Slippery Slope SUPPLEMENTS

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True. Another factor is people are so disconnected from themselves that they can't hear the signals of protest, or worse, regression as their body complains about what they pour in until it gets to crisis point.

This is so true. I think impatience is an even bigger problem. Not only do most people want a quick fix, but when they take the supplement and symptoms subside they don’t stop. RP so often says that phrase, “until symptoms subside”. The flip side of that coin is when they think their issues might be exacerbated by the multitude of supplements, and they go off of them to see, they just don’t wait long enough to let the body heal from the big mess. Taking fish oil for years took me years to undo.

 

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“There are a few reasons why people can have trouble absorbing vitamin D. Some factors that may reduce or block its absorption include:

Conditions such as celiac disease, chronic pancreatitis, Crohn's disease, and cystic fibrosis. These can all affect the intestines, preventing them from absorbing vitamin D found in food.

BMI (body mass index) higher than 30. Subcutaneous body fat can sequester, or trap, vitamin D, which is why deficiency is a greater concern in those who are obese.

Liver or kidney disease. Both diseases can negatively affect how your body processes vitamin D.

Kidney disease may cause a person to have trouble processing vitamin D to its active form, calcitriol, which is used throughout the body. Some forms of liver disease cause problems with fat absorption, also making it harder to absorb vitamin D.

Radiation treatment. This type of cancer treatment can make it harder for the intestines to absorb vitamin D.

Weight loss surgery. These procedures reduce the size of the stomach or bypass part of the small intestine, thus making it harder for the body to consume adequate levels of many vitamins and minerals including vitamin D.”

Muscle aches and fatigue could be a sign you're not absorbing enough vitamin D

Having vitamin D absorption issues could affect your bone health. Magnesium-rich and fatty foods can improve your absorption.

www.insider.com

 

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“Coconut oil lowers the requirement for vitamin E, and reduces the toxicity of the unsaturated fats (see Cleland, et al.), favoring effective respiration and improving thyroid and progesterone production.”
-Ray Peat

 

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“The effects of the phytoestrogens are very complex, because they modify the sensitivity of cells to natural estrogens, and also modify the metabolism of estrogens, with the result that the effects on a given tissue can be either pro-estrogenic and anti-estrogenic. For example, the flavonoids, naringenin, quercetin and kaempherol (kaempherol is an antioxidant, a phytoestrogen, and a mutagen) modify the metabolism of estradiol, causing increased bioavailability of both estrone and estradiol.” -Ray Peat

 

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“Why do plants make phytoestrogens? There is some information indicating that these compounds evolved to regulate the plants' interactions with other organisms--to attract bacteria, or to repel insects, for example, rather than just as pigment-forming materials. (Baker, 1995.) The fact that some of them bind to our "estrogen receptors" is probably misleading, because of their many other effects, including inhibiting enzyme functions involved in the regulation of steroids and prostaglandins. Their biochemistry in animals is much more complicated than that of natural estrogens, which is itself so complicated that we can only guess what the consequences might be when we change the concentration and the ratio of substances in that complex system.” -Ray Peat

 

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“When a person uses a drug, there is generally an awareness that the benefit has to be weighed against the side effects. But if something is treated as a “nutrient,” especially an “essential nutrient,” there is an implication that it won't produce undesirable side effects.” -Ray Peat

 

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And yet they still sell tons of cod liver based “fish oil” capsules in every store….

“Between the first and second world wars, cod liver oil was recommended as a vitamin supplement, at first as a source of vitamin A, and later as a source of vitamins A and D. But in the late 1940s, experimenters used it as the main fat in dogs' diet, and found that they all died from cancer, while the dogs on a standard diet had only a 5% cancer mortality. That sort of information, and the availability of synthetic vitamins, led to the decreased use of cod liver oil.” -Ray Peat

 

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“Through the 1970s, this sort of information about the harmful effects of the PUFA was being slowly assimilated by the culture, though many dietitians still spoke of “the essential fatty acids, vitamin F.” By 1980, it looked as though responsible researchers would see the promotion of cancer, heart disease, mitochondrial damage, hypothyroidism and immunosuppression caused by the polyunsaturated fats as their most important feature, and would see that there had never been a basis for believing that they were essential nutrients.” -Ray Peat

 

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This was posted by Warrior in another thread….


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PuSfV43Quuo



07:34 - ‘People’s symptoms improve when they stop taking their supplements’
17:12 - Contamination, fillers, pill casings, etc.
18:09 - What is Ray’s process for determining if something is safe or not?
22:13 - ‘Unnamed and unidentified nutrients in natural foods’
36:42 - Ray’s thoughts on the versatility of the body
51:57 - Ray expands on the relationship between aspirin and vitamin K
54:06 - Do people tend to be vitamin K deficient?
56:30 - If Ray could take any substance on a desert island what would it be?

 

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In the video posted above, at about the 12:30 minute mark Ray Peat talks about supplements working at first until they backfire and cause sensitivities, especially vitamin A, vitamin C, and riboflavin aka b2. This is a very good video you posted here @Warrior.

At the 22 minute mark he says any natural food is going to be purified, especially milk, and any supplements made chemically is going to be dirty “just in principle”

At the 43:40 minute mark of this interview RP says you can go without most vitamins for a couple of weeks as long as you still have energy. So you don’t need everything every day.

 

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Although several researchers have demonstrated that iron destroys vitamins, there is enough wishful thinking in industry, government, and the consuming public, that such mistakes can go on for generations before anyone can mobilize the resources to bring the truth to the public. 10 years ago, I thought it was a hopeful sign of increased awareness of iron's danger when the manufacturer of a new iron product mentioned in the Physician's Desk Reference that it hadn't yet been reported to cause cancer.” -Ray Peat

 

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I first bought bee pollen when I was 29, because I was into supplement and bee pollen had an endless list of benefits. The surprising thing I noticed, whuch wasn’t on that long list of benefits, is that I never had menstrual cramps taking it. I took it for decades. I never had one menopausal symptom either, not even one hot flash….

“Menopause, which marks the cessation of menstruation in women, is often accompanied by uncomfortable symptoms such as hot flushes, night sweats, mood changes and sleep disturbances (27Trusted Source).

Studies show that bee pollen may alleviate several menopausal symptoms.

In one study, 71% of women felt that their menopausal symptoms improved while taking bee pollen (27Trusted Source).

In another study, 65% of women taking a pollen supplement experienced fewer hot flashes. These women indicated other health improvements as well, such as better sleep, reduced irritability, less joint pain and improved mood and energy (28Trusted Source).

Moreover, a three-month study showed that women taking bee pollen supplements experienced significantly fewer menopausal symptoms. In addition, these supplements helped lower “bad” LDL cholesterol and raise “good” HDL cholesterol (29Trusted Source).“

Top 11 Health Benefits of Bee Pollen

Loaded with over 250 active substances, bee pollen has gained traction in the health community as a powerful supplement. Here are the top 11 health benefits of bee pollen.

www.healthline.com

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Stories like these are what makes me scared to experiment…

“I had started on T4 and T3 at 12.5mcg each, taken together with breakfast, in December 2021. I did not measure total cholesterol before starting. By February 2022 I began to notice a progressively accumulating fatigue which was worsened by adding T3 and seemed to get better by adding T4. This fatigue became debilitating by March 2022.

I had developed chronic diarrhea since the start of 2022. I got my blood drawn in February 2022 and my cholesterol was low - 146 mg/dL - possibly explaining why thyroid was not working for me.

I decided to wean off thyroid entirely, T3 first followed by T4. My teeth were chipping and I was experiencing chest pressure and immense fatigue. Due to these obstacles I had to wean off very gradually and was only able to get off thyroid completely, with a couple interspersed ER visits (feeling fatigued/horrible), by May 2022.

The chest pain returned when I tried about 15mg vitamin K over the course of a week in July 2022. The pain was intense, in my left pectoral, and aspirin brought instant relief. Vitamin D and aspirin helped for a couple weeks. When those stopped working, I panicked and went to the hospital, where after x rays, a CT scan, and a heart sonogram, they found nothing wrong, except iron deficiency for which I was recommended iron supplements. The diarrhea was still ongoing at this point.

In the beginning of November 2022 I tried progest-e which did not work well for me at all - I felt like I was suffocating and dying for 2-3 weeks. I have heard that this could be because I have too much goiter, which progest-e was rapidly reducing.”

Fatigue, Chest Pressure & Pain for 1 year

Hello all, I have been getting intense fatigue and chest pressure/pain for several months. It started as chest pressure when weaning off Thyroid. I had started on T4 and T3 at 12.5mcg each, taken together with breakfast, in December 2021. I did not measure total cholesterol before...

raypeatforum.com

 

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“For many years, I have been seeing more symptoms relieved by stopping all the chemical supplements, than by using them.” -Ray Peat

 

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“Bee pollen boasts an impressive nutritional profile.

It contains over 250 biologically active substances, including proteins, carbs, lipids, fatty acids, vitamins, minerals, enzymes and antioxidants (2).

Bee pollen granules consist of approximately (4):

Carbs: 40%
Protein: 35%
Water: 4–10%
Fats: 5%
Other substances: 5–15%
The latter category includes vitamins, minerals, antibiotics and antioxidants.

However, the pollen’s nutritional content depends on the plant source and season collected.

For instance, studies have shown that bee pollen collected from pine plants has approximately 7% protein, while pollen collected from date palm packs closer to 35% protein (2).

In addition, bee pollen harvested during springtime has a significantly different amino acid composition than pollen collected during the summer (2).“

“Bee pollen may boost your immune system, helping you avoid illnesses and unwanted reactions.

For one, research has shown that it may reduce the severity and onset of allergies.

In one study, bee pollen was shown to significantly reduce the activation of mast cells. Mast cells, when activated, release chemicals that trigger an allergic reaction (18Trusted Source).

Also, several test-tube studies have confirmed that bee pollen has strong antimicrobial properties.

Bee pollen extract was found to kill potentially harmful bacteria such as E. coli, Salmonella, Pseudomonas aeruginosa, as well as those that cause staph infections (19Trusted Source, 20Trusted Source).“

Top 11 Health Benefits of Bee Pollen

Loaded with over 250 active substances, bee pollen has gained traction in the health community as a powerful supplement. Here are the top 11 health benefits of bee pollen.

www.healthline.com

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Here is an alternative to taking thyroid supplements….

“Contrast hydrotherapy (application of hot and cold) to the neck and throat may stimulate thyroid function. It is done by alternating 3 minutes heat exposure with 1 minute cold. This is repeated three times for one set, and two to three sets are done per day.”

https://www.va.gov/WHOLEHEALTHLIBRARY/docs/Hypothyroidism.pdf

 

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“Typically, if you walk into a health food store and you speak with a store clerk or the manager about supplements you could benefit from in you have hypothyroidism, they will often recommend iodine and tyrosine (also known as L-tyrosine). If you take their advice you may be making a big mistake.

Just like iodine, tyrosine is an integral part of thyroid hormone production but supplementing with it has the potential to suppress thyroid activity.

In fact, there's not a single study out there that shows the ability of tyrosine to increase thyroid hormones, even when they are sub-par or too low. Tyrosine is the precursor to the neurotransmitter, dopamine, which in turn is a precursor to the adrenal "fight or flight" hormones, epinephrine and norepinephrine. Increased adrenal hormones, epinephrine and norepinephrine, will suppress thyroid function. Too much of these adrenal hormones can cause you to have:

anxiety and nervousness
heart palpitations
high blood pressure
headaches
insomnia
irritability
In addition, people who have migraine headaches should avoid tyrosine, as it can trigger migraine headaches and stomach upset.

"It's rare to be deficient in tyrosine. Low levels have been associated with low blood pressure, low body temperature, and an underactive thyroid. This does not mean, however, that taking tyrosine supplements will help any of these conditions." [1]

Dietary Sources of Tyrosine:

"Tyrosine is found in soy products, chicken, turkey, fish, peanuts, almonds, avocados, bananas, milk, cheese, yogurt, cottage cheese, lima beans, pumpkin seeds, and sesame seeds." [2]“

Why Tyrosine Can Ruin Your Chances With Hypothyroid Symptoms

Taking tyrosine supplements to help with low thyroid can backfire and suppress thyroid function further. Don't make this common mistake.

www.helpmychronicpain.com

 

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“Yes, you can overdose on vitamin D.

Since vitamin D is a hormone, it means that you can have serious consequences from taking too much. Unlike true vitamins like vitamin C, your body does not immediately eliminate excess vitamin D (because it is actually a hormone).

So, while vitamin D deficiency is linked to sleep (and health) issues; too high of a vitamin D level (through vitamin D supplementation) can also cause problems.

In other words, too much vitamin D is just as bad as too little.”

Vitamin D and Sleep - Dr. Gominak

Vitamin D deficiency is linked to most sleep (and health) issues. Learn the truth about vitamin D and how it can help restore your sleep naturally.

drgominak.com

 

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“, which is the raw material for producing many of the hormones of stress and adaptation, was known as early as 1934, but for several years it was considered to be an "inert" substance. A reason for this belief is that it was first tested on healthy young animals. Since these animals were already producing large amounts of pregnenolone (in the brain, adrenal glands, and gonads), additional pregnenolone had no effect.” -Ray Peat

 

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“While men do naturally produce progesterone, and can sometimes benefit from using it, it is not a male hormone. Some people get that impression, because some physicians recommend combining estrogen with either testosterone or progesterone, to protect against some of estrogen's side effects, but progesterone is the body's natural complement to estrogen. Used alone, progesterone often makes it unnecessary to use estrogen for hot flashes or insomnia, or other symptoms of menopause.” -Ray Peat