Red bull/coffee make me sleepy

BlackMolasses

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After several sleepless nights, I finally managed to fall asleep for about 6 to 7 hours thanks to a mixture of melatonin (2mg), passionflower, valerian and doxylamine (15mg).
Not being very energetic, I took a red bull at noon hoping it would energize me, but an hour or two later I was actually very tired, my thoughts were fuzzy and I just wanted to go to bed.
Do you think coffee could help me sleep and why such a paradoxical reaction.
 

Jonk

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A basic explanation I think is that it increases metabolism and lowers stress hormones, if there is enough fuel to support the boost. If your running on adrenaline or cortisol, and you lower these, you can feel sleepy. Eating plenty of sugar and enough protein and fat makes coffee relaxing to me.
 

ThinPicking

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After several sleepless nights, I finally managed to fall asleep for about 6 to 7 hours thanks to a mixture of melatonin (2mg), passionflower, valerian and doxylamine (15mg).
Not being very energetic, I took a red bull at noon hoping it would energize me, but an hour or two later I was actually very tired, my thoughts were fuzzy and I just wanted to go to bed.
Do you think coffee could help me sleep and why such a paradoxical reaction.
This is so basic you'll probably doubt it. That you have some insomnia without supplements, some general lethargy and that a high osmolality beverage makes you sleepy suggests to me you're running a body water deficit. If you're not thirsty you're probably adapted to it.

Try more salt and more water. Balancing them is for you. Go for water first and pay attention (preferably measure) to how much you lose in the can.
 
OP
BlackMolasses

BlackMolasses

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Caliphate of Toulouse, Francistan
This is so basic you'll probably doubt it. That you have some insomnia without supplements, some general lethargy and that a high osmolality beverage makes you sleepy suggests to me you're running a body water deficit. If you're not thirsty you're probably adapted to it.

Try more salt and more water. Balancing them is for you. Go for water first and pay attention (preferably measure) to how much you lose in the can.
I just tried a bupropion in an effort to deplete the cothecolamines earlier in the day, but that also made me tired.
I was even able to sleep two hours after taking it

@redsun
Catecholamines aren't supposed to be my problem? My dilated pupils, the small hallucinations of fractals and of course the insomnia in plain night lead me to suppose that, but the products supposed to increase them (stimulants) eliminate the problem.
I thought about serotonin, but even 10mg of cypro couldn't do anything to "calm" me down.
 

redsun

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I just tried a bupropion in an effort to deplete the cothecolamines earlier in the day, but that also made me tired.
I was even able to sleep two hours after taking it

@redsun
Catecholamines aren't supposed to be my problem? My dilated pupils, the small hallucinations of fractals and of course the insomnia in plain night lead me to suppose that, but the products supposed to increase them (stimulants) eliminate the problem.
I thought about serotonin, but even 10mg of cypro couldn't do anything to "calm" me down.
Caffeine does not just raise dopamine and norepinephrine activity in the brain. Adenosine antagonism also increase glutamate, histamine, acetylcholine activity. The direct and indirect effects of other neurotransmitters can actually make you feel more tired. It could also be something else in the redbull making you tired.

The B-vitamins can be sedating for some people. If you are overmethylated, these types of individuals tend to always have some form of sleep disorder. And because you mention it seems to run in the family you could be inheriting these genetic mutations predisposing you to an overmethylated state. You seem to have sleep onset insomnia and niacin in the redbull reduces methyl groups so could be helping you in this way.

Something you can actually do which would help you sleep is to make yourself dependent on caffeine. After a week of chronic caffeine intake, it will lead to upregulation of adenosine, acetylcholine, serotonin, and gaba receptors in the brain. These increased receptors will lead to more activity of these NTs making sleep easier as long as you dont have caffeine late in the day but earlier in the day so it has time to excrete out of the body by the time night hits around.
 

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