehend at this point. But, maybe I should look into it.


    j.: the magnesium was not the citrate -- it was the other one chol... I thought I read that it was Peat approved (sorry for lack of a better term)
    Have not done any juice except fresh oj or ripe watermelon for 3 weeks.

    Thanks a million for getting back to me. It feels overwhelming. I will keep trying.
     
  5. Jenn

    Jenn Member

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    I use epsom salts internally, as needed.
    I lost weight eating ice cream every night, only works with Hagen Daz, not any other brand. Even better, vanilla ice cream floats with OJ and a sprinkle of salt!
    Mineral/seltzer/club soda is excellent for carbonation, especially mixed half and half with OJ, but only drink when thirsty.
     
  6. OP
    Carac

    Carac Member

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    Thanks Jenn It's good to know this is possible.

    With that said, I am getting frustrated -- I get so thirsty. I have been used to trying to drink a gallon of water most days. Even when I was juicing vegetables. Everything I have done the past 3 weeks leaves me so thirsty. salt, milk, coffee, sugar, fat... the watermelon juice is refreshing. This morning my tongue feels swollen and sort of "burnt" from the additional salt I tried to take in yesterday because of the mineral water I drank. But I slept well :D

    And the weight gain is 5 pounds this morning. I don't mean to sound vain, but I am now 5'5' and 170 lbs. Much more than I weighed when I delivered my children, I don't think this weight is appropriate for me. Most importantly, I don't feel good about it. But I guess I never have felt good about my weight!

    Anyway, I may try tweeking things for a bit longer, but, I am not sure the pros are out weighing (pun intended HAHA) the cons. (trying to lighten --HAHA-- up a little bit)

    Thank for your help. SO glad so many people are finding help here!

    Oh, my pulse is staying @58 bpm. I feel for pulse at my wrist and watch my clock for one minute, counting each beat starting with the first one... I think I am taking it correctly. My pulse has been lower when I was doing more aerobic activity.
     
  7. Rayser

    Rayser Member

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    I'm sorry, j. - I didn't mean to ignore you, just didn't see you there.

    As for grape juice and being estrogenic. I suppose every fruit and vegetable is estrogenic to some extent but I remember Ray Peat saying the problem with grape juice are the seeds which are pressed with the fruit and not completely (if at all) filtered out later. That goes for industrial juice of course. In Germany we have some (expensive) organic juices without grape skins and seeds. I drink those when oranges are not ripe in nearby countries and those from far away haven't arrived yet. I have never noticed any good effects from drinking orange juice I did not make myself.
    I immediately notice the positive effects of grape juice. I guess it's the very high sugar content.

    There are some recent studies which claim grapes (and grape juice) are anti-estrogenic:

    "During the previous year, it was found that grape juice stopped the estrogen production in cells in a test tube. Recent experiments using mice demonstrated that the tumors implanted in mice fed with a very small amount of grape juice daily for 5 weeks were one-third the size of those in similarly implanted mice not given grape juice. These results suggest the possibility that drinking grape juice may prevent breast cancer."

    "The efficacy of these procyanidin B dimer compounds was then evaluated in an aromatase transfected MCF-7 breast cancer mouse model. The B dimer mixture was able to reduce androgen dependent tumor growth, indicating that procyanidin B dimers suppress in situ estrogen formation. This was done in collaboration with Dr. Rajeshwar Rao Tekmal at Emory University using a transgenic mouse model that over-expresses aromatase in the mammary tissues. Like the known specific aromatase inhibitor, Letrozole, the active B dimer fraction from red wine (administered by gavage) is a potent blocker of estrogen biosynthesis. When feed to the mice by gavage, it led not only to complete reduction and elimination of breast hyperplasia and other preneoplastic and neoplastic changes, but also affected other normal endocrine functions that are typical for estrogen deprivation."

    http://cbcrp.org.127.seekdotnet.com/res ... ant_id=281

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1674 ... stractPlus
    Grape seed extract is an aromatase inhibitor and a suppressor of aromatase expression.
    2006

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1151 ... t=Abstract
    Suppression of aromatase (estrogen synthetase) by red wine phytochemicals.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1209 ... t=Abstract
    Prevention and treatment of breast cancer by suppressing aromatase activity and expression.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1467 ... stractPlus
    Suppression of estrogen biosynthesis by procyanidin dimers in red wine and grape seeds.

    But at least some of those refer to the skin and seed extract of grapes or to wine.
    The Linus Pauling Institute summarizes both effects in regard to resveratrol, estrogenic and anti-estrogenic.

    http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/p ... sveratrol/

    "However, in cell culture experiments resveratrol acts as an estrogen agonist under some conditions and an estrogen antagonist under other conditions (18, 19). In estrogen receptor-positive breast cancer cells, resveratrol acted as an estrogen agonist in the absence of the endogenous estrogen, 17beta-estradiol, but acted as an estrogen antagonist in the presence of 17beta-estradiol (20, 21). At present, it appears that resveratrol has the potential to act as an estrogen agonist or antagonist depending on such factors as cell type, estrogen receptor isoform (ER alpha or ER beta), and the presence of endogenous estrogens (17)."

    I dont't know if that makes sense. Sounds a lot like Schrödinger.
    But they conclude:

    "Resveratrol has been found to inhibit the proliferation of a variety of human cancer cell lines, including those from breast, prostate, stomach, colon, pancreatic, and thyroid cancers (2). In animal models, oral administration of resveratrol inhibited the development of esophageal (75), intestinal (76), and mammary (breast) cancer (20, 77) induced by chemical carcinogens."

    The references are here: http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/p ... refs.html#

    As for the magnesium citrate: I use magnesium sulfate heptahydrate MgSO4·7H2O for baths but I do not use it orally. It gives me stomach cramps and doesn't have the effects I am looking for. I once told Ray Peat about it and he answered "Why would you use it orally?"
    I don't normally use magnesium supplements because they all cause intestinal problems after a while as Ray Peat pointed out several times. Usually with enough coffee and orange juice I don't need them. But sometimes I notice low energy during stress and supplementing egg shells doesn't help. In those rare cases I use magnesium citrate orally.
    In studies it shows a high bio availability which is in part caused by it's solubility even in low acid environments.

    I don't think citric acid is a problem in these occasions. It will be if used regularly because it can wake dormant cancer cells. But then you are not supposed to use magnesium supplements regularly over a long period of time anyway.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2407766

    "We conclude that a daily supplementation with Mg citrate shows superior bioavailability after 60 days of treatment when compared with other treatments studied."

    http://www.jle.com/e-docs/00/03/FA/FA/article.phtml
    Mg citrate found more bioavailable than other Mg preparations in a randomised, double‐blind study
     
  8. j.

    j. Guest

    Did you do that because the magnesium bath salt didn't give you enough magnesium. I'm trying to figure out why it's better than epsom bath salts.
     
  9. Rayser

    Rayser Member

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    Weight loss is absolutely possible and will happen when your metabolic rate is higher. Right now it seems to be very low, Carac. Jenn didn't mean you should eat ice cream every evening to lose weight.

    Ray Peat:
    "I used to eat huge amounts of commercial ice cream, but the good brands were forced out of the market by the junk brands, and now Haagen Dazs is the only one without dangerous additives, and its fat content is extremely high, so I prefer to make my own. Using coconut oil, the texture can approximate Haagen Dazs. Gelatin can be used for a variety of other desserts.

    Recipe Ice Cream:
    I blend an egg (warmed to 40 degrees C) with a cup of sugar (also warmed) and a cup of coconut oil until it's smoothly emulsified, and maybe half a cup of powdered milk for extra texture, then add milk to fill the blender (total volume a little over a liter), with strong coffee or orange juice for flavor, or other fruit or vanilla, etc. The high oil content, and powdered milk, make it freeze without crystallizing, so the ice cream machine isn't necessary."

    "I actually read through the entire Low-Carb Forum thread on Peat. There are definitely people there who "failed" in some way, whether it was gaining fat or poor blood sugar control. But in all those cases there was good reason for it. Some people took ice cream being allowed to mean you could eat it all the time. It's a thyroid supporting food but still very calorie dense and not meant to be eaten outside of certain situations (like before bed) unless metabolism is high."
    PrimalCG
    http://paleohacks.com/questions/99198/r ... z2YvxBPF7f

    "A lot of people experience weight gain with Ray's recommendations, due to eating high fat foods, such as Haagen Dazs, whole milk, cream, full fat cheeses, etc. Ray recommends low fat milk and no ice cream if you are trying to lose weight."
    http://mail.earthisround.com/showthread.php?p=8485496

    Actually this is one of the biggest problems with people starting Ray Peat and immediately eating lots of 40% fat cheese and ice creams and coconut oil and butter and other foods very rich in fats.
    Yes, saturated fats are protective. But they are very high in kcal. One should always try to increase the metabolic rate and watch the caloric intake, increase thyroid function, avoid and eliminate PUFA, raise temperature and pulse first. Milk, eggs, orange juice, carrots, aspirin, thyroid, salt, sugar ... that's were you start. It's important to eat or dink something throughout the day to keep the blood sugar up. Ice cream and cheese are healthy but they are not the first steps and certainly not steps on the way to losing weight.
    Trying to start there is going to be a frustrating experience and after gaining 20 pounds people quit, saying "Ray Peat is wrong".
     
  10. Rayser

    Rayser Member

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    No, epsom salt baths never gave me the quick magnesium fix I was aiming for in those occasions. I hear the same from other women who have cramps for instance. The baths will help while they are in the tub but occur again when they get out. I suppose it's a matter of dosage, too because how much epsom salt do you use in the water and how much will be absorbed through your skin and reach your blood stream?
    I once used too much salt and my skin got red and hurt. I always use the epsom salt together with baking soda but if I use too much salt my skin will react badly.
    I use Epsom salt baths regularly and I am sure they are beneficial. But when I feel low energy and neither T3 nor calcium nor sodium can change that, I use magnesium supplements orally. I am not home all day every day so very often the stress situation which leads to low energy happens to you somewhere in an office or a hotel or on a train. It would be hard to take a bath there.
    Also baths take time. You have to prepare them, you have to sit in them for at least 20 minutes. That's something you can do at night when you're home. But that's rarely when I am in need of extra magnesium.
    So: Yes, I think there are situations when oral magnesium supplements are necessary. Those should not be used regularly. If you use them, make sure to get the one with high bio availability - preferably one that doesn't give you stomach cramps or diarrhea immediately.
    For me that's magnesium citrate.
     
  11. gretchen

    gretchen Member

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    You might want to consider whether cow's milk works for you or not. I've switched to goat's in the last month and feel a lot better. If you get tired of drinking so much liquid you can put instant coffee in the goat milk- a great combination.

    It is hard to lose weight with a lowered metabolism and restricting calories makes it worse. That is the big drawback about this diet- so long as you eat well (which this diet encourages), you (probably) won't lose weight.

    You could reduce calories temporarily and add a lot of walking and some other light exercise like Pilates to your routine. That's what I did. Pilates isn't labor intensive and won't make you tired.

    I've added an OTC calcium supplement but don't suggest that you do so necessarily. I feel I need the extra calcium for fat burning and to lower PTH (and because I haven't drank milk or age cheese for decades) and don't want to make eggshell.
     
  12. OP
    Carac

    Carac Member

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    Hi gretchen. Thanks for your comment:

    "It is hard to lose weight with a lowered metabolism and restricting calories makes it worse. That is the big drawback about this diet- so long as you eat well (which this diet encourages), you (probably) won't lose weight." "

    This makes so much sense to me. It's exactly what I am going thru. For now, my weight gain for the past couple of days has leveled off, so I am not so anxious about it right now.

    Re; the goats milk I had the same initial thoughts and actually started my peating with it, but with the rapid onset of weight, and reading RP article@ weight loss, (and some helpful suggestions from posters) I decided to switch to 2% cows milk. Now, I guess (but I am not sure) I could heat the goats milk and skim fat off the top -- maybe someone could confirm this, or tell me if I am wrong -- but, I am not sure I am ready to add that step to the process just yet. My OCD is satisfied right now trying to read, learn, understand, think about food, etc... with everything I am currently doing.

    [dropshadow=blue]TMI ALERT below[/dropshadow]: :D

    Although, I am going to have to do something about the constipation soon (again, I did receive a suggestion on this forum for casa(something) which I will look into when I have a chance). I tried drinking epson salts disolved in water yesterday, but only 2 tsp, it helped a little bit... my BM are just not as comfortable as I am used to. And my hemorroids are beginning to act up -- so I need to keep working on this issue.

    Yes, I agree, walking works well for me and if I do more of it, I think it will only help EVERYTHING!
     
  13. Jenn

    Jenn Member

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    Actually, eating ice cream every night would be great for me, if I could afford it. It helps me sleep and reduce stress.

    Don't eat more than you can digest and assimilate. Edema is a sign of liver stress. It can be lack of sufficient protein and or energy and or lack of sufficient minerals, especially potassium.

    A lot of people are used to eating big meals of fluff food, airy breads, high cellulose vegetables and don't know how to translate that volume into nutrient dense foods. A snack doesn't have to be a full plate's worth of food (or the entire container of ice cream), it can be a few bites or sips.
     
  14. Mastemah

    Mastemah Member

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    Messages:
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    What Z courses have you been to? Have you been to Sustenance yet? If so, recently? Lots of Ray Peat info there. Rays work will take care of you, you just need to get everything on the right track. Cascara is a better choice that citrate. Oral Epsom Salts in small frequent amounts also works. Soaking for 20 mins is too long. 10-15 minutes with the right amount of salts helps as well. Poor gut function=low thyroid. Cytomel and Cynoplus both have made clients bowel function improve immeadiatly. Watch out for improper supplementation and try and get as much nutrition from food as possible. Endurance type exercise is not good for people with poor thyroid function. Strength work with higher volume, concentric emphasis and not to failure is the best way to sculpt a body. Play is the other great way to exercise.
     
  15. OP
    Carac

    Carac Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2013
    Messages:
    20
    Hi Mastemah, my husband and I have taken Essentials and R-Phase. We will probably do I-Phase in another year or two. We will continue with Z, but we are in Ohio and since most courses are offered in FL, AZ, CA, we have to do them bit by bit -- it's pretty pricey to fly/stay/cancel work/ etc. Love Z Health tho! We have someone working with us who has done all the courses (9s too). It's great to watch him put it into practice!! When we took R-Phase this past June that is how I heard about Peat. I was inquiring about some nutrition advice from our MasterTrainer. He suggested I check out DRoddy and I have been experimenting since the end of June. Not sure if the Peaty thing is going to work for me. I am giving it a shot. I do love this forum. Such smart, kind, thoughtful community! The science behind it makes my head spin! Very cool. But, putting it into practice is challenging for me.

    Things that still are not working for me:
    1.the bowel movements are not what they used to be. Never have had a problem, until switching to this eating style.
    2. I miss drinking water, I really like just plain old H2O! But, I have stopped it completely.
    3. weight gain -- no fun. I am laying off the ice cream so the gain has stopped, but, that is still a net gain of 5 lbs.
    4. swelling -- yuck -- some days are better, but, again, I have never had swelling, so I don't like this.

    I am using Mortons canning salt -- put it in everything, sometimes just take a pinch right out of the jar.
    I am using CO
    I am not suplementing at all right now. Was trying to get stable with the food changes first.
    I am not do any exercise to speak of -- should do some, it would definitely help. No cardio tho, I don't think my metabolism is capable yet.

    I will try the Cytomel and/or Cynoplus. I think if I get regular again, everything will feel better.
    I also need to make some bone broth -- I am using gelatin in coffee 2x/day, but I think I am developing a craving for bone broth, even though I have never had it! HA HA

    Mastemah, can you share with me What is your experience with Z? with Peat style? I am guessing this is something that has worked for you. Maybe give me some encouragement by sharing your experience! :)

    Thanks!
     
  16. j.

    j. Guest

    Thirst should regulate water consumption, so if you miss it or are thinking about it, I think you should drink it. That might help in the elimination department.
     
  17. jaa

    jaa Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2012
    Messages:
    1,035
    Hello Mastemah,

    Why is soaking for 10-15 minutes preferable to 20?
     
  18. Mastemah

    Mastemah Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Messages:
    100
    If they have enough Epsom salts in the bath and are low in magnesium, some people get nausea and occasionally diarrhea. Just something I have seen over the years :)
     
  19. jaa

    jaa Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2012
    Messages:
    1,035
    Luckily I have not experienced that!

    If tolerated, are longer soaks preferable? That is my gut feeling.
     
  20. j.

    j. Guest

    If you're "tolerating" something it probably isn't good. The baths stop being enjoyable at some point, some say it's because you're reabsorbing the toxins.
     
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