The Dope On Blocking Fatty Acid Oxidation

[Jessie]

Thanks for reading. I wouldn't exactly say that it's counterintuitive (although carnitine is anti-thyroid). Carnitine does increase the total amount of fat burned; which is most likely due to it improving mitochondrial function by restoring glucose oxidation. This then allows for more fatty acid oxidation. So the increase in fat oxidation is due to more and better functioning mitochondria, and not necessarily due to a higher rate of beta-oxidation per mitochondria.
So in other words, carnitine helps to lower excessive pathological fatty acid oxidation, but in the long term (by increasing total mitochondria), it can allow for more "healthy" fat oxidation.
But just because carnitine has a "good" aspect, such as promoting glucose oxidation, doesn't mean it should be used for that reason, because carnitine has its own side effects and there are better and smarter ways to restore glucose oxidation.

Thanks for clarifying

 

[Kevtoon2905]

Very interesting article. I wont lie, majority of it flew straight over my head.

Some of the theories of blocking FAO for exercise and fat loss are quite interesting, however, outside of using some random drugs, I can't really see much advice outside of using Aspirin and B Vitamins? Am I missing something obvious?

 

[ken]

Think mildronate, a thousand world class athletes can't be wrong. Actually Ray was mentioning it in his 1991 paper on adaptogens. Without mention it by name.

 

[yerrag]

Not sure if more mitochondria will help the heart beat faster. Acetylcholine slows heart rate, so I think lowering excessive acetylcholine might be a better strategy for that.


If the heart were to use only glucose, then the risk of death would have been very high, because if there would be a famine, then everyone would die. So I think it's partly because fat stores are much much larger than glycogen stores so it's a "safer" and more reliable source. Also, the heart would definitely use more glucose as the workload increases because glucose is a much more effective fuel for hard-working muscles.


Even healthy people can experience benefits from it, that's why it's used as a performance enhancer. Blocking FAO, even if you're healthy, should increase mitochondrial biogenesis and upregulate the beneficial effects of peroxisomal beta-oxidation.


The benefit would most likely be improving energy production even more, limiting the damages of stress, upregulating peroxisomal beta-oxidation, etc.

Thanks Hans!

 

[yerrag]

Good question!
I have an unexplained illness, and every so often I throw things at it to get an Idea of what may be going on. You know, perturbing the system to know more about it.

I remember going for a walk a few days after starting meldonium, and I felt incredibly light. Absolutely no oxygen “hunger”. But the fat gain and fat cravings are real. I have gone thru several boxes of meldonium and everytime, they appear.

I wonder why you would crave fats. Is the body trying to tell you it wants to burn those fats you were blocking from being metabolized? Would you have gained fat if you resisted eating those fats?

 

[ButtonMushroom9]

It depends on which one you use as they have different half-lives. Meldonium and Pyrucet are best taken twice daily, whereas Haidut is currently working on one with a much longer half-life of 1-2 days IIRC. I think dosing in the morning is a good idea, since then FFAs are highest after an overnight fast. Also, taking it during stress will be helpful to limit the harmful effects of stress.

Doesn’t coffee/caffeine increase FFAs? I’ve always wondered why I reach for coffee first thing in the morning in choice of food. I know a few other people that do this as well. You’d think that coffee would be the last thing the body needs after an overnight fast. Maybe that’s just the addictive nature of caffeine, and reaching for it first thing is the craving for the drug (even though taking it after appropriate food that supports it, would be better).

 

[Hans]

Very interesting article. I wont lie, majority of it flew straight over my head.

Some of the theories of blocking FAO for exercise and fat loss are quite interesting, however, outside of using some random drugs, I can't really see much advice outside of using Aspirin and B Vitamins? Am I missing something obvious?

Pyrucet isn't a drug so maybe that's something you can try out. Stress hormones, such as cortisol, noradrenaline, adrenaline, serotonin, estrogen, and also inflammation, endotoxins, etc., increase lipolysis, promote insulin resistance and mess with glucose oxidation. So keeping those in check should also help to limit excess lipolysis and fat oxidation.

 

[Hans]

Doesn’t coffee/caffeine increase FFAs? I’ve always wondered why I reach for coffee first thing in the morning in choice of food. I know a few other people that do this as well. You’d think that coffee would be the last thing the body needs after an overnight fast. Maybe that’s just the addictive nature of caffeine, and reaching for it first thing is the craving for the drug (even though taking it after appropriate food that supports it, would be better).

Yes, and if there is glucose available, caffeine stimulates the oxidation of both. Black coffee or coffee without enough carbs can actually worsen insulin resistance for some people that are already insulin resistant with high stress hormones in the morning. So maybe combining it with aspirin or another compound that can lower excess cortisol in the morning can help offset that.
Peat talked about coffee being an adaptogen, so I won't say it's bad, but it should be used in the right context.

 

[Kevtoon2905]

Pyrucet isn't a drug so maybe that's something you can try out. Stress hormones, such as cortisol, noradrenaline, adrenaline, serotonin, estrogen, and also inflammation, endotoxins, etc., increase lipolysis, promote insulin resistance and mess with glucose oxidation. So keeping those in check should also help to limit excess lipolysis and fat oxidation.

The Pyrucet have Pyruvate similar to Calcium Pyruvate? or totally different substances?

 

[qwyk]

Yes, and if there is glucose available, caffeine stimulates the oxidation of both. Black coffee or coffee without enough carbs can actually worsen insulin resistance for some people that are already insulin resistant with high stress hormones in the morning. So maybe combining it with aspirin or another compound that can lower excess cortisol in the morning can help offset that.
Peat talked about coffee being an adaptogen, so I won't say it's bad, but it should be used in the right context.

This answered a LOT of questions for me. Thank you for this information!

 

[Hans]

The Pyrucet have Pyruvate similar to Calcium Pyruvate? or totally different substances?

No it's ethyl pyruvate, which is much more potent than calcium pyruvate. I haven't looked too deeply into the difference yet though.

 

[Hans]

This answered a LOT of questions for me. Thank you for this information!

Sweet man, glad it was helpful.

 

[Hans]

Thank you!

Do you think pyrucet with niacinamide right after waking could help someone who tends towards hypoglycemia? If going that route, how long do you theorize it would take to have sustained improved E metabolism? Do you think someone would need to cycle this throughout the year or do you think its more a one time 6wk process?

Do you ever supplement Cu or do you rely on liver, oysters, etc?

It depends on why they have hypoglycemia. Is it chronic low blood sugar or is it reactive hypoglycemia?

 

[Peroxphos]

Excellent, new peater, I learned a lot of things. Thanks Hans

 

[Hans]

Excellent, new peater, I learned a lot of things. Thanks Hans

My pleasure man. Good luck on your Peating journey. :)

 

[tankasnowgod]

I see you mentioned taking pyrucet with "25g of Stearic Acid." That seems like quite a bit!

Just wanted to check if you had the amount right, and how you would take that 25g. Stearic Acid has a high melting point, would you just be eating a couple spoonfuls of the flakes?

 

[Hans]

I see you mentioned taking pyrucet with "25g of Stearic Acid." That seems like quite a bit!

Just wanted to check if you had the amount right, and how you would take that 25g. Stearic Acid has a high melting point, would you just be eating a couple spoonfuls of the flakes?

It was because in this human study they used 24g in a shake. However, if you eat stearic acid rich food, such as dairy fat, cocoa butter, beef fat, etc, then that amount can be less. One can always split it in 2 doses of 1tbsp twice daily.
And yes, the stearyl alcohol or at least the free stearic acid (not the triglyceride form) will be best, because then the body doesn't have to melt it and digest it. But if those forms are unobtainable, then using stearic acid in the triglyceride form on baking is the next best thing.

 

[yashi]

It was because in this human study they used 24g in a shake. However, if you eat stearic acid rich food, such as dairy fat, cocoa butter, beef fat, etc, then that amount can be less. One can always split it in 2 doses of 1tbsp twice daily.
And yes, the stearyl alcohol or at least the free stearic acid (not the triglyceride form) will be best, because then the body doesn't have to melt it and digest it. But if those forms are unobtainable, then using stearic acid in the triglyceride form on baking is the next best thing.

Would glycerol monostearate have the same effect or would there be negatives ?

 

[Hans]

Would glycerol monostearate have the same effect or would there be negatives ?

That should be fine as well.

 

[Drareg]

What about using defibron and meldonium?