Tarmanders Auto-Immune Log

[charlie]

post 106913 To sum everything up, things are going well. Libido doing really well, skin very soft and smooth, stress seems low. I have a lot of days where I am very thankful for the things I have learned and the life that I have.

Beautiful.

Appreciate the update.

 

[kaybb]

Thanks for your log. I hope you will cont. To update. It has been very educational.

 

[Giraffe]

post 106917

post 106913 To sum everything up, things are going well. Libido doing really well, skin very soft and smooth, stress seems low. I have a lot of days where I am very thankful for the things I have learned and the life that I have.

Beautiful.

Appreciate the update.

Thanks for the Health Notes, Tarmander! Great summary!

 

[Tarmander]

Thanks for the good feedback guys! I will keep updating as I go along

 

[charlie]

Just checked out those notes, nice! Definitely look forward to those updates.

 

[Tarmander]

Couple things and some questions:

•For the last couple weeks I have lowered the amount of Pregnenolone. It was getting more and more stimulative so I pulled back from 200-300mg per day to 50-100mg. I still wanted to take it because I noticed stronger muscles and tighter skin. In that time, it seems I have developed a bit of gyno. I also started taking Taurine, which can raise T quite a bit, so perhaps that is the reason. After doing a bit of research it seems others have run across this issue with Preg as well. So I am going to stop taking it daily in small amounts and stick to maybe weekly in large amounts. Could it be like DHEA but the opposite? As in, large doses do not convert to estrogen and small doses do? I remember that Ray did not take it indefinitely, but only for a short amount of time. Perhaps it is time to pull back for me. If anyone could share any insight into this I would appreciate it.

•I have been messing around with Cascara for the past few days and I stumbled upon something great! I have always had a bit of restless leg at night, ever since I was a child. The other day I really got to thinking that I needed to focus more on my gut. It seems a lot of problems can stem from there. I think you can clean out your liver, take supplements that increase sugar oxidation, and do an all manner or things, but if your gut is still spewing out Endotoxin, its a bit like taking 2 steps forward, 2 steps back. I have tried a bunch of different tactics that raise metabolism, but nothing has really resolved this restless leg issue, except cascara! Not only am I less restless at night, but during the day I have an easier time staying still. I think endotoxin and its buddy estrogen give this feeling under my skin like the cells are running around and bouncing off each other and don't know what to do. Cascara seems to relax that. Has anyone taken Cascara long term and then gone off it? Did you lose peristalsis? If you have any feedback on taking Cascara long term I would love to hear it.

•I think I am going to take a break on the gelatin. I have been taking it for probably 9 months or so. Back in the summer, shortly after starting to take gelatin, I started getting this cough where I cough up phlegm. I know...nice. It was not yellow colored, indicating an infection or anything, but it was pretty persistent. It usually only happened in the morning, and seeing as it was not affecting my health in any other way, I left it alone thinking it would resolve itself. Wellll it hasn't. I thought that it was from my immune system being lowered from the glycine in the gelatin, and that with a higher metabolism later on, this would be fine, but I think differently now. I think that the gelatin was causing endotoxin. I am not sure how, but someone else on this forum mentioned it and it was like a light bulb went off in my head. My cough also gets worse with other fibers/starches (especially resistant starch like when I sometimes eat cold rice for lunch), even carrot fiber which should be suppressing endotoxin. Instead of just eating a carrot, I am going to try the carrot "salad" with some coconut oil and see if that works better. My belief has been further validated with Cascara. With its use, I woke up this morning refreshed, and with very little cough.

•Lastly, I think part of why I have never been able to tolerate caffeine and other immune stimulants is because of the restlessness caused by endxtoxin. I was already being stimulated by endotoxin, and adding another stimulant on top was like torture. I am going to try some other stimulants with cascara and let you guys know.

So to sum up, endotoxin and resolving it is a big focus of mine right now. I have a good litmus test with this cough and the amount of phlegm I spew forth. Cascara seems to be helping immensely with relaxing this inner stimulated feeling, and allowing me to take other metabolism stimulating substances. I am worried a bit with taking Cascara long term, along with maybe Taurine causing gyno? Carrot seems to be having the opposite effect that it should, so adding some coconut oil.

 

[Giraffe]

I also have restless legs since childhood, but no issues with coffee. Coffee starts to taste weird when I have too much of it. When I am ill it starts to take weird much earlier, so I drink less of it. It's my experience too that restless legs is inflammation/gut related.

Do you think it is necessary to take cascara every day to have the effect you get? Did you try to cycle it? Maybe take it twice a week?

 

[charlie]

post 108293 Has anyone taken Cascara long term and then gone off it?

Yes.

post 108293 Did you lose peristalsis?

Quite the opposite. Ray Peat said Cascara Sagrada "normalizes" things. He also said somewhere, I think it was a radio interview, that Cascara Sagrada does so many good things that it's almost too good to be true.

post 108293 If you have any feedback on taking Cascara long term I would love to hear it.

It's so crucial to keep the bowels movings for the reasons you stated above. This is paramount. KEEP THE BOWELS MOVING!!! Sluggish bowels = toxic overload! No way the liver can keep up.

I use Cascara Sagrada anytime I need it. I use however much it takes to keep the flow going, easy peasy no worries.

 

[Tarmander]

Thanks for the answers Giraffe and Charlie. I could definitely try spacing it out, I haven't tried cycling it yet. The endotoxin lowering effect seems to last at least a day or two, so maybe taking it a few times here a weekwould be better. It is SO nice being able to sit still and relax. Being able to be still is such a treasure.

I wonder if some of the bad reactions people have to sugar is actually endotoxin creation from their gut bacteria feeding on the sugar. I notice that when I eat a lot of sugar I have a similar reaction as to the Gelatin. Coughing, not being able to hold still, etc. It passes pretty quickly. This seems to support the idea that as your metabolism increases and your gut becomes more sterile, you can handle sugar better.

 

[tara]

If the endotoxin seems to be a key issue, you could try an occasional dose of activated charcoal. Peat has expressed some concern about small particle size, and it will soak up nutrients as well as junk, so it may be better not to take it every day, but it's another possible tactic to try.

 

[Bumberleybee]

Fantastic log, have thoroughly enjoyed reading. I will have to start my own type one diabetes log so that we can share info and see what may be possible for those beta cells of ours. :)

Thank you for sharing.

 

[Tarmander]

It has been awhile since I have updated this and I'd like to throw some thoughts out here and recent experiences.

Caffeine:

So at the end of November, I was feeling really good, like really really good. I was getting sunlight each day, breathing in CO2 every other night from some dry ice I was buying at the store, and I felt fantastic. The better I felt the more interested in art I became. I started playing the piano more, journalling, and just enjoying life. I also had the last week of November off work, and December was going to be a light work month. I decided that if there was ever a time to try Caffeine, NOW was the time.

I bought 200mg pills of Caffeine and started taking 50mg per day. My plan was 50mg per day for the first week, then up to 100mg, then 200mg, adding more and more each week, hopefully getting up to 800-1200mg. I was also going to take as much theanine as possible to get me to sleep at night, come hell or high water.

That first week was quite the experience. I have never gone from feeling so good, to so bad, so quickly. After the first 4 days, I wondered what the hell I was even doing. If I had not felt so good the week before, and known that I could go back to that, I may have stopped in the first week with how bad I was feeling. I went from doing art and being calm and free to being a basket case. I wanted to watch porn and movies back to back and just lay around all day. It reminded me a bit of the study Haidut posted saying that addiction was caused by stress. I definitely went into some type of addiction mind set. I also got pretty mean and angry. I became very impatient with just about everything. Driving was a nightmare for awhile. My blood sugar would also go through the roof for a day or two after each increase in Caffeine. I made it through the first week and increased it to half a pill, and then increased it again to 3/4 of a pill, then a whole pill, etc. Each time I increased it, blood sugar would go bad for a day or two, I would get very tired, cranky, depressed, and impatient.

All together it was a pretty hellish experiment! However there were up sides. My skin looked better. I was just tougher in general oddly enough. By the end of the experiment, at around a month and a half, I was drinking 24oz of coffee and adding 300mg of Caffeine to it. I was getting very dizzy from it, almost light headed. I had lost maybe 5 or 10 pounds. I also started craving salt like a mad man and eating pickles like they were candy (adrenaline causes salt wasting). My blood sugars, after the day of being bad, would actually be better and the amount of insulin I was taking dropped. I make it sound like it was a failed experiment, but I actually was happy with some of the things that Caffeine was doing for me. The whole being more manly and tough should not be understated. I definitely noticed some receding in my hair line however, and that has not returned. In fact it has continued. I have always had really great hair, so it has been a bit concerning. Funnily enough though, I do not mind so much. Part of being a man and growing older is getting some thinning hair, and if that is the price you pay, that is the price you pay. If good hair is associated with a more feminine affect, I will trade it in for masculinity.

After a couple months, I stopped the Caffeine pills. I think they are not great, and without other nutrients, are imbalanced. I still drink about 32oz of coffee a day with lots of honey and milk, which is new for me, and continues to give me that manliness without all the crazy dizzy symptoms of the pure Caffeine. I also have slowly started to migrate back to the arts, which is a nice sign that the stress hormones that I was running on have quieted down. My vision is also better, indicating better liver function. If you want to try getting on Caffeine and react poorly to it, give yourself a week to get through the most hellish part and then give it a go. It WILL cause stress, but hopefully in the long run will be worth it

 

[Tarmander]

It has now been about a year a few months since reading Matt Stone's book Diet Recovery, getting off my crazy meat and veggie diet and getting onto the Peat choo choo train. I wanted to talk a bit about bloating, estrogen, and salt. When I started, I was about 50lbs lighter then I am now, very depressed, and couldn't sleep for more then a couple hours at a time. No libido either. I was also eating very little sugar, lots of meat and veggies, and any carbs I was eating were "slow" carbs with lots of fiber. I read Diet Recovery and jumped off the deep end in eating whatever the hell I wanted: ice cream, milk, pizza, whatever. I told myself that I would always go back to a more veggie based diet when I was through this "phase," but...yeah that never really happened. I gained weight fast, like really fast, and I was constantly bloated a bit. I had read that this could happen after being on a prolonged calorie deficient diet, so I said no problem, and ate my way to health. I am happy to report I continue to be free of much of those symptoms I experienced over a year ago.

But it has been over a year now, and I still get bloated in the morning after breakfast. I think any kind of adaptation to this eating style has happened, or at least MOSTLY happened. So I am going to do something about this weight gain and bloating. Which leads me to salt, and some theories I have regarding sugar. I read an old post of pboy's where he mentions that he had edema, and what resolved it for him was drinking more salt water. For some reason this stuck in my brain. Peat has a great article about salt that I would highly recommend: Salt, energy, metabolic rate, and longevity

Lots of people come to this forum, jump into the peat diet, and basically start showing signs of type 2 diabetes. They swell up with water, have blood sugar issues, get gout, gain belly fat etc. The usual advice is that they need to increase metabolism, add in fat solubles, clean the liver, and do things that will better their ability to handle sugar. But in no way is sugar the problem! Nope! Sugar is like a god we all worship. In some ways it is if you define god as the energy that flows through all of us. But why do so many people have problems with sugar?

Some thoughts come to mind:

•Most people who get on blood pressure pills, which are usually salt wasting, develop type 2 diabetes. I have seen tons of people come into health food stores asking for help with their blood sugar, and I find out they are on blood pressure meds (and usually statins too, but that's another post).
•An old anti-sugar guy I used to read always said that as soon as you consume sugar, it causes some type of dehydration. Hydration means water and electrolytes. Without electrolytes you cannot be hydrated.
•In Macrobiotics and Chinese medicine, sugar is the ultimate yin substance, salt the ultimate yang substance. They are on two opposite sides of the spectrum that balance each other. This guy is pretty crazy, but he sums up this view here: http://drlwilson.com/articles/yin yang healing.htm
•Caffeine drys you out even more, and can cause further dehydration! Caffeine also tends to raise your blood sugar at first...

My theory on why sugar causes so many problems for people, and why the Ray Peat diet in general causes so many problems, is that it dehydrates you. It messes with the electrolyte balance of your cells. Sure it is pure energy that your cells use, but it causes a homeostatic imbalance in sodium and probably other electrolytes too. I think the reason why so many people do better on starch despite the endotoxin and SFA production problems is because these "slow" carbs do not require such rapid changes in salt balance. So as I am developing this idea, I am wondering about how this works. How does sugar mess with electrolytes? Or better yet, how does an increased metabolism mess with electrolytes? Does it "use up" your salt?

Each morning, when I get up I eat a big breakfast, drink orange juice, milk, coffee. I usually have to take massive amounts of insulin, more then at any other time per day, and I am bloated until probably noon. I have been doing this because stress hormones are highest in the morning and I want to start the day off right with a higher metabolism. However, after a year and change it does not seem to be working for me. I seem to be still bloated, still retaining water, still gaining weight. But today, was different! When I woke up, I drank a cup of water with a dash of salt in it. I did not get bloated. I did not eat as much as usual, but I was much more comfortable throughout the day.

I am still developing this idea for myself, and testing things out, but I think salt is the key to this whole bloating, estrogen, water logged crap that so many people go through. I have begun to salt my orange juice, and well everything else, very heavily. It can be a tricky balance because salt can dehydrate you if you do too much, but at the same time you need salt to be hydrated. I also noticed that when I sat out in the sun for a couple hours, initially my blood sugar would fall and my pulse would rise while being exposed. All good signs of an increasing metabolism. But then for an hour or two after getting out of the sun, it was like I became insulin resistant or something. If I drank any OJ at all my blood sugar would shoot up! So instead I decided to pound down a decent amount of salt and water after the sun and viola! No more insulin resistance craziness.

Matt Stone has this book called eat for heat which basically advises to lay off the liquids which will raise your core temp, and metabolism. In fact, water tends to get kind of the short end of the stick around most Peat circles because of how it behaves with Estrogen. I now think that Matt Stone's eat for heat idea may be the most idiotic idea imaginable. I think the heat is from stress and dehydration. I am still testing things out and developing this idea, so I would love to hear anyone's take on it.

 

[Brian]

My theory is a little different. I think high liquids aren't assimilated and processed well unless you are sweating heavily daily and/or have a very strong metabolism, and therefore a high-rate of evaporation/utilization. Just drinking lots of liquid doesn't hydrate your cells if you have a weak metabolic rate, if anything it makes it worse as it dilutes your sodium ions, which makes you more prone to losing magnesium.

I notice in the summer when I allow myself to sweat most of the day that I handle liquids extremely well, and don't really need to consciously regulate my intake of electrolytes or liquids. It seems to self-regulate much better. Metabolism remains high and bloating water retention is non-existent.

I was also able to recreate this last winter by turning up the thermostat to 80 degrees and wearing warm clothing indoors. So I know that it is largely caused by heat and sweating rather than benefits from sun, although I wouldn't doubt that helps a lot too by keeping stress hormones lower.

Eat for Heat is undoubtedly a confusingly written book. I don't think Matt's position is that a person should ignore thirst, but he wrote it in a way that has led a lot of his readers to go overboard.

But anyways, my suspicion is that sweating a significant amount daily is very important for many aspects of health, especially if your metabolic rate isn't particularly high. If you are sweating, because of ambient temperatures your cells are at a more optimal temperature and are more actively regulating their own electrolytes.

Humans are primarily a tropical/sub-tropical species. I think they operate best when ambient temperatures are 80 degrees plus, especially in handling electrolyte concentrations.

And so I think a high liquid milk and juice diet is very problematic for most people who aren't sweating significant amounts each day, except those with exceptionally high metabolic rates. While somebody like an outdoor laborer or athlete would also do well on these high liquid staples. They're great for somebody already functioning at a high level, but in my opinion poor staples for somebody trying to reboot their thyroid function and lower stress hormones unless they somehow increase their sweating significantly.

I wonder if Peat became very fond of milk and juice when he was living in Mexico for this reason. He probably thrived on them more effortlessly in that warmer climate, but in a cooler place like where he lives now in Oregon it would not surprise me that he requires more metabolism boosting substances to tolerate them at his age.

I think a simpler solution if possible is to sweat more. Whether that be through regular use of a sauna or a physical activity that induces a good amount of sweating without being too stressful for your current state of health and limiting use of air conditioning in the summer.

 

[tara]

I don't think Matt's position is that a person should ignore thirst, but he wrote it in a way that has led a lot of his readers to go overboard.

Yeah, both Stone and Peat warn against over-drinking water, but they have both expressed awareness that there is such a thing as too little, too, and that drinking when thirsty usually makes sense.

I think there may be a special case for people who are starting recovery from anorexia etc, who I think may have been be a significant target of Stone's in that book and some of his other writing. Avoiding excess water in the early stages may be especially important in the early stages for this subpopulation.

I think your points about our optimal operating temperature are probably important - as you say, we evolved largely in the tropics and sub-tropics. All our biochemical processes are probably designed to occur at suitable rates in these temperatures.

Personally, I have to watch out for both too much and too little fluids - either can get me.

 

[farmerMark]

Brian, You mention saunas and sweating. That's been a puzzle lately for me. I listen to Peat a lot and he loves the red light from heat lamps, and he says the heat from far infrared saunas is helpful, but I can't really detect anywhere where he endorses a real sauna. Heat is useful but a real hot sauna like the cheap near infrared saunas can be torture to me as I profusely sweat. I have researched sweating in pubmed and the studies mentioned nitric oxide production because of the "excessive" heat. I figured at that point there wasn't much point in bothering Dr. Peat about it, but I still wonder what he would say exactly.

 

[Brian]

Brian, You mention saunas and sweating. That's been a puzzle lately for me. I listen to Peat a lot and he loves the red light from heat lamps, and he says the heat from far infrared saunas is helpful, but I can't really detect anywhere where he endorses a real sauna. Heat is useful but a real hot sauna like the cheap near infrared saunas can be torture to me as I profusely sweat. I have researched sweating in pubmed and the studies mentioned nitric oxide production because of the "excessive" heat. I figured at that point there wasn't much point in bothering Dr. Peat about it, but I still wonder what he would say exactly.

Yeah, there's definitely a point where too much ambient heat is overly stressful. My own experience is just at the point of sweating feels the most beneficial. I think focused lamp heat can easily heat the skin surface too high and may do more harm than good when it is too close.

 

[Tarmander]

A couple quick updates:

•I used Haidut's topical vitamin K nightly for about 6 weeks (1-2 drops which would be equivalent to maybe 7-15mg of oral K2), and went off it a week ago or so. The stuff really helped me sleep, and I got some definite signs of raised testosterone (libido etc). However I also noticed hair loss. I did a bunch of research looking for reasons that vitamin K could cause hair loss and did not find anything. Like it was definitely noticeable hair loss, and the texture of my hair was drier and not as vibrant. My hair usually kind of sticks up all on its own, but it laid flat on my head for the most part while I did the topical K. After some time I tried switching to a different vitamin K brand and taking it orally. Same hair loss. So for whatever reason, vitamin K causes hair loss for me. I have been off it now for about a week and definitely notice some new hair coming in and more life to it. The bounce it used to have is back, and my scalp is not as itchy in those typical male pattern baldness places (the crown and the two sides). Would love anyone's input on the why of that.

•I went traveling and ate a bunch of crappy food and walked a crap ton. Long story short, when I got back I got the "Flu;" fever, headache, nasal blockage, sore throat, etc. I felt like total crap. So I thought to myself, what a time to test out Ray's theory on the flu being caused by endotoxin. I definitely had the crappy diet that might cause some intestinal/bowel inflammation to go along with it. I had to work, I tested my fever in the morning at 100 degrees F. I took two drops of MB, which was around 800mcgs, drank a bunch of caffeine, and went to work (lots of driving around and visiting different locations). When I got back in that night, after a day which should have made me feel even worse, I felt better. When I tested my temp that afternoon it was 97.7! I have not taken MB for probably 5 months or so, and it was the only thing I changed in this time frame.

The next day I did the same and I was over my "flu" just like that. I have continued to take the MB, and felt pretty amazing on it. My stomach bloat has been non existent, and I have needed less insulin for all the sugar I eat. I even had some clear mole/cyst things that are behind my ear lob disappear. With no stomach bloat, maybe I have even lost weight? I am not sure. The weird thing is, when I did MB before I did not have these awesome results. The difference this time is that I went off the kuinone at the same time as I went on the MB. I wonder if, even with the hair loss, the vitamin K kind of primed my body to take more advantage of the MB then it had the last time? I feel like I would have realized last time I tested out MB how awesome it was if it had these kinds of effects.

So anyways, to sum it all up, Vitamin K for six weeks, some good some bad, lost hair though. MB now, awesome results, perhaps because of stint on vitamin K. Question on why vitamin K was only awesome after getting off it...or what?

 

[Blossom]

Question on why vitamin K was only awesome after getting off it...or what?

Perhaps you have replenished your vitamin K stores and don't need that much that often? Congratulations on getting over the flu so quickly!

 

[Tarmander]

Hey guys. I am going to be posting a couple stories/updates here over the next day or so. They are pretty long, feel free to read them if you like, but they are mostly for my own reference.