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The Anabolic Effects Of Pregnenolone

Discussion in 'Scientific Studies' started by haidut, Jan 2, 2017.

  1. haidut

    haidut Member

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    I posted a few studies showing pregnenolone has anti-cortisol and anti-estrogen effects, which make it anti-catabolic by definition. However, older studies referred to pregnenolone as an anabolic steroid and some of them examined its anabolic effects. While pregnenolone was not as potent as testosterone, it still displayed clear anabolic effects as measured by blood protein concentration, brain trophic effects, and (in older studies) abolishing the nitrogen loss of catabolic states. So, it appears that focusing solely on muscle growth promoting properties of steroids is not an adequate indication of their anabolism. The combination of anti-catabolic effects and promotion of protein synthesis (anywhere in the body) is a much more reliable measure of true anabolism, and pregnenolone (just as the well known AAS) satisfies those criteria quite well.

    Non-linear effects in the retention of an avoidance task induced by anabolic steroids. - PubMed - NCBI
    "...In the first experiment in that study a range of doses of two anabolic steroids, pregnenolone sulfate and ethylestrenol, were given s.c. just after the footshock training trial. In experiment 2 a similar range of doses of both steroids was given to the rats 1 h before the first retention test.

    The effect of certain steroids on the serum protein concentrations of the lizard, Uromastix hardwickii Gray
    "...The anabolic potency of a steroid could be assayed by measuring urinary nitrogen retention (Henderson and Weinberg, 1951; Potts ‘et al., 1960; Stucki et al., 1962; Arnold et al., 1963), myotrophic activity (Eisenberg et al., 1949; Kochakian and Tillotson, 1956; Dorfman and Dorfman, 1963; Kincl and Dorfman, 1964), renotrophic effect (Kochakian, 1947; Dorfman and Shipley, 1956)) erythropoiesis (Nathan and Frank, 1965), and other miscellaneous effects such as calcium and phosphorus metabolism and increase in body growth (Kochakian. 1947). Little work has been done in regard to the effect of the anabolic steroids on the serum protein concentrations, and no such information is available."

    "...However, Nimni and Geiger (1957) concluded that the hormone-induced growth of the levator ani muscle is not an appropriate index for determining the anabolic effects of steroid compounds. Levator ani muscle responds to both androgenic and anabolic components of the steroid (Edgren, 1963)."

    "...The blood chemistry analysis of Hantschman and Mertens (unpublished data quoted by H. Nowakowski, 1961) showed that the treatment of myopathies patients with 19-nortestosterone decanoate for 5- 6 months resulted in a significant increase in calcium and total protein content of the serum, but the changes in different protein fractions were not found to be statistically significant. In the present study, the increase in the total protein content of the serum is taken as an index of anabolic potency of the steroid."

    "...The steroids showed no parallelism in their specific activity in bringing about the changes in serum protein concentrations. Most of the steroids brought about an increase in the total protein content of the serum (Tables 1 & 2)... The same increase in albumin and a globulin was obtained with methyl testosterone, adrenosterone, androstane-3,17-dione, and pregnenolone, while a corresponding decrease was noticed in y globulin. The 5- androstene-3-&?, 17-$3-diol, and 4-androstene-3,17-dione did not bring about any effect on the serum protein fractions.
     
  2. Insaneacinamide

    Insaneacinamide Member

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    Haidut, any other substances/products you recommend taking pregnenolone with?

    Would vit a 20k iu/d3 10k iu/k2 15mg/500mg calcium/250mg magnesium/50mg preg be safe to take together most days of the week?
     
  3. tca300

    tca300 Member

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    Awesome! Thanks!
     
  4. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I would take it with niacinamide and/or methylene blue as they raise the NAD/NADH ratio. Most steroidogenic enzymes need NAD or NADH as a cofactor and some use both. With aging, the reductive side of the enzymes starts to dominate due to more NADH and less NAD (i.e. lower NAD/NADH ratio) and this results in weaker or less beneficial steroids being synthesized. With more NAD available, you tend to stay on the youthful side of hormonal balance and it allows pregnenolone to properly metabolize downstream as needed.
     
  5. gp3690

    gp3690 Member

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    What is a safe amount of pregnenolone per day for a 27 yo male?
     
  6. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I would test blood levels first, but the few studies with younger people with depression found good effects from 30mg daily and that is a physiological dose.
     
  7. Iron Man

    Iron Man Member

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    @haidut
    Any further updates on this? Long time bodybuilder here and am looking for an "edge" to push me past some boundaries. I have been on 50mg Pregnenolone and natural progesterone cream for about 2 months. I plan to get some blood tests this coming week to see where things are at.
    Steroids are tempting, but I am not sure the risk is worth it. I would rather cautiously play with hormones a bit. Jerry Brainum wrote a book titled Natural Anabolics. Has anyone read this?
    I would welcome thoughts and options from other dedicated bodybuilders. Thanks
     
  8. extremecheddar

    extremecheddar Member

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    I'm very interested in this also.
     
  9. Iron Man

    Iron Man Member

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    Bump? Really interested in getting some thoughts and discussion on this. Thanks
     
  10. Gl;itch.e

    Gl;itch.e Member

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    First off let me give you a few "non hormonal" things I have used to great success that you may or may not have tried.

    Leucine. Or BCAAs. At least 5g of leucine (or BCAA containing this amount) with every meal/snack. I gained 2kgs in 2 weeks doing this alone the first time I tried. I also noticed a small amount of fat loss too.

    Mid-night feedings. How desperate are you to gain muscle, because this one sucks!?! Again I managed to increase my weight by roughly 2kgs in 2 weeks by adding a shake containing 30g protein. I never got up specifically to drink them but if I woke up at night to piss (usually did) then I would have a shake. I now take more casein protein and ditched whey so this probably wouldn't be needed. Switch to casein for your shakes if you need shakes.

    Methylene blue/Thyroid. I found it much easier to gain muscle and strength when I added Methylene Blue and later Thyroid in to my supplement regimen. Perhaps it helped some metabolic problem I was experiencing. But either way its worth a shot if you aren't already using them.

    Caffeine (pre-workout) and during the day. More important for fat-loss, but you can push much harder at the gym and this can help with muscle growth. Did my best with 200mg pill in morning, 2-3 coffees and 200mg pre workout.


    If you do want to "dabble" with a small amount of a relatively safe hormone then try DHEA or maybe Pregnenolone first

    DHEA. 2.5-5mg a day seemed to give me a boost in strength. I am 34 so maybe less important if you are much younger. Adding 11 keto, Androsterone didn't have as much effect as the small amount of DHEA.
     
  11. Iron Man

    Iron Man Member

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    @Gl;itch.e
    Thanks.
    I am probably considered an advanced bodybuilder. I wonder if the gains you were talking about were more beginner/intermediate gains?
    I am in my early 40's now and feel that I am at the cross-roads of needing something "extra" to get me over the hurdle. Time is not really on my side now and I am really interested in pushing the limits just to see what I can achieve.
    I had tried Leucine previously and didn't think it did much, but maybe the dosages I took were too low?
    I tried DHEA for a period and suspect it was converting to Estrogen in my case. I am on Pregnenolone (50mg per day) and a teaspoon (daily) of natural Progesterone cream currently.
    I was taking natural desiccated thyroid, but suspect that I need to get back on this and take higher doses for a longer period.
    It would be great to get some more discussion happening on the hormonal anabolics available.
     
  12. Iron Man

    Iron Man Member

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    @haidut
    Is there like an ultimate stack or something?
     
  13. Gl;itch.e

    Gl;itch.e Member

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    The problem is that pushing the body beyond what you have already achieved over your years of training is not likely to be healthy at this point. If more gains cant be achieved via healthy eating and training, then your only real options beyond a few safe things like I mentioned are unfortunately going to be much like most pro bodybuilders are already doing. Maybe someone could tell you how to do that in the best way possible to mitigate some of the negative effects.
     
  14. Iron Man

    Iron Man Member

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    I hear you... I am a big fan of the classic era of Bodybuilding with the likes of Schwarzenegger, Zane, Scott etc. We all know these dudes were on stuff. There is a guy by the name of Calum Von Moger (who they call Arnold 2.0) is even coming out and admitting to using certain substances.
    It would be great to see if it is possible to create a stack from Peat friendly hormones and supplements. Just something to help give an edge.
     
  15. Gl;itch.e

    Gl;itch.e Member

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    I'm sure you've been in the game long enough to know that "where ever there is doubt, there is no doubt". Pretty much everyone is "on" something. All the youtube, instagram, facebook "celebrities". Those who can naturally get much above 220-240lb and be very lean are a very, very rare animal.
     
  16. Anders86

    Anders86 Member

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  17. Gl;itch.e

    Gl;itch.e Member

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  18. Iron Man

    Iron Man Member

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    Yeah, I have been in the game a while... Ha, ha...
    I am around the 213lb mark, but need to lose some body fat. I think to get a healthy lean for me, I would be around 205 - 208lb. I am currently aiming for this and on track.
    I agree with your comments about the fake naturals... I have great doubts about being natural and over the 220lbs, unless you have superhuman genetics.
    Is @haidut able to chime in? Or how about @TubZy ??
    I am taking the 50mg of pregnenolone a day, along with the natural progesterone cream. Not sure what this is doing yet and my pending lab tests will let me know. I have noticed a drop in libido, so am not sure what is happening here. Prior to getting on these two, I had very low testosterone and believe that I had estrogen dominance. My libido was out of control though. Weird...
     
  19. Gl;itch.e

    Gl;itch.e Member

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    Not weird at all. High estrogen is often seen in people with "high" sex drives. Sex Addicts and Borderline Personality Disorders etc.
     
  20. DaveFoster

    DaveFoster Member

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    The risks are not worth it in any sense whatsoever, and you'll probably end up being on them for life.
     
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