The Anabolic Effects Of Pregnenolone

[Wagner83]

I'm pretty sure a few members have reported anti androgenic effects from supplementing too much progesterone (even Ray has commented on this), and if pregnenolone converts mostly into it I don't see the reason to use both, however I'm far from being an expert and some seem to experience positive effects from the right dose of progesterone.

 

[Anders86]

if it doesn't make you feel bad potatoes are fine they are very nutritious. Peat is a big fan of potatoes and are the only "starch" that he recommends. He has said (i believe, this may be incorrect but makes sense from what ive read from him) that well cooked potatoes are superior to bananas and the plaintain class. If a person doesn't have access to fresh fruits or even if they do potatoes are a safe and good food to eat to get glucose and other essential nutrients. Some people get really gassy and endotoxin symptoms from potatoes and for them it's probably good to watch it. I think if you workout potatoes are really a great food to eat, especially since you will require some extra protein which slighty increases vitamin B6 requirements (got that from Peat) and potatoes have a fair serving of b6.

Thanks, some great info :)
I`ll add the potatoes as an staple.

 

[Anders86]

@Anders86
You may need to get an opinion from someone more knowledgeable with diet, but I feel that everything in moderation is best. I have been bodybuilding a considerable number of years also and do not get the DOMS all that often. I don't really believe this is an indicator of growth anyway as the muscle does not need too much stimulus to generate hypertrophy. Muscle damage is happening though, as this is all a part of hypertrophy. Sometimes people get too caught up in the feeling of it and that is coming down to taxing the CNS more than anything.

Yeah I agree, everything in moderation. I`ll probably just add one potato to every meal and a couple more post-workout. I used to be lifting alot more aggressive, so much I used to take cold showers focusing on the back of my head to calm down CNS damage. That might have been broscience but it felt like it was working to some degree.Now I just enjoy my time in the gym, breathing deep and taking my time.

I also train alot of martial arts, but I`m having a break now after starting Peating. I`m quite concerned on the chronic head-trauma as we sparre alot and have a very high energy focused sessions.

 

[Iron Man]

I'm pretty sure a few members have reported anti androgenic effects from supplementing too much progesterone (even Ray has commented on this), and if pregnenolone converts mostly into it I don't see the reason to use both, however I'm far from being an expert and some seem to experience positive effects from the right dose of progesterone.

So is it better to use either one or the other? I would be really keen to know some suggested dosages to trial. I cannot seem to get Haidut to chime in. I am willing to experiment, but someone with a better idea on what sort of a stack to play with would be great.
On some other threads, I think I am getting the opinion of a low dose of DHEA (10-15mg?) and Pregnenolone (25-50mg) taken together is the best? I am trying to read between the lines...

Are there Ray Peat articles on this?

 

[Wagner83]

Have a look at those threads : Optimal Dose Of Pregnenolone For Androgen Synthesis
Raising Serum Androgens Using DHEA, Pregnenolone, And Vitamin K
There are plenty of other threads on those topics. You can use the search function of the forums (titles, posted by etc..) or you can use google : type "site:raypeatforum.com [insert key words] " .
DHEA can convert into estrogen pretty easily, yet a study haidut posted in a thread said ADG was significantly raised after 6 months of 200mg oral supplementation. It seems it's quite tricky to successfully supplement with it.

 

[Gl;itch.e]

On some other threads, I think I am getting the opinion of a low dose of DHEA (10-15mg?) and Pregnenolone (25-50mg) taken together is the best? I am trying to read between the lines...

Start low. Seriously. You don't need much DHEA to get a good effect and higher doses are more likely to convert to estrogen than testosterone or DHT. 2-3 mg is a great place to start. Probably don't need much more than 5mg a day max to really get all the benefits without the negatives.

 

[Iron Man]

@Wagner83 - Mucho Gracias ... Thanks for that!

@Gl;itch.e - Thanks also. I have heard that DHEA in very low doses are best.

 

[haidut]

Bump? Really interested in getting some thoughts and discussion on this. Thanks

I doubt pregnenolone will turn you into a Hulk. What it may do is improve impaired protein synthesis and optimize hormonal environment if you take in doses of 30mg - 50mg daily so that when you ingest a decent dose of protein it will stimulate muscle synthesis instead of turning mostly into ammonia. If you have not tried already, I would try topical pregnenolone and progesterone in a 1:1 ratio. Even as little as 10mg - 15mg daily should produce a noticeable effect on muscle size and hardening.
And adding glycine/taurine as other people mentioned in this thread should also help.
I have another supplement in the works for raising endogenous testosterone levels. It probably can;t match what a person will get from injecting T but I think the effects would be much healthier with the supplement as it has been shown that people with endogenously high T levels respond much better to exercise than people who raise T levels to the same mark by using injections. But for now the pregnenolonoe, progsterone, taurine, glycine, and even aspirin should help.

 

[PUTFOT]

I have another supplement in the works for raising endogenous testosterone levels.

Care to share?

 

[haidut]

Care to share?

Not until it is released. Sorry, can't discuss details on work in progress and waiting just a week more is not that much.

 

[Iron Man]

@haidut
[QUOTE="But for now the pregnenolonoe, progsterone, taurine, glycine, and even aspirin should help.[/QUOTE]
Your reply is much appreciated! Thanks.
I get that we all need to work things out for ourselves and I am trying to do this, but am floundering to be quite honest...
I was applying topical natural progesterone (teaspoon) and taking 50mg of pregnenolone each day. I was advised in this thread that this is too much? So, is it better to trail one day progesterone and one day pregnenolone? I was going to give DHEA (3-5mg only) a trial, but I think I may just stick with the pregnenolone.

I am already taking 3g of Taurine a day before bed. What sort of dosages of Glycine are commonly used? I am also looking to stack things together.

I definitely want to Hulk up before I get much older (early 40's now) and then just maintain right on through into the "twilight" years.

 

[PUTFOT]

Not until it is released. Sorry, can't discuss details on work in progress and waiting just a week more is not that much.

Is t>e conversion taken into consideration?

 

[Iron Man]

With Vitamin K, I go with the MK-7 type. I just noted that @haidut research quotes MK-4 or Vitamin K2? I was lead to believe MK-7 is the best?

 

[Agent207]

as it has been shown that people with endogenously high T levels respond much better to exercise than people who raise T levels to the same mark by using injections.

Probably because people with high endogenously high T levels have a good overall hormonal metabolism as well, and excersice outcome doesn't depend on just isolated T level.

As for the upcoming T-rising supplement, I hope it won't be at the expense of rising LH...

 

[haidut]

Probably because people with high endogenously high T levels have a good overall hormonal metabolism as well, and excersice outcome doesn't depend on just isolated T level.

As for the upcoming T-rising supplement, I hope it won't be at the expense of rising LH...

No, it does not affect LH/FSH levels at all. It is a combination of steroid precursors that I did not even suspect could raise testosterone levels but the studies are pretty solid and the results I got from human volunteers are amazing as well. To top it off, there are no known side effects or toxicities from those precursors. Well, within the suggested doses of course, anything can get abused by overzealous souls

 

[Iron Man]

Sorry... But I need to bump this thread as I need some help with getting a better understanding.
Thanks.

 

[Iron Man]

@haidut
[QUOTE="But for now the pregnenolonoe, progsterone, taurine, glycine, and even aspirin should help.

Your reply is much appreciated! Thanks.
I get that we all need to work things out for ourselves and I am trying to do this, but am floundering to be quite honest...
I was applying topical natural progesterone (teaspoon) and taking 50mg of pregnenolone each day. I was advised in this thread that this is too much? So, is it better to trail one day progesterone and one day pregnenolone? I was going to give DHEA (3-5mg only) a trial, but I think I may just stick with the pregnenolone.

I am already taking 3g of Taurine a day before bed. What sort of dosages of Glycine are commonly used? I am also looking to stack things together.

I definitely want to Hulk up before I get much older (early 40's now) and then just maintain right on through into the "twilight" years.[/QUOTE]

 

[Iron Man]

With Vitamin K, I go with the MK-7 type. I just noted that @haidut research quotes MK-4 or Vitamin K2? I was lead to believe MK-7 is the best?

 

[haidut]

With Vitamin K, I go with the MK-7 type. I just noted that @haidut research quotes MK-4 or Vitamin K2? I was lead to believe MK-7 is the best?

This has been discussed a few times before. Search the forum for "MK-7 MK-4". The MK-4 form is the actual type the organism uses directly in biochemical reactions.

 

[haidut]

Your reply is much appreciated! Thanks.
I get that we all need to work things out for ourselves and I am trying to do this, but am floundering to be quite honest...
I was applying topical natural progesterone (teaspoon) and taking 50mg of pregnenolone each day. I was advised in this thread that this is too much? So, is it better to trail one day progesterone and one day pregnenolone? I was going to give DHEA (3-5mg only) a trial, but I think I may just stick with the pregnenolone.

I am already taking 3g of Taurine a day before bed. What sort of dosages of Glycine are commonly used? I am also looking to stack things together.

I definitely want to Hulk up before I get much older (early 40's now) and then just maintain right on through into the "twilight" years.

[/QUOTE]

In my experience, pregnenolone and progesterone, progesterone and DHEA, or pregnenolone and DHEA work best as combinations. I don't know what dose would work best. The 3g taurine should be plenty and some people do well even on half that dose. Glycine was shown to restore the anabolic effects of protein (leucine) in older age at a dose of about 6g-7g daily. So, adding a spoon of gelatin to all of your protein meals should work too.