Saturated Fats Weaken Brain, Damage Heart, Cause Endotoxin. What's Up?

[dookie]

It seems pretty well established, even on this forum, that saturated fats cause more of an endotoxin/LPS response than unsaturated fats. So chugging a cup of fish oil will actually provoke less endotoxin/LPS -> less estrogen -> less FFA ... etc

The main studies we have that the UNsaturated oils are damaging, is @haidut 's posts of people with certain diseases having higher "metabolites" of unsaturated fats in their urine or elsewhere.

But We know that the body is capable, under some conditions, of producing unsaturated fats (for instance, cold exposure can produce unsaturated fats, even when diet is saturated fat only). So where is the evidence that completely avoiding them in the diet is a good thing?

I keep seeing more and more studies, including the one from Harvard posted on the forum, that saturated fats are associated with higher mortality and disease.

You can easily find studies showing that saturated fats are bad, and that they weaken the resistance of the organism to many diseases. Just do a simple online search. Here are just 2 studies I found:

A saturated-fat diet aggravates the outcome of traumatic brain injury on hippocampal plasticity and cognitive function by reducing brain-derived ne... - PubMed - NCBI

https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms13997

This is interesting, given the fact that Peat says animals high in saturated fats are more resistant to injury.

But since the body can saturate unsaturated fats, and unsaturate saturated ones, in vivo, isn't it better to focus on optimizing metabolism, than obsessing about dietary fat ratios?

Where's the evidence that a low fat diet, of mostly unsaturated fats, is toxic?

 

[Westside PUFAs]

If the fat of lactating mammals is mostly saturated then that proves that they are not toxic to mammals. It makes no sense that mammals would have evolved something to clog their arteries while breastfeeding, or else no mammals would exist. I do think saturated fat does cause and is a large contributor to excess body fat but that's just because people over-eat it ("If you eat lots of butter or cream, it can make you fat" - RP). But it doesn't make sense that it would clog a warm blooded animals arteries or cause some other disease because they are required for babies. Getting fat from SFA will simply fill up your adipose tissue with stored energy. It may cause insulin resistance because of the problem of having too much body fat and FFA but that's probably about it.

Look at how saturated mammal milk is, and the fact that whale milk is as well even while in the cold water, unlike non-mammal fish, says a lot about mammals:

Milk Composition - Species Table

that saturated fats cause more of an endotoxin

It's tough to point to exactly what kind of fat in the context of endotoxin because a person is likely to eat other fats besides SFA, in fact, a person definitely eats a mix of all fats because of the naturally occurring amount of all kinds of fats in almost all foods. Once chewed and broken down, all fats are present in the GI to interact with bacteria and absorbed. I think endotoxin boils down to excess intestinal bacteria. Drink some yacon syrup and watch what happens. Farts on crack.

the one from Harvard posted on the forum

Harvard's head of nutrition Walter Willett says some silly things. And Harvard's articles on nutrition say many silly things. Don't fall for the appeal to authority fallacy. Harvard is just a building in Cambridge filled with a bunch of SJW's and a small amount of cool people who want to be lawyers and doctors to make some money.

I don't think observational and population studies on nutrition are worth anything because they are not controlled. People can be eating and living in any way and then lie/omit/forget on a questionnaire.

Where's the evidence that a low fat diet, of mostly unsaturated fats, is toxic?

I think that's a weird statement because why would a low fat diet have to have mostly unsaturates? People dying from the top killers of heart disease etc. don't eat low fat of either pufa or SFA, they eat both.

Peat thinks SFA is protective against the degenerative diseases.

PUFA breakdown products - acrolein, malondialdehyde, hydroxynonenal, crotonaldehyde, lipid peroxides, isoprostanes, prostaglandins, neuroprostanes, eicosanoids, leuktotrienes.

People eat lots of pufa in these forms:

Mayonaise
Salad dressings (the first ingredient in salad dressing and mayo is pure oil)
Condiments and dipping sauces like ranch dip, bbq sauce etc.
All snack foods like Cheetos, Doritos and potato/corn chips are cooked in pufa oil
Fried food like french fries, onion rings and donuts
Baked goods like pastries and cakes are cooked with pufa
Restaurant food
Pizza dough is made with pufa oil
Soups from restaurants are made with lots of oil (and homemade soups too, by people who think oil is good for them)

Combine that with all of the cheese people eat and you have a high pufa and high SFA diet.

.

 

[Ella]

Drinking OJ with a high-fat meal prevents LPS translocation.

 

[Queequeg]

If the fat of lactating mammals is mostly saturated then that proves that they are not toxic to mammals. It makes no sense that mammals would have evolved something to clog their arteries while breastfeeding, or else no mammals would exist. I do think saturated fat does cause and is a large contributor to excess body fat but that's just because people over-eat it ("If you eat lots of butter or cream, it can make you fat" - RP). But it doesn't make sense that it would clog a warm blooded animals arteries or cause some other disease because they are required for babies. Getting fat from SFA will simply fill up your adipose tissue with stored energy. It may cause insulin resistance because of the problem of having too much body fat and FFA but that's probably about it.

Look at how saturated mammal milk is, and the fact that whale milk is as well even while in the cold water, unlike non-mammal fish, says a lot about mammals:

Milk Composition - Species Table



It's tough to point to exactly what kind of fat in the context of endotoxin because a person is likely to eat other fats besides SFA, in fact, a person definitely eats a mix of all fats because of the naturally occurring amount of all kinds of fats in almost all foods. Once chewed and broken down, all fats are present in the GI to interact with bacteria and absorbed. I think endotoxin boils down to excess intestinal bacteria. Drink some yacon syrup and watch what happens. Farts on crack.



Harvard's head of nutrition Walter Willett says some silly things. And Harvard's articles on nutrition say many silly things. Don't fall for the appeal to authority fallacy. Harvard is just a building in Cambridge filled with a bunch of SJW's and a small amount of cool people who want to be lawyers and doctors to make some money.

I don't think observational and population studies on nutrition are worth anything because they are not controlled. People can be eating and living in any way and then lie/omit/forget on a questionnaire.



I think that's a weird statement because why would a low fat diet have to have mostly unsaturates? People dying from the top killers of heart disease etc. don't eat low fat of either pufa or SFA, they eat both.

Peat thinks SFA is protective against the degenerative diseases.

PUFA breakdown products - acrolein, malondialdehyde, hydroxynonenal, crotonaldehyde, lipid peroxides, isoprostanes, prostaglandins, neuroprostanes, eicosanoids, leuktotrienes.

People eat lots of pufa in these forms:

Mayonaise
Salad dressings (the first ingredient in salad dressing and mayo is pure oil)
Condiments and dipping sauces like ranch dip, bbq sauce etc.
All snack foods like Cheetos, Doritos and potato/corn chips are cooked in pufa oil
Fried food like french fries, onion rings and donuts
Baked goods like pastries and cakes are cooked with pufa
Restaurant food
Pizza dough is made with pufa oil
Soups from restaurants are made with lots of oil (and homemade soups too, by people who think oil is good for them)

Combine that with all of the cheese people eat and you have a high pufa and high SFA diet.

.

Interesting point on human milk. I found an interesting article on the presence of SFA in human milk and whether or not SFA is healthy. My reading of the article is that the reason why the SFA studies are all over the place is that human response to SFAs may be highly individual.
Saturated Fats: A Perspective from Lactation and Milk Composition
"Recognizing that different humans with different lifestyles respond differently to fat intakes and compositions implies that in the future, diets will be designed for individuals not populations. In such a future, finite intakes of specific saturated fats may actually be recommended."

However I do want to clarify that human milk is 45% SFA, 38% MUFA, & 11% PUFA. So it could also be argued that since PUFA is 11%, it cant be that bad. Human milk also has twice the PUFA content as cow's milk. I am not saying that I necessarily agree with that argument but there maybe something to it.

 

[Such_Saturation]

A saturated-fat diet aggravates the outcome of traumatic brain injury on hippocampal plasticity and cognitive function by reducing brain-derived ne... - PubMed - NCBI

The HFS diet is high in saturated and monounsaturated (primarily from lard plus a small amount of corn oil, 39% energy)

lol

 

[Orion]

However I do want to clarify that human milk is 45% SFA, 38% MUFA, & 11% PUFA. So it could also be argued that since PUFA is 11%, it cant be that bad. Human milk also has twice the PUFA content as cow's milk. I am not saying that I necessarily agree with that argument but there maybe something to it.

I believe I have read the high PUFA content is from the modern diet and seed oil consumption, before the seed oil industries the PUFA content was much much lower.

 

[Queequeg]

I believe I have read the high PUFA content is from the modern diet and seed oil consumption, before the seed oil industries the PUFA content was much much lower.

good point. However I wonder why there is any PUFA at all in human milk if it is as bad for us as we all have come to believe.
This study compares modern women to Amazonian tribal foragers. The foragers also have high PUFAs in their milk but a much better ratio of n-3 to n-6. They do eat a lot of fish but obviously no s3eed oil. So I still wonder if PUFAs were so bad wouldn't the breast milk have evolved to remove all the PUFAs.
Fatty acid composition in the mature milk of Bolivian forager-horticulturalists: controlled comparisons with a US sample
this table summarizes the difference in fat content
Fatty acid composition in the mature milk of Bolivian forager-horticulturalists: controlled comparisons with a US sample

 

[Elysium]

Just thinking where does the assumption that whatever comes out of a breast has to be top notch evolution-approved and superhealthy. The nature needs us to die. Thats a part of the plan, and perhaps PUFA in the breast milk is the first of the influencing factors that lead to it.

 

[lvysaur]

To the extent that PUFA is bad because of AA metabolites, seed oil isn't even an issue; animal fat is (less so for ruminant fats).

 

[Queequeg]

Just thinking where does the assumption that whatever comes out of a breast has to be top notch evolution-approved and superhealthy. The nature needs us to die. Thats a part of the plan, and perhaps PUFA in the breast milk is the first of the influencing factors that lead to it.

That assumption comes from the same place that every other assumption comes from. But here it seems to make sense as I would think that every advantage to get the baby to the age of procreation would have evolved. The advantage of having older people die only begins after they cant procreate anymore. Babies who are fed formula w/o DHA supplementation have lower DHA content in their brains than breast fed babies. Breast fed babies do better in in several measures than formula fed infants but they don't know if its the DHA or not. Obviously Ray thinks its something else.

 

[schultz]

lol

Haha classic.

Lard is like 34% saturated fat and 25%-29% PUFA, not to mention the added corn oil. How is that high in saturated fat? Freaking scientists man! At least use tallow @ 50% saturated or maybe coconut oil which is 82.5% saturated. I guess this could skew the results though... ... ...

Lard Analysis

 

[Such_Saturation]

Haha classic.

Lard is like 34% saturated fat and 25%-29% PUFA, not to mention the added corn oil. How is that high in saturated fat? Freaking scientists man! At least use tallow @ 50% saturated or maybe coconut oil which is 82.5% saturated. I guess this could skew the results though... ... ...

Lard Analysis

Lol rather have some high oleic sunflower than modern lard

 

[schultz]

Lol rather have some high oleic sunflower than modern lard

Had to look up high oleic sunflower oil to see it's breakdown. 3.8% PUFA, I must say I expected more!

 

[Such_Saturation]

Had to look up high oleic sunflower oil to see it's breakdown. 3.8% PUFA, I must say I expected more!

I tell you they could grow any percentage of any characteristic they want nowadays from any plant if they just wanted to...

 

[James IV]

Nah. Nevermind.

 

[BigYellowLemon]

lol

Nice.

Yeah the sucrose didn't help either.

 

[REOSIRENS]

Palmitic acid (saturated fat ) actually restores the gray matter plasticity... helping to improve cognition dementia patients and people with traumatic brain injury

 

[lollipop]

Palmitic acid (saturated fat ) actually restores the gray matter plasticity... helping to improve cognition dementia patients and people with traumatic brain injury

This is interesting @REOSIRENS, could you speak more about this?

 

[James IV]

Palmitic acid (saturated fat ) actually restores the gray matter plasticity... helping to improve cognition dementia patients and people with traumatic brain injury

IIRC, This is the type of fat our liver makes from excess fructose.

 

[TibRex]

This is interesting @REOSIRENS, could you speak more about this?

At Wikipedia, I came across the following shockers though, re palmitic acid (a major [saturated] component of palm oil). It is possible that some folks are conflating palmitic acid with palmitoleic acid (Omega-7), a monounsaturated acid that is biosynthesized from palmitic acid.

[A] Palmitic acid

1. Aluminium salts of palmitic acid and naphthenic acid were combined during World War II to produce napalm. The word "napalm" is derived from the words naphthenic acid and palmitic acid.

2. According to the World Health Organization, evidence is "convincing" that consumption of palmitic acid increases the risk of developing cardiovascular disease,[16] based on studies indicating that it may increase LDL levels in the blood.

3. Palmitic acid strongly boosts metastasis in mouse models of human oral cancer cells. Among all fatty acids, it has the strongest effect in boosting the metastatic potential of CD36+ metastasis-initiating cells.

4. Rats fed a diet of 20% palmitic acid and 80% carbohydrate for extended periods showed alterations in central nervous system control of insulin secretion, and suppression of the body's natural appetite-suppressing signals from leptin and insulin (the key hormones involved in weight regulation)

Source: Palmitic acid - Wikipedia

B. Palmitoleic Acid

1. It is a common constituent of the glycerides of human adipose tissue. It is present in all tissues but, in general, found in higher concentrations in the liver.

2. Dietary sources of palmitoleic acid include breast milk,[1] a variety of animal oils, vegetable oils, and marine oils. Macadamia oil (Macadamia integrifolia) and sea buckthorn oil (Hippophae rhamnoides) are botanical sources with high concentrations, containing 17% and 19-29% of palmitoleic acid, respectively.

Source: Palmitoleic acid - Wikipedia