Sensitivity to liver, eggs, sardines, shellfish...

CiggyTardust

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Joined
Sep 23, 2021
Messages
250
Location
Southeast US
As a relative newcomer to Ray Peat's work, I have a question about hopefully fixing some dietary sensitivities. I will try to be as concise as possible and give some context:

I'm 35 years old. At 25 I had walking pneumonia and was over-prescribed antibiotics/steroids which wrecked my gut and caused pretty bad acid reflux and gastritis that I dealt with for years. Nearly a decade! I was prescribed PPIs briefly but dumped those after realizing it was depleting my body of magnesium and making things generally worse. I tried all kinds of things over the years (keto/low carb/many supplements) only to find, two years ago, that supplementing daily with brewer's yeast completely resolved my symptoms. It was a Japanese formulation called Ebios recommended by my wife's aunt in Taiwan. Within a few weeks of taking the brewer's yeast with every meal all symptoms of acid reflux subsided. I still deal with bloating occasionally but my stomach no longer hurts or feels acidic. It's the closest thing to a miracle cure I've ever found and I don't need to take it regularly anymore. I now suspect after browsing these forums that the brewer's yeast could possibly have corrected a Thiamine deficiency or other B vitamin deficiency that impeded the proper function of my gastric/parietal cells so they produce enough acid now. At any rate, I feel much better. That being said, I do still suffer from sensitivities to a few foods:

1. Shrimp - Two years ago I ate nearly two pounds of peel-n-eat shrimp in one sitting and had a bad reaction afterwards. My breathing felt constricted and my throat felt like it was tight. It scared me. I also felt chills, elevated heart rate, anxiety, intestinal distress and brain fog for a couple days. This reaction recurs any time I eat shellfish now, namely squid or oysters or shrimp--so I stay away. I can live without shellfish so this isn't a huge deal to me.

2. Beef liver - In an effort to re-introduce beef liver more recently, I soaked some slices in lemon juice over night. I pan fried them with onions and had with rice. This was a preparation I used many times years ago to make the liver flavor more mild. Felt a very similar reaction to shellfish--elevated heart rate, chills, tight breathing/constricted throat, intestinal distress, brain fog and panic sensation afterward. Also strange tingly sensation in extremeties--like vibration or shakiness. Subsided after a few hours. Oddly when I have liverwurst from US Wellness (containing grass fed beef, liver, heart and kidney) no such negative reaction occurs--I feel great!

3. Sardines - I cooked up some sardines in a pan a year ago and felt much the same. Now that I know what I know about PUFAs, I'm not too concerned about this but I did find it odd that it made me feel similar to the shellfish--tight throat, elevated heart rate and overall anxiety/stress response.

4. Scrambled eggs - I get no such negative response as mentioned above, just some stomach irritation and bloating. Sometimes a bit of brain fog for an hour or two also.

Any ideas on what this reaction may be or if they're linked in any way? Best I can surmise is leaky gut from years of digestive problems and I need to heal my gut. I've been eating raw carrot daily, drinking OJ and raw milk and eating liverwurst and feeling amazing as a result. Less bloating than I've had in years. I plan to incorporate some Great Lakes collagen regularly too to hopefully heal my gut further. Of every sensitivity mentioned above, my only real worry is about eggs and shellfish. I suspect the beef liver reaction had something to do with lemon juice and affected enzymes but that's just a hunch.

Thanks for any tips or insights you can pass along to this newcomer. Love this forum, by the way. Refreshing to see all the free and open-minded thinkers in one place.
 
Joined
Mar 10, 2021
Messages
21,494
As a relative newcomer to Ray Peat's work, I have a question about hopefully fixing some dietary sensitivities. I will try to be as concise as possible and give some context:

I'm 35 years old. At 25 I had walking pneumonia and was over-prescribed antibiotics/steroids which wrecked my gut and caused pretty bad acid reflux and gastritis that I dealt with for years. Nearly a decade! I was prescribed PPIs briefly but dumped those after realizing it was depleting my body of magnesium and making things generally worse. I tried all kinds of things over the years (keto/low carb/many supplements) only to find, two years ago, that supplementing daily with brewer's yeast completely resolved my symptoms. It was a Japanese formulation called Ebios recommended by my wife's aunt in Taiwan. Within a few weeks of taking the brewer's yeast with every meal all symptoms of acid reflux subsided. I still deal with bloating occasionally but my stomach no longer hurts or feels acidic. It's the closest thing to a miracle cure I've ever found and I don't need to take it regularly anymore. I now suspect after browsing these forums that the brewer's yeast could possibly have corrected a Thiamine deficiency or other B vitamin deficiency that impeded the proper function of my gastric/parietal cells so they produce enough acid now. At any rate, I feel much better. That being said, I do still suffer from sensitivities to a few foods:

1. Shrimp - Two years ago I ate nearly two pounds of peel-n-eat shrimp in one sitting and had a bad reaction afterwards. My breathing felt constricted and my throat felt like it was tight. It scared me. I also felt chills, elevated heart rate, anxiety, intestinal distress and brain fog for a couple days. This reaction recurs any time I eat shellfish now, namely squid or oysters or shrimp--so I stay away. I can live without shellfish so this isn't a huge deal to me.

2. Beef liver - In an effort to re-introduce beef liver more recently, I soaked some slices in lemon juice over night. I pan fried them with onions and had with rice. This was a preparation I used many times years ago to make the liver flavor more mild. Felt a very similar reaction to shellfish--elevated heart rate, chills, tight breathing/constricted throat, intestinal distress, brain fog and panic sensation afterward. Also strange tingly sensation in extremeties--like vibration or shakiness. Subsided after a few hours. Oddly when I have liverwurst from US Wellness (containing grass fed beef, liver, heart and kidney) no such negative reaction occurs--I feel great!

3. Sardines - I cooked up some sardines in a pan a year ago and felt much the same. Now that I know what I know about PUFAs, I'm not too concerned about this but I did find it odd that it made me feel similar to the shellfish--tight throat, elevated heart rate and overall anxiety/stress response.

4. Scrambled eggs - I get no such negative response as mentioned above, just some stomach irritation and bloating. Sometimes a bit of brain fog for an hour or two also.

Any ideas on what this reaction may be or if they're linked in any way? Best I can surmise is leaky gut from years of digestive problems and I need to heal my gut. I've been eating raw carrot daily, drinking OJ and raw milk and eating liverwurst and feeling amazing as a result. Less bloating than I've had in years. I plan to incorporate some Great Lakes collagen regularly too to hopefully heal my gut further. Of every sensitivity mentioned above, my only real worry is about eggs and shellfish. I suspect the beef liver reaction had something to do with lemon juice and affected enzymes but that's just a hunch.

Thanks for any tips or insights you can pass along to this newcomer. Love this forum, by the way. Refreshing to see all the free and open-minded thinkers in one place.

Welcome Ciggy! Sounds like you have Histamine Intolerance. I have delt with the same thing for 7+ years. All the foods you mentioned are high histamine foods and eating them builds up histamines in your system. You may have a slight allergy to some things that a high histamine load can turn into something serious eating them. That happened to me eating banana bread and using flouride toothpaste, my tongue swelled out of my mouth in my sleep, angioedema. Histamines Intolerance is the same mechanism as a diabetic with sugar, they build up and your body, and not having enough of the insulin, or DAO with histamine intolerance to lower them quick enough, before symptoms strike. It is a gut issue, and it can be healed, but it takes some time. Sugar, caffeine and salt are your best friends now, use them liberally when you are eating high histamine foods or having a reaction. Ray Peat has mentioned a study with results proving that chugging a Coke fast works better than an EpiPen. Here is a list, off the top of my head of high histamine foods..

-leftovers
-restaurant food
-seafood especially shellfish
-ground meats
-cured meats
-smoked foods
-tomato products
-egg whites
-aged cheeses
-long cooked soups including gelatin
-oranges
-spinach
-avocados
-bananas
-dried fruits
-chocolate
-fermented foods like sauerkraut, kefir, yogurt, sour cream, beer & wine

Also high altitudes and heat raises histamines.


View: https://youtu.be/ZgrxfB9zjf0
 

Elize

Member
Joined
Jan 25, 2016
Messages
918
Thanks Rinse and rePeat

I was going to post something similar but yours is well done.
 

L_C

Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2018
Messages
554
Welcome Ciggy! Sounds like you have Histamine Intolerance. I have delt with the same thing for 7+ years. All the foods you mentioned are high histamine foods and eating them builds up histamines in your system. You may have a slight allergy to some things that a high histamine load can turn into something serious eating them. That happened to me eating banana bread and using flouride toothpaste, my tongue swelled out of my mouth in my sleep, angioedema. Histamines Intolerance is the same mechanism as a diabetic with sugar, they build up and your body, and not having enough of the insulin, or DAO with histamine intolerance to lower them quick enough, before symptoms strike. It is a gut issue, and it can be healed, but it takes some time. Sugar, caffeine and salt are your best friends now, use them liberally when you are eating high histamine foods or having a reaction. Ray Peat has mentioned a study with results proving that chugging a Coke fast works better than an EpiPen. Here is a list, off the top of my head of high histamine foods..

-leftovers
-restaurant food
-seafood especially shellfish
-ground meats
-cured meats
-smoked foods
-tomato products
-egg whites
-aged cheeses
-long cooked soups including gelatin
-oranges
-spinach
-avocados
-bananas
-dried fruits
-chocolate
-fermented foods like sauerkraut, kefir, yogurt, sour cream, beer & wine

Also high altitudes and heat raises histamines.


View: https://youtu.be/ZgrxfB9zjf0

Have you tried DAO supplement to lower histamine?
 
OP
CiggyTardust

CiggyTardust

Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2021
Messages
250
Location
Southeast US
Thanks for the input, Rinse & rePeat! I'll give those videos a watch shortly. I did look at histamine intolerance a while back however most of those foods don't bother me too much. I will mark the foods that I don't tolerate well in bold:

-leftovers
-restaurant food
-seafood especially shellfish
-ground meats
-cured meats
-smoked foods
-tomato products
-egg whites (mostly bloating, brain fog)
-aged cheeses
-long cooked soups including gelatin
-oranges
-spinach (oddly I did eat a lot of spinach in one sitting and it sent me to the bathroom... if I eat moderate amounts there's no problem)
-avocados (bloating, chills if consumed in any significant quantity)
-bananas
-dried fruits
-chocolate
-fermented foods like sauerkraut, kefir, yogurt, sour cream, beer & wine

So yeah, while histamines may be contributing here but I suspect it's a bit more complex than that as most of those foods sit fine with me. I'm also not eager to diagnose myself with any disorder although I know that can be helpful in assisting healing...

I haven't tried DAO supplements. I am hoping I can address whatever underlying imbalance there might be through diet and lifestyle without relying too much on supplements but I'm open if there's something that can assist healing.
 

JamesGatz

Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2021
Messages
3,189
Location
USA
-seafood especially shellfish
-egg whites
-spinach
-avocados
-fermented foods like sauerkraut, kefir, yogurt, sour cream, beer & wine

I have anaphylactic reactions to shellfish - if you have allergic reactions to it I wouldn't try to force it - my mom does too ... was once sent to the ER by just using a restaurant's spoon that a waiter had took from shellfish and put in the vegetables

egg whites are high in tryptophan - which can easily convert to serotonin in a metabolic rate that is not ideal or if your daily tryptophan intake is too high in general or not being balanced with gelatin

Spinach is very high in vitamin A - when i consume too much vitamin A in a non-ideal metabolic state i get brain fog/headaches

I belieeve avocados has a bit of PUFA which shuld be causing the stomach issues

Beer is estrogenic for the most part I believe, fermented foods in general seem to increase serotonin in a compromised gut ... it's good to keep things moving
 
Joined
Mar 10, 2021
Messages
21,494
Have you tried DAO supplement to lower histamine?

No. In 2013 there wasn't much info on histamine intolerance. Instead, this was the highly touted thing to take (photo attached). It got me safely through a lot restaurant meals for a couple of years. When it was backordered for a year I just learned how to take better care of myself. By the time I learned about DAO I already had my bag of tricks. My girlfriend has histamine issues too and was taking DAO until she found out grass fed beef kidneys work better. I have a bottle on hand for "just in case".
 

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Joined
Mar 10, 2021
Messages
21,494
The Ancestral kidney supplement made me feel far worse.

I bought it myself because of my girlfriend having such luck with it, but after hearing some downsides I decided not to partake. I keep it around for an emergency, but I wont repurchase again when it expires.
 

Elize

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Joined
Jan 25, 2016
Messages
918
I have not found supplements to help me. The fillers used cause Mast Cell activation with me. Olive oil, MCT, alcohol, DMSO also have problems with.
 

L_C

Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2018
Messages
554
I have not found supplements to help me. The fillers used cause Mast Cell activation with me. Olive oil, MCT, alcohol, DMSO also have problems with.
Would be good to know if there is anything natural without fillers that can stop mast cell activation.
 

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