Steroid Cycle: Test P + Masteron Questions & Discussion

[NextLevel_]

Guys @olive @sebastian_r @Mark21 @TheBeard & all others

I want to include an oral (like I said before) for about 4-6 weeks to my T-P/T-PP cycle. Goal here again is to gain strength (strength to bw ratio), cut a little bit of water / build quality lean muscle, perform better, recover faster

Now the question is which one to choose: Anavar, Turinabol or Winstrol

I heard that Winstrol is the strongest one in terms of effects (strength gain, lean muscle mass). Probably also with the harshest side effects. Liver toxicity / dry joints. This could probably be kept under control with lowest effective dosage and taking breaks for 1-2 days after every 3 days of usage like sebastian mentioned.

I have experimented with Anavar (10-20mg/day) last year for about a month or so (without taking additional T though), didnt feel too much of it. Maybe a little strength gain, looked a little bit leaner (abs more visible). I have heard that to really get the full benefits of Anavar, one must take about 50mg/day alongside T.
Also with T-bol couple month later. That was about only 10 mg/day alongside EQ, but it was only like 3-4 weeks in total. Got stronger, muscles felt pumped soon after starting exercise, veins visible when training. More of a harder look as well.

Whats your opinion, which should I include to get the most effect? Mainly I am looking to gain more strength (strength to bw ratio) with the inclusion of the oral.

Thank you.

 

[Satellite]

Absolutely. Raw size here is not the goal. For that the cycle/dosages needed to be much higher I guess.
Recovery - being able to do more work is the goal as well as getting stronger. Also feeling good, ready to attack every day / every training session without being run down from the previous days.

Ok. Yaaaasssss. For me, I noticed improving my sensitivity brings equal results with milder compounds, so less side effects.

Definitely check out westside barbell. Using their methods I add ten pounds a week to my lifts (without gear) and never overtrain- unless I go too heavy on speed work or too much conditioning and too little sleep.

 

[Satellite]

Hope you can resolve the insecurities surrounding your masculinity, sounds like it’s taking a lot of place in your life

All your statements are garbage and only reflects your emotional bias. Keep it to the science buddy, no one cares about your opinions of me.

 

[Satellite]

Guys @olive @sebastian_r @Mark21 @TheBeard & all others

I want to include an oral (like I said before) for about 4-6 weeks to my T-P/T-PP cycle. Goal here again is to gain strength (strength to bw ratio), cut a little bit of water / build quality lean muscle, perform better, recover faster

Now the question is which one to choose: Anavar, Turinabol or Winstrol

I heard that Winstrol is the strongest one in terms of effects (strength gain, lean muscle mass). Probably also with the harshest side effects. Liver toxicity / dry joints. This could probably be kept under control with lowest effective dosage and taking breaks for 1-2 days after every 3 days of usage like sebastian mentioned.

I have experimented with Anavar (10-20mg/day) last year for about a month or so (without taking additional T though), didnt feel too much of it. Maybe a little strength gain, looked a little bit leaner (abs more visible). I have heard that to really get the full benefits of Anavar, one must take about 50mg/day alongside T.
Also with T-bol couple month later. That was about only 10 mg/day alongside EQ, but it was only like 3-4 weeks in total. Got stronger, muscles felt pumped soon after starting exercise, veins visible when training. More of a harder look as well.

Whats your opinion, which should I include to get the most effect? Mainly I am looking to gain more strength (strength to bw ratio) with the inclusion of the oral.

Thank you.

Halodrol™

 

[NextLevel_]

Halodrol™

Really? This looks like some prohormone stuff with some nasty added bull**** in it. Probably more side effects than regular AAS.

 

[Satellite]

Really? This looks like some prohormone stuff with some nasty added bull**** in it. Probably more side effects than regular AAS.

That nasty bull**** is probably still used by Russian weightlifters today.

Just throwing it out there as an option. Stronger isn’t always better when your sensitivity is proper.

No side effects for me. Just lean muscle gains and tons of strength. I recently squatted 545 at 225 lbs bw.

 

[Mark21]

I think you'll find much better answers on a forum dedicated to steroids TBH, but anything non-aromatizing or minimally aromatizing is going to mean less water weight. Less water weight may mean better relative strength at the end of a cycle, but not necessarily. More water weight tends to actually make for a more anabolic environment, which might actually be preferable when we remember that water weight sheds pretty fast following a cycle.

Maybe worth considering here is the idea that relative strength is dependent on genetic endowment, meaning that at any given stage of muscular development, there is going to be a constant of CNS efficiency that determines the ratio of muscular development to maximal output, all else (like technical skill and training) being equal.

As I see it, non-aromatizing steroids are useful for getting a boost without soliciting unwanted attention. If sport is the only object, I would consider the heavy hitters like d-bol, anadrol, test. If Est gets to high you can take an AI.

 

[sebastian_r]

Winstrol is really harsh on the system. Anavar I don't like, especially for a men that is already doing 300mg Test/week.

Turinabol is a favorite of powerlifters. Can confirm, got great improvements of strength out of it.

Though take into consideration that orals can sometimes have long detection times, google "Jon Jones Turinabol pulsing". But this is rocket since level testing from USADA.

Since you already pinning, I don't think you should limit yourself to the orals. You could look into primobolan and doing a frontload to get levels up right from the start (comes in the longer Enanthate ester). Though detection time of the Enanthate ester sucks.

Alternatively look into nandrolone phenylpropionate for strenght, but do some reading about suppression, heard that nandrolone can make PCT tougher.

Edit: If you use Winstrol 3-4 days per week you will probably be fine in terms of sides.

 

[NextLevel_]

I think you'll find much better answers on a forum dedicated to steroids TBH, but anything non-aromatizing or minimally aromatizing is going to mean less water weight. Less water weight may mean better relative strength at the end of a cycle, but not necessarily. More water weight tends to actually make for a more anabolic environment, which might actually be preferable when we remember that water weight sheds pretty fast following a cycle.

Maybe worth considering here is the idea that relative strength is dependent on genetic endowment, meaning that at any given stage of muscular development, there is going to be a constant of CNS efficiency that determines the ratio of muscular development to maximal output, all else (like technical skill and training) being equal.

As I see it, non-aromatizing steroids are useful for getting a boost without soliciting unwanted attention. If sport is the only object, I would consider the heavy hitters like d-bol, anadrol, test. If Est gets to high you can take an AI.

Thank you. And I can definitely see your point. Thing is I will compete in a certain weight class, so I can’t bulk up too much. That’s why the idea is to improve performance, rather than pure gains.

 

[NextLevel_]

Winstrol is really harsh on the system. Anavar I don't like, especially for a men that is already doing 300mg Test/week.

Turinabol is a favorite of powerlifters. Can confirm, got great improvements of strength out of it.

Though take into consideration that orals can sometimes have long detection times, google "Jon Jones Turinabol pulsing". But this is rocket since level testing from USADA.

Since you already pinning, I don't think you should limit yourself to the orals. You could look into primobolan and doing a frontload to get levels up right from the start (comes in the longer Enanthate ester). Though detection time of the Enanthate ester sucks.

Alternatively look into nandrolone phenylpropionate for strenght, but do some reading about suppression, heard that nandrolone can make PCT tougher.

Edit: If you use Winstrol 3-4 days per week you will probably be fine in terms of sides.

Why you don’t like Anavar with Test?

Yeah, I am aware of the Jon Jones situation. I like T-Bol as well. However, I don’t know about the detection times. People used to take it up to 3-7 days before competition and got tested clean. In 2016 they found a new metabolite which can be detected for a longer time. I can’t find information on it for how long exactly. There was one study where it showed that the M2 metabolite I believe is detectable for at least 2 weeks. My guess would be 3-6 weeks as for the other orals (which is usually 3-8 weeks), but some sources say it can be detacted for up to a year, which is crazy.

Primobolan I think is good. Expensive though. From what I have read it can only be detected for about 5 weeks. So this could be an option. Would you think it has any performance enhancing qualities? It is considered very mild.

I will look into NPP. Any ideas on detection times here?

 

[olive]

Why you don’t like Anavar with Test?

Yeah, I am aware of the Jon Jones situation. I like T-Bol as well. However, I don’t know about the detection times. People used to take it up to 3-7 days before competition and got tested clean. In 2016 they found a new metabolite which can be detected for a longer time. I can’t find information on it for how long exactly. There was one study where it showed that the M2 metabolite I believe is detectable for at least 2 weeks. My guess would be 3-6 weeks as for the other orals (which is usually 3-8 weeks), but some sources say it can be detacted for up to a year, which is crazy.

Primobolan I think is good. Expensive though. From what I have read it can only be detected for about 5 weeks. So this could be an option. Would you think it has any performance enhancing qualities? It is considered very mild.

I will look into NPP. Any ideas on detection times here?

As someone on NPP I can’t attest that it’s strength qualities are subpar compared to even small doses of tbol or anavar. NPP detection times are very long, up to 6 months. It’s also worth mentioning that NPP should never be stacked with testosterone as together it creates a synergistic estrogen and prolactin inducing effect. 10mg dbol/day solo feels stronger than 1400mg NPP/week in my experience.

Run tbol or anavar. 5mg AM + 5mg PM.

 

[boxers]

I never noticed any benefit from using anavar or proviron. Winstrol was incredible, the strength, vascular, confidence.

 

[olive]

I never noticed any benefit from using anavar or proviron. Winstrol was incredible, the strength, vascular, confidence.

Winstrol is definitely strong. Just harsh on joints in my experience. Also significantly more liver toxic than anavar or tbol. It’s a risk tolerance thing I guess. If OP wants optimal results winstrol would be a better choice over anavar but anavar would be safer.

 

[boxers]

I tried taking precautions and used liver support. I only used it for 3 weeks and usually took 1-2 days off a week. Usually 30mg daily. Its extremely strong and the effects were noticeable. It seemed to make my jaw/face much defined . I always had a rounder face, i really think i got more looks from women, but i could just be imagining that.

Interesting about anavar. I didnt feel a difference or could tell any improvement in strength, but my mid cycle bloods showed a very worrisome lipid panel

 

[olive]

I tried taking precautions and used liver support. I only used it for 3 weeks and usually took 1-2 days off a week. Usually 30mg daily. Its extremely strong and the effects were noticeable. It seemed to make my jaw/face much defined . I always had a rounder face, i really think i got more looks from women, but i could just be imagining that.

Interesting about anavar. I didnt feel a difference or could tell any improvement in strength, but my mid cycle bloods showed a very worrisome lipid panel

Lipid enzyme changes on anavar are mechanistic and return to normal very quickly after cessation. 30mg is likely excessive. You would have noticed very similar effects at 10mg/day. The facial changes you noted are simply due to GR/MR inhibition, or more simply water manipulation.

 

[boxers]

luckily i didnt notice any side effects like joint pain, hair loss etc. i will have to get labs again to make sure everything returned to baseline

 

[NextLevel_]

Very interesting.
I had a one month experience with Anavar (10-20mg/day) and didn’t notice a major difference or performance enhancing effect.
T-bol at 10mg gave me a little more strength/power. Also confidence I think.
So I will probably either run T-bol again or use Winstrol, starting at 10mg, see how I feel and adjust from there. Sounds like @boxers you had pretty good effects on it!

 

[boxers]

Yeah i felt so awesome on it, i just wanted to stay on.

 

[TheBeard]

Why people would dabble with orals is beyond me.
Shoot Masteron already

 

[boxers]

Why people would dabble with orals is beyond me.
Shoot Masteron already

Thats what i will try next time around