RP Email Advice Comment: Viruses

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In other words, being around sick/stressed people is technically contagious. Even if their disease is not caused by virus/bacteria.

Oh yeah I've definitely experienced that! All bodies speak the same language... and cells also affect one another like this.
 

Tired

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My Question:
Hey Ray!
I read a book called Fear of The Invisible by Jeanine Roberts which is an incredible detailed account of the history of Virology, and presents the hypothesis that Virus' are completely misunderstood. The author reports the political history of Virology which consisted of a bunch of childlike scientists trying desperately to make a contribution to science to satisfy their egos.

If she's correct, and it seems very likely based on what I've read, viruses are solvents, produced BY the cells (when they have been exposed to toxic chemicals) as a kind of self-cleaning/detoxification mechanism.

If the invisible virus is the cause of massive deaths in the case of, for example, polio, then the chemical-producing companies instantly become free of all liability.

“When I dug back further, to the origins of virology and the great hunt for the poliovirus, I found the story was scandalously much the same. Powerful evidence was presented to Congress linking the summer polio epidemics to summer-used heavy metal pesticides. These scientists suggested remedies, reported curing polio – and were ignored. Instead parents were told to be scared of a yet undiscovered virus.” – Janine Roberts

Additionally, Pasteur appears to be a complete fraud (Pasteur vs. Bechamp), so the invention of viruses could in theory also have been to get people to accept toxic vaccine injections.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on this!
Best regards,
-Mark


Ray's Reply:
Hey,how did get through to RP..TANKS
 

Suikerbuik

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In other words, being around sick/stressed people is technically contagious. Even if their disease is not caused by virus/bacteria.

Haidut, I too think that is true. Stress has even been proven to be directly contagious. More hypothetically, although there seems to be some evidence in case of severe dysfunction, people with malfunction, even when not directly being caused viruses, bacteria or w/e, carry a cloud of micro-organisms with likely opportunistics among them and if you're vulnerable ... So once again my appreciation for all your effort, it certainly benefits the whole!

Flat earth, I can't really follow your reasoning? And see the posts on HIV and AIDS and endotoxin (from haidut).
 

Blossom

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Haidut, I too think that is true. Stress has even been proven to be directly contagious. More hypothetically, although there seems to be some evidence in case of severe dysfunction, people with malfunction, even when not directly being caused viruses, bacteria or w/e, carry a cloud of micro-organisms with likely opportunistics among them and if you're vulnerable ... So once again my appreciation for all your effort, it certainly benefits the whole!

Flat earth, I can't really follow your reasoning? And see the posts on HIV and AIDS and endotoxin (from haidut).
I'm very interested in learning more about stress being directly contagious @Suikerbuik. If you or @haidut or anyone else has information/additional reading that you can point me towards I would greatly appreciate it. I actually think it would make for an interesting separate thread if anyone is interested in starting one.
 

Kasper

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Does it also work the other way around? I mean, being stress free being contagious.
 

Makrosky

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I'm very interested in learning more about stress being directly contagious @Suikerbuik. If you or @haidut or anyone else has information/additional reading that you can point me towards I would greatly appreciate it. I actually think it would make for an interesting separate thread if anyone is interested in starting one.
I think it's pretty obvious that if you are surrounded by stressed people you can easily become stressed. Have you never experienced this ? Unless you are a Zen master or have a very strong metabolism.

This is the same as if you are sorrounded by greyish people you'll become grey yourself.

Or as Peat has mentioned before, if you're surrounded by an authoritarian it can spread it to the rest of the group.
 

Blossom

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I think it's pretty obvious that if you are surrounded by stressed people you can easily become stressed. Have you never experienced this ? Unless you are a Zen master or have a very strong metabolism.

This is the same as if you are sorrounded by greyish people you'll become grey yourself.

Or as Peat has mentioned before, if you're surrounded by an authoritarian it can spread it to the rest of the group.
Yes, I have experienced this and agree it's very obvious @Makrosky. I'm just interested in reading more on the topic because I work with terminally and critically ill people and my co-workers seem to be about as stressed as it gets. I no longer catch 'infections' from working in such an environment but if I'm completely honest the stress of dealing with extreme illness in others still takes a toll and I can see that my co-workers have a hard time coping as well often taking their frustrations out on each other. If at all possible I would like to read more on the topic to but I will probably still have to change my environment soon regardless as it is glaringly obvious it is not conducive to health. Thanks for your input.
 

moss

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Yes, I have experienced this and agree it's very obvious @Makrosky. I'm just interested in reading more on the topic because I work with terminally and critically ill people and my co-workers seem to be about as stressed as it gets. I no longer catch 'infections' from working in such an environment but if I'm completely honest the stress of dealing with extreme illness in others still takes a toll and I can see that my co-workers have a hard time coping as well often taking their frustrations out on each other. If at all possible I would like to read more on the topic to but I will probably still have to change my environment soon regardless as it is glaringly obvious it is not conducive to health. Thanks for your input.

Blossom no doubt you will change your environment to one that is more conducive for your health when you are able to. I am in a similar place ( I don't work in a hospital) however, being around illness is a drain and I think this becomes more problematic as one's energy and health improves.
 

tara

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I'm very interested in learning more about stress being directly contagious @Suikerbuik. If you or @haidut or anyone else has information/additional reading that you can point me towards I would greatly appreciate it. I actually think it would make for an interesting separate thread if anyone is interested in starting one.
Boss yells at man, man grumps at wife, wife scolds child, child kicks dog.

The way I think about it is that good human contact and communication is so important to us social creatures.
When we are stressed about present or past circumstances, or in pain, or short of energy, it's so much harder to communicate warmth, approval, respect for self and others, interest in each other, etc - the kinds of things that strengthen relationships and make us feel secure and happy with each other and give us a basis for excitement about living and learning.
Where we personally are vulnerable to how other people relate to us (ie what kind of interactions make us feel stressed) probably has a bit to do with both our current health/metabolic status, but also which parts of our past experiences are still unresolved enough to be triggered by eg the a gloomy or pained or angry or fearful face or voice from someone else.

I also wonder whether there might be something more direct and physical to do with the radiation our cells give out when we are physically close to each other. Maybe healing touch from a healthy and well-intentioned person involves transmitting something supportive, and stressed or unwell people don't have as much of this to give?
 

Blossom

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Blossom no doubt you will change your environment to one that is more conducive for your health when you are able to. I am in a similar place ( I don't work in a hospital) however, being around illness is a drain and I think this becomes more problematic as one's energy and health improves.
I've noticed that too, the healthier I get the more aware and sensitive I am to how bothersome the stress and illness in others is to deal with on a consistent basis @moss! Thanks for understanding.
 

Blossom

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Boss yells at man, man grumps at wife, wife scolds child, child kicks dog.

The way I think about it is that good human contact and communication is so important to us social creatures.
When we are stressed about present or past circumstances, or in pain, or short of energy, it's so much harder to communicate warmth, approval, respect for self and others, interest in each other, etc - the kinds of things that strengthen relationships and make us feel secure and happy with each other and give us a basis for excitement about living and learning.
Where we personally are vulnerable to how other people relate to us (ie what kind of interactions make us feel stressed) probably has a bit to do with both our current health/metabolic status, but also which parts of our past experiences are still unresolved enough to be triggered by eg the a gloomy or pained or angry or fearful face or voice from someone else.

I also wonder whether there might be something more direct and physical to do with the radiation our cells give out when we are physically close to each other. Maybe healing touch from a healthy and well-intentioned person involves transmitting something supportive, and stressed or unwell people don't have as much of this to give?
I agree tara! Great explanation as always.
 

Blossom

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I also wonder whether there might be something more direct and physical to do with the radiation our cells give out when we are physically close to each other. Maybe healing touch from a healthy and well-intentioned person involves transmitting something supportive, and stressed or unwell people don't have as much of this to give?
I'm specifically curious about this aspect of being around numerous stressed/ill people for hours on end. I know Mother Theresa seemed to tolerate it fine but it doesn't seem like your average person has her gift!
 

Suikerbuik

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I'm very interested in learning more about stress being directly contagious @Suikerbuik. If you or @haidut or anyone else has information/additional reading that you can point me towards I would greatly appreciate it. I actually think it would make for an interesting separate thread if anyone is interested in starting one.

In the thread below you may find some interesting links:
Stress increases weight gain by slowing down metabolism | Ray Peat Forum

More directly:
Cortisol increase in empathic stress is modulated by emotional closeness and observation modality:

http://www.psyneuen-journal.com/article/S0306-4530(14)00124-3/abstract?cc=y=

I am unaware of scientific studies and the possibility of physical trasnmitted stress through body radiation.
 

DaveFoster

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It's kind of funny how everyone in college is sick all the time, and I haven't been nearly sick in three years.

No one even has a clue.
 
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the Janine Roberts book is absolutely outstanding. Thanks for recommending it! It is an amazing eye-opener. And it's like a thriller, it is a real page turner.
 

Blossom

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haidut

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@haidut So could a "stomach bug" be cured by antibiotic for someone without charcoal?

If it is indeed a bug and of bacterial type, then probably yes. Not sure why else you would take an antibiotic. The charcoal is used not to kill the bug but to reduce endotoxin absorption into the bloodstream. So, not much in common between the antibiotic and charcoal when it comes to killing bugs.
 

sugarbabe

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Charcoal definitely reduces the severity of stomach bugs but I've never had it knock out the subsequent fever and lethargy the next day. I should say I only have experience with it twice.
 

Travis

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This does not follow. Standard theory is that viruses are produced by cells inside the body. This does not stop them being infections and transmissible.
Thanks Tara. Apparently I could not find a way to reconcile those opposing issues myself. Some viruses actually do appear to be transmissible.

HIV does not cause AIDS. This should be the model "viral hoax" because there is more information on this than any other viral hoax. I read Peter Duesberg's Inventing the AIDS Virus a decade ago and his arguments are irrefutable. Duesberg is a Virologist in Berkeley.

I read a book called Virus Mania earlier this year, and this one expanded the viral hoax theory to include Polio, Mad Cow Disease, SARS, ect...

Stephen Lanka is also a Virologist that believes that viruses are endogenous; and the Nobel Prize-winning inventor of the PCR, Kary Mullis, is also convinced that AIDS is not caused by a virus. Aids is caused by heavy drug use, antibiotics, and AZT (the drug used to treat AIDS).

Hemophiliacs get it from Factor VIII or something; I don't quite remember exactly .

Visit this website for some really cool information on this stuff!

Thanks for the book review. I will have to get a copy of that!
 
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