Sun, Tanning, Vitamin D: I Wonder What Dr. Peat Thinks

[pete]

Vitamin D
http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/V/vitamin_D.html

A fat-soluble steroid prohormone that plays an important role in regulating body levels of calcium and phosphorus, and in the
mineralization of bone. (A prohormone displays no significant hormone activity itself but is a chemical precursor of a hormone.)
The term "vitamin D" is imprecise because it can refer to one or more members of a group of steroid molecules. Also, vitamin D
is not a true vitamin because in the important form known as D3 (see below), it can (in the presence of adequate sunlight) be
manufactured in the body without the need for dietary supplementation. It is more accurate to describe vitamin D as a
conditional vitamin.

---

Science Behind Vitamin D
http://mpkb.org/home/pathogenesis/vitamind

Vitamin D: The Alternative Hypothesis
http://autoimmunityresearch.org/transcripts/AR-Albert-VitD.pdf

Vitamin D May Exacerbate Autoimmune Disease
http://phys.org/news158425579.html

Authored by a team of researchers at the California-based non-profit Autoimmunity Research Foundation, the paper goes on to point
out that molecular biologists have long known that the form of vitamin D derived from food and supplements, 25-hydroxyvitamin D (25-D),
is a secosteroid rather than a vitamin. Like corticosteroid medications, vitamin D may provide short-term relief by lowering inflammation but
may exacerbate disease symptoms over the long-term.

---

Why “Vitamin D” Is Not A Hormone
http://www.direct-ms.org/pdf/VitDVieth/Vit D not a Hormone Vieth.pdf

Vitamin D is a vitamin in the truest sense of the word, because “insufficient amounts in the diet may cause deficiency diseases”. The term,
prohormone, is not relevant to the Vitamin D system, but 25-hydroxy-Vitamin D (calcidiol) is appropriately described as a prehormone,
i.e. a glandular secretory product, having little or no inherent biologic potency, that is converted peripherally to an active hormone.

 

[narouz]

Good point. I checked on pubmed and tried to find something but the data is not clear. The newer evidence says 'might be generated in the eye'. I only recall that Ray Peat advised me not to wear sunglasses and to look into the sun for a few moments every now and then. The rest (about vitamin D being produced in the eyes) was not from him. I suppose it's really mostly the skin and some of it is generated in the eye. That would make more sense. The infrared lights are supposed to shine on as much naked skin as possible and so is the sun. Thank you for being accurate, Charlie.

'Vitamin D might be generated in the eye by UVB – May 2012

Enhancement of Vitamin D Metabolites in the Eye Following Vitamin D3 Supplementation and UV-B Irradiation.
Curr Eye Res. 2012 May 25.
Lin Y, Ubels JL, Schotanus MP, Yin Z, Pintea V, Hammock BD, Watsky MA.
Department of Entomology & Cancer Center, University of California , Davis, CA , USA.

Purpose: This study was designed to measure vitamin D metabolites in the aqueous and vitreous humor and in tear fluid, and to determine if dietary vitamin D3 supplementation affects these levels. We also determined if the corneal epithelium can synthesize vitamin D following UV-B exposure.

Methods: Rabbits were fed a control or vitamin D3 supplemented diet. Pilocarpine-stimulated tear fluid was collected and aqueous and vitreous humor were drawn from enucleated eyes. Plasma vitamin D was also measured. To test for epithelial vitamin D synthesis, a human corneal limbal epithelial cell line was irradiated with two doses of UV-B (10 and 20 mJ/cm(2)/day for 3 days) and vitamin D was measured in control or 7-dehydrocholesterol treated culture medium. Measurements were made using mass spectroscopy.

Results: 25(OH)-vitamin D3 and 24,25(OH)(2)-vitamin D3 increased significantly following D3 supplementation in all samples except vitreous humor.

Tear fluid and aqueous humor had small but detectable 1,25(OH)(2)-vitamin D3 levels.
Vitamin D2 metabolites were observed in all samples.
Vitamin D3 levels were below the detection limit for all samples.
Minimal vitamin D3 metabolites were observed in control and UV-B-irradiated epithelial culture medium except following 7-dehydrocholesterol treatment, which resulted in a UV-B-dose dependent increase in vitamin D3, 25(OH)-vitamin D3 and 24,25(OH)(2)-vitamin D3.

Conclusions: There are measurable concentrations of vitamin D metabolites in tear fluid and aqueous and vitreous humor, and oral vitamin D supplementation affects vitamin D metabolite concentrations in the anterior segment of the eye. In addition, the UV exposure results lead us to conclude that corneal epithelial cells are likely capable of synthesizing vitamin D3 metabolites in the presence of 7-dehydrocholesterol following UV-B exposure.

PMID: 22632164

Page last modified on 29 of May, 2012'

I've come across light therapies which seem to focus
on the eyes.
It's not impossible that certain rays of light hitting the retina
could have some amazing power.

 

[peatarian]

I've come across light therapies which seem to focus
on the eyes.
It's not impossible that certain rays of light hitting the retina
could have some amazing power.

Yes, they usually do and I have a therapy light on my desk for winter (10.000 lux). As Ray Peat says: It is more helpful to look into several hundreds of watt of light once an hour for a few seconds than to have small power light on all the time. I'm sure it's in the eyes. But I am not sure vitamin D is produced there. Don't know if it matters, either. But you are right: Light shining in your eyes is extremely beneficial. I experience it every day.

 

[charlie]

Yes he definitely recommends the sun, without burning. Vit D supplement is for winter only. Btw you need the sun to be 50 degrees above the horizon (at least) for UVBs (for Vit D). I always check which hours for any given area I will be sunning in on any given day especially if I dont have much time.

http://aa.usno.navy.mil/data/docs/AltAz.php

You can google the latitude/longitude of any location.

Yes Mercola is some good but also a snake oil seller.
And not least, demonizer of fructose!!!!!

The highest the sun gets now in my area is 44.3. I guess its probably time to start considering supplementing vitamin D.

 

[narouz]

Yes he definitely recommends the sun, without burning. Vit D supplement is for winter only. Btw you need the sun to be 50 degrees above the horizon (at least) for UVBs (for Vit D). I always check which hours for any given area I will be sunning in on any given day especially if I dont have much time.

http://aa.usno.navy.mil/data/docs/AltAz.php

You can google the latitude/longitude of any location.

Yes Mercola is some good but also a snake oil seller.
And not least, demonizer of fructose!!!!!

The highest the sun gets now in my area is 44.3. I guess its probably time to start considering supplementing vitamin D.

I wonder how this sun-angle thing affects
the Red Light spectrum?

I wonder if one can get adequate Red Light from the sun
when it is below that angle.
Maybe the Red Light is even stronger?

It is confusing to me about the value, in PeatWorld,
of the different spectrums of light.
Peat seems to believe the Red spectrum in most important.
But then he does value vitamin D,
which as I understand it is produced by the UVB (ultraViolet) spectrum
hitting our skin.
Aside from that, Peat doesn't seem to see much value in the UVB spectrum
(as emitted from computer screens and fluorescent light, for example).

 

[charlie]

I dunno narouz. More questions that need to be answered in the Peat paradigm.

Its been nice and sunny the last couple days so I been trying to soak up as much sun as possible before the real cold weather sets in.

 

[narouz]

I dunno narouz. More questions that need to be answered in the Peat paradigm.

Its been nice and sunny the last couple days so I been trying to soak up as much sun as possible before the real cold weather sets in.

Yes, because I can't yet feel comfortable about how to proceed
on the Peat artificial Red Light thing,
I've been diverting that light enthusiasm into sunbathing.

But how much Red Light is there as the sun gets lower and lower in the sky?

 

[gabriel79]

"But how much Red Light is there as the sun gets lower and lower in the sky?"
There will be lower red light as all the received radiation from the sun will be reduced. But the most affected wavelengths will be the shorter ones, as UV. Shorter WLs are more absorbed, in general, by the atmosphere gases than longer ones.

 

[narouz]

Eye-Oriented, SAD-style Light Therapy

I've come across light therapies which seem to focus
on the eyes.
It's not impossible that certain rays of light hitting the retina
could have some amazing power.

Yes, they usually do and I have a therapy light on my desk for winter (10.000 lux). As Ray Peat says: It is more helpful to look into several hundreds of watt of light once an hour for a few seconds than to have small power light on all the time. I'm sure it's in the eyes. But I am not sure vitamin D is produced there. Don't know if it matters, either. But you are right: Light shining in your eyes is extremely beneficial. I experience it every day.

peatarian (or anyone)-

I'm doing the Red Light therapy thing.
But it seems that Peat also values a separate kind of Light Therapy
which is something like SAD light therapy.
You say Peat thinks "it is more helpful to look into several hundreds of watt of light once an hour for a few seconds than to have small power light on all the time."

You say you've addressed that kind of eye-oriented light therapy
by using a 10,000lux light box.
This would be, I would think, a broader spectrum of light
than the red light kind of therapy.

The "several hundred watts" of light Peat suggests looking at for a few seconds every hour
would seem, most likely, to be regular (but powerful) incandescents
because I've never heard him speak about the value of the blue or green spectrums,
which, as I understand it, are very strong in most SAD-style light boxes
presumably like the one you use.

I'm trying to figure out a way to make my own "Peatian Eye Light Therapy" box or source.
I'm thinking it will be based upon regular incandescents--several hundred watts.
Do you have any more knowledge about how to approach this?
Maybe you are, with your desk "eye-light,"
going beyond strictly Peatian workpoints...?

 

[peatarian]

Actually - I wear orange glasses when I work at the computer and that's were I use the 10.000 lux light. So the blue is filtered out 99.9 percent. I have another pair of glasses for TV. Filter out 98 percent.

I use 10 heat bulbs in winter. I checked with Ray Peat. He told me that was fine. And it is. Sorry, I don't spend anymore time checking on the things I am sure about because he said they would work and I found out they do. But as for looking into the light I am sure the incandescent bulbs will be fine.

Good light!

 

[narouz]

Actually - I wear orange glasses when I work at the computer and that's were I use the 10.000 lux light. So the blue is filtered out 99.9 percent. I have another pair of glasses for TV. Filter out 98 percent.

I use 10 heat bulbs in winter. I checked with Ray Peat. He told me that was fine. And it is. Sorry, I don't spend anymore time checking on the things I am sure about because he said they would work and I found out they do. But as for looking into the light I am sure the incandescent bulbs will be fine.

Good light!

Thanks, peatarian.
Yeah...the heat lamps...
I too would like to include them in my mighty red light array.
It doesn't make great sense in terms of providing the Peat-declared optimal 600-820nm wavelengths.
But I have so much regard for Dr. Peat
that I kinda think he will be proven right, somehow, about those bulbs.
It's a little like the religious quandry: skepticism vs. faith.

 

[BaconBits]

Yes he definitely recommends the sun, without burning. Vit D supplement is for winter only. Btw you need the sun to be 50 degrees above the horizon (at least) for UVBs (for Vit D). I always check which hours for any given area I will be sunning in on any given day especially if I dont have much time.

http://aa.usno.navy.mil/data/docs/AltAz.php

You can google the latitude/longitude of any location.

Yes Mercola is some good but also a snake oil seller.
And not least, demonizer of fructose!!!!!

Just to refresh the topic since the summer sun is coming, or is already here and there are new people joining the forum.

 

[MyUsernameHere]

There is nothing wrong with oral Vitamin D, it probably works just the same. I think this picture explains it:

http://www.nature.com/nrc/journal/v7/n9/images/nrc2196-f1.jpg

The Inuit and people up top never would have been able to get their Vitamin D from sunlight, they got theirs from food.

I spent all last summer tanning outside, my Vitamin D level barely moved. I don't think hypothyroid people are very good at making Vitamin D through skin (just like they aren't good at anything else more or less) so that may be the reason.

I supplement even in the summer, albeit less. Had levels tested a few weeks ago but still didn't receive the results, three times hooray for bureaucracy.

 

[BaconBits]

There is nothing wrong with oral Vitamin D, it probably works just the same. I think this picture explains it:

http://www.nature.com/nrc/journal/v7/n9/images/nrc2196-f1.jpg

The Inuit and people up top never would have been able to get their Vitamin D from sunlight, they got theirs from food.

I spent all last summer tanning outside, my Vitamin D level barely moved. I don't think hypothyroid people are very good at making Vitamin D through skin (just like they aren't good at anything else more or less) so that may be the reason.

I supplement even in the summer, albeit less. Had levels tested a few weeks ago but still didn't receive the results, three times hooray for bureaucracy.

You did the 25(OH) vitamin d? You went into the sun when the sun rays were above 50° but nothing?
Thats interesting. There is a study of teenage skaters in Hawaii skating shirtless in the hottest sun but their vitamin D was in deficient state.

You arent near a industrial or higly dense area are you. Tha UVB rays do not get through the ozone layers or the NO2 layes.

 

[Peata]

I've been vitamin D deficient in the past when I've had my levels checked. The dr. gave me Rx Vit. D that brought levels back up. Since then, I take some vit. D now and then, besides what I get in food, though I haven't had levels checked in a long time.

Just in the last week, I've started sitting out 5 - 20 min around midday, exposing face, neck, hands, arms, legs, etc. I was super pale but I'm getting the slightest bit of color now. :)

Here's a question: Does anyone know how contact lenses affect the light you take in through your eyes?

I wear contacts during the day and have since I was 14. I always got a lot of sun until I was 19. From about age 19 - 29 I practiced extreme sun avoidance. Then I started going more for moderation (though some summers I've barely seen the sun and then once a few years ago I got what was probably the worst burn of my life so - so much for moderation I guess! )