Shutting off serotonin turns lab rat study into an orgy

[NathanK]

This is an older 1970 study that I'm sure Ray has seen. I posted on the RPI FB group a week or two ago and thought I'd share: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1702805/

Researchers permanently shut down serotonin in adult male rats. Subsequent libido and "mounting" activity went through the roof. I think I recall them "mounting" up to 60x per hour compared to the average of 2

Researchers had a novel idea to make them lazy, unsocial, and unreproductive by administering 5-HTP. Worked like a charm.

The hair loss association can be ignored as it's not from some physiological function, but more from increased grooming/sexual behavior.

Unfortunately, zero serotonin does seem to have a negative effect of restless sleep. This was also replicated in cats: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/5312896

Anecdotally, after a month+ of cypro I concur with their findings except I sleep much better.

 

[goodandevil]

Nice!

 

[Dizzryda]

Anecdotally, after a month+ of cypro I concur with their findings except I sleep much better.

That's awesome. I'm curious how much cypro do you take? I'm still prone the zombie stage even when I take .5gms though not as bad anymore. I would like to experiment with a higher dose.

 

[NathanK]

post 105188

Anecdotally, after a month+ of cypro I concur with their findings except I sleep much better.

That's awesome. I'm curious how much cypro do you take? I'm still prone the zombie stage even when I take .5gms though not as bad anymore. I would like to experiment with a higher dose.

I might take a nibble if I feel any elevated stress during the day. I can probably withstand a couple mg and not feel any sleepiness. I probably take 2-3mg every other night on avg with no zombie or lowered dopamine effects. It stops the stress cycle enoùgh to allow me to gently close my eyes and sleep. Otherwise, I am still prone to occasional "second winds" that can keep me up and throw my sleep schedule out of whack. Cypro has had an overall good effect whether ive taken it recently or not. Its been a pleasant surprise. Few things match the hype like cypro has.

 

[mujuro]

Could this partially explain bromocriptine's incredible boost of libido, other than dopamine increase?

 

[NathanK]

post 105193 Could this partially explain bromocriptine's incredible boost of libido, other than dopamine increase?

Pramapexole is the same way and a raging libido is known as one of it's "sides". Serotonin and dopamine antagonize each other so it's likely a combination of both.

 

[lexis]

So the inability to fall in love is a nutritional issue?

Lot of illnesses have been psychologised and a lot of human behaviour have been medicalized

 

[daIllu]

Interesting, I guess this could be the reason why antidepressants that I've taken like Fluoxetine and Sertraline had this tendency to numb me which was always most noticeable with sex. I never liked antidepressants for this very reason even though they came with some slight feeling of high of some sort and calmness at times, kinda like being slightly drunk but the sexual numbness always bothered me and is the biggest reason I stopped using these medications.

Also alcohol seems to have similar effects although I heard some girl tell me she was most sexually aroused when she was drunk which I've never experienced though.

 

[NathanK]

post 105282 So the inability to fall in love is a nutritional issue?

Lot of illnesses have been psychologised and a lot of human behaviour have been medicalized

The answer is probably somewhere in between. A healthy metabolism probably does solve many considered psychiatric problems. Some people consider psychiatry just a last stop for doctors that can't cure their patients. Many people that follow Peat have already been told by their doctors that their libido/hypothyroidism/anxiety/low energy/adrenal fatigue problem is all in their head because their labs are within range. Of course, this study had nothing to do with love; just mating.

 

[answersfound]

post 105335

post 105282 So the inability to fall in love is a nutritional issue?

Lot of illnesses have been psychologised and a lot of human behaviour have been medicalized

The answer is probably somewhere in between. A healthy metabolism probably does solve many considered psychiatric problems. Some people consider psychiatry just a last stop for doctors that can't cure their patients. Many people that follow Peat have already been told by their doctors that their libido/hypothyroidism/anxiety/low energy/adrenal fatigue problem is all in their head because their labs are within range. Of course, this study had nothing to do with love; just mating.

I remember going into a doctors office and telling him about my ice cold hands and feet, my 95.5 degree temperature, exhaustion, etc. and he told me I was depressed and referred me to a psychiatrist....I truly wanted to punch him in the face...,im like no sh*t im depressed, I have all these symptoms and you have no explanation for this. I don't understand how so many people ride the fda gravy train popping a cocktail of all these medications, and are perfectly okay with all the side effects like loss of libido....the world is messed up

 

[mujuro]

post 105278

post 105193 Could this partially explain bromocriptine's incredible boost of libido, other than dopamine increase?

Pramapexole is the same way and a raging libido is known as one of it's "sides". Serotonin and dopamine antagonize each other so it's likely a combination of both.

That's funny - the reason I asked is because pramipexole does nothing of the sort for me. Libido is unaffected. Other impulses like binge eating are amplified. I have never taken pramipexole for longer than a week due to the hyperalgesia. All across my back it feels like every muscle is cramping, it pains me even to breathe. Horrible stuff.

 

[GAF]

Prami is great.

Any cramping I get is from pushing the aromatase inhibitor a bit too hard. No cramping related to prami for me, just libido and better sleep plus motivation and getting stuff done.

 

[lexis]

post 105335 Of course, this study had nothing to do with love; just mating.

Loving is part of mating.Lot of LSD experimenters claim to have achieved the feelings of 'ego destruction' and selfless love.

In spiritual development field,this is the desired destination.

The blogger pranarupa has an article on the benefits of meditation.

To be able to love,enjoy art,learn ...etc are very much related

 

[michael94]

post 105370

post 105335 Of course, this study had nothing to do with love; just mating.

Loving is part of mating.Lot of LSD experimenters claim to have achieved the feelings of 'ego destruction' and selfless love.

In spiritual development field,this is the desired destination.

The blogger pranarupa has an article on the benefits of meditation.

To be able to love,enjoy art,learn ...etc are very much related

Not always, you can scratch a sexual itch so to speak with minimal emotional attachment. I think that's what he was getting at, 0 serotonin is probably not good overall

 

[haidut]

post 105178 This is an older 1970 study that I'm sure Ray has seen. I posted on the RPI FB group a week or two ago and thought I'd share: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1702805/

Researchers permanently shut down serotonin in adult male rats. Subsequent libido and "mounting" activity went through the roof. I think I recall them "mounting" up to 60x per hour compared to the average of 2

Researchers had a novel idea to make them lazy, unsocial, and unreproductive by administering 5-HTP. Worked like a charm.

The hair loss association can be ignored as it's not from some physiological function, but more from increased grooming/sexual behavior.

Unfortunately, zero serotonin does seem to have a negative effect of restless sleep. This was also replicated in cats: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/5312896

Anecdotally, after a month+ of cypro I concur with their findings except I sleep much better.

I spoke to a person who was a student of Shillito (or so he claims). He said that rats started mounting/humping cats when depleted of serotonin. So, we can conclude that serotonin is one of the primary constituents of the survival instinct and the instinct can be suppressed. The opposite is also true - triggering one's survival instinct raises serotonin. So, if you are constant stress or struggling in some way, metabolism/libido will not be working well.

 

[NathanK]

post 105387

post 105178 This is an older 1970 study that I'm sure Ray has seen. I posted on the RPI FB group a week or two ago and thought I'd share: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1702805/

Researchers permanently shut down serotonin in adult male rats. Subsequent libido and "mounting" activity went through the roof. I think I recall them "mounting" up to 60x per hour compared to the average of 2

Researchers had a novel idea to make them lazy, unsocial, and unreproductive by administering 5-HTP. Worked like a charm.

The hair loss association can be ignored as it's not from some physiological function, but more from increased grooming/sexual behavior.

Unfortunately, zero serotonin does seem to have a negative effect of restless sleep. This was also replicated in cats: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/5312896

Anecdotally, after a month+ of cypro I concur with their findings except I sleep much better.

I spoke to a person who was a student of Shillito (or so he claims). He said that rats started mounting/humping cats when depleted of serotonin. So, we can conclude that serotonin is one of the primary constituents of the survival instinct and the instinct can be suppressed. The opposite is also true - triggering one's survival instinct raises serotonin. So, if you are constant stress or struggling in some way, metabolism/libido will not be working well.

This is very interesting. I am beginning to see serotonin in the brain is as an inhibition hormone. Raising and lowering will have different effect. The mice trying to mate with a potential predatory animal, would be an example of a lack of serotonin allowing other hormones/neurotransmitters to "run wild". Under normal circumstances, under stress or the anticipation of stress, serotonin would suppress certain functions/chemicals in order to conserve energy for the coming fight or flight functions. And mating isn't one of them.

In the case of hibernating bears, winter is the upcoming stress. Serotonin is a constituent of the survival instinct. Serotonin is activated by either less sunlight, temperature, or predictive internal clock causing them to start suppressing active-life functions and ultimately sleeping off the winter.

 

[Joocy_J]

post 105335 Of course, this study had nothing to do with love; just mating.

Loving is part of mating.

Not for men.

 

[Such_Saturation]

 

[Gl;itch.e]

post 105282 So the inability to fall in love is a nutritional issue?

Lot of illnesses have been psychologised and a lot of human behaviour have been medicalized

http://www.raypeatforum.com/forum/v...0&sid=270d80608ab2fc84d45f30abdb5993e0#p49981
you may get something out of this thread lexis

 

[charlie]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpYeekQkAdc