Remarkable Synergistic Effect Of Androsterone With DHEA

[haidut]

I'm curious about giving the pansterone a try; possibly with 11 keto dht or androsterone. Any reason to pick one over the other? I tried ashwagandha which has effects on GABA and it made me very sedated/lethargic even at smallish doses, I've seen androsterone is a GABA agonist too.

Why have you (haidut) switched from keto to androsterone?

I use androsterone mostly because it is a precursor to DHT and I like to take precursors instead of direct hormones whenever possible. But in cases where metabolis is compromised and the steroid enzymes are not working well, or if there is an excess of cortisol/estrogen/prolactin one may need to use 11-keto DHT to bring things under control. You should not be doing something just because I am doing it. You should try things yourself and do what works best for you.

 

[Wagner83]

Sure , your answer gave me food for thought anyway so thank you for that.

 

[milk_lover]

@haidut Pansterone+Androsterone are giving me muscles without going to the gym! My biceps and triceps are so pumped up my coworkers commented on them. Hmmm so far so good. I will continue using them to explore this combination more. Can I use the combination only once a week and gain the benefits? I don't want to shut down my natural DHT because steroids are not permitted in my country. I am talking about the future.

 

[Constatine]

@haidut Pansterone+Androsterone are giving me muscles without going to the gym! My biceps and triceps are so pumped up my coworkers commented on them. Hmmm so far so good. I will continue using them to explore this combination more. Can I use the combination only once a week and gain the benefits? I don't want to shut down my natural DHT because steroids are not permitted in my country. I am talking about the future.

It's unlikely your natural DHT production will be represented, rather your natural testosterone production will be repressed with an overabundance of DHT. But that has only been shown to happen at pretty generous dosages. My guess is that you will begin to exhibit signs of too low estrogen before DHT causes any suppression though.

 

[haidut]

@haidut Pansterone+Androsterone are giving me muscles without going to the gym! My biceps and triceps are so pumped up my coworkers commented on them. Hmmm so far so good. I will continue using them to explore this combination more. Can I use the combination only once a week and gain the benefits? I don't want to shut down my natural DHT because steroids are not permitted in my country. I am talking about the future.

Depending on what your endogenous levels of DHEA and DHT are, you can take less if you already have enough. Maybe taken twice a week after going to the gym will amplify the effects of training and serve as a substitute for the days you don't take it.

 

[milk_lover]

It's unlikely your natural DHT production will be represented, rather your natural testosterone production will be repressed with an overabundance of DHT. But that has only been shown to happen at pretty generous dosages. My guess is that you will begin to exhibit signs of too low estrogen before DHT causes any suppression though.

Depending on what your endogenous levels of DHEA and DHT are, you can take less if you already have enough. Maybe taken twice a week after going to the gym will amplify the effects of training and serve as a substitute for the days you don't take it.

Thanks to both of you. I will take it after weight training to see how it affects me.

 

[DaveFoster]

Since androsterone can suppress endogenous steroid production in high doses or with very long chronic administration, I would watch for signs of decreased libido, energy, etc and maybe take a break for a week. If used sporadically, say every other day, I think this combination can probably be used indefinitely without much risk of suppression.

That's very interesting; do you have any sources for this besides haidutipedia?

 

[haidut]

That's very interesting; do you have any sources for this besides haidutipedia?

Sources for what - the lack of suppression? I think some of the older studies with Atromid showed that it did not cause suppression in doses that provided 50mg androsterone x 3 daily for a total of 150mg daily. These studies are in the original post.

 

[tca300]

Ray thinks Androsterone is safe in doses similar to DHEA ( 10-15mg/day). I would say that at that amount it could be used indefinitely. Otherwise he would have said differently. Also, not being able to convert to estrogen IMO makes it much safer that DHEA.

 

[DaveFoster]

Sources for what - the lack of suppression? I think some of the older studies with Atromid showed that it did not cause suppression in doses that provided 50mg androsterone x 3 daily for a total of 150mg daily. These studies are in the original post.

Thanks, haidut. Should have looked; that seems to be about 5 drops, three times per day with the potentiation from DMSO. I'm not sure the DHEA would contribute to suppression either way; I'd assume not.

 

[raypeatclips]

Ray thinks Androsterone is safe in doses similar to DHEA ( 10-15mg/day).

Where did he say this about androsterone?

 

[tca300]

@raypeatclips Private email between him and I.

 

[raypeatclips]

@raypeatclips Private email between him and I.

In a private email to me he mentioned "a few mg's" of androsterone, which I think sounds a lot less than 10-15mg, did he mentioned specific dosages to you?

 

[tca300]

@raypeatclips

I asked " Whats your opinion on men supplementing topical Androsterone? Do you think it would be a safe beneficial supplement for inhibiting estrogen and potentially other positive benefits? Thank you!"

Ray said " I’ve never used it, but I think it’s safe in amounts similar to DHEA (10 or 15 mg/day) or testosterone (2 to 4 mg/day). Have you used pregnenolone? It doesn’t build connective tissue the way DHEA does, but it tones up fibrous tissue, causes contraction of fascia, and it’s safe in any amount, 100 or 1000 mg or more. "

 

[sladerunner69]

@raypeatclips

I asked " Whats your opinion on men supplementing topical Androsterone? Do you think it would be a safe beneficial supplement for inhibiting estrogen and potentially other positive benefits? Thank you!"

Ray said " I’ve never used it, but I think it’s safe in amounts similar to DHEA (10 or 15 mg/day) or testosterone (2 to 4 mg/day). Have you used pregnenolone? It doesn’t build connective tissue the way DHEA does, but it tones up fibrous tissue, causes contraction of fascia, and it’s safe in any amount, 100 or 1000 mg or more. "

Wow id he really say tht about testosteorone? What is contraction of fascia if you dont mind me asking?

 

[raypeatclips]

@raypeatclips

I asked " Whats your opinion on men supplementing topical Androsterone? Do you think it would be a safe beneficial supplement for inhibiting estrogen and potentially other positive benefits? Thank you!"

Ray said " I’ve never used it, but I think it’s safe in amounts similar to DHEA (10 or 15 mg/day) or testosterone (2 to 4 mg/day). Have you used pregnenolone? It doesn’t build connective tissue the way DHEA does, but it tones up fibrous tissue, causes contraction of fascia, and it’s safe in any amount, 100 or 1000 mg or more. "

Thanks, for reference, this is my exchange.

Me "I couldn't see you mention androsterone anywhere. What are your opinions on its usefulness and safety?"

Ray "A few milligrams per day should be safe, but I don’t think it has any special value that DHEA doesn’t."

 

[tca300]

Wow id he really say tht about testosteorone? What is contraction of fascia if you dont mind me asking?

I think the average male makes between 3-7mg/day of testosterone, so its pretty physiological. Of course thats probably aimed towards someone with low Testosterone, which if combined with asprin and thyroid would help keep it from turning into estrogen. When he says "contraction of the fascia" I belive he is referring to skin, like if your facial skin was getting droopy because of age, stress, etc... a younger person wouldn't likely noticed any effect like that.

 

[tca300]

@raypeatclips Haha, ya, to me 10-15 doesn't sound like a few either, but I've noticed over the years, thats how he talks.

 

[raypeatclips]

@tca300 Yeah he does vary information a little bit, if it was harmful though he would have flat out said it. Perhaps your mentioning of topical increased his suggestion, and my emphasis on safety lowered it. Either way, it all depends on the individual using it and how they feel!

 

[sladerunner69]

I think the average male makes between 3-7mg/day of testosterone, so its pretty physiological. Of course thats probably aimed towards someone with low Testosterone, which if combined with asprin and thyroid would help keep it from turning into estrogen. When he says "contraction of the fascia" I belive he is referring to skin, like if your facial skin was getting droopy because of age, stress, etc... a younger person wouldn't likely noticed any effect like that.

Ti ny understanding exogenous test is suppressive even at low dose though. so i dont ever plan on messing with t.

My joints haave been hurting more after adding androsterone with pregnenelone and I feel more emotions which is good but also more nervous. i think this indicates that my pregnenelone is being converted mainly into progesterone and allopregnanelone as I want. however my jointa are really really bothering me in the gym. It was making like no sense too because I would hit a 20 rep set of quad curls and I would ha e to quit because my elbows(?) hurt so awfully! and i cant do a full set of dquats without twrrific knee cracking and pain or a set od chest press without my sternum acheing like nuts. none of this was an issue before taking fat solubles and dht/andro and dhea and/or preg.

Is that a sign my estrogen is low?

My back and neck also bother me even after only a small amount of work​