Serotonin Production (gut) Depends On Bacteria

[DaveFoster]

People who have gone Carb free for a period of time develop a gut flora adapted to that. Increasing carb intake can then be a double edged sword. On one hand they feel better, more energy, but on the other hand the bacterial overgrowth and the endotoxin created makes you feel fatigued and sickly (sore throat, etc).

The gut environment has adapted to a low carb environment, and increasing those carbs rapidly probably accounts for most people's problems with Peat's stuff. Cleansing the gut is definitely risky. Before going the antibiotic route, charcoal and carrot should probably be exhausted as options. You can test your body's bacterial health by having a large carby meal...like rice and honey. How do you feel? Crappy and good at the same time?

I'm at this point. The charcoal and carrot doesn't work, and my gums are still receding.

 

[Tarmander]

I'm at this point. The charcoal and carrot doesn't work, and my gums are still receding.

Have you tried the 50g of Charcoal that you asked Haidut about earlier? I think I am going to give it a try tomorrow. I still deal with endotoxin quite a bit from all the carbs.

 

[tyw]

No on both counts. First, we are about 1:1 bacteria and cells. A study recently came out that heavily criticized the idea promoted by mass media that somehow we are composed of more bacteria than cells. Even the 1:1 ratio is way too generous to bacteria. Keep in mind that given the size of bacteria (usually larger than a cell) having as many as your cells would occupy a space the size of another...you. Clearly that is not the case.
Second, living in pathogen-rich environment does not mean much for your gut. Unless you are shoving dirt and whatnot up your behind, your colon is relatively isolated from the crap around you. The pathogen exposure is more of a way to keep the immune system primed and ready to remove debris. Getting bacteria in your colon is quite dangerous and can get you enterocolitis requiring emergency surgery and even then death rates are high. So, even the "natural" bacteria in your colon can be dangerous if the immune system is not working well or you have lesions due to IBD or impaction.

Heheh, this is where people throw out the "we are more bacteria than human" quip without actually thinking about it

The only possibly accurate statement is that, "a human body likely houses more bacterial DNA than human DNA". Whether or not this difference actually matters is a different story ......

----

Agree that the GI barrier is a barrier that must only allow certain things into the rest of the body. "Good gut bacteria" in your blood spells sepsis and death.

"Good micro-organisms" are only definitely good to the extent that they produce substances that are useful for the body (eg: butyrate and H2 gas production by colon bacteria).

Another possible benefit is in bacterial quorum sensing, whereby "good" micro-organisms out-compete "bad" pathogens in the gut (some may view this as the choice of the lesser of all evils whereby bacteria like lactobacillus or fungi like saccharomyces are "not so bad"). This is a very uncertain field of study though, and we can't say for certain why or how these things do the things that they do, nor make any recommendations based on mechanical analysis.

......

 

[DaveFoster]

Have you tried the 50g of Charcoal that you asked Haidut about earlier? I think I am going to give it a try tomorrow. I still deal with endotoxin quite a bit from all the carbs.

35 grams last night. I still have IBS symptoms. Burping and chest pain especially.

 

[haidut]

@haidut bacteria are MUCH smaller than cells, no?

Depends on the bacteria, but yes, bacteria are smaller. Still, even with a difference in size by a factor of 10, if we had 10 times more bacteria than cells that would be a serious amount of biological mass that would need to go somewhere and would be readily visible. It probably can't all fit in your gut and still keep it normal shape/size.

 

[Blossom]

@haidut
@Everyone else

I e-mailed Peat about activated charcoal products, and he only said to take it intermittently, as it's non-specific in its absorption of substances, so one could end up with deficiencies.

I'm using the HealthNatura brand charcoal too and based on this post earlier in the thread
Serotonin Production (gut) Depends On Bacteria it looks like two scoops (2.4 grams per scoop) three times a day occasionally should be good amount.

 

[Tarmander]

35 grams last night. I still have IBS symptoms. Burping and chest pain especially.

Bummer. I was hoping it would work. Does it make you feel better at all? I have always felt better on antibiotics, I used to take them occasionally in college, although not a great kind.

 

[DaveFoster]

Bummer. I was hoping it would work. Does it make you feel better at all? I have always felt better on antibiotics, I used to take them occasionally in college, although not a great kind.

It does. It just doesn't do the job all the way.

 

[Tarmander]

It does. It just doesn't do the job all the way.

Well that's a good sign. Maybe it'll get better as you use it more often...

 

[DaveFoster]

Well that's a good sign. Maybe it'll get better as you use it more often...

I was just thinking that. I hope so. Ray emphasizes the importance of good thyroid function, and I just started a thyroid supplement. I'll keep you updated.

 

[ecstatichamster]

I'm using the HealthNatura brand charcoal too and based on this post earlier in the thread
Serotonin Production (gut) Depends On Bacteria it looks like two scoops (2.4 grams per scoop) three times a day occasionally should be good amount.

@Blossom I have that too. How do you take it? The particles are larger than others, which makes it less likely to persorb I suppose, but how does one consume it? Thanks!

 

[lindsay]

35 grams last night. I still have IBS symptoms. Burping and chest pain especially.

Do you experience constipation or symptoms of diarrhea?

 

[DaveFoster]

@Blossom I have that too. How do you take it? The particles are larger than others, which makes it less likely to persorb I suppose, but how does one consume it? Thanks!

I mix it with water. About 5 grams down the hatch per swig.

Do you experience constipation or symptoms of diarrhea?

Both. The constipation isn't very bad, and thyroid seems to very quickly stimulate intestinal peristalsis. The diarrhea made me feel a lot better afterwards (this was two days ago).

 

[Blossom]

@Blossom I have that too. How do you take it? The particles are larger than others, which makes it less likely to persorb I suppose, but how does one consume it? Thanks!

I just pour a scoop full directly in my mouth and chase it down with water too.

 

[ecstatichamster]

Thanks!

 

[lindsay]

I mix it with water. About 5 grams down the hatch per swig.

Both. The constipation isn't very bad, and thyroid seems to very quickly stimulate intestinal peristalsis. The diarrhea made me feel a lot better afterwards (this was two days ago).

Yeah - I experience the same yo-yo from time to time. I don't have a gallbladder, so I have found Ox Bile super helpful, along with small amounts of cascara. Too much cascara is no good and too much charcoal causes constipation for me.

 

[DaveFoster]

@hamster No problem.

@lindsay Have you tried antibiotics? Sorry if you already said, my memory's not the best right now.

 

[lindsay]

@hamster No problem.

@lindsay Have you tried antibiotics? Sorry if you already said, my memory's not the best right now.

Not recently, no. I took Minocycline and I think Doxycycline almost two years ago following appendicitis & an appendectomy (my starch eating experiment went bad). The antibiotics gave me diarrhea for about a week, and then I got a UTI when they finished (probably from the surgery and being in a hospital), but cranberry cleared that up and I felt great when they were finished for a time. I recently ordered tetracycline antibiotics because I think I need a mild dose of something very occasionally to help me with gut problems. Otherwise, I rely upon natural things, like foods, charcoal and oregano oil.

One thing I want to research more is Iodine. I took nascent iodine in moderately high doses all through the winter and didn't get sick once - not to mention, I had fantastic energy. When I stopped taking the iodine, the stomach issues crept back up. It helped me with other things too, but seems to be very controversial in the Peat realm. However, when I wrote to him to ask him about iodine, he said it could be beneficial in high doses for a short time, but is known to cause thyroid problems in the long term. But with proper selenium intake, I think it could be useful. Iodine deficiency is something I'm curious about and how it relates to thyroid and immune issues. I gave it to my dog too and it really helped his energy levels.

 

[DaveFoster]

Not recently, no. I took Minocycline and I think Doxycycline almost two years ago following appendicitis & an appendectomy (my starch eating experiment went bad). The antibiotics gave me diarrhea for about a week, and then I got a UTI when they finished (probably from the surgery and being in a hospital), but cranberry cleared that up and I felt great when they were finished for a time. I recently ordered tetracycline antibiotics because I think I need a mild dose of something very occasionally to help me with gut problems. Otherwise, I rely upon natural things, like foods, charcoal and oregano oil.

One thing I want to research more is Iodine. I took nascent iodine in moderately high doses all through the winter and didn't get sick once - not to mention, I had fantastic energy. When I stopped taking the iodine, the stomach issues crept back up. It helped me with other things too, but seems to be very controversial in the Peat realm. However, when I wrote to him to ask him about iodine, he said it could be beneficial in high doses for a short time, but is known to cause thyroid problems in the long term. But with proper selenium intake, I think it could be useful. Iodine deficiency is something I'm curious about and how it relates to thyroid and immune issues. I gave it to my dog too and it really helped his energy levels.

I too used to take iodine; I took Lugol's solution, not the nascent. I noticed hyperthyroid symptoms (high adrenaline from insufficient glucose since I was ketogenic). Do you have good results with oregano oil? Is it worth adding in for gut issues?

 

[YuraCZ]

35 grams last night. I still have IBS symptoms. Burping and chest pain especially.

You are still stuck in old habits right? I can't believe that easy to digest foods such as well cooked jasmine rice or buckwheat flour pancakes, eggs, good quality whey protein, hydrolyzed collagen, lean muscle meat (chicken, turkey breast), ripe bananas etc.. Will cause any problems with endotoxin or digestion overall... This in combination with smaller portions for one meal every 2-3 hours, eating fruits always alone and most importantly like I said before. Avoiding Gluten, casein, excess of fructose, simply no high foodmap foods. If you can't do this. You can't expect any results..