Sugar Is Physically Addictive. You Could Replace The Word Heroin For Sugar And All Of The Same Princ

[you]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Paleo/comments ... he/cqy6mxb



How indoctrinated do you have to be to put sugar on the same level as heroin?

 

[Westside PUFAs]

http://beesandbutterflies.org/46094/hav ... et-over-it

 

[pboy]

sad

I mean it obviously isn't, they all know that, everyone knows that

its some weird trick to justify their not eating sugar, basically theyre so desperate they're willing to delude themselves into trying anything in a desperate hope they get lucky and it makes all their troubles go away

 

[SQu]

That link to the functionalps article from the bees and butterflies link is a really great explanation of why we need carbs. Wish I'd read it before Atkins. Didn't know it existed then of course. Thanks!

 

[Hugh Johnson]

Also air. I have never been able to overcome my air addiction.

 

[jyb]

Whether you are sympathetic to this claim depends on whether you think it is okay to drink litres of soda each day, which some populations do. It is for these cases we talk about "addiction", not the physiological amounts a healthy individual needs. I am sympathetic to this claim because I think my brain is not the same from eating a physiological amount of sugar, such as that found in milk or a bit of fruit, and that from drinking those large refined quantities found in junk food. In the former case, my brain is not "addicted" because I still have a taste for milk and animal products. In the later case, I think health becomes so poor that there is a stressful need for constant high sugar feeding to avoid immediate breakdown and the "addiction" is not physiological but pathological. That's for the brain. For the liver, I think we know what extreme sugar does to rat liver, especially HFCS which is the standard model to induce fatty liver.

Seems pretty similar to breathing air. Loss of respiration when you start hyperventilating, your brain loses control and you continue to breath in a rush, whereas the physiological amount is just slow breathing.

So, I don't see why you take offence at this claim. Consuming junk food daily just seems like hyperventilating, both as an addiction habit and as a metabolic harm with loss of respiration.

 

[Nicholas]

the constant issue seems to be more that humans struggle to understand their cravings.

 

[Stuart]

So, I don't see why you take offence at this claim. Consuming junk food daily just seems like hyperventilating, both as an addiction habit and as a metabolic harm with loss of respiration.

I wonder how damaging junk food would be if you took out all the pufas, and left the sat fat and sugar.

Do you think that theres a limit of sugar consumption for a particualar individual beyond which they are metabolically stressed. Assuming of course that they are satisfying all their micronutrient requirements and avoid pufa?

Also, I wonder if the addiction to junk foods far beyond metabolic requirements would revert to easy self regulation if it didn't contain pufa.

The reason I ask, is that my lifelong proclivity to overeat sweet food, including fruit, has completely evaporated since I started avoiding pufa. It's a remarklable feeling of inner effortless self control. Before it always took a lot of willpower.

 

[EnoreeG]

So, I don't see why you take offence at this claim. Consuming junk food daily just seems like hyperventilating, both as an addiction habit and as a metabolic harm with loss of respiration.

I wonder how damaging junk food would be if you took out all the pufas, and left the sat fat and sugar.

The reason I ask, is that my lifelong proclivity to overeat sweet food, including fruit, has completely evaporated since I started avoiding pufa. It's a remarklable feeling of inner effortless self control. Before it always took a lot of willpower.

For me, PUFA isn't involved. But I recently discovered grains and even other starches were involved in some kind of "urge to snack". More than most anything, I'm with Peat on reduction of starches from the diet.

I went off all refined sweeteners over 35 years ago, but still cheated for many years, once every month or two having some ice cream or cheese cake. Haven't cheated though for probably 20 years. Totally happy with my new found health and self control. Went off grains except for quinoa and rice about 2 years ago. Had no problem doing that. But just about 2 months ago I decide to not include any starch, like the rice, or even a potato or sweet potato with my dinners (only time to eat a starch all day). As soon as I did that, I lost my "carb tooth", which I didn't even know I had. Finally, after all these years, I have no tendency to even snack on what others would call a healthy carb. It feels really good. So I think there is more to the addiction than just refined sugars being added to foods.

I have to admit, I am diabetic, without any drug dependence, so it's controlled by foods. As long as I stay away from sugar/starch I have good, steady energy with 4 hours between meals and no snacks after dinner, so eating in a 10 hour window between 8 am and 6 pm, or sometimes 10 am to 6 pm. But if I ingest something like berries, or nuts with higher carbs, I go into a hypoglycemic funk in a few minutes. So I really have to watch it, and have, for at least all the time since I went off the refined sweets. For me, sugar has the taste of an ugly memory of addiction, loss of control, bloating and poor eyesight and poorer attitude. So I sort of agree with the comments added to the end of the article in the OP here, and with jyb:

...In the later case, I think health becomes so poor that there is a stressful need for constant high sugar feeding to avoid immediate breakdown...

Strange that there are two, very strongly felt sides to this issue. It seems though that the pro-sugar side consists of the sugar eaters, and the anti-sugar side consists of the ex-sugar addicts. I'm thinking it may be more individual differences or prejudice than scientifically caused side-choosing. So this is just my testimony, not a sermon. I think people should decide what they can take, and let others decide what is right for them. Definitely, sugar is something to not take away from another, or force on another. Those thar' are rights to be fought fer.

As is oft' said, we are encourage to take from Peat what is properly applicable to our particular needs. I can take all the refined PUFA (except for the 6% I find in olive oil) from my diet, and go off starch, and ignore refined junk foods, but I can't add refined sugars to my diet without feeling absolutely horrible.

 

[gummybear]

http://i.imgur.com/vCgIK7e.gifv

 

[jyb]

So, I don't see why you take offence at this claim. Consuming junk food daily just seems like hyperventilating, both as an addiction habit and as a metabolic harm with loss of respiration.

I wonder how damaging junk food would be if you took out all the pufas, and left the sat fat and sugar.

Do you think that theres a limit of sugar consumption for a particualar individual beyond which they are metabolically stressed. Assuming of course that they are satisfying all their micronutrient requirements and avoid pufa?

Also, I wonder if the addiction to junk foods far beyond metabolic requirements would revert to easy self regulation if it didn't contain pufa.

The reason I ask, is that my lifelong proclivity to overeat sweet food, including fruit, has completely evaporated since I started avoiding pufa. It's a remarklable feeling of inner effortless self control. Before it always took a lot of willpower.

It's an endless debate as to what amount exactly is physiological...I think the amount you'd find in milk gives a good intuition. Without stress, you have no craving and may not need anything more than some lactose. I believe even Peat would agree. And yes I personally believe hyperglycaemia is one factor in modern disease, which would be relevant for populations drinking litres of sodas daily - after all, diabetes is on the rise so I would not be surprised if they were insulin resistant and thus often hyperglycaemic from drinking all that. Whether insulin resistance was caused by PUFA or excess sugar is another question, some authors speculate that you need both but not always.

 

[pboy]

your sugar limit is how much space you have in your stomach and intestines for tonified sugar solutions and how much time you have to consume it, if there is all the nutrients to metabolize it (including enough protein) without harmful toxic substances in there

you want it to be a comfortable flow though...if you fill up to the point of stretching it produces serotonin and isn't good. And its best to like...let yourself urinate before re filling kinda thing

if sugar is like heroin what do humans eat then? protein just is sugar with a nitrogen on it, and turns into sugar in the body if used as fuel. Do they propose we live on fat? There must be a fish oil supplement on their website

if sugar makes you feel like heroin without side effects whats the problem? lol...they got the meat head no pain no gain religious sin model going, where its like...anything that opens you up to pleasure in life must be a BAD THING...you SINNER! HOW DARE YOU NOT BE POLLUTING AND STRESSED OUT?!?! ARE YOU A GLUTTON? SUPPORT THE TROOPS MAN

I feel sorry for a lot of people like that, but at the same time...they are causing collateral problems that effect everyone else in society, so its kind of a deserved consequences they get. Life is about pleasure grace and harmony and moments of exhilaration, look at nature, anything not that is....destructive

 

[Zachs]

Working in a health food store is both hilarious and sad for the same reasons. I overhear people every day talking about the dangers of sugar or saturated fat or salt. All the while they are loading up on high polyunsaturated foods.

It's also fun being really lean and eating the way I do around people, they trip out when I eat.

I wish I could distribute Ray Peat flyers but most wouldn't even read em.

 

[Suikerbuik]

diabetes is on the rise so I would not be surprised if they were insulin resistant and thus often hyperglycaemic from drinking all that. Whether insulin resistance was caused by PUFA or excess sugar is another question, some authors speculate that you need both but not always.

Chronic excessive inflammation is the prerequisite I think (TNF-a and IL-6 I know of)

 

[pboy]

Working in a health food store is both hilarious and sad for the same reasons. I overhear people every day talking about the dangers of sugar or saturated fat or salt. All the while they are loading up on high polyunsaturated foods.

It's also fun being really lean and eating the way I do around people, they trip out when I eat.

I wish I could distribute Ray Peat flyers but most wouldn't even read em.

lol, I know exactly what you mean...I used to work at a whole foods years back then other little places throughout the years. Their bags talk about eating more whole grains, 'healthy fats' and collards and kale and stuff. I was actualy a vegan back then and only started peat when I stopped working there, but still...I already was aware from personal experience the detriments of gastric upsetting food (nuts and seeds, and too many greens or green juice and all that). Whenever people would talk about kale, its like the gut bacteria thing...people all buy into it hook line and sinker and are strangely protective of a foul tasting/smelling thing. I would tell people I have a vendetta against kale and they'd look at me slightly confused and disturbed and id just be laughing. But I do. We had to like write what our favorit vegetable was on a tag one time and I put lettuce cause really I didn't like anything harsher than that...all the rest were the common 'healthy' things like kale. Id always make comments how the chia smoothies and green drinks were like instant diaareah and people would act like it wasn't true...and yet they'd always go to the bathroom inconspicuously. I was saying that at this other place I worked, like a juice place for a bit, even tho I was juicing things...I was like, why don't we just juice the melons, oranges and carrots...all the other stuff is useless and harsh, but the place's business depended on customers buying the propaganda ...it was hilarious the people that came in, like yoga woman, random people and id see them all drinking the juices and in my mind every time I knew what the outcome would be. They're like 'its a cleanse' and im like...no, its just the thing you drink coming out, that's it. These 2 young girls drank a chia smoothie one time then took turns going to the bathroom like multiple times over the next few hours...which was hilarious because id been saying that for like months

now days when people ask me what I eat, and I talk about how I drink a ton of milk its like what everything is based around...they keep trying to pretend its not true like im lying, and keep trying to get me to admit..'well what else do you eat' 'well milk this and that...oh im lactose intolerant...ect ect' and I don't budge on it. I don't know why people like to buy into the no pain no gain or just...eat stuff that taste ***t to become healthy thing. Even when I was a vegan I trusted my gut and ate simple non harsh things.

Ive been around and in the whole gambit of all health and diet stuff and have done more testing than probably anyone...so I always just say the grounded truth and 99% of people, almost all really, cant handle it..and yet it totally complies with their senses and the foods appeal....so im sure their subconscious knows.

I honestly think the fact people are disconnected from cows and dairy animals is a huge fault of society, and reason why so many people are ungrounded and programmable. Imagine the difference in demeanor everyone would have if all occasionally like weekly milked cows and took care of them and stuff...it would change the whole thing...the fake plastic reality most live would change to more realistic, and also...people would see cows as the benevolent near divine gift that they are...as they do in india. It also just adds a level of humor into life, less mechanical fear science theory and more just harmony with nature

 

[cout12]

I eat like 500g of sugar a day. I could stop at any moment cold turkey easily. I would just be really tired and hungry. Then I some point I would stop being hungry and get used to the food I'm eating, but I would never get the same amount of vitality I have.

 

[Zachs]

Pboy, it's the same here. People praise kale and collards and other bad tasting and hard to digest greens. People are afraid to eat melons for the sugar content or only juice veggies and a bit of grapefruit or green apple. I got a guy who comes in weekly who basically lives off of veggie juice, every time I see him he is praising the life giving properties of veggies, this guy is missing teeth, his hair is white and the white of his eyes and palms are extremely yellow.

It's amazing the amount of disconnect people have between their own health and their diet. Just regurgitating things they overhear without even fact checking. Fish oil and flax, Chia and hemp are super foods, nuts and avocado are the only good fats, dairy is puss and hormone filled poison and should be replaced with calcium rich almond milk (nevermind that the calcium is added and comes with carageenen, d2, guar gum, etc. Oh and whole grains!!!!!!!1!1!! The epitome of health foods, don't forget the big bag of amaranth flour because it's gluten free, get some teft crust for the next soya cheese and kale pizza.

Oh it cracks me up. I gave up on giving unsolicited advice though so I'll go on eating and looking the way I do and let them wonder whats his trick.

 

[pboy]

lol nice

yea man that's what you should do...you probably have had an open mind moreso along your journey which is why you are rewarded with the knowledge you are, and you allowed to feel how you do...the same qualities that led you arriving at the diet you have are the same good qualities that probably make you a better person for society at large...its, I could go into pages on this but I think you know what I mean. You deserve what you get basically...on every energetic and tangible level...lifes a trip like that. I used to make myself near emaciated trying to help and save people until I realized they are full of like concreted ***t that isn't gonna come out...by being the example and sharing with those that approach in a particular way that you can tell they have higher aspirations, that's the right thing to do. The way I speak is in a way that doesn't close the door to whats right but not directly saying things, like bread crumbs, its the only way to go about it. I find that if I give, or if people just want direct details, then that leaves you open to attack by them and they have something to pin on you or talk ***t about you with...that's how many jealous or just crab in the bucket people are...so its better not to feed them. Im to the point now where I can just look at or observe for a few seconds a person and already know their being, their potentials, their energy, ect, and I do my best to not even engage most people because ive spent years coming from all angles and just know how the story plays out. If they happen to change its immediately recognizable by me then I treat them how they are...always how people are on the spot at that moment...most don't change, they usually just degrade...which is weird to me, I think its just my personality and make up, but ive totally transformed myself over the years, multiple times, and I don't see how others don't...its like they lack a certain part of the brain that reflects and reprograms

 

[Stuart]

It's an endless debate as to what amount exactly is physiological...I think the amount you'd find in milk gives a good intuition. Without stress, you have no craving and may not need anything more than some lactose. I believe even Peat would agree. And yes I personally believe hyperglycaemia is one factor in modern disease, which would be relevant for populations drinking litres of sodas daily - after all, diabetes is on the rise so I would not be surprised if they were insulin resistant and thus often hyperglycaemic from drinking all that. Whether insulin resistance was caused by PUFA or excess sugar is another question, some authors speculate that you need both but not always.

Food for thought. Thanks. My own experience so far is that as long as pufas are avoided you just don't feel like making a pig of yourself on sugar. I just love that self limiting feeling. It's so new. So maybe the hyperglycemia is just as much from the pufas directly making you want to overeat sugar as from the inlammatory damage the pufas are doing. Maybe the pufa infammation can make you overconsume (or just want to overconsume) sugar.

I definitely think you can overeat sugar. It's just that really lowering pufas seems to have destroyed the urge. Love it

 

[EnoreeG]

It's also fun being really lean and eating the way I do around people, they trip out when I eat.

now days when people ask me what I eat, and I talk about how I drink a ton of milk its like what everything is based around...they keep trying to pretend its not true like im lying,

I guess the world is balanced and it takes all types.

I agree with Zachs -- people trip out when I eat veggies and enjoy it. And I love it.

If I ate your milk and sugar pboy, I'd feel as horrible as you would on my cucumbers and kale! If there's a worldwide famine, for sure we won't have to compete. If there's a worldwide insurrection and breakdown in communication and transportation, be sure and have a cow or goat handy. I already have my veggie garden.