Regularly using pregnenolone/vit K/methylene blue, any of these "too good to be true" substances stops you from progressing in life

[GreekDemiGod]

2 years of peating(still struggling) have left me disinterested in progressing in my career, however this year I've gotten laid more than I ever had in my life. So there's that.
Once I will finally achieve high energy levels, I will have bigger ambitions in my financial life.

 

[peter88]

We live in a world where we’re exposed to many unnatural things, the majority of which I believe are put in place to dampen the spirit of the general public - like chemicals in the water/food supply and the nearly inescapable bombardment of EMF radiation. Given this, I think some supplements are necessary to progress.

Which supplements do you believe are necessary?

 

[Dr. B]

Very interesting topic. I definitely think Peating screwed up my life in many ways. These substances are just so powerful and can give you a false sense of achievement and contentment you probably shouldn't have. If for whatever reason you can't afford to take them or can't source them anymore, it's gonna be a painful fall. This is what I experienced. It's been humbling, for sure.

which substances are you referring to

The simplest and best explanation, don’t know why more people don’t admit this

is cuote a word...? I think I saw Ray himself use that but thought it was a typo...

We live in a world where we’re exposed to many unnatural things, the majority of which I believe are put in place to dampen the spirit of the general public - like chemicals in the water/food supply and the nearly inescapable bombardment of EMF radiation. Given this, I think some supplements are necessary to progress.

if you stick to liquid intake of things like organic coconut water, organic pomegranate juice/organic orange juice/organic milk, organic meats only, cant you avoid those toxic chemicals in the water and food supply

Not quite sure the OP is saying this, more so that supplements and hormones can create a sense of achievement which can mask other areas of your life that need fixing. This is fundamentally fact, and the main reason people seek out recreational drugs. Routinely taking too many androgens is potentially a lot less worrying than a cocaine habit, but both can make you temporarily feel like superman and allow you to put off that relationship with your parents you’ve been meaning to fix for the last ten years.

interesting, what do you mean by that relationship fixing... people who arent in touch with their parents?

 

[Dr. B]

2 years of peating(still struggling) have left me disinterested in progressing in my career, however this year I've gotten laid more than I ever had in my life. So there's that.
Once I will finally achieve high energy levels, I will have bigger ambitions in my financial life.

interesting, what do you think is most responsible, is it having a better physique?

 

[InChristAlone]

Relying on coffee did it for me. Causes a kind of high for me that makes me unable to change things about my life that are difficult to see the realty of. I can say I'm fed up of a certain thing but actually changing takes quite a bit of humbleness and willingness to not be so focused on pleasure. Kinda makes me hedonistic, too much estrogen does the same.

 

[Korven]

Relying on coffee did it for me. Causes a kind of high for me that makes me unable to change things about my life that are difficult to see the realty of. I can say I'm fed up of a certain thing but actually changing takes quite a bit of humbleness and willingness to not be so focused on pleasure. Kinda makes me hedonistic, too much estrogen does the same.

I have similar feelings about coffee. It makes me feel so good (coffee high) that I become kind of complacent and don't have the same motivation for fixing problems in my life. I try to limit it to 1 cup per day.

 

[X3CyO]

I think the problem with "Peating" is that its condusive to life, and living. Not career.

What's the benefit of increased honesty, compassion, work-drive, decreased stress, perspective taking, obsession with learning or just something in general without a financial means to an end, and general happiness?

There is also the difference between using “peating” as a tool, or abusing it: clogging up your metabolic efficiency by pumping it too hard without substrate and exacerbating issues, or being able to sustain it, but pushing it too far into a state of Zen, and relaxation.

I think people mistake what peat teaches as being the end all be all of diet/lifestyle, but it's really just what perpetuates longevity with healthfulness most effectively (Opinion).
Longevity isn't work-efficiency. That requires personal obsession and sacrifice. Hierarchical success? Possible foul play, connections, and quick thinking. Monetary? Personal growth? Self love?

One thing I teach people when they come to exercise with me is to find what they want in the end, because that typically doesn't involve any of the damaging movements and things they’d originally been taught to do. It's always extremely simple, and is a lifestyle choice.

I think that's part of the problem with society that the internet has unravelled before us. We have a lot of permanent solutions not set in place, because there's much more personal money and safety to gain in not providing everyone all the keys to success. There's no incentive to evolve in some industry: Just to be different is good enough. The experts must die for a new tech to come to fruition, etc. Hierarchy holds us back in a lot of ways. Discourse versus argument and yelling. Genuine listening versus just waiting to talk.

Thinking needs to be incentivised instead of parroting: something peat has advocated from the very beginning of it all.

I think that's what the world is coming to. I’ve talked about this in another thread before as well in a different light.

 

[Charger]

I've actually progressed further in my career since I've started peating. The increased resilience to stress and higher energy has made things that were once seemingly difficult to accomplish or tolerate feel like literal child's play and people have taken notice.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

interesting, what do you think is most responsible, is it having a better physique?

No, the physique is just a bonus. It was due to a better mindset caused by better nutrition. And also, applying dating advice that worked for me like nothing else before this.(being straightforward and embracing my sexual side and women's sexual side)
Basically, I used to have a low self-image & self-esteem & used to think women do not find me attractive. And that reality manifested. I didn't even try to date. I was in learned helplessness.
What changed this year is that I've overcome all those limiting beliefs and started seeing the possibility that I am indeed attractive. Then success after success came, and I am now forever changed for the better.

Can only imagine how much will my mindset & drive improve once I fix hypothyroidism for good.

 

[Mossy]

Lots of hypotheses in this thread, so read with an open mind. There are just ideas and a way to look at things, not telling people to stop taking vit K or something. Also, this is about chronic usage and not about using these substances just once or a few times to break out of a stress state and then stopping them.

On a spiritual level, I think issues like high cortisol, nitric oxide, calcification mean that you have lessons to learn in life. They only happen if your life is led in a way such that your brain is not following your heart (leading to chronic hyperventilation). So if you take substances that lower NO or fix calcification, you have to make sure you're not taking a "shortcut substance" that heals you without making you learn the lessons you need to learn. You could say that there's no point in "learning lessons" when you could be healthy immediately by just taking a few supplements, but I think if you learn these lessons, then once you're healed your quality of life will be much greater/deeper than it would have been than if you had just relied on the supplement.

And I think the way to know whether something is a short-cut substance is to know whether or not it raises metabolic rate indefinitely. For example, although pregnenolone might temporarily raise metabolism and appetite (by lowering stress hormones and cortisol), you can take unlimited quantities without any effects, so it's not actually raising metabolic rate the way thyroid does. So it's a "short-cut" substance. Methylene blue is the same, by lowering NO it might temporarily turn on a metabolism that has been blocked by excess NO, but after the initial dose, you can take basically unlimited quantities without a raise in metabolism. Same with vitamin K (Dr. Peat has mentioned there is no "upper limit" to vitamin K dosage).

In contrast, things like coffee, aspirin, thyroid do raise metabolic rate infinitely the more you take them; the more coffee you drink or the more thyroid you take, the higher your temperature, and the more aspirin you take, the more you deplete nutrients like vit K and glycine. They don't "plateau" like pregnenolone/vitamin K/methylene blue. What that means is that whereas pregnenolone/methylene blue/vitamin K are "shortcut substances" that make you healthy without making you learn the lessons you need to learn, these substances make you healthy by making you learn needed lessons at an accelerated pace.

I have 0 evidence to back this up, but it just came to me and made sense to me in my head. (But it could also be utter nonsense.) Thoughts?

This is interesting theorizing. Without having the time to really dissect it, I can see some logic, and maybe some truth, to what you're saying. I think this coincides with a theory (maybe they're one and the same) that our decisions and actions can determine our chemical make-up. For instance, if a man chooses to have courage to face a problem, and continues to make this choice of courage, his hormonal make-up may tend towards pro-anabolic: testosterone, DHT, androgen, etc; and if he chooses the opposite, he'll tend towards pro-catabolic: estrogen, deficient thyroid, poor adrenals, etc. This is obviously a very simplistic explanation and many variables come into play, as not everyone starts from the same spiritual, mental, and physiological base.

 

[InChristAlone]

I have similar feelings about coffee. It makes me feel so good (coffee high) that I become kind of complacent and don't have the same motivation for fixing problems in my life. I try to limit it to 1 cup per day.

I get the high from even half a mug of coffee lol. And before people say it's a stress response I made sure to combine it with a generous amount of sugar and cream and food with it.

 

[lampofred]

This is interesting theorizing. Without having the time to really dissect it, I can see some logic, and maybe some truth, to what you're saying. I think this coincides with a theory (maybe they're one and the same) that our decisions and actions can determine our chemical make-up. For instance, if a man chooses to have courage to face a problem, and continues to make this choice of courage, his hormonal make-up may tend towards pro-anabolic: testosterone, DHT, androgen, etc; and if he chooses the opposite, he'll tend towards pro-catabolic: estrogen, deficient thyroid, poor adrenals, etc. This is obviously a very simplistic explanation and many variables come into play, as not everyone starts from the same spiritual, mental, and physiological base.

Yes, I've seen studies showing that victory raises testosterone and defeat raises estrogen.

 

[Lollipop2]

I think the problem with "Peating" is that its condusive to life, and living. Not career.

What's the benefit of increased honesty, compassion, work-drive, decreased stress, perspective taking, obsession with learning or just something in general without a financial means to an end, and general happiness?

There is also the difference between using “peating” as a tool, or abusing it: clogging up your metabolic efficiency by pumping it too hard without substrate and exacerbating issues, or being able to sustain it, but pushing it too far into a state of Zen, and relaxation.

I think people mistake what peat teaches as being the end all be all of diet/lifestyle, but it's really just what perpetuates longevity with healthfulness most effectively (Opinion).
Longevity isn't work-efficiency. That requires personal obsession and sacrifice. Hierarchical success? Possible foul play, connections, and quick thinking. Monetary? Personal growth? Self love?

One thing I teach people when they come to exercise with me is to find what they want in the end, because that typically doesn't involve any of the damaging movements and things they’d originally been taught to do. It's always extremely simple, and is a lifestyle choice.

I think that's part of the problem with society that the internet has unravelled before us. We have a lot of permanent solutions not set in place, because there's much more personal money and safety to gain in not providing everyone all the keys to success. There's no incentive to evolve in some industry: Just to be different is good enough. The experts must die for a new tech to come to fruition, etc. Hierarchy holds us back in a lot of ways. Discourse versus argument and yelling. Genuine listening versus just waiting to talk.

Thinking needs to be incentivised instead of parroting: something peat has advocated from the very beginning of it all.

I think that's what the world is coming to. I’ve talked about this in another thread before as well in a different light.

Nice thoughts.

 

[Lollipop2]

I've actually progressed further in my career since I've started peating. The increased resilience to stress and higher energy has made things that were once seemingly difficult to accomplish or tolerate feel like literal child's play and people have taken notice.

I agree - I became more resilient and less “fragile” of sorts. I was always strong and independent, but now I feel more grounded, stable, brain functions better, smarter.

 

[miraddo]

Lots of hypotheses in this thread, so read with an open mind. There are just ideas and a way to look at things, not telling people to stop taking vit K or something. Also, this is about chronic usage and not about using these substances just once or a few times to break out of a stress state and then stopping them.

On a spiritual level, I think issues like high cortisol, nitric oxide, calcification mean that you have lessons to learn in life. They only happen if your life is led in a way such that your brain is not following your heart (leading to chronic hyperventilation). So if you take substances that lower NO or fix calcification, you have to make sure you're not taking a "shortcut substance" that heals you without making you learn the lessons you need to learn. You could say that there's no point in "learning lessons" when you could be healthy immediately by just taking a few supplements, but I think if you learn these lessons, then once you're healed your quality of life will be much greater/deeper than it would have been than if you had just relied on the supplement.

And I think the way to know whether something is a short-cut substance is to know whether or not it raises metabolic rate indefinitely. For example, although pregnenolone might temporarily raise metabolism and appetite (by lowering stress hormones and cortisol), you can take unlimited quantities without any effects, so it's not actually raising metabolic rate the way thyroid does. So it's a "short-cut" substance. Methylene blue is the same, by lowering NO it might temporarily turn on a metabolism that has been blocked by excess NO, but after the initial dose, you can take basically unlimited quantities without a raise in metabolism. Same with vitamin K (Dr. Peat has mentioned there is no "upper limit" to vitamin K dosage).

In contrast, things like coffee, aspirin, thyroid do raise metabolic rate infinitely the more you take them; the more coffee you drink or the more thyroid you take, the higher your temperature, and the more aspirin you take, the more you deplete nutrients like vit K and glycine. They don't "plateau" like pregnenolone/vitamin K/methylene blue. What that means is that whereas pregnenolone/methylene blue/vitamin K are "shortcut substances" that make you healthy without making you learn the lessons you need to learn, these substances make you healthy by making you learn needed lessons at an accelerated pace.

I have 0 evidence to back this up, but it just came to me and made sense to me in my head. (But it could also be utter nonsense.) Thoughts?

"We gradually begin to think of ourselves, in the course of growing up, as personalities made up of all the lessons we have learned. Our hard-earned lessons count heavily in our consideration of who we are. We complicate our lives by holding on to these hard-earned lessons long after they have outlived their usefulness. Take, for example, the child who learns to persistently beg his mother in a whiny voice, first for cookies, and later for the keys to the car. Since it worked with Mom, and since Dad left most of that up to Mom, he keeps using what works. At age 40, he may still be treating his third wife the same way without having gotten those same results for years. The mind doesn't like to change itself in the face of new information. Lessons learned and held on to in this fashion make up the personality to which we are shackled. This makes life harder than it has to be. The way out of this suffering is to expand who we consider ourselves to be. We must return to being more than the personalities we have shrunk to during the course of growing up." - Brad Blanton, Radical Honesty

Ray Peat's ideas and articles would best be viewed as tools to add to your toolbox. They could be applied equally by a sick person who is struggling with basic tasks to a Navy SEAL team looking to make their combat personnel more stress hardy.

In fact, Dr Charles A. Morgan has found that people who make it through the rigorous selection program tend to have higher DHEA and higher neuropeptide-y than others. Neuropeptide-y and DHEA tightly control glucose metabolism in the brain and other tissue. These are also the same factors which lower the incidence of PTSD - which is a huge problem for any military.

 

[lampofred]

"We gradually begin to think of ourselves, in the course of growing up, as personalities made up of all the lessons we have learned. Our hard-earned lessons count heavily in our consideration of who we are. We complicate our lives by holding on to these hard-earned lessons long after they have outlived their usefulness. Take, for example, the child who learns to persistently beg his mother in a whiny voice, first for cookies, and later for the keys to the car. Since it worked with Mom, and since Dad left most of that up to Mom, he keeps using what works. At age 40, he may still be treating his third wife the same way without having gotten those same results for years. The mind doesn't like to change itself in the face of new information. Lessons learned and held on to in this fashion make up the personality to which we are shackled. This makes life harder than it has to be. The way out of this suffering is to expand who we consider ourselves to be. We must return to being more than the personalities we have shrunk to during the course of growing up." - Brad Blanton, Radical Honesty

Ray Peat's ideas and articles would best be viewed as tools to add to your toolbox. They could be applied equally by a sick person who is struggling with basic tasks to a Navy SEAL team looking to make their combat personnel more stress hardy.

In fact, Dr Charles A. Morgan has found that people who make it through the rigorous selection program tend to have higher DHEA and higher neuropeptide-y than others. Neuropeptide-y and DHEA tightly control glucose metabolism in the brain and other tissue. These are also the same factors which lower the incidence of PTSD - which is a huge problem for any military.

That's a great quote. I'm going to check out that book.

 

[LUH 3417]

this makes sense to me, analogous to doing psychedelics and getting caught in a loop of perpetual eternal returns. They’re mimetics that amplify a pattern or experience in a way that feels as though there is a resolution, closing of the loop, but it’s not always the case. The energy expands and contracts but doesn’t necessarily change form or structure, if you do lsd everyday for a week you will by the end of the week not experience any hallucinations.