Schooling System Is Designed To Destroy Children

[Xisca]

Permaculture is first of all a design system.
Current education is also a design.

There is a separate private system designed to make the rulers and leaders.

Yes, this I learnt about in my social therapy course.
The problem is how they make rulers... Have you thought about what can those poor children endure? In England, as was our example in class, in a boarding school without seeing their parents, they are HUMILIATED, so that they can REPRODUCE this with the workers. It is designed so that they can reproduce it without noticing what they do, because it will be automatic, and the cortex will justify what it does in a very reasonable way. Below the ruler, there is the suffering child, and the man does not even know it.
There is little awareness. Nothing will change without awareness, because violence is transmitted more easily than a virus!

And humiliation is part of the subtle ways of violence, thus traumatising. Then came my course of Somatic Experiencing, I learnt about trauma, and we do not want to say we are traumatised because we have LEARNED to think it is a SHAME. But this is part of the design. Shame is always what shapes education, though it can be done in a way that it does not traumatise. We have to behave within a certain range of similarity, enough to trigger securuty when living together. Shame is not a problem when the human link is not broken, when there is still parental love. Only the out of standart behaviour is punished, NOT the person and its humanity. Unfortunately, this is rarely the case. Thus trauma, and the word is so big that most of us think we are not traumatised, and we indeed all are. A war veteran can be more impaired than you and me, but still, we also have some impairements! At physiological and behavioural levels.

The system that uses violence such as humiliation, so that people will go on the chain, is self-perpetuating. Only awareness will lead to a change, instead of helplessness. Speaking without acting is showing inner impotency. We have to go out of this by doing little changes and by communicating, so as to connect and reach more strenght by uniting. Impotency is not a shame when something is too big to be dealt with alone!

What I concluded both with social therapy and SE: when we went through some violence, one way to overcome the bad feeling that lingers, is to put what has been done to us at an unconscious level of normallity. Then you suffer no more. When you repeat what has been done to you, you just, at unconscious nervous level, deal with the level of past activation that is still there. Past triggers us, and then we react in a way that is meant to cool down the activation. All brains are involved, the 3 that are united in US. We usually forget about the autonomic one. Psychotherapy models are not enough to understand human behaviour, and it is necessary to go deep, or high, how ever you see it, into the autonomic nervous sytem. All in life is about survival, keep your cells happy! Or else they adapt so that you can live, but not an optimal life.

 

[Xisca]

Then you can also considere the indian cast model...
WE all know it has been forbiden and that is is immoral!
But...
We know nothing about what it is. We just know about the untouchables!
Maybe I was innocent and you know this, but when I learnt a little bit more, I realized they were NOT PART of the cast system, they were OUTCASTS.
What sort of design was the cast system?
A SCHOOLING system. There was none as we know, but children were just living with their family and learning by being there, then by watching, then by helping, then by doing. So they could become real experts. And as happyness does not depend on what you do, but how you do, and how you feel, and how you are with other people around, it probably created less stress than what we see now.
I suppose the self made man has a lot more to do with adrenaline and serotonine...

 

[DaveFoster]

Nobody with the requisite IQ is "stuck" with the public education system for very long. We all pay for it in taxes of course, but those are negligible relative to the societal benefits; public schools are effectively daycare centers for the poor and the stupid.

Holy social Darwinism, batman. Public schools in the U.S. destroy intelligence; they don't allow "low intelligence" people to foster and grow. If anything, they allow incongruent, often selfish ideologies to fester in echo chambers, and then take root in young prisoners.

When was the last time you've been in a public school?

 

[Rafe]

@Xisca
I've seen Bill Molisson in the film Anima Mundi. Then I introduced some people to David Holmgren's book Permaculture Principles, I think is the name. What a good job they do demonstrating food-politics-life. Vision for a sustainable way.

But I still think eating better in a peat way would be really necessary to alter the vision of what is possible to do. I mean, no one I showed Permaculture to got excited & went out to experiment & engage differently. But you do see that sometimes with people eating peat-ish.

 

[Xisca]

When one changes Quick, crash is not rare...

 

[pimpnamedraypeat]

Permaculture is first of all a design system.
Current education is also a design.

Yes, this I learnt about in my social therapy course.
The problem is how they make rulers... Have you thought about what can those poor children endure? In England, as was our example in class, in a boarding school without seeing their parents, they are HUMILIATED, so that they can REPRODUCE this with the workers. It is designed so that they can reproduce it without noticing what they do, because it will be automatic, and the cortex will justify what it does in a very reasonable way. Below the ruler, there is the suffering child, and the man does not even know it.
There is little awareness. Nothing will change without awareness, because violence is transmitted more easily than a virus!

And humiliation is part of the subtle ways of violence, thus traumatising. Then came my course of Somatic Experiencing, I learnt about trauma, and we do not want to say we are traumatised because we have LEARNED to think it is a SHAME. But this is part of the design. Shame is always what shapes education, though it can be done in a way that it does not traumatise. We have to behave within a certain range of similarity, enough to trigger securuty when living together. Shame is not a problem when the human link is not broken, when there is still parental love. Only the out of standart behaviour is punished, NOT the person and its humanity. Unfortunately, this is rarely the case. Thus trauma, and the word is so big that most of us think we are not traumatised, and we indeed all are. A war veteran can be more impaired than you and me, but still, we also have some impairements! At physiological and behavioural levels..

I agree completely. I spent my childhood in an ex-British colony and back then they still practiced the old system of public beatings and humiliation in the schools. It's mostly been weeded out now but it was still in place while I was in school.

While I don't remember it or feel like it was a memorable or traumatizing event, I can look back and see the scars it's left in my persona and that of many other people in my culture who went through the same gauntlet. The people in my culture are very successful, but they tend to be narcissistic almost across the board, with delusional beliefs, instilled in childhood, that they hold onto more dear than their lives or the lives of their nearest and dearest.

There's a deep curent of shame that's found in every culture where child beatings and humiliation is practiced. the purpose of this form of child-rearing is to destroy the intrinsic self of the child and replace it with a socially acceptable and socially programmable false self. A person with a socially defined self worth (as opposed to intrinsic self worth that is destroyed in childhood) is willing to kill or die to maintain their false self.

Examples:

The Muslim world where a father will kill his own daughter for cavorting with a non-muslim and bringing shame to the family.

Feudal Japan where samurais would take their own life instead of dealing with the pain of dishonor (shame)

Old school Christians who were more than willing to disown their children for being gay

There's a myriad of tribal cultures where young men are forced to go through a painful and possibly lethal trial before they can become full fledged members of the tribe (i.e brainwashed drones willing to risk their life for the elders)

Almost every culture has traumatic rituals they put their men through, with the men's worth being determined by their willingness and ability to kill/die to protect their queen and country.


Modern schooling is just the next step, it's a scaled up, decentralized brainwashing system.

The horror of WW2 would not have been possible without modern schooling

 

[Xisca]

I agree completely. I spent my childhood in an ex-British colony and back then they still practiced the old system of public beatings and humiliation in the schools. It's mostly been weeded out now but it was still in place while I was in school.

While I don't remember it or feel like it was a memorable or traumatizing event, I can look back and see the scars it's left in my persona and that of many other people in my culture who went through the same gauntlet

Really thank you for this personal example, which speaks more than my 2nd hand saying!

I suggest that you do not remember because humans have a protection, which is a mild freeze response. This is also why we do not feel traumatized, when in fact we all are, at mild levels at least. the trauma shows in the scars you mention and in perosnal health. It is just meant by physiology to help us live, but it is at the root of behaviour trait, the persona, and also at the root of somatic disorders, espacially in digestion and immunity.

 

[Constatine]

Modern schools promote Ray Peat's version of rationalism (how he defined rationalism). Thus we get a society of the dumbest smart people.

 

[Constatine]

I agree completely. I spent my childhood in an ex-British colony and back then they still practiced the old system of public beatings and humiliation in the schools. It's mostly been weeded out now but it was still in place while I was in school.

While I don't remember it or feel like it was a memorable or traumatizing event, I can look back and see the scars it's left in my persona and that of many other people in my culture who went through the same gauntlet. The people in my culture are very successful, but they tend to be narcissistic almost across the board, with delusional beliefs, instilled in childhood, that they hold onto more dear than their lives or the lives of their nearest and dearest.

There's a deep curent of shame that's found in every culture where child beatings and humiliation is practiced. the purpose of this form of child-rearing is to destroy the intrinsic self of the child and replace it with a socially acceptable and socially programmable false self. A person with a socially defined self worth (as opposed to intrinsic self worth that is destroyed in childhood) is willing to kill or die to maintain their false self.

Examples:

The Muslim world where a father will kill his own daughter for cavorting with a non-muslim and bringing shame to the family.

Feudal Japan where samurais would take their own life instead of dealing with the pain of dishonor (shame)

Old school Christians who were more than willing to disown their children for being gay

There's a myriad of tribal cultures where young men are forced to go through a painful and possibly lethal trial before they can become full fledged members of the tribe (i.e brainwashed drones willing to risk their life for the elders)

Almost every culture has traumatic rituals they put their men through, with the men's worth being determined by their willingness and ability to kill/die to protect their queen and country.


Modern schooling is just the next step, it's a scaled up, decentralized brainwashing system.

The horror of WW2 would not have been possible without modern schooling

Well put. Is there a culture you can think of that does not employ shaming?

 

[Xisca]

There's a myriad of tribal cultures where young men are forced to go through a painful and possibly lethal trial before they can become full fledged members of the tribe (i.e brainwashed drones willing to risk their life for the elders)

I have possibly other explanations for this trait in some cultures. It might have had the purpose of avoiding trauma later in life!

When pain comes from one event, though prepared through teenage, the impact is not the same as a recurent stress from your pairs. Young people have always been prepared as best as possible for the specific dangers one will have to face in their part of this beautiful but dangerous planet. They would have to face animals for hunting, or wars with the neighbours, and they were prepared to go through this while not suffering trauma.
When you go through ritual, the fear will likely cause some dissociative state, which leads often to some spiritual experience, the same way it impacts in NDE, near death experience. And those people report beautiful things and how their life has been changed! A ritual is much less risky, because it is controled. And also, the coming out of the dissociative state is prepared...
When those young men came through the experience, and for sure everybody would support them and hope they succeed, they would be praised, they would be welcomed in a big relational warmth, and at nervous level, it balances the dissociative state and anchor in the feeling of deep relationship with their pairs.

If we could be supported this way instead of being told to go on head up high after any accident, this would be perfect, and we do not have this very much in our society. Be strong and forget about the accident, trauma etc, this is in the past and you should forget it now, etc. This is what locks in trauma inside us, and it will show through. Anxiety and panick attacks and much more, prove the disregulation of the autonomic nervous system. Spirituality in society was originaly meant to deal with these problems and regulate people. Of course we can hardly see this now, because of all the manipulations, but believers still use the power of healing that that understood.

School should still be used to strenghten younsters, instead of weakening them. Both consequences come from having to face stress, but strength comes from succeeding in managing gradually increased difficulties, while weakness comes from a lack of titration.

And school should do this also while strenghening social bonds among the students as well as with the elders. After all, they will be welcome as workers and their competencies will be praised in their jobs!

Thus, this was surely the second goal of those fearful experiences in tribes. When you go hunting with your pairs, you want to be sure you can trust them, because your life may depend on it. If you know you are with friends who went through fear without going away in panick, then you are much more secure.

This is part of education as well! You want to respect young people growing into adults, and you want them to feel good, but you also want them to be able to deal with stress! If you teach this not enough, they will not face life easily, and if events in life teach this too quickly and too strongly to them, this is called trauma. It is all about being progressive, and tailored to each child needs. It is about expantion of the capacity to hold what happens without being overwhelmed. Parents who manage to accompany their children to do this can be proud!

 

[Xisca]

Well put. Is there a culture you can think of that does not employ shaming?

I doubt you find one, shame is the tool that allow us to fit more or less. Just try to go out naked and you will see what shame is about.

The problem is about the intensity if shame, then the way to make it feel, and then and most of all, the cut it implie, unfortunately, in the relationships.

The good way:
If you find a culture, well just even a familly, where shame is normally used AND the link of love is maintained, then the child learn the correct behaviour WITHOUT trauma. This is what happens when a child is scowled by mom, cries, but is held in arms and assured that she is loved. The child understand that the behaviour was not welcome, but that SHE IS WELCOME.

Then the social feature is internalised, it makes national and regional caracteristics, but the difference is in the scars that some may have about behaving well.

 

[pimpnamedraypeat]

Well put. Is there a culture you can think of that does not employ shaming?

No. All child-rearing employs shaming to a certain extent. It's the mothers job. Human mothers have a need to trauma bond their children to themselves, in addition to socializing them. They do this by alternating pain(stonewalling, scolding, shaming) and pleasure (praise and attention), in a skinnerian fashion.

This puppy trains the child and creates a lifelong bond, as can be seen in any domesticated dog.

There's a form of horse breaking that goes on in every household once a child reaches a certain age, usually around toddler years. It centers around the words "good boy" and "bad boy", and the treatment associated with those words.

If you're a good boy mommy gives you a kiss and a hug and youre lauded with excessive praise. A bad boy is yelled at, beaten, or rejected until behavior changes.

It would be very difficult to get a man to go to a job he hates and do the same thing day in day out for years if he wasn't horse-broken as a child.

 

[pimpnamedraypeat]

I have possibly other explanations for this trait in some cultures. It might have had the purpose of avoiding trauma later in life!

When pain comes from one event, though prepared through teenage, the impact is not the same as a recurent stress from your pairs. Young people have always been prepared as best as possible for the specific dangers one will have to face in their part of this beautiful but dangerous planet. They would have to face animals for hunting, or wars with the neighbours, and they were prepared to go through this while not suffering trauma.
When you go through ritual, the fear will likely cause some dissociative state, which leads often to some spiritual experience, the same way it impacts in NDE, near death experience. And those people report beautiful things and how their life has been changed! A ritual is much less risky, because it is controled. And also, the coming out of the dissociative state is prepared...
When those young men came through the experience, and for sure everybody would support them and hope they succeed, they would be praised, they would be welcomed in a big relational warmth, and at nervous level, it balances the dissociative state and anchor in the feeling of deep relationship with their pairs.

If we could be supported this way instead of being told to go on head up high after any accident, this would be perfect, and we do not have this very much in our society. Be strong and forget about the accident, trauma etc, this is in the past and you should forget it now, etc. This is what locks in trauma inside us, and it will show through. Anxiety and panick attacks and much more, prove the disregulation of the autonomic nervous system. Spirituality in society was originaly meant to deal with these problems and regulate people. Of course we can hardly see this now, because of all the manipulations, but believers still use the power of healing that that understood.

School should still be used to strenghten younsters, instead of weakening them. Both consequences come from having to face stress, but strength comes from succeeding in managing gradually increased difficulties, while weakness comes from a lack of titration.

And school should do this also while strenghening social bonds among the students as well as with the elders. After all, they will be welcome as workers and their competencies will be praised in their jobs!

Thus, this was surely the second goal of those fearful experiences in tribes. When you go hunting with your pairs, you want to be sure you can trust them, because your life may depend on it. If you know you are with friends who went through fear without going away in panick, then you are much more secure.

This is part of education as well! You want to respect young people growing into adults, and you want them to feel good, but you also want them to be able to deal with stress! If you teach this not enough, they will not face life easily, and if events in life teach this too quickly and too strongly to them, this is called trauma. It is all about being progressive, and tailored to each child needs. It is about expantion of the capacity to hold what happens without being overwhelmed. Parents who manage to accompany their children to do this can be proud!

Very good point.

I agree that trauma bonding is necessary to create trust and camaraderie within groups, especially those that will have to put their lives in each others hands. It also toughen up the men and makes them loyal to the tribe, which is of questionable benefit to the individual but good for the race.

I was referring to the boot-camp like traumatic brainwashing young men are put through to turn then into selfless warriors willing to die over national pride or national boundaries or oil. It's a hijack of that more innocent ritual.

Break them down then build them up.

"Give me the boy till 7 and I'll give you the man".

The 2 ton elephant still imprisoned by the flimsy rope that held him as a child.

 

[Constatine]

I doubt you find one, shame is the tool that allow us to fit more or less. Just try to go out naked and you will see what shame is about.

The problem is about the intensity if shame, then the way to make it feel, and then and most of all, the cut it implie, unfortunately, in the relationships.

The good way:
If you find a culture, well just even a familly, where shame is normally used AND the link of love is maintained, then the child learn the correct behaviour WITHOUT trauma. This is what happens when a child is scowled by mom, cries, but is held in arms and assured that she is loved. The child understand that the behaviour was not welcome, but that SHE IS WELCOME.

Then the social feature is internalised, it makes national and regional caracteristics, but the difference is in the scars that some may have about behaving well.

No. All child-rearing employs shaming to a certain extent. It's the mothers job. Human mothers have a need to trauma bond their children to themselves, in addition to socializing them. They do this by alternating pain(stonewalling, scolding, shaming) and pleasure (praise and attention), in a skinnerian fashion.

This puppy trains the child and creates a lifelong bond, as can be seen in any domesticated dog.

There's a form of horse breaking that goes on in every household once a child reaches a certain age, usually around toddler years. It centers around the words "good boy" and "bad boy", and the treatment associated with those words.

If you're a good boy mommy gives you a kiss and a hug and youre lauded with excessive praise. A bad boy is yelled at, beaten, or rejected until behavior changes.

It would be very difficult to get a man to go to a job he hates and do the same thing day in day out for years if he wasn't horse-broken as a child.

Cultures are inherently limiting and dogmatic. However there are many aspects of culture that is beneficial or even necessary. How would one raise a good citizen, prepared for the world, without limiting the mind?

 

[Queequeg]

Well put. Is there a culture you can think of that does not employ shaming?

Just thinking out loud but it seems that the snowflakes of today are growing up with a complete lack of any shame. It could be argued that this is just as harmful as the old school methods of hazing if not more so. The only thing that kids today are shamed for is if they try to shame anyone else. Being called a bully is now the worst thing you can say to someone. And since everyone must be fully accepted as they are, there is no reason for anyone to try to improve themselves. In fact it seems that college kids today are actively trying to out do one another with who can be more ugly/fat/unkempt/antisocial etc

 

[Xisca]

It also toughen up the men and makes them loyal to the tribe, which is of questionable benefit to the individual but good for the race.

Maybe what is good for the group is good for individuals? Loyalty must have been "unexisting" as it was probably so obvious that they did not have to think about it! Toughening up is probably very universal in all training, but it depends if the stress has been put out or if it has been guarded inside... They knew, and we most have forgotten, how to put it out, and when the person could not do it alone, they this was the job of the shaman, sometimes with all the tribe, to put the person in transe so that the trembling would discharge the electric charge. (the animals shake out stress, look for impala and lions on youtube for example!)

I was referring to the boot-camp like traumatic brainwashing young men are put through to turn then into selfless warriors willing to die over national pride or national boundaries or oil. It's a hijack of that more innocent ritual.

Well, just that I do not know to what culture you refer to!
lol you might have noticed I am quite interrested in old cultural manners to be adapted to our environment, I like anthropology of tribes very much.

 

[Constatine]

Just thinking out loud but it seems that the snowflakes of today are growing up with a complete lack of any shame. It could be argued that this is just as harmful as the old school methods of hazing if not more so. The only thing that kids today are shamed for is if they try to shame anyone else. Being called a bully is now the worst thing you can say to someone. And since everyone must be fully accepted as they are, there is no reason for anyone to try to improve themselves. In fact it seems that college kids today are actively trying to out do one another with who can be more ugly/fat/unkempt/antisocial etc

I would say they lack the mainstream's definition of shame but they have their own culture and are still kept in line via internal shaming. Suddenly having "bigot" ideas would not go over well within their circle.

 

[Xisca]

Cultures are inherently limiting and dogmatic. However there are many aspects of culture that is beneficial or even necessary. How would one raise a good citizen, prepared for the world, without limiting the mind?

Just thinking out loud but it seems that the snowflakes of today are growing up with a complete lack of any shame. It could be argued that this is just as harmful as the old school methods of hazing if not more so. The only thing that kids today are shamed for is if they try to shame anyone else. Being called a bully is now the worst thing you can say to someone. And since everyone must be fully accepted as they are, there is no reason for anyone to try to improve themselves. In fact it seems that college kids today are actively trying to out do one another with who can be more ugly/fat/unkempt/antisocial etc

I agree! I would like to write short sometimes...
In what you both said, there is this that shame is necessary, but WITH the love and respect of the person. And this is sad to see that the lack of this is making an opposite strong reaction. Under this reaction is the lack of bonding. We long for love and compagnonship and sweet oxytocine and group harmony.
It seems impossible for this girl to hear at the same time a respect of her, and some concern for her health for example.

And if we should accept people as they are, well, they still don't, because they do not accept as they are the persons who do not accept others as they are!

 

[Queequeg]

I would say they lack the mainstream's definition of shame but they have their own culture and are still kept in line via internal shaming. Suddenly having "bigot" ideas would not go over well within their circle.

Agreed that's what I meant by saying bullying is the worst thing you could do in school today. It's ironic that they are using shaming to enforce their goal of no shaming or anything else that is not politically acceptable to the left. Basically you can do anything you want except think for yourself.

 

[Xisca]

I would say they lack the mainstream's definition of shame but they have their own culture and are still kept in line via internal shaming. Suddenly having "bigot" ideas would not go over well within their circle.

Yeah! exactly!
They will only see it when they grow up and open eyes wide with their children!

there is no reason for anyone to try to improve themselves.

I live in a place that is plagued by shame, and people have a lack of competence in work, terrible.
And you cannot say anything, unless you want to receive all the charge of their past shame!

So of course they will not improve...