T3- Massive Water Rentention Cause?

Sagitarrius90

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309
Hello there,

I know in advance this isnt necessarily "peaty" but I'm beyond baffled at this considering I have a good indicator as to what's up with my body.

I'm currently dieting close to 10% finally, around 190 lbs now 6"0. I purchased t3 and I've used it before in smaller doses recommended by peat himself.

This time around I increased my dose to around 50mg a day since I'm close to where I want to be body fat wise and my body is retaining alot of water mostly in my face and chest. Any idea why t3 would cause this? My liver heath is good. I've heard of elevated t3 levels causing higher estrogen? Could explain the retaining water aspect but if anything all the other symptoms point to lower estrogen (skin's dry, joints crack nonstop, 0 appetite and no emotions/dull). So I actually suspect this is due to cortisol or even aldosterone.

Does or has anyone experienced this? Super discouraging. I will starting today lower the dose to 25 mcg a day and see if the water comes off but I woke up around 196 when I was hovering around 189-190 for a week and a bit now. Diet wise on point, so no I didnt eat alot of carbs, or salt. Regular bowel movements.
 
J

james2388

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Fluid retention
No appetite
Cracking joints
Dry skin
Dulled emotions

If anything this points to hypothyroidism.
Also the sourcing of your t3 should be considered as well. Administration should result in energy uplift after taking it and hunger in the following hours. I'd say this could be metabolic syndrome from dieting.
Aldosterone should be fine if you have a good sodium and calcium intake and you aren't chugging a gallon of water a day.
Cortisol should be fine if you don't have stressful work, you eat 200-300 or more grams of carbs, saturated fats, modest protein.

I would rather mess around with dhea, preg, and andro than t3.
 
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Sagitarrius90

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I should mention that I was taking cypro got off abruptly and had high cortisol serotonin symptoms that have since gone away since I'm supplementing with it again but I've felt off ever since I just stopped.

T3 source is good and confirm there is t3 actually in it since I get a good increase in heart rate and temp from taking it.

I take cortinon during the day and cypro at night. I eat salt a decent amount and I'm around 500 under maintenance calories. Cant put my finger on why I'm retaining so much water. Used estroban as well and it did nothing so I actually read low estrogen can cause water retention since when estrogen is low it can actually increase aldoaterone. Maybe cypro really screwed me up and caused me to develop cushing like symptoms I cant seem to shake its frustrating to say the least
 

Andman

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did your weight loss actually stall/reverse or is it more of a flat/depleted muscles and softer appereance thing?
 
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Sagitarrius90

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reverse... I originally thought it could have been low protein hence catabolism would create high serotonin/high cortisol/estrogenic symptoms but I was eating around 200grams a day. I thought t3 lowered estrogen but from what I am reading it increases it yet nothing about t3 is estrogenic. Taking cypro and cortinon with t3 to lower cortsiol symptoms yet massive water retention I'm confused
 

ddjd

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Jul 13, 2014
Messages
6,677
Hello there,

I know in advance this isnt necessarily "peaty" but I'm beyond baffled at this considering I have a good indicator as to what's up with my body.

I'm currently dieting close to 10% finally, around 190 lbs now 6"0. I purchased t3 and I've used it before in smaller doses recommended by peat himself.

This time around I increased my dose to around 50mg a day since I'm close to where I want to be body fat wise and my body is retaining alot of water mostly in my face and chest. Any idea why t3 would cause this? My liver heath is good. I've heard of elevated t3 levels causing higher estrogen? Could explain the retaining water aspect but if anything all the other symptoms point to lower estrogen (skin's dry, joints crack nonstop, 0 appetite and no emotions/dull). So I actually suspect this is due to cortisol or even aldosterone.

Does or has anyone experienced this? Super discouraging. I will starting today lower the dose to 25 mcg a day and see if the water comes off but I woke up around 196 when I was hovering around 189-190 for a week and a bit now. Diet wise on point, so no I didnt eat alot of carbs, or salt. Regular bowel movements.
Anyone Else Getting Increased Estrogen From T3/ASPIRIN/CYPRO/PROGESTERONE
 

Andman

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767
reverse... I originally thought it could have been low protein hence catabolism would create high serotonin/high cortisol/estrogenic symptoms but I was eating around 200grams a day. I thought t3 lowered estrogen but from what I am reading it increases it yet nothing about t3 is estrogenic. Taking cypro and cortinon with t3 to lower cortsiol symptoms yet massive water retention I'm confused

ive experienced something similar with high(ish) dose t3 in april, weight loss stalled until i lowered the dose. also used aspirin to get rid of excess bloating
 
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Sagitarrius90

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What dose of t3 did you end up using? I'll try lowering to 25 mcg a day split rather than taking larger amounts throughout the day (I was doing around 50 mcg daily)
 

Andman

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went up to 150+mcg, lowered to around 12,5 - 30mcg split in 3 doses per day. other than the few weeks at high dose where i stalled my cut this year has been a breeze
 
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Sagitarrius90

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So you're saying when you were up big in the t3 department you were getting water retention? In the face? Chest?

I'm on TRT (100mg test prop split every 2 days) so I was using a low dose arimdex to no avail so I was confused that it wasnt estrogen. I never use an AI I believe there terrible but things went downhill bad soon as I used. 5mg and stopped cyproheptadine. Then I pinpointed it to one of two things that it could be possibly
1.) High cortisol or
2.) Protein defiency ( wont lie I've been slacking bad in the diet department while dieting - havent used weights since pre covid. Protein intake pre covid was around 200 grams a day. Went down to maybe 80 a day - I still do cardio mostly. I'm guessing low protein with high t3 and calorie defecit will increase cortisol alot ontop of the fact I'm probably increasing serotonin and estrogen from the breakdown of muscle tissue which I know is happening but I hate to brag I can afford some muscle loss lol I'm going to reduce t3 and try eating more protein consistently and see if it works!
 
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james2388

Guest
You do realize you need protein to make thyroid hormones. 80 grams a day and you respond with taking t3. This doesn't make sense you are literally going backwards.
You mentioned you were using a low dose AI - to no avail and now you stopped and now you are dealing with water retention. It's not the cyproheptadine. You are taking 100mg test prop, every other day. In jay campbell resources he recommends 50mg every other day.
So get back on the AI, or taper your dose.
If you are not working with an HRT coach, you need to get a few people in your contact list. When things go wrong you contact the professional that manages cycles for athletes for a living.
If you're going to do HRT, you need to run labs, as soon as you do anything with your stack. You got off the AI.. I'm assuming if you checked your labs, your estradiol is going to be high.
The more protein you eat on trt, the more protein is utilized in building muscle.
I'm really astonished here because you need to take this seriously man.
https://jayccampbell.com/hormones/testosterone-propionate/
 
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Sagitarrius90

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100 mg a week split dude. Nothing is outrageous other than my low protein intake I'm doing this really responsible. Taking 100 every other day is irresponsible but yeah 100 mg split over a week so 25 every other day. A bit more conservative than 50 eod which is stupid imo considering natural test a day is 7mg
 

thomas00

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Nov 14, 2016
Messages
872
Hello there,

I know in advance this isnt necessarily "peaty" but I'm beyond baffled at this considering I have a good indicator as to what's up with my body.

I'm currently dieting close to 10% finally, around 190 lbs now 6"0. I purchased t3 and I've used it before in smaller doses recommended by peat himself.

This time around I increased my dose to around 50mg a day since I'm close to where I want to be body fat wise and my body is retaining alot of water mostly in my face and chest. Any idea why t3 would cause this? My liver heath is good. I've heard of elevated t3 levels causing higher estrogen? Could explain the retaining water aspect but if anything all the other symptoms point to lower estrogen (skin's dry, joints crack nonstop, 0 appetite and no emotions/dull). So I actually suspect this is due to cortisol or even aldosterone.

Does or has anyone experienced this? Super discouraging. I will starting today lower the dose to 25 mcg a day and see if the water comes off but I woke up around 196 when I was hovering around 189-190 for a week and a bit now. Diet wise on point, so no I didnt eat alot of carbs, or salt. Regular bowel movements.

You might be making yourself hypothyroid by taking too much. I think Ray's advice not to take more than 10mcg in one go is prudent. A lot of people start lower. Is there any reason you aren't taking t4 with it?
 

milkboi

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You might be making yourself hypothyroid by taking too much. I think Ray's advice not to take more than 10mcg in one go is prudent. A lot of people start lower. Is there any reason you aren't taking t4 with it?

How exactly would that work?
 

ddjd

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Messages
6,677
So you're saying when you were up big in the t3 department you were getting water retention? In the face? Chest?

I'm on TRT (100mg test prop split every 2 days) so I was using a low dose arimdex to no avail so I was confused that it wasnt estrogen. I never use an AI I believe there terrible but things went downhill bad soon as I used. 5mg and stopped cyproheptadine. Then I pinpointed it to one of two things that it could be possibly
1.) High cortisol or
2.) Protein defiency ( wont lie I've been slacking bad in the diet department while dieting - havent used weights since pre covid. Protein intake pre covid was around 200 grams a day. Went down to maybe 80 a day - I still do cardio mostly. I'm guessing low protein with high t3 and calorie defecit will increase cortisol alot ontop of the fact I'm probably increasing serotonin and estrogen from the breakdown of muscle tissue which I know is happening but I hate to brag I can afford some muscle loss lol I'm going to reduce t3 and try eating more protein consistently and see if it works!
arimidex is risky. Aromasin is much safer
 
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Sagitarrius90

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Personal experience aromasin is far far worse than arimidex. With aromasin once you kill the aromatise enzyme it takes so much longer to create and then aromatise vs arimidex which just binds itself and when its half life is all done then you'll aromatise again. Low estrogen is awful peat advises a healthy way of lowering estrogen but I feel more alive and human when my estro levels are mid 20s low 30s. I had it low single digits and low teens and felt terrible so this idea of low esteogen and dht only use is so dumb try it out rather than study it and tell me how you feel
 

thomas00

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How exactly would that work?

Ray:

If Cytomel is used, it is efficient to approximate the physiological rate of T3 formation, by nibbling one (10 to 25 mcg) tablet during the day. When a large amount is taken at one time, the liver is likely to convert much of it to the inactive reverse T3 form, in a normal defensive response...what happens is that when the liver has too much of it, if there is also T4 present, it converts some T4 to reverse T3.
Ray Peat, PhD on Thyroid, Temperature, Pulse, and TSH – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)

I don't know what else is going on when large amounts of t3 are taken but it's clearly not something good, in my experience and others (but I know some can take large amounts with seemingly less bad effects).
 

milkboi

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Ray:

If Cytomel is used, it is efficient to approximate the physiological rate of T3 formation, by nibbling one (10 to 25 mcg) tablet during the day. When a large amount is taken at one time, the liver is likely to convert much of it to the inactive reverse T3 form, in a normal defensive response...what happens is that when the liver has too much of it, if there is also T4 present, it converts some T4 to reverse T3.
Ray Peat, PhD on Thyroid, Temperature, Pulse, and TSH – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)


I don't know what else is going on when large amounts of t3 are taken but it's clearly not something good, in my experience and others (but I know some can take large amounts with seemingly less bad effects).

Ok, that makes sense the body will turn endogenous T4 into RT3 if it senses too much T3 in the blood steam. Tho I gotta say my experience with multiple 8 mcg doses spread out through the day is quite positive, so it seems that at least for me that’s not already overdoing it. I also don’t go hypo when I forget a dose.
 
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Sagitarrius90

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Could the water retention be because of increased cortisol thus my body is retaining more salt/lowering potassium? I will be lowering to 25-35 mcg a day instead of 50 mcg/day and see how my body adjusts. I just feel this is related to thyroid and not estrogen since when I was doing TRT 100 mg a week (SPREAD out 3-4 doses of 25mg a shot) I wouldn't have any sides at all. Out of the blue when I stopped Cypro and added more t3 my body just ballooned.

Someone mentioned when you mess with hormones you're body is trying to seek homeostasis hence the increase in water weight and simply adjusting downward should help. Perhaps I've tapped into my potassium from again increased t3 and increased cortisol thus causing water retention and probably increased E2 from higher SHBG (t3 increases SHBG) and thus my test shot's are aromatizing alot faster and more to E2 than Test.
 

Recoen

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Are you supplementing B1? Do you get enough vitamins and minerals for TCA and ETC? Edema seems to be from the cells water changing structure and more water coming in (Ling, Pollack). B1 seems to really help edema.
Thyroid is important but if your metabolism is struggling pushing it harder doesn’t really help.
 

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