"The GABA System, Defences, And Tissue Renewal"

metabolizm

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The following snippets are taken from Ray's newsletter from 2008.

"Protective inhibition is one of the most important principles in biology. Heart disease, cancer, anxiety, allergies, epilepsy, degenerative nerve diseases, endocrine disorders, inappropriate inflammation and shock all involve defects of protective inhibition."

"Nitric oxide increases the ratio of glutamate to GABA ('the excitatory index')... while lowering mitochondrial energy production."

"The PUFA increase the susceptibility to excessive serotonin in the nervous system. One of the functions of the GABA system is to inhibit serotonergic nerves... Eating a diet with very low tryptophan content, and lacking PUFA, can support that function of the GABA system. The tea amino acid, thianine, suppresses serotonin by supporting the effects of GABA."

"It's important not to confuse the process of inhibition with psychological depression, which often involves an inability to inhibit the stress responses. The GABA system restrains the production of cortisol, which is typically increased in depression... The Diazepam type of antianxiety, antiseizure drug activates the GABA system, and this system is involved with the synthesis of steroids. Several varieties of that type of sedative increase the synthesis of neurosteroids, derived from progesterone. Progesterone and some of its metabolites protect the mitochondria, while acting with GABA to increase the state of inhibition."

"It [estrogen] is antagonistic to the GABA system, and promotes the action of excitatory transmitters, and increases formation of nitric oxide and prostaglandins."

"The saturated fats, rather than simply lacking the toxic and excitatory properties of the polyunsaturated fats, are being shown by many types of research to have protective, inhibitory, and restorative functions."

"Niacinamide, one of the B vitamins, happens to have GABAergic sedative activity."

"Maintaining an adequate supply of glucose is directly protective against excitotoxicity and helps to prevent stress reactions systemically."

"Although caffeine is a stimulant that can offset the sedative effects of GABA, it also functions as a neuroprotectant, protecting against some of the effects of glutamate. It is also a very good source of two other protective factor, magnesium and niacin. 'French-roast' (dark) coffee is an especially rich source of niacin, which might be responsible for the 'French paradox', the low incidence of heart disease in a country that doesn't follow the AHA's 'heart protective diet'."
 

LucyL

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What newsletter is that from? Do you have the full version?
 

mrchibbs

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"It's important not to confuse the process of inhibition with psychological depression, which often involves an inability to inhibit the stress responses. The GABA system restrains the production of cortisol, which is typically increased in depression...

I think this distinction by Ray is crucial. It's normal to be lethargic or without energy for a while, especially when you've been running on chronically elevated stress hormones.
A healthy individual should have high sensitivity to adrenaline, cortisol etc. They modulate our response to stimulation. Other emergency systems like nitric oxide, estrogen, parathyroid hormone, tsh, growth hormone etc. are needed too, but shouldn't be chronically elevated to compensate for an impaired oxidative metabolism.

To recover from years of chronic stress, there needs to be a phase of inhibition, so that the energy potential of the cells can be restored. Nathan Hatch has a chapter on this in his book, regarding the GABA system and how to activate it. For instance, it maybe helpful to avoid coffee for a little while (maybe just a week), along with suppressing the stress hormones with something like aspirin or cyproheptadine, along with a steady supply of glucose and protein is necessary to rebuild tissues and repair the functional base of the organism.

This inhibition (or inward restorative state) creates the foundation for future growth and development, and ability to respond to stimulation, and adapt to life challenges appropriately.
 

Regina

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The following snippets are taken from Ray's newsletter from 2008.

"Protective inhibition is one of the most important principles in biology. Heart disease, cancer, anxiety, allergies, epilepsy, degenerative nerve diseases, endocrine disorders, inappropriate inflammation and shock all involve defects of protective inhibition."

"Nitric oxide increases the ratio of glutamate to GABA ('the excitatory index')... while lowering mitochondrial energy production."

"The PUFA increase the susceptibility to excessive serotonin in the nervous system. One of the functions of the GABA system is to inhibit serotonergic nerves... Eating a diet with very low tryptophan content, and lacking PUFA, can support that function of the GABA system. The tea amino acid, thianine, suppresses serotonin by supporting the effects of GABA."

"It's important not to confuse the process of inhibition with psychological depression, which often involves an inability to inhibit the stress responses. The GABA system restrains the production of cortisol, which is typically increased in depression... The Diazepam type of antianxiety, antiseizure drug activates the GABA system, and this system is involved with the synthesis of steroids. Several varieties of that type of sedative increase the synthesis of neurosteroids, derived from progesterone. Progesterone and some of its metabolites protect the mitochondria, while acting with GABA to increase the state of inhibition."

"It [estrogen] is antagonistic to the GABA system, and promotes the action of excitatory transmitters, and increases formation of nitric oxide and prostaglandins."

"The saturated fats, rather than simply lacking the toxic and excitatory properties of the polyunsaturated fats, are being shown by many types of research to have protective, inhibitory, and restorative functions."

"Niacinamide, one of the B vitamins, happens to have GABAergic sedative activity."

"Maintaining an adequate supply of glucose is directly protective against excitotoxicity and helps to prevent stress reactions systemically."

"Although caffeine is a stimulant that can offset the sedative effects of GABA, it also functions as a neuroprotectant, protecting against some of the effects of glutamate. It is also a very good source of two other protective factor, magnesium and niacin. 'French-roast' (dark) coffee is an especially rich source of niacin, which might be responsible for the 'French paradox', the low incidence of heart disease in a country that doesn't follow the AHA's 'heart protective diet'."
Great quotes!
 

milkboi

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I think this distinction by Ray is crucial. It's normal to be lethargic or without energy for a while, especially when you've been running on chronically elevated stress hormones.
A healthy individual should have high sensitivity to adrenaline, cortisol etc. They modulate our response to stimulation. Other emergency systems like nitric oxide, estrogen, parathyroid hormone, tsh, growth hormone etc. are needed too, but shouldn't be chronically elevated to compensate for an impaired oxidative metabolism.

To recover from years of chronic stress, there needs to be a phase of inhibition, so that the energy potential of the cells can be restored. Nathan Hatch has a chapter on this in his book, regarding the GABA system and how to activate it. For instance, it maybe helpful to avoid coffee for a little while (maybe just a week), along with suppressing the stress hormones with something like aspirin or cyproheptadine, along with a steady supply of glucose and protein is necessary to rebuild tissues and repair the functional base of the organism.

This inhibition (or inward restorative state) creates the foundation for future growth and development, and ability to respond to stimulation, and adapt to life challenges appropriately.

This strategy didn't seem to work for me. Having no energy to do anything while supposedly "healing" lead to me just becoming depressed and ultimately succumbing to unhealthy habits.
 

mrchibbs

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This strategy didn't seem to work for me. Having no energy to do anything while supposedly "healing" lead to me just becoming depressed and ultimately succumbing to unhealthy habits.

I'm sorry you had problems in your recovery. But I only speak from experience and my understanding of the physiology. It worked for me.

I will say that your perspective is a bit reductive. Nowhere did I say you should have no energy to do anything. Initially yes you'll have a period of lower energy from lowering the stress hormones, and of course if you don't actively work to improve the anti-thyroid factors in your life, you'll remain in a state of low energy.

So it's certainly not about taking cypro and lying in bed for months on end and hoping for a magical recovery. But it's about gentle stimulation, easy tasks/projects, walking, making an effort to get sunshine, to cook better food, get filtered water etc.

Either the thyroid, or the stress hormones supply drive and energy. If you don't have either, it's pretty clear you're going to get stuck.
 

Lejeboca

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regarding the GABA system and how to activate it. For instance, it maybe helpful to avoid coffee for a little while (maybe just a week), along with suppressing the stress hormones with something like aspirin or cyproheptadine, along with a steady supply of glucose and protein is necessary to rebuild tissues and repair the functional base of the organism.

I see this "GABA-like" lack of energy if I slightly overdose progesterone (e.g., 9mg instead of usual 6mg). For me this lethargic feeling differs from depression: It is more inward looking and centered on my physical state (everything becomes warm and fuzzy) while the lethargic feeling from depression or stress is outward looking in the sense that I start disliking life in general and everything around me. But for both kinds of "lethargy" a couple drops of tyromix on my wrist makes me either more dynamic (in the former case) or less gloomy (in the latter case). So I agree with mrchibbs on thyroid as being a remedy here.
 

mrchibbs

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I see this "GABA-like" lack of energy if I slightly overdose progesterone (e.g., 9mg instead of usual 6mg). For me this lethargic feeling differs from depression: It is more inward looking and centered on my physical state (everything becomes warm and fuzzy) while the lethargic feeling from depression or stress is outward looking in the sense that I start disliking life in general and everything around me. But for both kinds of "lethargy" a couple drops of tyromix on my wrist makes me either more dynamic (in the former case) or less gloomy (in the latter case). So I agree with mrchibbs on thyroid as being a remedy here.

You described it better than I did. Progesterone can feel like a warm blanket. That's the GABA-inhibitory state. Much different than depression. If you're depressed during recovery, something is not working right. As Ray said multiple times, feeling mentally ill is a sign of degradation, and an indicator that things are not going in the right direction.
 

milkboi

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You described it better than I did. Progesterone can feel like a warm blanket. That's the GABA-inhibitory state. Much different than depression. If you're depressed during recovery, something is not working right. As Ray said multiple times, feeling mentally ill is a sign of degradation, and an indicator that things are not going in the right direction.

Yes, and Cypro makes me feel that way. Even with T3/thyroid. Not hating on your approach, if it works for you and others that's great, but it doesn't seem for everyone.

Edit: Ok, to be fair, Cypro also can give me this warm fuzzy feeling. BUT it also takes away any drive, which then over time makes me depressed.
 

mrchibbs

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Yes, and Cypro makes me feel that way. Even with T3/thyroid. Not hating on your approach, if it works for you and others that's great, but it doesn't seem for everyone.

Edit: Ok, to be fair, Cypro also can give me this warm fuzzy feeling. BUT it also takes away any drive, which then over time makes me depressed.

Then cycle. Use Cypro for a week or two and then stop taking it. Use it as a boost. People always notice a major rebound in energy after stopping cypro. There are some indications anti-histamines should be cycled anyway. Many threads on this forum talk about this.
 

SonOfEurope

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As someone who was dependant on 2.5 mg clonazepam (hell of a drug) yet managed to drop it to only 0.45mg in two years. (With luck... Should be off by next spring ) by reducing the dose 5% monthly AND USING 15mg progest-e daily, I BUMP this thread.

My Gaba-ergic system has re-sensitized thanks to the slow taper and Progesterone, hormone of brain adaptability... Reminds me of Peat mentioning in one article how Birds' brains grow in complexity faster in spring when the growing days favour Progesterone... And indeed I made faster progress during the growing days of April & May , greater room for re adapting to your own sensitivity.

Amazing.
 

rei

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To recover from years of chronic stress, there needs to be a phase of inhibition, so that the energy potential of the cells can be restored.
Very good summation of the concept, i think this is the best "one liner" to explain how for me simply using topical progesterone for a few days kickstarted an unbelievable cascade of healing chronic damage. Once it was well under way it made no change when i ran out of the bottle i had managed to secure, the process continued as before using other supplements.
 

metabolizm

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I should just mention to everyone, there was a post here which contained a link to many old newsletters including this one from 2008, if you want to read the whole thing.
 
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metabolizm

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"Although caffeine is a stimulant that can offset the sedative effects of GABA..."

I think this point is incredibly important, and Ray doesn't emphasise it enough. He is constantly promoting caffeine, and with good reason, but too often he fails to remind us that it is not always appropriate, especially when you're suffering from low-GABA problems like anxiety and insomnia. After a lot of experimentation, I've found that one mug of relatively weak instant coffee with milk is my daily limit - any more caffeine and I can feel the "sedative effects of GABA" being horribly offset.* We all need to find our personal upper limit, and some people won't be able to tolerate any caffeine at all, at least for a while.

*Paradoxically enough, I actually find that one cup of Instant Joe to be both relaxing and to promote excellent bowel movements, but any more than that and I become constipated.
 
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ddjd

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"Nitric oxide increases the ratio of glutamate to GABA ('the excitatory index')... while lowering mitochondrial energy production."
from everything ive read there's a very symbiotic relationship between GABA and nitric oxide, in that they increase alongside one another, not inversely
 

mrchibbs

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Very good summation of the concept, i think this is the best "one liner" to explain how for me simply using topical progesterone for a few days kickstarted an unbelievable cascade of healing chronic damage. Once it was well under way it made no change when i ran out of the bottle i had managed to secure, the process continued as before using other supplements.

I don't deserve any credit lol, I've probably lifted that verbatim from one of Ray's articles.

Your anecdote about progesterone is spot on. It can stop a pattern of stress and allow to the body to restart its course towards restorative processes. I think anti-stress ''adaptogens'' like progesterone or cyproheptadine or any other are best used intermittently, in times of stress, as opposed to daily.

Something like aspirin can probably be taken on the regular though.
 
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