Temp Pulse-- what up with mine?

Katty

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
396
I get really hot and sweaty right after breakfast. I thought it was because I'm stressed getting ready for work, commuting, etc. But I'm not so sure.
Took temp before bed- it was 98.6. Woke up, still 98.6 (can't ever find pulse in the morning). I was surprised my temp was still 98.6 because I woke up an hour or two prior, feeling very hungry, but not enough to get out of bed.
After breakfast, temp went up to 99.6 and pulse was about 110 or maybe a bit more. This seems excessive to me. As I eat more food, the pulse comes down to about 90-92- gets to this by late morning and stays there the rest of the day.

Is this adrenaline? I thought my temp and pulse would drop after breakfast if adrenaline was the issue. Perhaps cortisol?
I take my T4 at night before bed, then take my first dose of T3 either right before breakfast or right after. I suppose I should take the T3 after breakfast-- maybe it won't pump me up so much.

But anyone else experience this? Wondering if the thyroid meds are too high. Or if I just need to eat more in the mornings? Thoughts?
 

marcar72

Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2013
Messages
659
Location
Tucson, AZ
I'm pretty sure your situation implies optimal metabolism. Might be a little too much thyroid though. :2cents
 
OP
K

Katty

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
396
I'd love if that were true, but then why do I have so many negative symptoms? I can't tell if it's because the thyroid meds are working but pushing me hard (adrenaline,etc), so I need to eat more calorie/minerals/vitamins to combat these problems... or if my body just doesn't like the meds. I'll list my symptoms below, maybe that will give some idea. (For background info, I switched from NDT to synthetics 14 weeks ago- 8 weeks on about 50mcg of T4 and 10-12mcg of T3... 6 weeks ago I switched to 75mcg of T4 and 10mcg of T3)

1) Mood is worse (need more magnesium and/or food in general... OR just bad rxn to synthetic?)
2) menstrual cramps were worse this cycle (meds make me need more magnesium OR synthetics aren't working?)
3) fibrocystic breasts are back- they had been gone for a while
4) Hair loss worse on synthetics
5) Hands/feet/nose getting cold at bedtime- hadn't had this symptom in a long while.
6) More pains in liver/intestines/ovaries
7) Had more digestive issues on synthetics (not enough food? need more minerals? or synthetics not working?)
8) Body odor on synthetics (is this adrenaline pushing me.. or body doesn't like synthetics?)

Also, If my metabolism is good, shouldn't I be energetic and losing weight?
My energy might be a bit better on synthetics... but I'm wondering if it's because my adrenaline is always going, making it seem like good energy.
 

HDD

Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2012
Messages
2,075
Broda Barnes recommends waking temperature is 97.9-98.2 (IIRC). Maybe your dosage is too high and causing nutritional deficiencies?

Are you using Progest-e?
 
OP
K

Katty

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
396
Yes, that could be. I'm thinking of lowering the dose. I'm going to the Dr in the next 2 weeks to get more labs done (not that I want to rely solely on labs, but Dr won't renew my meds if I don't get them). So maybe the labs will give me some insight.
The temps I'm taking are oral, and I think Broda Barnes recommended underarm... so it's possible my waking temps aren't really quite as high as they seem (though still pretty high ;) )

I'm not taking progest-e. I took it for about 9 months or so (I think about 2 years ago)- didn't really notice it doing anything positive, but caused several unpleasant side effects. Worried about trying it again.
 

Blossom

Moderator
Forum Supporter
Joined
Nov 23, 2013
Messages
11,031
Location
Indiana USA
Oral temperatures usually read .5 degrees higher than under arm temps. This is just a general guideline though and I'm sure it can vary from person to person.
 

Blossom

Moderator
Forum Supporter
Joined
Nov 23, 2013
Messages
11,031
Location
Indiana USA
I definitely had a lot of energy when I was running on stress hormones and lost a lot of weight! I wonder sometimes if rather than losing weight we stabilize at a weight that is healthy for us (maybe more, maybe less?) and an energy level that is appropriate for our unique situation as we heal. Those are just my personal thoughts of course. I hope you get to feeling better.
 
OP
K

Katty

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
396
Blossom said:
I definitely had a lot of energy when I was running on stress hormones and lost a lot of weight! I wonder sometimes if rather than losing weight we stabilize at a weight that is healthy for us (maybe more, maybe less?) and an energy level that is appropriate for our unique situation as we heal. Those are just my personal thoughts of course. I hope you get to feeling better.
Thanks for those thoughts, Blossom! My weight just won't stabilize. I've gained 45 pounds since starting Ray Peat eating about 3 years ago... which was almost half my body weight at the time. Maybe my body needs a lot of extra fat to heal right now. It's just so annoying. And since I'm not stabilizing, I'm concerned that there is something else going on with me. Hard to know how to tweak things or maintain things when my body keeps changing. If it would stay put for a while, at least I could go a couple months without buying a new pair of pants :roll: :D
 

Blossom

Moderator
Forum Supporter
Joined
Nov 23, 2013
Messages
11,031
Location
Indiana USA
Katty said:
Blossom said:
I definitely had a lot of energy when I was running on stress hormones and lost a lot of weight! I wonder sometimes if rather than losing weight we stabilize at a weight that is healthy for us (maybe more, maybe less?) and an energy level that is appropriate for our unique situation as we heal. Those are just my personal thoughts of course. I hope you get to feeling better.
Thanks for those thoughts, Blossom! My weight just won't stabilize. I've gained 45 pounds since starting Ray Peat eating about 3 years ago... which was almost half my body weight at the time. Maybe my body needs a lot of extra fat to heal right now. It's just so annoying. And since I'm not stabilizing, I'm concerned that there is something else going on with me. Hard to know how to tweak things or maintain things when my body keeps changing. If it would stay put for a while, at least I could go a couple months without buying a new pair of pants :roll: :D
I know how you feel. It's can be hard to adjust to a higher weight than we are used to in a culture that equates thinness with health. I think to a certain degree we have been misled. What I do know for certain for myself anyway is that I must put my health over a number on the scale or clothing size. In the 90 pound range I'm sure neither one of us was at a healthy weight for an adult female regardless of height. I would have never discovered Peat had I not been desperately searching for help because my health was so poor. It would be great to hear the experience of women who have been at this over 4 years and started underweight like us. I'm just trying to ignore all the media images and keep the focus on health. Maybe we should start a thread called " getting healthy curves with Dr.Peat!" I'm half joking. Hang in there, eventually our bodies will be convinced that the famine is over.
 
OP
K

Katty

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
396
Blossom said:
Katty said:
Blossom said:
I definitely had a lot of energy when I was running on stress hormones and lost a lot of weight! I wonder sometimes if rather than losing weight we stabilize at a weight that is healthy for us (maybe more, maybe less?) and an energy level that is appropriate for our unique situation as we heal. Those are just my personal thoughts of course. I hope you get to feeling better.
Thanks for those thoughts, Blossom! My weight just won't stabilize. I've gained 45 pounds since starting Ray Peat eating about 3 years ago... which was almost half my body weight at the time. Maybe my body needs a lot of extra fat to heal right now. It's just so annoying. And since I'm not stabilizing, I'm concerned that there is something else going on with me. Hard to know how to tweak things or maintain things when my body keeps changing. If it would stay put for a while, at least I could go a couple months without buying a new pair of pants :roll: :D
I know how you feel. It's can be hard to adjust to a higher weight than we are used to in a culture that equates thinness with health. I think to a certain degree we have been misled. What I do know for certain for myself anyway is that I must put my health over a number on the scale or clothing size. In the 90 pound range I'm sure neither one of us was at a healthy weight for an adult female regardless of height. I would have never discovered Peat had I not been desperately searching for help because my health was so poor. It would be great to hear the experience of women who have been at this over 4 years and started underweight like us. I'm just trying to ignore all the media images and keep the focus on health. Maybe we should start a thread called " getting healthy curves with Dr.Peat!" I'm half joking. Hang in there, eventually our bodies will be convinced that the famine is over.
Thanks for the support and solidarity! Yes, I try to ignore the weight thing, I'm just having a hard time finding clothes that fit or that I feel confident in. I'd be happy to have curves, but most of my curves are all in my low belly... and a tad on the back of my arms now. Not where I was hoping :mrgreen:
 

Blossom

Moderator
Forum Supporter
Joined
Nov 23, 2013
Messages
11,031
Location
Indiana USA
This is not completely Peat but I thought I'd mention it since it is not contradictory to Peat's work and has been discussed on the forum before. Tara mentioned a site called youreatopia a few months ago and although it is geared toward people healing from restrictive eating disorders I think there is some good information for what to expect when recovering from being underweight no matter the cause. When we have been undernourished/underweight or how ever you label it and for whatever reason it seems normal sometimes (according to youreatopia and based on the Minnesota starvation experiment) to overshoot ones optimal weight set point temporarily as part of the healing process. It seems that many gain in places they consider less than desirable and eventually they do taper down (for lack of a better description) to a shape more like they had prior to the starvation situation. I would imagine that if your normal shape prior to becoming underweight didn't include fat stores were you currently have them and find them bothersome you will probably return to that. Maybe tara has some better insight into this and you could always read the information on youreatopia.
I know what you mean about finding clothes. I'm petite so clothes were already hard to find but now it seems a bit more challenging. It's all worth it to have my health back though. Hang in there Katty!
 
OP
K

Katty

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
396
Blossom said:
This is not completely Peat but I thought I'd mention it since it is not contradictory to Peat's work and has been discussed on the forum before. Tara mentioned a site called youreatopia a few months ago and although it is geared toward people healing from restrictive eating disorders I think there is some good information for what to expect when recovering from being underweight no matter the cause. When we have been undernourished/underweight or how ever you label it and for whatever reason it seems normal sometimes (according to youreatopia and based on the Minnesota starvation experiment) to overshoot ones optimal weight set point temporarily as part of the healing process. It seems that many gain in places they consider less than desirable and eventually they do taper down (for lack of a better description) to a shape more like they had prior to the starvation situation. I would imagine that if your normal shape prior to becoming underweight didn't include fat stores were you currently have them and find them bothersome you will probably return to that. Maybe tara has some better insight into this and you could always read the information on youreatopia.
I know what you mean about finding clothes. I'm petite so clothes were already hard to find but now it seems a bit more challenging. It's all worth it to have my health back though. Hang in there Katty!
Thanks Blossom. Yes, I'm definitely familiar with youreatopia and the Minnesota Starvation experiment. I'm not going to stop the course in order to try and lose weight... just sometimes feel a bit frustrated =)
I know the youreatopia site recommends women eating 2500 calories a day. I never get that high, so maybe I'll never really heal, or it will just take that much longer. I was doing 2300 or so for a while. I wish there was a more precise formula as to when someone is supposed to stabilize.
 

Blossom

Moderator
Forum Supporter
Joined
Nov 23, 2013
Messages
11,031
Location
Indiana USA
Yeah, it would be really awesome to hear Peat's thoughts on the topic or even hear from others who have been following a Peat approach long-term and came from an underweight situation. I suppose we can't always control precisely how the healing process unfolds.
 

HDD

Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2012
Messages
2,075
Katty said:
I'd love if that were true, but then why do I have so many negative symptoms? I can't tell if it's because the thyroid meds are working but pushing me hard (adrenaline,etc), so I need to eat more calorie/minerals/vitamins to combat these problems... or if my body just doesn't like the meds. I'll list my symptoms below, maybe that will give some idea. (For background info, I switched from NDT to synthetics 14 weeks ago- 8 weeks on about 50mcg of T4 and 10-12mcg of T3... 6 weeks ago I switched to 75mcg of T4 and 10mcg of T3)

1) Mood is worse (need more magnesium and/or food in general... OR just bad rxn to synthetic?)
2) menstrual cramps were worse this cycle (meds make me need more magnesium OR synthetics aren't working?)
3) fibrocystic breasts are back- they had been gone for a while
4) Hair loss worse on synthetics
5) Hands/feet/nose getting cold at bedtime- hadn't had this symptom in a long while.
6) More pains in liver/intestines/ovaries
7) Had more digestive issues on synthetics (not enough food? need more minerals? or synthetics not working?)
8) Body odor on synthetics (is this adrenaline pushing me.. or body doesn't like synthetics?)

Also, If my metabolism is good, shouldn't I be energetic and losing weight?
My energy might be a bit better on synthetics... but I'm wondering if it's because my adrenaline is always going, making it seem like good energy.

Maybe too much t4? Your ratio of t4 to t3 looks too high.

" An excess of thyroxine, in a tissue that doesn't convert it rapidly to T3, has an antithyroid action. (See Goumaz, et al, 1987.) This happens in many women who are given thyroxine; as their dose is increased, their symptoms get worse."

"An effective way to use supplements is to take a combination T4-T3 dose, e.g., 40 mcg of T4 and 10 mcg of T3 once a day, and to use a few mcg of T3 at other times in the day. Keeping a 14-day chart of pulse rate and temperature allows you to see whether the dose is producing the desired response. If the figures aren't increasing at all after a few days, the dose can be increased, until a gradual daily increment can be seen, moving toward the goal at the rate of about 1/14 per day"



http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/thyroid.shtml
 
OP
K

Katty

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
396
Haagendazendiane said:
Maybe too much t4? Your ratio of t4 to t3 looks too high.

" An excess of thyroxine, in a tissue that doesn't convert it rapidly to T3, has an antithyroid action. (See Goumaz, et al, 1987.) This happens in many women who are given thyroxine; as their dose is increased, their symptoms get worse."

"An effective way to use supplements is to take a combination T4-T3 dose, e.g., 40 mcg of T4 and 10 mcg of T3 once a day, and to use a few mcg of T3 at other times in the day. Keeping a 14-day chart of pulse rate and temperature allows you to see whether the dose is producing the desired response. If the figures aren't increasing at all after a few days, the dose can be increased, until a gradual daily increment can be seen, moving toward the goal at the rate of about 1/14 per day"



http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/thyroid.shtml

Yes, I've considered that my ratio was off. I was closer to a 4:1 ratio when I first switched to synthetics. But after that dose for 8 weeks, I didn't necessarily feel great. My TSH jumped up a bit (though still below 2, and people say TSH can vary a bit on blood tests day to day). Also, if I wasn't converting anything to T3, wouldn't I be cold all the time, instead of just hands/feet/nose at night?
My Dr wanted me to try this new dose, probably because my T4 was still low and out of range, but T3 was low-in-range.
I'm getting blood work done again soon, so I'll talk to my Dr about the ratio then. Of course, I don't imagine he'll care what Peat's ideal ratio is, so I'll have to see what I can do.
Thanks for taking the time to post that info!
 

HDD

Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2012
Messages
2,075
I am looking to increase either cynoplus or add cynomel, so I was rereading his articles. I read that and thought of your symptoms getting worse. Did you feel better/have less symptoms on lower ratio? Peat says 4:1 or even 3:1.

Are taking cynoplus? What about aspirin or vitamin E to lower estrogen? Vitamin A? I apologize if you have already answered this in another post. When my metabolism was increasing, I had to supplement A because of skin issues.
 
OP
K

Katty

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
396
Haagendazendiane said:
I am looking to increase either cynoplus or add cynomel, so I was rereading his articles. I read that and thought of your symptoms getting worse. Did you feel better/have less symptoms on lower ratio? Peat says 4:1 or even 3:1.

Are taking cynoplus? What about aspirin or vitamin E to lower estrogen? Vitamin A? I apologize if you have already answered this in another post. When my metabolism was increasing, I had to supplement A because of skin issues.
I'm not taking cynoplus. I'm taking synthroid and cytomel. I do take vitamin e daily. I was taking nutrisorb A over the summer, but I think I overdid it. So I've stopped the A for a while and I'm focusing on zinc for a bit.

It's hard to say if the symptoms were better on the lower ratio. I'm really hot on this dose, so perhaps I'm converting a lot of the T4. I keep suspecting that the symptoms I'm having are from the meds pushing me too hard. So maybe I need to eat more and get more minerals, etc. but hard to say.

I also tried cynomel for a bit but I really pushed me too hard and made me so achy.
 

Gabriela

New Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2015
Messages
1
Hi there :)

I was just wondering, Katty, if you ever figured your situation out?
 
OP
K

Katty

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
396
Hi @Gabriela,

Sorry I missed your post before- just saw it now. I'm off thyroid meds now. The symptoms of high body temperature and sweating have gone down a lot. I think the meds were pushing my stress hormones. My pulse also came down for a while, but now it's elevated again. Higher than it has ever been regularly. Which sucks. I still suspect that I just need more nutrients, but maybe something else is going on.

Sorry I'm not much help here. How are things going for you?
 

Similar threads

Back
Top Bottom