Scalp Progesterone For Hair Loss Experiment

Elephanto

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I think the calcification balding hypothesis is silly.
Actually L'Oréal funded a study in the 1980's where they found that the scalp of deceased bald men had a thick layer of calcification whereas it wasn't seen in non-balding individuals. I've read this study several years ago but I don't see it on Google after a quick search.

The scalp detumescence (scalp massaging) study where complete regrowth was achieved is entirely based on the concept of decalcification :
Detumescence Therapy of Human Scalp for Natural Hair Regrowth
aa.png


A hypothetical pathogenesis model for androgenic alopecia: clarifying the dihydrotestosterone paradox and rate-limiting recovery factors - ScienceDirect
The hypothesis argues that: (1) chronic scalp tension transmitted from the galea aponeurotica induces an inflammatory response in androgenic alopecia-prone tissues; (2) dihydrotestosterone increases in androgenic alopecia-prone tissues as part of this inflammatory response; and (3) dihydrotestosterone does not directly miniaturize hair follicles. Rather, dihydrotestosterone is a co-mediator of tissue dermal sheath thickening, perifollicular fibrosis, and calcification – three chronic, progressive conditions concomitant with androgenic alopecia progression.

Taurine, which is more effective than Finasteride at reversing hair loss, has the main mechanism of decalcifying tissues.
Taurine More Effective Than Finasteride For Hair Loss

Taurine prevents beta-glycerophosphate-induced calcification in cultured rat vascular smooth muscle cells. - PubMed - NCBI

Taurine is a sulfur agent, and all forms of sulfur are systematically decalcifying :
Endogenous Sulfur Dioxide Inhibits Vascular Calcification in Association with the TGF-β/Smad Signaling Pathway. - PubMed - NCBI
(Taurine is also proven to inhibit TGF-Beta)
 
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Progesterone

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I think the calcification balding hypothesis is silly.


Clomiphene being as SERM does not scare me. I think it is excellent as a base to experiment with it and other orthomolecular supplements.
Well Im not taking it for my recession coz that is not the case with me. Im going to use it to boost T and SHBG in the hope it will restore downregulated estrogen expressions, coz in the past I had low T and E dominance. And maybe it can help with hair growth too. But I will be using more than Clomiphene for that. Still working on my formula, but it will involve, olive oil, coffee, turmeric, ashwagandha and a DermaPen.

What dosage of clomid will you use? When will you start?

Please keep everyone posted here about your progress.

Don't be surprised if you notice the Test boost very quickly...
 

Arrade

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I think the calcification balding hypothesis is silly.


Clomiphene being as SERM does not scare me. I think it is excellent as a base to experiment with it and other orthomolecular supplements.
Well Im not taking it for my recession coz that is not the case with me. Im going to use it to boost T and SHBG in the hope it will restore downregulated estrogen expressions, coz in the past I had low T and E dominance. And maybe it can help with hair growth too. But I will be using more than Clomiphene for that. Still working on my formula, but it will involve, olive oil, coffee, turmeric, ashwagandha and a DermaPen.
Why do you think that the theory is silly?
 

Progesterone

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Actually L'Oréal funded a study in the 1980's where they found that the scalp of deceased bald men had a thick layer of calcification whereas it wasn't seen in non-balding individuals. I've read this study several years ago but I don't see it on Google after a quick search.

The scalp detumescence (scalp massaging) study where complete regrowth was achieved is entirely based on the concept of decalcification :
Detumescence Therapy of Human Scalp for Natural Hair Regrowth
aa.png


A hypothetical pathogenesis model for androgenic alopecia: clarifying the dihydrotestosterone paradox and rate-limiting recovery factors - ScienceDirect


Taurine, which is more effective than Finasteride at reversing hair loss, has the main mechanism of decalcifying tissues.
Taurine More Effective Than Finasteride For Hair Loss

Taurine prevents beta-glycerophosphate-induced calcification in cultured rat vascular smooth muscle cells. - PubMed - NCBI

Taurine is a sulfur agent, and all forms of sulfur are systematically decalcifying :
Endogenous Sulfur Dioxide Inhibits Vascular Calcification in Association with the TGF-β/Smad Signaling Pathway. - PubMed - NCBI
(Taurine is also proven to inhibit TGF-Beta)

WOW wait a second...

The last thing you mentioned about sulfur inhibiting calcification is very interesting!

Then technically.. we should be taking MSM and/or organic sulfur????
 

Elephanto

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@Progesterone I've experimented with MSM and found it very effective, maybe moreso than Taurine. A few consecutive days of high dose (about 1g x 2-3 times a day) increases hair thickness and gives signs of lower Endotoxins.
 

Elephanto

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More than Taurine? Shidds
In my perception yes but I was still taking Taurine once a week or in small doses (3 x 175mg a day usually) so it might be tackling some specific factors that MSM doesn't (like the production of bile acids and more specific effects on liver health). But Taurine also increases Prolactin by triggering opioid receptors (which can affect your mental state if taken during the day) and increases Nitric Oxide while MSM inhibits NO. The minimization of NO has always given me good results hair-wise, some of the most potent inhibitors are Magnesium, Zinc, Niacinamide, Methylene Blue and MSM.
 
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Why do you think that the theory is silly?
because decreased blood flow from calcified arteries would have more effects than just hairloss. And the term is wrong coz it should be called Collagen accumulation.
@General Orange so you don’t have recession? You’re diffusive thinning then, I reckon?

Frankly it sounds like you are just arguing with me
I have no receding hairline it has stopped.
Not attacking you bro, just asking questions for clarification. :)

edit: yes diffuse thinning
 

Arrade

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because decreased blood flow from calcified arteries would have more effects than just hairloss. And the term is wrong coz it should be called Collagen accumulation.

I have no receding hairline it has stopped.
Not attacking you bro, just asking questions for clarification. :)
Are you sure collagen accumulation is the same as calcification? I'm not so sure, though I imagine they occur often simultaneously.
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/jdv.12424
Androgenetic alopecia is associated with increased arterial stiffness in asymptomatic young adults
How's this for evidence? "
asymptomatic young adults so no other symptoms
 

Elephanto

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because decreased blood flow from calcified arteries would have more effects than just hairloss. And the term is wrong coz it should be called Collagen accumulation.

edit: yes diffuse thinning

The narrow skull structure precipitates the calcification of temples since blood circulation isn't optimal in the first place. Only a little systemic calcification, much before it becomes life-threatening, will cause it when the skull structure is improper, whereas a wide skull structure will protect against hairline regression even with more systemic calcification. Things like Boron, K2 and raising androgens widen the skull structure, mechanical effects are seen from proper tongue posturing (mewing) and chewing hard mastic gum (hairline regression is much less present in meat-based cultures). There are many testimonies of these changes happening in adults.

But it's true that there is another factor that specifically calcifies soft tissues rather than arteries, and that is excess keratinocytes proliferation. It is inhibited by IGFBP-3, which is significantly lower in balding men, and so fixing the factors that downregulate IGFBP-3 is important.
 

Elephanto

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I've made this post when researching things that both increase Nitric Oxide and decrease IGFBP-3. It might be missing some IGFBP-3 negative factors but I can't think of any right now.

Here are things that both increase Nitric Oxide and decrease IGFBP3 : Arginine, Estrogen, Endotoxins, Iron, Vitamin D deficiency, Ammonia, lack of Magnesium, lack of Vitamin A, lack of Zinc, Arachidonic Acid.

Arginine can be reduced with high dose Lysine, which happens to be promoted as a a skin and hair health supplement (also has direct functions on hair follicles, independently of Arginine competition). Ammonia clearance is fixed by restoring kidney functions, general systemic decalcification will help a lot but there are a few things that are specifically effective like B1 (300mg), Niacinamide (30mg/kg), Zinc and Ceylon Cinnamon. Kidney damage also correlates with Prolactin concentrations. Iron can be chelated with coriander seeds powder and through blood giving. Arachidonic Acid from O6 restriction and a little bit of caviar weekly is probably safe (much safer than the toxic doses of fish oils in the bb.com guide; caviar is also lower in environmental contaminants).
 

Arrade

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I've made this post when researching things that both increase Nitric Oxide and decrease IGFBP-3. It might be missing some IGFBP-3 negative factors but I can't think of any right now.



Arginine can be reduced with high dose Lysine, which happens to be promoted as a a skin and hair health supplement (also has direct functions on hair follicles, independently of Arginine competition). Ammonia clearance is fixed by restoring kidney functions, general systemic decalcification will help a lot but there are a few things that are specifically effective like B1 (300mg), Niacinamide (30mg/kg), Zinc and Ceylon Cinnamon. Kidney damage also correlates with Prolactin concentrations. Iron can be chelated with coriander seeds powder and through blood giving. Arachidonic Acid from O6 restriction and a little bit of caviar weekly is probably safe (much safer than the toxic doses of fish oils in the bb.com guide; caviar is also lower in environmental contaminants).
Do you have links about nitric oxide and hairloss? I'd like to read more about it
I'm considering the use of ascorbic acid for my thyroid
 
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The narrow skull structure precipitates the calcification of temples since blood circulation isn't optimal in the first place. Only a little systemic calcification, much before it becomes life-threatening, will cause it when the skull structure is improper, whereas a wide skull structure will protect against hairline regression even with more systemic calcification. Things like Boron, K2 and raising androgens widen the skull structure, mechanical effects are seen from proper tongue posturing (mewing) and chewing hard mastic gum (hairline regression is much less present in meat-based cultures). There are many testimonies of these changes happening in adults.

But it's true that there is another factor that specifically calcifies soft tissues rather than arteries, and that is excess keratinocytes proliferation. It is inhibited by IGFBP-3, which is significantly lower in balding men, and so fixing the factors that downregulate IGFBP-3 is important.
Allright I see, I personally dont want to hear the stupid term "calcification" anymore hehe lol.

I've made this post when researching things that both increase Nitric Oxide and decrease IGFBP-3. It might be missing some IGFBP-3 negative factors but I can't think of any right now.

Arginine can be reduced with high dose Lysine, which happens to be promoted as a a skin and hair health supplement (also has direct functions on hair follicles, independently of Arginine competition). Ammonia clearance is fixed by restoring kidney functions, general systemic decalcification will help a lot but there are a few things that are specifically effective like B1 (300mg), Niacinamide (30mg/kg), Zinc and Ceylon Cinnamon. Kidney damage also correlates with Prolactin concentrations. Iron can be chelated with coriander seeds powder and through blood giving. Arachidonic Acid from O6 restriction and a little bit of caviar weekly is probably safe (much safer than the toxic doses of fish oils in the bb.com guide; caviar is also lower in environmental contaminants).

But is not a reduced Nitric Oxide one of the causes of arterial calcification. Nitric oxide inhibits vascular smooth muscle cell calcification
Excessive stress hormone release, via HPA axis, of adrenaline and elevated prostaglandin E2 will constrict arteries.
So I don't think you should reduce NO and arginine, especially stay away from high Lysine food. We need Nitric oxide production to dilate the tiny arteries in the scalp.
 

Progesterone

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Blah.

I'm considering going back on clomid...

Miss it. I kind of feel like garbage. I've felt like this for maybe 1-2yrs but, clomid lifted that.

Not sure if it was actually harming hair, in fact I'm shedding more now off of it, as expected though.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

It's a tough one, for sure.

This guy on reddit, has been on clomid for 3 yrs and says he's had zero hair loss as a result of using it.
 

Arrade

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Allright I see, I personally dont want to hear the stupid term "calcification" anymore hehe lol.



But is not a reduced Nitric Oxide one of the causes of arterial calcification. Nitric oxide inhibits vascular smooth muscle cell calcification
Excessive stress hormone release, via HPA axis, of adrenaline and elevated prostaglandin E2 will constrict arteries.
So I don't think you should reduce NO and arginine, especially stay away from high Lysine food. We need Nitric oxide production to dilate the tiny arteries in the scalp.
Calcification isn't a stupid word it's a scientific term.

Nice post about the nitric oxide
 

Arrade

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Blah.

I'm considering going back on clomid...

Miss it. I kind of feel like garbage. I've felt like this for maybe 1-2yrs but, clomid lifted that.

Not sure if it was actually harming hair, in fact I'm shedding more now off of it, as expected though.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

It's a tough one, for sure.

This guy on reddit, has been on clomid for 3 yrs and says he's had zero hair loss as a result of using it.
Yeah but that could be any number of other factors.

Why are you using clomid?
If it's for T levels perhaps you should try to raise them naturally and in peaty ways. Also you're supposed to be able to come off clomid and retain higher levels
 

Elephanto

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Do you have links about nitric oxide and hairloss? I'd like to read more about it
I'm considering the use of ascorbic acid for my thyroid

I don't think there are studies related to hair loss (in fact applied topically can give temporary results by increasing vasodilatation) but the theory behind is from a larger context which can be learned from Peat's articles. Promoting excessive angiogenesis is both bad for cancer and hair (similar to keratinocytes proliferation, an excess of blood vessels in an area that block circulation). Then you have the fact that most Nitric Oxide-increasing agents I can find also decrease IGFBP-3, especially its main precursor Arginine. From my own experience, I notice lesser hair quality with NO agents like Theanine and Cocoa; and on the opposite side rapid amelioration with Nitric Oxide-inhibiting agents. Conditions that result in high NO correlate with mpb. Raising CO2 which is very helpful leads to NO minimization.

Nitric Oxide induces glutamate release and NO inhibiton has similar effects to NMDA antagonism. Both of these induce hyperexcitability (excicotoxicity) from over-activating calcium receptors. This leads to the uptake of calcium into cells, and out of bones.
Peat's quote :
Increased intracellular calcium, in association with excess nitric oxide and excitatory amino acids, is involved in several neurodegenerative diseases

Ray Peat, PhD on Nitric Oxide – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)

Its range of negative effects is so large that it would be hard to isolate every ways it can lead to hair loss.

@General Orange
Lack of context, please read Peat's articles on Nitric Oxide. It is produced when CO2 is low, which is the main protector of blood vessels and circulation. While having a temporary effect it also shifts many parameters toward deterioration.

The basic control of blood flow in the brain is the result of the relaxation of the wall of blood vessels in the presence of carbon dioxide, which is produced in proportion to the rate at which oxygen and glucose are being metabolically combined by active cells. In the inability of cells to produce CO2 at a normal rate, nitric oxide synthesis in blood vessels can cause them to dilate. The mechanism of relaxation by NO is very different, however, involving the inhibition of mitochondrial energy production (Barron, et al., 2001)
 

Arrade

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I don't think there are studies related to hair loss (in fact applied topically can give temporary results by increasing vasodilatation) but the theory behind is from a larger context which can be learned from Peat's articles. Promoting excessive angiogenesis is both bad for cancer and hair (similar to keratinocytes proliferation, an excess of blood vessels in an area that block circulation). Then you have the fact that most Nitric Oxide-increasing agents I can find also decrease IGFBP-3, especially its main precursor Arginine. From my own experience, I notice lesser hair quality with NO agents like Theanine and Cocoa; and on the opposite side rapid amelioration with Nitric Oxide-inhibiting agents. Conditions that result in high NO correlate with mpb. Raising CO2 which is very helpful leads to NO minimization.

Nitric Oxide induces glutamate release and NO inhibiton has similar effects to NMDA antagonism. Both of these induce hyperexcitability (excicotoxicity) from over-activating calcium receptors. This leads to the uptake of calcium into cells, and out of bones.
Peat's quote :


Ray Peat, PhD on Nitric Oxide – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)

Its range of negative effects is so large that it would be hard to isolate every ways it can lead to hair loss.

@General Orange
Lack of context, please read Peat's articles on Nitric Oxide. It is produced when CO2 is low, which is the main protector of blood vessels and circulation. While having a temporary effect it also shifts many parameters toward deterioration.
Damn you always give me more to think about.
I'll have to read everything he and Danny writes about it as well as other people's ideas. Personally I won't accept his statements immediately but in balance with other researchers and writers.
 

Elephanto

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@Arrade Sure, that's a sign of intelligence right there.

Some other things to consider is the hair regrowth stack which has so many supps/factors that leads to significant NO reduction, and has worked. I think even Taurine, by potently reducing Endotoxins is more likely to have a net reducing effect on long-term NO levels. If the simplistic theory that raising NO is good for hair because of its vasodilatating property was true, then the opposite would have happened. Minoxidil also has a low rate of success in long term, most report worse regression after a few months.

There's a couple of testimonies on the internet, like this one :
L-arginine Supplements - Sudden Rapid Hairloss ?!?

Also, bald men have significantly higher risks of aggressive prostate cancer and NO promotes it (4 times the risk of lethal prostate cancer when high and low iNOS are compared)
High inducible nitric oxide synthase in prostate tumor epithelium is associated with lethal prostate cancer. - PubMed - NCBI
 
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