Taurine Dramatically Improves Protein Utilization From Food

Elephanto

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Anyone read denise minger's new blog post? She mentioned that protein decreases vitamin A ...

Then just take 10k iu every day, or eat liver. Considering that high protein intake is probably necessary for optimal health, this kind of argument has no weight.
 

m_arch

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Then just take 10k iu every day, or eat liver. Considering that high protein intake is probably necessary for optimal health, this kind of argument has no weight.
I agree, I just had no idea that protein interacts with vitamin A!
I think my vitamin A needs are already sky high, maybe I should be eating liver every day. I'm not a fan of supplements when you can get it in food
 

DaveFoster

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@haidut Do you think taking taurine with protein (say milk) would interfere with its absorption (and blood-pressure lowering, liver enzyme lowering effects?)
 
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taurine should actually increase efficacy of proteins. Milk and some taurine is an awesome combo with the taurine preventing any kind of protein waste. I find before bed, adding taurine reduces the total amount of protein needed which is nice since I don't want protein heavy food that close to sleep.
 
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haidut

haidut

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@haidut Do you think taking taurine with protein (say milk) would interfere with its absorption (and blood-pressure lowering, liver enzyme lowering effects?)

As user jb mentioned, I would expect taurine to help with protein utilization from milk. Also, some people complain of getting symptoms of calcium overload when ingesting 2 quarts of milk and a few people said their blood calcium shot up on tests they did after a few months on a milk-heavy diet. Taurine protects against hypercalcemia and balances all electrolytes, so if the person is magnesium deficient taurine can protect from calcium overload and excitotoxicity.
 

DaveFoster

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As user jb mentioned, I would expect taurine to help with protein utilization from milk. Also, some people complain of getting symptoms of calcium overload when ingesting 2 quarts of milk and a few people said their blood calcium shot up on tests they did after a few months on a milk-heavy diet. Taurine protects against hypercalcemia and balances all electrolytes, so if the person is magnesium deficient taurine can protect from calcium overload and excitotoxicity.

and @jb116

Powerful stuff; thanks for the info.
 

InChristAlone

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I don't think it means people taking taurine should eat more protein. Where did you see that implied in the study? I think the study simply shows that eating high protein diet leads to protein waste since most people cannot really utilize more than 1g/kg daily without adding some sort of anabolic steroid. Taurine increases that utilization somehow, so you produce less waste even on high protein diet.
I don't know whether high protein diet would be bad, or whether taurine would lower mTOR.
Do you still believe people can't utilize more than 1g/kg protein a day? Is it per day because for me that would only be 48g protein.
 
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haidut

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Do you still believe people can't utilize more than 1g/kg protein a day? Is it per day because for me that would only be 48g protein.

If that is your total weight, then yes, 48g would be about right. Protein utilization decreases with age and ti is usually due to declining thyroid, anabolic steroid synthesis, increased cortisol/estrogen, and accompanying insulin resistance. You can try more if it makes you feel better but for most people optimal protein intake is indeed about 1k/kg and each portion should probably not exceed 25g as more than that was shown NOT to stimulate muscle synthesis (which means it is oxidized as fuel and generates ammonia).
Btw, there is some evidence that adding glycine to the protein restores its anabolic action so taurine and glycine in tandem can be very good as anabolism boosters.
Glycine restores the anabolic response to leucine in a mouse model of acute inflammation. - PubMed - NCBI

Human equivalent dose for glycien in that study was about 70mg/kg daily.
 

InChristAlone

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If that is your total weight, then yes, 48g would be about right. Protein utilization decreases with age and ti is usually due to declining thyroid, anabolic steroid synthesis, increased cortisol/estrogen, and accompanying insulin resistance. You can try more if it makes you feel better but for most people optimal protein intake is indeed about 1k/kg and each portion should probably not exceed 25g as more than that was shown NOT to stimulate muscle synthesis (which means it is oxidized as fuel and generates ammonia).
Btw, there is some evidence that adding glycine to the protein restores its anabolic action so taurine and glycine in tandem can be very good as anabolism boosters.
Glycine restores the anabolic response to leucine in a mouse model of acute inflammation. - PubMed - NCBI

Human equivalent dose for glycien in that study was about 70mg/kg daily.
Thanks :) I'm having people tell me in a Peat group that 80g would be absolute minimum no matter how big you are, and that 1g/lb is better. That would be over 100 g of protein for me and I'm nowhere near that in appetite right now. They said that eating enough carbs with it decreases ammonia.
 
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haidut

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Thanks :) I'm having people tell me in a Peat group that 80g would be absolute minimum no matter how big you are, and that 1g/lb is better. That would be over 100 g of protein for me and I'm nowhere near that in appetite right now. They said that eating enough carbs with it decreases ammonia.

Exact protein requirements vary and depend on many things, including physical activity. The only way to know for sure is to have a metabolic study done in a lab that measured biomarkers for muscle synthesis after protein bolus. Since that is very expensive and usually not done unless it is part of a study, the second best surrogate is to take a pinch of Ceylon cinnamon, which lower ammonia. If you feel strong relief, sense of calm, and improved mood then it means ammonia levels are higher than they should be, which suggests protein intake (at whatever level it is) may be too much for that state. If you don't feel any effects then eating more protein is probably fine but ultimately the goal is to eat enough protein to stay in positive nitrogen balance but not more.
 

paymanz

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Interesting,so haidut opinion is a bit different than ray.ray recommends a bit more protein I think.

I also think similar to haidut,from personal experience.

Maybe peat really is in a high/good metabolism state that needs that much protein.

But its not only muscles that need proteins,connective tissues need a lot too, that is why glycine is so good at maitaining muscle mass.

However,ray mentioned in an interview that by increasing carb intake you can spare proteins and hence need very lower protein intake.

Its very important to not use proteins as energy source.
 

Stevie

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Thank you Haidut for this information. In the early 1970's many babies born with protein digestion problems were wrongly diagnosed with phenylketonuria. Me being one, I was fed a soy protein formula for two years before the doctors ruled out pku, though protein was still a problem for me and still is. I recently read somewhere that a protein deficiency can cause panic/anxiety problems, and I cannot remember a time, even as a child, when I didn't have these.
 
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haidut

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Thank you Haidut for this information. In the early 1970's many babies born with protein digestion problems were wrongly diagnosed with phenylketonuria. Me being one, I was fed a soy protein formula for two years before the doctors ruled out pku, though protein was still a problem for me and still is. I recently read somewhere that a protein deficiency can cause panic/anxiety problems, and I cannot remember a time, even as a child, when I didn't have these.

Sorry to hear that. Very few people have true PKU and since the establishment learned the hard way that mistakes in diagnosis are costly ( many lawsuits were filed due to fake PKU) now they push the genetic metabolic screen at birth to rule out PKU for good...and of course collect all of your genetic data for quite nefarious purposes.
 
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haidut

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I bought some taurine, then came across this

TREATING ANXIETY SAFELY & EFFECTIVELY - Mental Health

'TAURINE is also a GABA RECEPTOR AGONIST so I would steer well clear of it.'

Is seems I shall heal one problem at the expense of another:-/

Why would you stay away from it? GABA agonists are usually good for alleviating anxiety. The benzodiazepine drugs like valium used for anxiety are (partial) GABA agonists.
 

Wagner83

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Why would you stay away from it? GABA agonists are usually good for alleviating anxiety. The benzodiazepine drugs like valium used for anxiety are (partial) GABA agonists.

She is probably referring to what the guy on the other forum said:
DEFINITELY TO BE AVOIDED:

1) GABA RECEPTOR AGONISTS:

I STRONGLY advise that you AVOID any and all things where the mechanism of action is that of GABA RECEPTOR AGONISM; which induce down-regulation of the GABA receptors leading to TOLERANCE as well as REBOUND AND WITHDRAWAL upon their cessation of prolonged use.

IMPORTANT NOTE: Please kindly note that I am NOT stating that GABA RECEPTOR AGONISTS have no valuable medicinal use, nor am I suggesting that they should NEVER be taken in any circumstance. The topic of this thread is TREATING ANXIETY SAFELY & EFFECTIVELY, and by 'ANXIETY' we are talking about ANXIETY-RELATED MEDICAL CONDITIONS (e.g. Generalised Anxiety Disorder (GAD), Panic Disorder etc.); and as such, treatment entails administration of whatever substance for prolonged periods, namely the medium to long term.

Any GABA RECEPTOR AGONIST (whether PHARMACEUTICAL or NUTRACEUTICAL) will induce down regulation of the GABA receptors when administered for prolonged periods (i.e. for the medium to long-term). Hence, administration of GABA RECEPTOR AGONISTS for prolonged periods is ill advised. This is exactly the same reason why administration of OPIOID RECEPTOR AGONISTS (e.g. Morphine, Codeine, Oxycodone etc.) for prolonged periods is NOT recommended.

Therefore, it is strongly recommended that GABA RECEPTOR AGONISTS are not used for treating ANXIETY.

GABA RECEPTOR AGONISTS do have useful safe application in circumstances where the usage is restricted to short-term use only.

Some substances which are a GABA RECEPTOR AGONIST also have a number of other useful physiological beneficial effects
that you might wish to benefit from (e.g. ASHWAGANDHA); in such instances it is recommended that the substance be CYCLED ON AND OFF, such that each 'ON' period is limited to the short-term use only, and an appropriate 'OFF' washout time period is employed that allows status to fully return to baseline.
 

Stevie

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Oh, clearly I have much to learn. The taurine, I'm pleased to say seems, so far, to be agreeing with me. I'm a model maker, and the only chemicals I have the slightest bit of knowledge about are all glues.

Also, I don't like surprises, I have diazepam hidden all over the place :):
 

Stevie

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Unrelated I know but I take myo inositol for when I have to 'socialise', this seems to really help my digestion.
 

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