Schizophrenia Treatment Could Be As Simple As Reducing Ammonia

[BigYellowLemon]

Have you seen any noticeable effects from it?
How much did you take?

It was like 4 years ago that I took it last. I didn't notice anything that interesting, made me slightly clearheaded. I'd recommend buying sodium benzoate instead, it's much much cheaper than ceylon cinnamon and is easier to consume.

 

[Light]

It was like 4 years ago that I took it last. I didn't notice anything that interesting, made me slightly clearheaded. I'd recommend buying sodium benzoate instead, it's much much cheaper than ceylon cinnamon and is easier to consume.

Thanks,
I'm trying to minimize supplements, it's starting to get a little out of hand, and I have a bag of ceylon cinnamon at home already.
Plus, I don't know which of the compounds in cinnamon are active in reducing LPS, and whether or not its the same one that helps with overall digestion (though it's certainly possible that reducing LPS is the reason for better digestion)

 

[Sativa]

sodium benzoate itself actually inhibits HMG-CoA, the same target of statins. Not good, I want cholesterol synthesis pathways working 100%.

inhibiting Cholesterol synthesis = not cool!
I imagine there's a dose range for NaBenzoate whereby the ammonia neutralisation benefits outweigh any inhibition of cholesterol synthesis probably along the dose used in haiduts Oxidal formula.

 

[magnesiumania]

So how much do i take? Hard to find any info on dosage and i have a teaspoon, no scales...

I know sodium benzoate is also used for Glycine encephalopathy which is why i wanna try it. I thought i exerpeinced hyperammonemia once and something similar happened from 3 grams of glycine. Im not sure if it was schizophrenia or glycine building up in brain and tissues which neuological dysfunction as a consqence but all this lead me to believe that sodium benzoate can be well worth trying and i have some at hand, just need to know how to ingest. Help much appreciated...

 

[magnesiumania]

inhibiting Cholesterol synthesis = not cool!
I imagine there's a dose range for NaBenzoate whereby the ammonia neutralisation benefits outweigh any inhibition of cholesterol synthesis probably along the dose used in haiduts Oxidal formula.

How about eating a little extra cholesterol like a couple of eggs when you have NaB?

 

[Terma]

I was interested in sodium benzoate a while back, I actually used to eat ceylon cinnamon quite a lot, and tried to buy some raw sodium benzoate powder, but accidentally got potassium sorbate instead.

Ceylon cinnamon contains coumarin, though lower than cassia cinnamon, still a problem (vitamin K antagonist), and ceylon is expensive, so I discontinued that.

And sodium benzoate itself actually inhibits HMG-CoA, the same target of statins. Not good, I want cholesterol synthesis pathways working 100%.

https://i0.wp.com/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3206174/bin/nihms307987f1.jpg

Edit:

For lowering ammonia, making sure protein intake is at sufficient levels, and absolutely no more that that.

Even more relevant would be to find a way to lower the oxidation of amino acids for energy. That should never be used, ever, glucose/fatty acids/ketones, but never amino acids. They should only ever be used for structure or mechanical work, not the fuel that powers those things.

My first thought in regards to preventing amino acid oxidation would be to make sure you're well fed, and that muscles are NEVER catabolized, meaning androgens(?) or anti-glutocorticoids measures (no direct antagonists though).

Keto-acids also seem helpful (I don't understand the pathways well enough yet though..), but people should be aware that the biggest keto-acid found in food, alpha-ketoglutaric acid, turns into glutamic acid when donated the amine group (when the ammonia is sequestered).

Yes, but if you look at that same graph, that suggests sodium benzoate will spare (aceto)acetyl-COA for other things. Maybe that's part why it works as a temporary nootropic as PRL-8-53 - Wikipedia does.

You make very good posts.

Remember, everyone has to make up for Travis leaving now :\ - so reach for the stars dude.

 

[Sativa]

How about eating a little extra cholesterol like a couple of eggs when you have NaB?

Well sure, there's solutions for everything!
I personally wouldn't worry about minor cholesterol synthesis inhibition from NaB, i'd go for the dose used in Haidut's Oxidal formula:

Oxidal is a liquid supplement that supports optimal oxygenation of tissues and cells.
Drops per container: about 250
Each drop contains approximately:

Methylene Blue (MB), USP: 0.4mg (400mcg)
Caffeine: 0.4mg (400mcg)
Benzoic acid: 0.4mg (400mcg)

 

[magnesiumania]

I have NO idea how much that translates to teaspoons of soodium benzoate.

 

[Sativa]

I have NO idea how much that translates to teaspoons of soodium benzoate.

well google is always hand for converting amounts!
since i can do it in my head, to give you at least a theoretical idea -
1g = 1000mg
1mg = 1000mcg
1 mg is already an absolutely minuscule tiny amount.

dont use a teaspoon LOL. use the point of a sowing needle

 

[magnesiumania]

well google is always hand for converting amounts!
since i can do it in my head, to give you at least a theoretical idea -
1g = 1000mg
1mg = 1000mcg
1 mg is already an absolutely minuscule tiny amount.

dont use a teaspoon LOL. use the point of a sowing needle

I diluted about half a teaspoon in water a drank it about 20 min ago, hope im dying =)

I dont know how sodium and benzoic acid is devided by weight...

 

[magnesiumania]

I thought, those 4 grams are meant to preserve 1 liter of strawberry jam and nobody ever dies from strawberry jam, not even a litre =) However cant say i notice anything from it, but worth a try.

 

[Sativa]

Well Statin drugs are prescribed specifically to inhibit cholesterol synthesis, and obviously, people don't die straight away. (otherwise it would have failed clinical trials etc). A year of Statin intake should predictably give Alzheimer's like symptoms/accelerate ageing/degeneration.

Statins were designed to inhibit the HMG-CoA pathway which is an essential metabolic pathway responsible for the generation of a diverse class of over 30,000 biomolecules such as cholesterol, heme, vitamin K, coenzyme Q10, and all steroid hormones.

So, probably advisable are low doses of NaBenzoate, accompanied by extra vit K, CoQ10, and dietary cholesterol (or alternatively, squalane extracted from olive oil) and some anti-estrogen substances, to mitigate the reduced progesterone production, in face of exposure to environmental estrogenic substances.

 

[BigYellowLemon]

Yes, but if you look at that same graph, that suggests sodium benzoate will spare (aceto)acetyl-COA for other things. Maybe that's part why it works as a temporary nootropic as PRL-8-53 - Wikipedia does.

You make very good posts.

Remember, everyone has to make up for Travis leaving now :\ - so reach for the stars dude.

I'm not sure sparing acetyl-coa will do anything. That stuff is already so absolutely plentiful in the body. We probably produce pounds of it a day. Compare that to cholesterol which is like 1g produced a day. Inhibiting hmg-coa will reduce cholesterols production by a significant (relative) amount while barely changing net relative acetyl-coa production.

Thanks.

I'm honestly worried Travis is dead, or something happened to him. That would be crazy. There'd be no reason for him to abandon the forum and he hasn't even logged in in like a year or something.

Does anyone have any contact with him outside this forum? Any word on how he is?

 

[redsun]

I'm not sure sparing acetyl-coa will do anything. That stuff is already so absolutely plentiful in the body. We probably produce pounds of it a day. Compare that to cholesterol which is like 1g produced a day. Inhibiting hmg-coa will reduce cholesterols production by a significant (relative) amount while barely changing net relative acetyl-coa production.

Thanks.

I'm honestly worried Travis is dead, or something happened to him. That would be crazy. There'd be no reason for him to abandon the forum and he hasn't even logged in in like a year or something.

Does anyone have any contact with him outside this forum? Any word on how he is?

Acetyl-CoA isn't exactly plentiful... you need thiamine, riboflavin, niacin, and pantothenic acid to make it. Any inadequacy will hinder production, which is all too common in most people's diets not too mention stressors can aggravate already poor micronutrient intake.

 

[magnesiumania]

Acetyl-CoA isn't exactly plentiful... you need thiamine, riboflavin, niacin, and pantothenic acid to make it. Any inadequacy will hinder production, which is all too common in most people's diets not too mention stressors can aggravate already poor micronutrient intake.

You also need to be hydrated to properly use b-vitamins and nnEMF dry you out like a steak in the microwave.

 

[Terma]

I'm not sure sparing acetyl-coa will do anything. That stuff is already so absolutely plentiful in the body. We probably produce pounds of it a day. Compare that to cholesterol which is like 1g produced a day. Inhibiting hmg-coa will reduce cholesterols production by a significant (relative) amount while barely changing net relative acetyl-coa production.

Thanks.

I'm honestly worried Travis is dead, or something happened to him. That would be crazy. There'd be no reason for him to abandon the forum and he hasn't even logged in in like a year or something.

Does anyone have any contact with him outside this forum? Any word on how he is?

Yeah on the whole - but I was thinking individual brain cells, and the multiple enzymes affected from the picture. You have a point though and quantification is something I need to work on in general.

I didn't try to contact him. I have my guesses (from the things he was experimenting with). Honestly I almost stopped posting here entirely too a couple times. But this is hard stuff and you realize you need all the help you can get and you have to throw absolutely everything at these problems cause man it's almost 2020 and Travis was the closest we had to a medical tricorder.

 

[Sativa]

Statins were designed to inhibit the HMG-CoA pathway which is an essential metabolic pathway responsible for the generation of a diverse class of over 30,000 biomolecules such as cholesterol, heme, vitamin K, coenzyme Q10, and all steroid hormones.

...further insights... which can give insights into the consequences of Sodium Benzoate oral use on levels of endogenously produced cholesterol, CoQ10, vit K & steroidal hormone.

Statins block the production of a compound called malevolate that is needed to make both cholesterol and CoQ10.
Statins can reduce CoQ10 levels by as much as 54% [38, 39, 2, 40+].

from Cancer: Disorder and Energy:
Coenzyme Q10 protects from aging-related oxidative stress and improves mitochondrial function in heart of rats fed a polyunsaturated fatty acid (PUFA)-rich diet.

from Rosacea, inflammation, and aging: The inefficiency of stress:
Vitamin K is also extremely light sensitive, and it interacts closely with coenzyme Q in regulating mitochondrial metabolism.

 

[golder]

Anyone got any idea of sodium benzoate dosages with regards to reducing ammonia? Any help very much appreciated!

 

[Sherbert]

@haidut do you think the schizophrenic-like symptoms from large, continuous doses of caffeine are also caused by ammonia?

haidut:
Yes, and cortisol is also likely involved if enough caffeine is taken to trigger heavy lipolysis and a stress reaction.


sherbert:
would taking theanine along with the caffeine prevent that from happening?

 

[Sherbert]

Anyone got any idea of sodium benzoate dosages with regards to reducing ammonia? Any help very much appreciated!

saw doses ranging from 500 mg to 5 grams ie roughly 1/4 teaspoon to 2&1/2 teaspoons. could be others.