Suggestions To Lose Belly Fat?

cfhunter

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OK...day 11 off thyroid meds. Temps every morning average 98.4. Temps go up AFTER meals every time and have been as high as 99.2 mid day. Pulse is slower to raise but it's between 60-85. The biggest issue I have is my belly fat is terrible! 133 pds 5 foot 6. I am five pounds up on two weeks. I feel GREAT, sleep GREAT and have energy. However...not sure what to cut out or add in on food? I drink about 8 oz of milk, 8 oz of OJ a day. Had 1/4 cup ice cream a couple times this past week.
What should I have LESS of and still not compromise my increased temps? I was a low carbing paleo gal and think part of this weight came from that but not eating fruit and dairy again is TOTALLY different idea.
Also is a high temp and pulse thats rising for this long a good sign that my metabolism is getting better? Lean and muscular in arms and legs and back. Belly? ugh. :cry: :cry:
 

Mittir

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Just 8 z of milk and 8 0z OJ daily? Starch, cortisol and insulin are responsible for belly fat.
I remember RP specifically mentioned cortisol causing belly fat.
If you are following RP diet without starch ,belly fat should not be there.
My belly fat is directly related to my starch intake.
Calcium plays a big role in metabolism.
 

cfhunter

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I eat very little starch and I don't fit any profile of adrenal stress for cortisol issues except belly fat. Tahts why I am perplexed. My calcium intake should be higher then?
 

Mittir

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It is hard to know when you are running on cortisol or not.
It does feel good in the beginning, the high feeling during fast.
What is your typical meals? Do you eat small frequent meals with
carb and protein to keep your blood sugar steady?
Bright incandescent light helps with lowering cortisol at night.
 

cfhunter

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I struggled with adrenals back in early 2012. Spent a crapload of time recovering and feel totally recovered and symptoms match my recent diurnal cortisol test (totally normal circadian rhythm with only a slight LOW at night but still within normal ranges and then some). I follow a circadian lifestyle and get lots of good sleep. A typical day for me as of the last two weeks is: Breakfast: two eggs in CO, OJ with salt (upon waking) and a splash of milk, a coconut flour muffin, coffee with coconut milk (from BPA free can). Carrot salad snack piece of 80% cacao choclate. Lunch oysters, Jello made with GL gelatin and grape or apple juice. Dinner: small amount of grassfed meat, super cooked veggies in CO. snack: Maybe a huge bite of Ice cream or a greek yogurt. Thank you for your time.
 

gretchen

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Switch from cow's milk to goat's, drink coffee and try PIlates. The carrot is also important.
 

cfhunter

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I DO the carrot, goats milk is part of my dairy intake and I am a personal trainer....pilates is not going to budge belly fat...strengthen the core YES...but not what I would deem good fat burning exercise for where I am.. I powerlift 4 days a week. Thank you for your time though!
 

wildtruffle14

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a more detailed picture of your diet would be helpful. If you haven't tried Cronometer.com, making sure all of your nutrients are being met is probably the first step in the right direction....including calcium.
 

wildtruffle14

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also, I'm curious if there is a link between respiration dysfunction and elevated cortisol....and if there could be any negatives to the intensity/frequency of your powerlifting/pilates. I saw something on Peat's site about concentrations of different hormones in abdominal fat, too.
 

cfhunter

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I don't eat much more than what unlisted except maybe small amount of ice cream, a piece of chocolate 80% cacao no soy etc. I have a small amount of veggies totally cooked to mush with some protein at night. I do low heart rate powerlifting. No Pilates. :) where would you say that article is?
 

Edward

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wildtruffle14 said:
also, I'm curious if there is a link between respiration dysfunction and elevated cortisol....and if there could be any negatives to the intensity/frequency of your powerlifting/pilates. I saw something on Peat's site about concentrations of different hormones in abdominal fat, too.

"Posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD) is a common psychiatric disorder often accompanied by morphologic changes in the hippocampus. Brain imaging studies have demonstrated a strong relationship between PTSD and a reduction in the volume of the hippocampus; however, the mechanisms that cause such atrophy are not well understood. In an attempt to expand our knowledge of these mechanisms, our theory has focused on the role of mitochondria in cell death, which may be associated with atrophy of the hippocampus. In addition to their function in respiration, mitochondria play an important role in the regulation of cytochrome c, an apoptotic signaling element. Normally, cytochrome c resides in the intermembrane space of mitochondria, where membrane potential exists-negative inside of about 180–200 mV. In response to a variety of apoptotic stimuli, mitochondria membrane potential can be changed by genomic and non-genomic cortisol action. For the non-genomic action, stress increases cortisol levels, which activates the glucocorticoid receptor (GR). Stress-activated GR directly binds to mitochondrial membranes to regulate membrane potential. The GR will also produce a genomic action, in which GR, in interacting with several other molecules (such as heat shock proteins 90/70/40, etc.), translocates into the nucleus of the cell, where it binds to DNA and exerts transcriptional action. As one of the downstream modulaters of GR activation, Bax can be up regulated and translocated to the mitochondria, where it binds to modulator of apoptosis-1 (MAP-1), a mitochondrial effector of BAX to cause change Δψ. These non-genomic and genomic cortisol-induced changes of the mitochondrial membrane potential can result in the release of cytochrome c from the mitochondria to the cytoplasm where the cytochrome c promotes of the action of caspases which leads to apoptosis. Therefore, we hypothesis that stress-induced changes of mitochondrial membrane potential are regulated by non-genomic and genomic actions of cortisol in hippocampal neurons. Understanding the molecular mechanism for stress-induced cell death in the hippocampus may shed a new light on developing a mitochondrial membrane potential related therapeutic drug and/or diagnostic tool for PTSD." (Zhang et al., 2006)

Correct, cortisol and respiration are linked. In this study they actually are looking at it completely backwards, but it will do for now, essentially when thyroid hormone is under-produced either physiologically and/or pathologically the cerebellum and hippocampus atrophy, which are responsible among other things for motor coordiation and long and short term memories, this is why hypothyroid people tend to have poor coordination and/or poor memory recall, and in extreme cases lower intelligence. In Alzheimer's which is essentially a respiration disorder, the cerebellum and hippocampus atrophy causing the classic symptoms in that disease. It is interesting that in some studies (don't have them handy) T4 and T3 in vivo and in vitro reverse this atrophy completely linking mitochondria and thyroid function thus respiration together tightly and neatly. All disease is essentially a dysfunction in mitochondrial respiration.

Since stress (any stress) reduces thyroid output, this causes estrogen to build up, in an acute situation the response is normal and the mitochondria are able to metabolize estrogen via certain cytochrome p450 enzymes. Chronically however the scenerio changes, because thyroid output is low, stress increases and the ability of the mitochondria to metabolize estrogen becomes efficient causing the cells to become stressed, this causes a cascade of things to happen namely intracellular calcium increases causing in essence the mitochondria to malfunction and cytochrome c is released which causes a cascade of signaling proteins to be released which results in apoptosis of the cell which eventually leads to atrophy of tissues, and organs, and eventually the organism as a whole, usually gut integrity fails and endotoxin ends up killing you. Of course this worst case scenario only happens if your grocery store happens to be sold out of table sugar.

Cortisol increases under stress (psychological and physiological), and it increases in essence to try and mobilize amino acids and fats that can be used by the TCA cycle and plays a role in their burning, again this is chronically elevated cortisol. The are numerous studies indicating that washing cortisol soaked mitochondria in a sucrose solution completely restores respiration and allows the buggers to continue humming along. But in essense when cortisol increases so does estrogen and usually it is a slow process that happens over time that leads to man boobs, belly fat, flacid and dry pink parts, and hairs growing in places they shouldn't.

Anyway that is most of the story.

Reference
Zhang, L., Zhou, R., Li, X., Ursano, R., & Li, H. (2006, February). Stress-induced change of mitochondria membrane potential regulated by genomic and non-genomic GR signaling: A possible mechanism for hippocampus atrophy in PTSD. Medical Hypotheses, 66(6), 1205-1208. doi:doi:10.1016/j.mehy.2005.11.041
 

Mittir

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cfhunter said:
I struggled with adrenals back in early 2012. Spent a crapload of time recovering and feel totally recovered and symptoms match my recent diurnal cortisol test (totally normal circadian rhythm with only a slight LOW at night but still within normal ranges and then some). I follow a circadian lifestyle and get lots of good sleep. A typical day for me as of the last two weeks is: Breakfast: two eggs in CO, OJ with salt (upon waking) and a splash of milk, a coconut flour muffin, coffee with coconut milk (from BPA free can). Carrot salad snack piece of 80% cacao choclate. Lunch oysters, Jello made with GL gelatin and grape or apple juice. Dinner: small amount of grassfed meat, super cooked veggies in CO. snack: Maybe a huge bite of Ice cream or a greek yogurt. Thank you for your time.

It seems like you are eating a hypocaloric diet. It is important that you get at least 80 grams of good quality protein.
You can eat 33 to 50 percent of total calorie as sugar. Chocolate and Egg both are known to lower blood sugar and
that can trigger cortisol increase. Here is a quote from RP on consuming egg
"I find that I need almost a pint of orange juice to balance one egg."
May be you will need more sugar with egg or you can lower your egg consumption.
Weekly 4-6 oz of liver is very important for B vitamins and loads of other good nutrient.
It is better to avoid protein rich food for dinner as tryptophan
can increase serotonin. Calcium phosphorus balance is very important.
You will need at least 1200 mg of calcium and ideally equal amount of
phosphorus. Ice cream, OJ or a glass milk with some added sugar can
keep your cortisol level low through out the night.
 

thehobbit

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I also have a big belly. It started when I was on low carb and
continued when I started eating carbs again. I have been of
low carb for a couple of years now but still can't loose my belly fat.

I think stress has a big impact and my pulse has gone down from
90-105 till 75-85 when going on vacation now. I work very irregular
hours so being able to sleep enough seems to help me a lot.
Still tweaking on my diet but seems like other think is more important
to focus on.

I also got a diagnosis of hyperthyroidism and are on thyroid blocking
meds. My symptoms and blood work don't seems to correlate. Even
doc says so. Eating T4 as well now. That won't help either...
 

cfhunter

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Ok...so not eating enough. Got it. I have OJ milk before bed but not much. It's the ever ingrained fear of too many calories...not too little. I can't do liver. Just can't. It gags me to think of it. I have some in freezer from my local grassfed company...probably freezer burnt. I was considering taking a high quality pure liver capsule.
So if I eat enough of the right food I should lose the fat? why is it there though? cortisol? I had a totally normal test and feel great. Believe me I know what excess and lack of cortisol feels like. It was hell.
 

Mittir

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There is no guarantee that eating right will solve this problem. But that is the first step.
For some people supplement or thyroid med is needed. According to RP cortisol is the prime
suspect. Cortisol disturbs many other functions like conversion of thyroid hormone,
increasing aromatase which increases estrogen, increases PTH. Cortisol, thyroid ,estrogen, serotonin,
PTH all are inter connected . Ray Peat mentioned that people who were chronically consuming
little protein for long time loose the ability to detoxify estrogen by liver. You past diet could have
weaken your liver. Have you checked your liver numbers? If you can, check your thyroid and estrogen.
If you eat too much, especially starch and protein without enough carb, that will increase insulin , which increases cortisol. If you eat too little then body uses muscle tissue to use as energy, which increases cortisol.
You have to find a right balance between two extreme.
Most people don't like the taste of liver. I make small piece of liver, 1/2 oz or less.
Then i eat one piece with each meal. It is quite easy , you can barely taste anything.
Chicken liver has very mild taste .
Liver is much easier to eat If you soak liver in milk or salt water over night .
Did you soak liver in milk when you tried it?
There is some good liver recipe in the recipe section.
 

cfhunter

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Thank you...I was on more protein doing paleo VLC than I am now. Too much probably. RP said to stay off thyroid meds since my temps are normal and pulse is up. Thyroid meds brought my temp DOWN. I was on it for months...never felt good. Joint pain gone now, energy normal and temps up. liver numbers were normal last december. sigh...guess I will have to keep plugging away. Hopefully the labs I get done this week will help...although I lost faith in those too since hearing they can be inaccurate.
thanks for your time Mittir.
 

cfhunter

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I am using progest e and gettng pregnenelone tested this week. Gonna do one thing at a time. I don't FEEL like its high cortisol I have had that before and KNEW the feelings...I could be wrong but I doubt it.
 
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