Should I be worried about TUDCA?

[June]

From this article, should I be wary about taking TUDCA?

Bile acids (taurocholic acid, taurodeoxycholic acid, taurochenodeoxycholic acid, tauroursodeoxycholic acid) develop esophageal cancer in a rat model of duodenoesophageal anastomosis after total gastrectomy - Hashimoto - Annals of Esophagus

 

[Healthseeker]

I've took it, I don't think it's good for you. I've never taken the prescription bile salts, but I imagine there's a difference in those and the tudca. If anybody knows, I'd like to know the difference.

I believe that if you use tudca your guts will get used to it, and absorb more bile than they used too and that's not good

 

[golder]

@Lokzo is knowledgable here. Would be good to hear his input.

 

[frannybananny]

@Lokzo is knowledgable here. Would be good to hear his input.

I've only taken TUDCA 2 times during the day and I must say it gave me such a feeling of well being and slow calm energy that lasted well into the evening, helped with digestion and got rid of all bloating. I had researched all about it and could find no wrong side effects and that it helped reduce fatty liver and helped in losing weight. I plan on taking it one or two times a week during the day along with NAC. I would take it everyday but it made me feel so good that I didn't want to go to sleep at night!

 

[Ben.]

I believe that if you use tudca your guts will get used to it, and absorb more bile than they used too and that's not good

Isnt that a result of increased bile flow and the following reabsorption? How is that "bad". I mean whatever garbage is in the bile is there nonetheless. With more bileflow there is a higher chance of it being eliminated trough the stool eventually, especially with certain fibreous foods. Or am i missing something?

Let alone increased fat soluble vitamin uptake, better transit time etc.

 

[Lokzo]

 

[Healthseeker]

Isnt that a result of increased bile flow and the following reabsorption? How is that "bad". I mean whatever garbage is in the bile is there nonetheless. With more bileflow there is a higher chance of it being eliminated trough the stool eventually, especially with certain fibreous foods. Or am i missing something?

Let alone increased fat soluble vitamin uptake, better transit time etc.

It's a problem when you stop taking it.
Additionally I noticed side effects while taking it, ashy skin, a general not fresh healthy look to my face tho it could have been the source. I only took one brand

 

[Ben.]

It's a problem when you stop taking it.
Additionally I noticed side effects while taking it, ashy skin, a general not fresh healthy look to my face tho it could have been the source. I only took one brand

Mhhhh ... is it? I thought tudca increased the microbes making tudca.
Your experience does indeed not sound good. You took it for liver issues i assume?

 

[June]

This is super helpful to hear all these anecdotes. Please keep them coming. @Healthseeker I am curious if you might have experienced detox symptoms. I have read somewhere that it's best to start on a low dosage so your body can drain the toxins. Which brand did you take?

 

[artist]

I didn’t notice anything bad when I took (Double Wood 500mg/d) TUDCA the first time around, but I was in such a bad state at the time it may have been hard to tell. I felt like it was helping a bit with general well-being, and I reacted poorly to a lot of other supplements during that period. I was actually about to start taking it again.

Edit: removing the last part of my statement as I think it was misleading

 

[golder]

I didn’t notice anything bad when I took (Double Wood 500mg/d) TUDCA the first time around, but I was in such a bad state at the time it may have been hard to tell. I felt like it was helping a bit with general well-being, and I reacted poorly to a lot of other supplements during that period. I was actually about to start taking it again but I’ve noticed a big turn against it when researching it now vs even two years ago. There are a lot more skeptical reviews out there now, whereas it was being touted as virtually side-effect free and a panacea for liver issues then.

I don’t understand why it’s suddenly a lot more dangerous? I remember reading a few people on forums who have been taking it for years at 250-500mg a day seemingly without any issues. What is the potential causes for concern?

 

[artist]

@James b I didn’t mean to imply that it actually is more dangerous. I should be more clear: I doubt it’s dangerous, but maybe as it’s gotten more popular, because more people have used it there is always going to be that minority for whom it isn’t a good fit. The claim I have seen against it is mainly that it can inhibit absorption of cholesterol (haidut’s written about this). I feel like it’s one of those things to use for a stint to clean up the liver, but probably not for long-term use. Too many people have said it helped them immensely and in ways taurine never could for me to think it’s not worth looking at. If you’re teetering on the edge with low hormone status or something I’d consider finding another solution for the liver but maybe someone can explain the cholesterol thing better and it’s not actually a big deal. I just can’t figure out how that works.

 

[frannybananny]

@James b I didn’t mean to imply that it actually is more dangerous. I should be more clear: I doubt it’s dangerous, but maybe as it’s gotten more popular, because more people have used it there is always going to be that minority for whom it isn’t a good fit. The claim I have seen against it is mainly that it can inhibit absorption of cholesterol (haidut’s written about this). I feel like it’s one of those things to use for a stint to clean up the liver, but probably not for long-term use. Too many people have said it helped them immensely and in ways taurine never could for me to think it’s not worth looking at. If you’re teetering on the edge with low hormone status or something I’d consider finding another solution for the liver but maybe someone can explain the cholesterol thing better and it’s not actually a big deal. I just can’t figure out how that works.

I wish haidut would chime in here and explain the cholesterol thing and Tudca. Tudca might make it higher if it can't be absorbed? I have genetically high cholesterol and I certainly don't want it to go higher but TUDCA has only impacted me in a very positive way... high energy and ready to tackle projects all day long with a feeling of well being.... almost too good to be true. I don't understand the negative comments here about Tudca.

 

[artist]

I wish haidut would chime in here and explain the cholesterol thing and Tudca. Tudca might make it higher if it can't be absorbed? I have genetically high cholesterol and I certainly don't want it to go higher but TUDCA has only impacted me in a very positive way... high energy and ready to tackle projects all day long with a feeling of well being.... almost too good to be true. I don't understand the negative comments here about Tudca.

My understanding is that it may inhibit absorption of cholesterol from food into the body somehow, so that might be desirable in your case! I’m glad TUDCA is helping you. I hope I’m not contributing to a negative impression of it on here. I regard it as a worthwhile supplement to try, it seems more substantial/therapeutic and safer than most other liver support supplements out there like NAC or milk thistle.

 

[frannybananny]

My understanding is that it may inhibit absorption of cholesterol from food into the body somehow, so that might be desirable in your case! I’m glad TUDCA is helping you. I hope I’m not contributing to a negative impression of it on here. I regard it as a worthwhile supplement to try, it seems more substantial/therapeutic and safer than most other liver support supplements out there like NAC or milk thistle.

So now what's wrong with NAC and Milk Thistle? I was just going to take some NAC and took milk thistle last night! Lol.

 

[artist]

So now what's wrong with NAC and Milk Thistle? I was just going to take some NAC and took milk thistle last night! Lol.

Lol nothing! Okay sorry I gotta really choose my words carefully. Milk thistle is an herb and I feel herbs can be a lot more scattershot in their effects than something like a single compound like TUDCA because one herb can contain so many different compounds. NAC can chelate minerals and I didn’t react well to it personally because it is a histamine liberator. I have histamine intolerance though and many other people do fine with NAC. Also worth noting some people are more sensitive to supplements than others so the “risks” might be basically nothing depending on your situation and dosage. And of course this is just my own research and philosophy talking.

 

[Healthseeker]

This is super helpful to hear all these anecdotes. Please keep them coming. @Healthseeker I am curious if you might have experienced detox symptoms. I have read somewhere that it's best to start on a low dosage so your body can drain the toxins. Which brand did you take?

From morphogen nutrition. I took it cause liver damage from too much wormwood that I took cause parasites. So my state is probably different from yours. I didn't know what I was doing then. But, to drain toxins you want a little Metamucil in your system. As far as detox symptoms from tudca, no, are you killing off candidia? Besides feeling bad, I only recognize the symptom of foul smelling sweat with die off. But the tudca didn't cause any symptoms it helped with digestion. Well a little fluttering heartbeat with high dose before you get used to it. See, I was treating cholistasis. Buts it's not a cure

 

[Healthseeker]

Mhhhh ... is it? I thought tudca increased the microbes making tudca.
Your experience does indeed not sound good. You took it for liver issues i assume?

My understanding is the microbes act on the bile salts as mechanism where they send signals back to the liver. So you might be sending a signal you don't want to send, like "everything's fine, be more anabolic" when it's not actually optimal. But I mean I don't really know how it all works and in this case we're talking about good microbes in the small intestine, and it's all going to depend on what alls wrong with op in first place.

 

[June]

Thanks @Healthseeker . Upon further research I read mentions about the problem with cholesterol and iron absorption. I have normal cholesterol but I am anemic, so a little concerned how TUDCA might affect this. I have a very rare case of SIBO/CANDIDA where anything I take that makes it opportune causes me to hemorrhage (think ladies' monthly except x100) I almost didn't make it out alive twice. The issue is still with me if I'm not careful. I just went through a bout of full on bleeding for a full month which I kept at bay with Allicin+Apple Cider Vinegar. This is telling me my stomach acid/digestive system is compromised. This bleeding issue started in 2011 when I started to wean off SSRIs..then this issue soared when I withdrew off 2 months use of benzos in 2014. After 2014, if I took the wrong supplement, the bleeds would start and not stop. Worst was when I tried liquid glutathione and ozone water. I believe the glutathione that caused it was cultivated by some live yeast and the ozone simply killed everything I had in my gut, good and bad. Even LDN caused a bleed that lead to a surgery 2012. Didn't realize it may have been my microbiome at the time. Went insane in 2018 when a gyno gave me high dose birth control pills/tranexamic to stop the bleeding, but it didnt work (since i now know it wasn't hormone or clot related) and made me a hot flashing basket case and turned my poop a pale clay colour. So it stems back to 2012 when withdrawals changed my digestion and microbiome. This is why I am very apprehensive about taking anything and must do my research. But with the past medical treatments, I know my liver and digestion is done for. I literally poop maybe once a week, if i'm lucky. So to have this discussion here is giving me hope...extreme gratitude for you great people.

Edit: honestly, with my microbiome the way it is..not sure how well I would react to TUDCA since I had an increase in SIBO or Candida with the use of a product that included conjugated bile salts. Unclear if that's the same as TUDCA, since it's a bile acid?.

 

[Healthseeker]

The only thing you can do is try. You can try taking tudca on an empty stomach before bed to cleanse, or you can try to use tudca to eat a bunch of grease. The grease has good vitamins in it when you actually break it down that you probably haven't had in a while.
But figure out what you can have, I mean try putting some lettuce and different veggies in a blender and drinking them. I think the chlorophyll stuff you hear like in wheatgrass shots is true it's good for you it draws out inflammation but I just use red lettuce, but not raw spinach. But something green for chlorophyll. Maybe some apple or something for taste. This way your getting fiber but it's a gentle fiber.