The Dance of Mandance

mandance

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Hey all, so this will be my log of Peat eating, health and other things. My main goals:

Optimize thyroid function and metabolism

Raise my low testosterone

Get rid of the mysterious fatigue and brain fog (maybe from low T)

Overcome getting off anti depressants at the same time.


The support is most welcome and appreciated. I am going through a very hard fight with antidepressants and getting off of them after almost 15 years. I am 29 years old and also have low testosterone.

I have been eating more peat like for a few months but so far, have not experienced any gains from it that I can tell.



Captains Log 01: With no appetite, I was only able again, to consume milk, OJ and gelatin today. I took my first dose of prenenolone, 50mg to see what effects it might have in hopes of it helping me raise testosterone. I feel very tired from it, but somewhat calm. I cant tell what symtopms are from what anymore as the withdrawls from antidepressants have me mroe fatigued than before, a lot of anxiety, chest pain and heart palpitations, night terroris, weakness, tremors etc.

The preg seems to have had a calming effect though although very sleep, but that could also be due to the pot I smoked as well. This is Mandance singing off...no other activity to report at this time. Sleep will be hard once again.
 

charlie

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Mandance, preg definitely has a calming almost high like effect to it.
 

mandance

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Thanks guys, yes the preg almost put me to sleep. Last night all feels like a dream...it felt euphoric and I slept well. I didnt have any trouble getting to sleep at all. I do need to try and get more salt....ive been taking lithium tabs which is basically salt so hopefully that helps.
 

mandance

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Entry 2:

fully withdrawling from antidepressants after being on them 15 plus years. It is a complete hell ride but im trying to stay strong through it.

I have extreme dizzyness, fatigue...chronic chest pain that shoots down my arms like heart attack symtpoms...numbness in left arm sometimes...higher blood pressure...worse brain fog, no appetite still, extreme anxiety cant leave the house,....yet somehow mentally I feel pretty positive despite all these things through meditation and reading. At night its the worse...when I try to doze off, I get hit with an adrenaline rush that wakes me back up...this keeps happening until I pass out from exhaustion...all these things since stopping these meds....I hope it gets better soon...I cant take this for long but being mindful is really helping...either that or that 10 days or prozac really worked haha.

All I want to do is go do things and enjoy summer but I cant really do anything right now other than rest. Like before, with no appetite..I sip OJ and Milk all day with added gelatin to get by but its not nearly enough...ive bene dropping a lot of weight from all this. Also supplementing B-1, Vit D and lithium tabs etc. Coffee in the morning with added magnesium.

Going to heart doc tomorrow to make sure getting off these pills isnt actually killing my heart and causing health problems but im 95 percent sure its all just anxiety. My main worry is that, I will not recover from this and will have to be on those meds the rest of my life...since I was on them since childhood.

I did get off once before and did well...but 3 months after, i had crazy panic attacks, freaked and got back on. But I think im much better equppied now to deal with that. If I am feeling good, I can handle anxiety easier. This is complete hell though worse than all the injuries and broken bones ive had, worse than any sickness ive had....its like a battle for my body and mind. Anyhow...if you have positivety, send it my way...i dont have much support for this...family doesnt understand, neither does girlfriend.....even though they see me suffer...my only real support is my best friend so this forum is really a big help.

I am considering updating Peat himself again on this. But I know this can take months or more. Anyhow...just keeping things updated. I think I lost 3lbs last week from not eating. I made sure to eat more over the weekend although sadly...with no energy to shop or cook...I did consume more pufa foods over the weekend than I would have liked although I usually never feel any different when I do or dont.
 
J

j.

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mandance said:
I did consume more pufa foods over the weekend than I would have liked although I usually never feel any different when I do or dont.

I was typically the same way. I only feel a noticeable difference if a consistently avoid PUFA every day for 3 to 6 months. One day or two of avoiding or eating PUFAs doesn't make much of a difference, I don't think in anyone, because it's not enough to alter the composition of the adipose tissue (fat stores).
 

mandance

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Yeah, I only eat pufas generally maybe once or twice a week (1 or 2 meals) at most usually.
 

mandance

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Updates: Things are getting better getting off these pills....starting to sleep better, appetite and libido coming back. Gaining more energy etc...still a ways to go. I need to eat more...I have been dropping weight like crazy. I dropped like 5 lbs in the last 2 weeks.

Still mostly just consuming OJ, milk, coffee and gelatin and a carrot salad when I remember to make one.

My meditation practice has been very strong lately and its making a huge difference. I think I might go buy myself a new bicycle soon and start trying to get out more now that im starting to get back to health again.

Might start experimenting with cynoplus again soon. Im worried with my lack of eating, that I am screwing up my metabolism again.
 

mandance

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Updates: Things are getting much worse withdrawling from these drugs. I might be forced to reinstate them and got a liquid syringe form to taper more slowly. This is the most unimaginable suffering Ive ever experienced. Wondering though if I should tough it out. I emailed ray peat again. I hope he responds because there isn many answers in terms of these drugs.

I am losing weight like mad due to not eating, and I can no longer sleep due to new insane cortisol spikes at night time. I cant leave my house...I feel so out of wack and helpless. I fear now I may never be able to live a normal life again or be off these drugs. I shouldnt talk like that but I guess im hoping someone might chime in with something positive to say.

This cant be reality. lol
 

Carac

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Hi Mandance, I really don't have any advice for you, but I am so sorry to hear that you are not feeling well. Hang in there. It sounds like you are a survivor and are in search of finding something that will help you! I just encourage you to keep looking!
 

charlie

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When I quit taking xanax after taking them for 10 years or more I thought I was gonna die. It was incredibly hard. I thought I was going to go insane. The most intense panic attacks set it, I almost completely lost it while driving down the road. I knew I had to get off of them, and I knew there was no going back. I set my mind to get through it even if it was going to kill me because I was not going to be hooked up to their evil pills no more.

Lots of showers helped me through, hot baths. If I was to have to do it now, I would prolly do lots of sugar, I mean tons of sugar, ice cream, gelatin and tons of gelatin, lots of sunshine as much as my skin could stand, maybe see how aspirin does for me. When feeling really bad I would go outside and just walk around and get some fresh air, then back to the shower. Thats how I was when the worst of it was happening, to the shower, then bath, back outside, back to the bath. Whatever it took.

I hope the best for you.
 

mandance

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Damn, I had no idea Charlie...that sounds very similar to what I am dealing with now. I just want to die and feel no more hope for any type of life or recovery from this. Or that I will have to be on these pills the rest of my life. My concern is that, since I have been on them since childhood and now 29...I fear I may not be able to recover...and everyone over in the getting over antidepressants forums is telling me its insane that I didnt try tapering slowly off of them for years and that I should get back on my old dose and try to taper slower over awhile. Ive been drugged for about 20 years total.

How long did it take for you to overcome the withdrawal suffering of xanax?
 

charlie

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I read those forums, I saw people say it was insane to not taper down. So I tapered down for one week, I went down to Klonopin(sp?) which is a weaker form of xanax for another week, then quit.

I would say the worst of it was over in a month. But I still think I had "withdrawal" symptoms for up to or even more then a year but after that month was when the worst was over.

Till this day, I thank myself for not giving up and giving in. One of the best things I have done for myself and my family.

The body has an incredible healing capacity. And now that you are Peating your healing capacity will be going at its max. Especially if you are using thyroid along with a clean Peat diet.
 

mandance

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Im so glad you got off Charlie. That is great news indeed. And you are a very strong person for being able to have gone through that nightmare. I am torn because yeah...the antidepressant forum people seem to be clueless about ray peat...but most people are. I am trying to turn them onto him more. BTW...he just emailed me if anyones interested...i posted it in the email depository

Anyhow...Do you think I should just ride this out, given my history of being on for 20 years since basically 8 or 9 years old. Or should I follow the advice of tapering slowly and reinstating?

So many people over there say it takes years to get over getting off but then again...everyone is different and its hard to say. I am at a loss for which direction to go because if the withdrawel gets better, I can deal with it. But if its like this for months, I dont think I can because right now its just too extreme. I called my therapist, he will probably call me back...in a moment of desperation I left a message saying that I think I want to get back on the pills.

I guess maybe I should give it more time though? I just know there is a risk that...the longer off these pills, the harder it could be to stabalize back on them then you are really screwed.

What symptoms lasted for the year after the first month of hell for you? How are you now?
the symptoms i am dealing with

Chronic Chest pain (resolving)
arm tingling muscle twitchign everywhere (resolving)
bad anxiety
dizzyness
loss of balance
fog
bouts of extreme depression and hopelessness
bouts of euphoria and happiness
crying
fatigue and muscle weakness
the worst one of all - trying to fall asleep but waking up from adrenaline shocks and
waking up feeling extreme terror.

Anyways sorry for the long post, I am at a crossroads and trying to make a decision on which path to take here. I know I cant be on these pills any longer...but i cant handle this hell much longer either and its ruined my relationship with the woman...and family and friends.

I dont have much support either...luckily I work from home though. Will eat pint of haagen daaz tonight..and maybe try pregnenolone again. Might try cynoplus also. I help off on supps with all this chaos going on but now im thinking I should just do it. Although my nutritional input is terrible right now. Dropping tons of weight and no appetite.

Thanks guys!
 
J

j.

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What's wrong with tapering slowly while applying Ray Peat's advice? Maybe the rate of dose reduction should be determined by how you feel.
 

mandance

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Thats what im saying. Like maybe I should reinstate my previous dose...stabalize on it from these effects and follow peats advice while tapering more slowly. Or..just ride it out right now. But riding it out now is scary sicne there is no promise things will get better anytime soon.
 

mandance

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Ray Peat just wrote:

I knew someone who had been addicted to morphine and alcohol for 30 years, who was drinking quarts of beer and wine daily when he didn't have morphine, who had an opportunity for a good job if he could get sober. Starting progesterone at bedtime (and stopping the wine), he said it was the first time he didn't have a hangover in the morning. He used enough progesterone to neuter most people, but said it didn't affect his sex function; he was taking a lot of Cytomel and magnesium, but wasn't drunk again as long as I knew him, and his general health improved.
 

Peata

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Sorry you're going through this, Mandance. It takes a lot of time to get the effects of the drug out of one's system. I felt like crap for longer than I thought I would, but eventually it all went away. I know it's hard to take when you're in the midst of withdrawal agony. Even tapering very carefully, I went through bad times. The worst was when I got to the place of stopping it completely. (When I was referring to approx. how long it took for me to feel better, I was assuming we were talking about when I stopped the medicine completely. It takes time after doing that for the withdrawals to go away.)

Tapering with the liquid Paxil and syringes was so helpful because I could lower my dose by much smaller amounts than I ever could by just cutting the pills. And what I would do was lower the dose, then stay there as long as it took until I felt better before I'd think about lowering it anymore. Perhaps that was a part of my success the last couple times I tapered off - I didn't rush the withdrawal process, but stayed at a level until I "stabilized" before I lowered it again. I had a plan I came up with to lower it very gradually, as long as it took, until I was completely off of it. Then, when I went off it, that was a wilderness time as my body went through adjustment.

So this is a long-haul adventure you're on. Don't try to rush it. Just take it little by little.
 
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