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Strenuous Exercise Can Have The Same Effects As Sepsis

haidut

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Ray has mentioned numerous times how even a mild mechanical stress to the intestine can make it release serotonin and endotoxin. He has said that running is the worst of all exercises due to the leaky gut syndrome it causes and the ensuing "low grade sepsis". Well, it looks like he is right once again. According to this study, in all but the most highly trained athletes, several hours of strenuous activity produced a blood profile similar to the one of patients admitted to the hospital with sepsis.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/podca ... the-blood/

"...Researchers sampled the blood of 17 runners before and after a 24-hour ultramarathon—where runners covered anywhere from 75 to 130 miles on foot. During the race, their guts got leaky—due to a lack of blood flow to the intestines, and the physical trauma from so many jarring miles. Gut bacteria escaped into the blood, where some released toxins. The runners' bodies then responded by launching an immune response, and inflammation set in. Some runners actually had blood profiles identical to those of patients admitted to the hospital with blood poisoning, or sepsis. But the most well-trained competitors avoided the problem. Their bodies launched a counterattack, unleashing anti-inflammatory compounds to tamp down their bodies' immune overreaction. The authors say just four hours of activity is extreme enough to kick off this chain of inflammation. Suggesting it's key to gradually build up to new personal bests, even if they're not ultraworthy. As has long been said: slow and steady wins the race.
 
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Hugh Johnson

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haidut said:
But the most well-trained competitors avoided the problem. Their bodies launched a counterattack, unleashing anti-inflammatory compounds to tamp down their bodies' immune overreaction. The authors say just four hours of activity is extreme enough to kick off this chain of inflammation. Suggesting it's key to gradually build up to new personal bests, even if they're not ultraworthy. As has long been said: slow and steady wins the race.

I'd say this is pretty important too. Running might be OK if you can manage the stress and recovery. Though I'd still rather avoid the hungry skeleton look it tends to give people.
 

mt_dreams

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I wonder if the gut starts leaking at the onset of strenuous exercise, or if this is something that occurs only if being done for several hours. I doubt much that anybody here is a long distance runner, but we probably have a decent amount of people doing short stints of exercise be it for work or pleasure.
 

burtlancast

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Could this be one explanation on why exercising late in the day delays sleep at night ?
 
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Might as well sit on the couch under an x-ray lamp or let someone yell at you for twenty minutes.
 
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Let's remember that this is based on an ultramarathon, which is at the far end of the spectrum for exercise intensity.

Regular exercise like jogging, running and resistance training are all pro-Peat in the sense that they promote increased mitochondrial density, more blood vessels, better tissue oxygenation, better lung capacity and more.
 
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Okay I'll set my lamp to "low" in that case :cool:
 

haidut

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cantstoppeating said:
Let's remember that this is based on an ultramarathon, which is at the far end of the spectrum for exercise intensity.

Regular exercise like jogging, running and resistance training are all pro-Peat in the sense that they promote increased mitochondrial density, more blood vessels, better tissue oxygenation, better lung capacity and more.

More blood vessels is actually not a good thing unless you are trying to heal a wound or something. Virtually all anti-cancer drugs have some VEGF inhibiting action.
 
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haidut said:
cantstoppeating said:
Let's remember that this is based on an ultramarathon, which is at the far end of the spectrum for exercise intensity.

Regular exercise like jogging, running and resistance training are all pro-Peat in the sense that they promote increased mitochondrial density, more blood vessels, better tissue oxygenation, better lung capacity and more.

More blood vessels is actually not a good thing unless you are trying to heal a wound or something. Virtually all anti-cancer drugs have some VEGF inhibiting action.

Interesting; If the context is cancer, then I'm sure it's bad.

If the context is increased muscle mass (not to the extent of bodybuilders) due to moderate concentric resistance training then the increased vascular network as a consequence for the increased need for nutrient supply and oxygenation is a pro-metabolic adaptation.

I think this is another case of too-much-is-bad-and-not-enough-is-also-bad but as usual Peat tends communicate the downsides of extremes, while being mute on the benefits of moderation, without explicitly differentiating between the two.
 
A

Anonymous

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So I went to the gym did a pretty strenuous chest workout but it was only 25-30 minutes. I noticed a sharp decline in mood after the workout. I feel fine in regards to body temperature but am very fatigued. Am I overreacting here or is this a rush of serotonin? Also, I have been taking cyproheptadine throughout the day which certainly is contributing to the fatigue.
 

4peatssake

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cantstoppeating said:
... but as usual Peat tends communicate the downsides of extremes, while being mute on the benefits of moderation, without explicitly differentiating between the two.
That's a harsh indictment of someone with an impressive body of work.
 
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4peatssake said:
cantstoppeating said:
... but as usual Peat tends communicate the downsides of extremes, while being mute on the benefits of moderation, without explicitly differentiating between the two.
That's a harsh indictment of someone with an impressive body of work.

Well feel free to send Peat's lawyers an email and let them contact my lawyers and we'll proceed from there.
 
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JRMoney15 said:
So I went to the gym did a pretty strenuous chest workout but it was only 25-30 minutes. I noticed a sharp decline in mood after the workout. I feel fine in regards to body temperature but am very fatigued. Am I overreacting here or is this a rush of serotonin? Also, I have been taking cyproheptadine throughout the day which certainly is contributing to the fatigue.

I felt moderately anxious after a pretty tough workout yesterday, and later that night I felt dull. Even after making sure to not push myself to far which I can do very easily. If I workout too hard, I tend to get constipated with severe depression for days apart from the debilitating soreness lol. But I'm not very consistent so i probably lack some necessary conditioning. It seems like salt is a pretty effective mood booster post workout which could be because I sweat buckets when i lift.

I think olympic lifting might alleviate a lot of the issues I have with the typical strength training methods. There is little to no eccentric lifting apart from squatting. Dropping the bumper weights after each rep only performing the concentric portion results in significantly less DOMS and fatigue from what I understand. But i don't have a good place to slam weights down and they are pretty expensive.
 

tara

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cantstoppeating said:
I think this is another case of too-much-is-bad-and-not-enough-is-also-bad but as usual Peat tends communicate the downsides of extremes, while being mute on the benefits of moderation, without explicitly differentiating between the two.
I don't think Peat is mute on the benefits of moderate concentric exercise. He has recommended it. You may have a different idea than him of what counts as a moderate. It varies from person to person and over time depending on physical state - probably varies quite a bit between a fit and healthy young man and a sick elderly one.
 
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tara said:
cantstoppeating said:
I think this is another case of too-much-is-bad-and-not-enough-is-also-bad but as usual Peat tends communicate the downsides of extremes, while being mute on the benefits of moderation, without explicitly differentiating between the two.
I don't think Peat is mute on the benefits of moderate concentric exercise. He has recommended it. You may have a different idea than him of what counts as a moderate. It varies from person to person and over time depending on physical state - probably varies quite a bit between a fit and healthy young man and a sick elderly one.

Funny, the same two people on the same topic, let's take a trip down memory lane.
 

XPlus

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Exercise has to be followed by adequate recovery, where recovery has to counter the stress incurred, completely - reaching a breakeven point.
An idea a lot of sporty people aren't in touch with.

The idea of doing high intensity exercise for 2 hours 5 days a week at any cost is counterproductive.
The lack of sleep, inadequate and inappropriate nutrition, toxic burdens along with overexercise is just another recipe for disease.

Consistent light activity throughout the day sounds more productive as well as reasonable long-term strategy to stay fit.
 

burtlancast

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cantstoppeating said:
I think this is another case of too-much-is-bad-and-not-enough-is-also-bad but as usual Peat tends communicate the downsides of extremes, while being mute on the benefits of moderation, without explicitly differentiating between the two.

I think that's a very valid critique of Peat.

I could relate this to his position on milk ( all milk is good) or sugar in cancer ( not a problem), teflon coatings,...

Many people can interpret his words the wrong way, in the sense they take it at face value, as an absolute, without understanding the context, which very often is at one scientific extreme.

This is too why i've said we need to separate Ray's central points ( PUFAS being non essential, the role of inflammation, CO2, salt) from his minor ones, which appear controversial simply because he hasn't taken the time to detail the context and/or hasn't taken into account opposing evidence.
 

burtlancast

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Apprently, exercise stimulates neurogenesis:

From Wikipedia ( for whatever it's worth):

Scientists have shown that physical activity in the form of voluntary exercise results in an increase in the number of newborn neurons in the hippocampus of aging mice. The same study demonstrates an enhancement in learning of the "runner" (physically active) mice.[68][69] Recent research has shown that brain-derived neurotrophic factor and insulin-like growth factor 1 are key mediators of exercise-induced neurogenesis.[70] Exercise increases the uptake of IGF-1 from the bloodstream into various brain regions, including the hippocampus. In addition, IGF-1 alters c-fos expression in the hippocampus. When IGF-1 is blocked, exercise no longer induces neurogenesis.[70] Other research demonstrated that exercising mice that did not produce beta-endorphin, a mood-elevating hormone, had no change in neurogenesis. Yet, mice that did produce this hormone, along with exercise, exhibited an increase in newborn cells and their rate of survival.[71] While the association between exercise-mediated neurogenesis and enhancement of learning remains unclear, this study could have strong implications in the fields of aging and/or Alzheimer's disease.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neurogene ... _reduction
 

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