Really Tired After Breakfast - Why?

[superhuman]

Ray said the feeling tired after eating is often a sign that you are running on stress hormones and when you eat they go down and it reveals the low metabolism underneath. It should improve with time and better thyroid function. It could also be a result of high insulin if you are eating a lot of insulinogenic foods. Starches fall into that category as well as too much protein.

How do you know it its because of lowering stress or to much protein? i thought to much protein could cause you to get more energetic since it turns on adrenaline and stress?
I eat sugar,milk and gelatin for breakfast so no starch and insulin. But maybe to much protein? does milk protein require more sugar to balance? what about gelatin?

 

[haidut]

How do you know it its because of lowering stress or to much protein? i thought to much protein could cause you to get more energetic since it turns on adrenaline and stress?
I eat sugar,milk and gelatin for breakfast so no starch and insulin. But maybe to much protein? does milk protein require more sugar to balance? what about gelatin?

OK, I should have said it may be due to the high insulin from food. This will lower stress hormones initially but if blood sugar drops too much then it triggers the stress reaction and depending on how quickly your body starts to make sugar out of the broken down proteins you may get a rebound in "energy" in 30min - 60min.

 

[superhuman]

OK, I should have said it may be due to the high insulin from food. This will lower stress hormones initially but if blood sugar drops too much then it triggers the stress reaction and depending on how quickly your body starts to make sugar out of the broken down proteins you may get a rebound in "energy" in 30min - 60min.

Ok, how do i prevent this or what should i look for? is it the sugar to protein ratio that is most likely the cause?

 

[haidut]

Ok, how do i prevent this or what should i look for? is it the sugar to protein ratio that is most likely the cause?

It is a combination of the amount and type of protein, and amount and type of sugar. Also, as I posted in a recent thread, blood glucose is controlled mainly by the brain and not the pancreas so stress can keep blood sugar elevated even with normal insulin levels.
Some protein like gelatin does not lead to much insulin release and even lowers blood sugar without increasing insulin. Other protein like milk is very insulinogenic. So, if you are sure this type of food is giving you a low blood sugar and/or hi insulin I'd try to lower the protein to about 25g - 30g per serving. More than that in a single meal seems not to be absorbed and generates ammonia. Have you actually tested blood glucose before/after food to see where you stand? I have done tests like this in the past and found things to be normal in regards to the blood glucose even though I felt tired.
Finally, glucose itself acts on the glycine receptors in the brain so it can make you sleepy/tired/relaxed even without much insulin effect.
Glucose has the same effect on the brain as glycine

 

[superhuman]

It is a combination of the amount and type of protein, and amount and type of sugar. Also, as I posted in a recent thread, blood glucose is controlled mainly by the brain and not the pancreas so stress can keep blood sugar elevated even with normal insulin levels.
Some protein like gelatin does not lead to much insulin release and even lowers blood sugar without increasing insulin. Other protein like milk is very insulinogenic. So, if you are sure this type of food is giving you a low blood sugar and/or hi insulin I'd try to lower the protein to about 25g - 30g per serving. More than that in a single meal seems not to be absorbed and generates ammonia. Have you actually tested blood glucose before/after food to see where you stand? I have done tests like this in the past and found things to be normal in regards to the blood glucose even though I felt tired.
Finally, glucose itself acts on the glycine receptors in the brain so it can make you sleepy/tired/relaxed even without much insulin effect.

Understand. My breakfast is just skimmed milk mixed with plain white sugar/sucrose. And i take gelatin after.
My sugar to protein is 2:1 in the milk so i add 25g sugar to one quart of milk to get that 2:1 ratio. Maybe milk needs more sugar then?
I feel like sleepy/relaxed in a somewhat nice way but still its morning and i want to get stuff done but i dont feel like it in that state :P
Maybe its just something atm that lowers stress hormone, im not sure.

 

[superhuman]

@haidut i also remember i started to take some magnesium glycinate for breakfast also. Maybe its the magnesium thats making my sleepy? is that possible?

 

[Kasper]

I think you should see it as a good thing. I have this as well, I take a nap of 10 min. (Yes, morning nap), or do some meditation, and after that I feel energetic enough, to do things again.

I mean, it is good, in the sense that your morning cortisol is dropping, and the good metabolism gets allowed to drop in.

 

[haidut]

@haidut i also remember i started to take some magnesium glycinate for breakfast also. Maybe its the magnesium thats making my sleepy? is that possible?

Sure, magnesium is sedative even in moderate doses like 400mg, which is the RDA in the US.

 

[Kasper]

@haidut The sedative effect of magnesium is probably because of lowering stress hormones right?

I think you are better off taking the magnesium and just doing a little bit less in the morning really. Except if there are some urgencies in the morning that really have to be done, with all your attention, at that specific moment.

 

[superhuman]

@Kasper i agree if that is the case, but im not really sure its only that :p

 

[haidut]

@haidut The sedative effect of magnesium is probably because of lowering stress hormones right?

I think you are better off taking the magnesium and just doing a little bit less in the morning really. Except if there are some urgencies in the morning that really have to be done, with all your attention, at that specific moment.

Magensium is considered a GABA agonist and as such it would be sedative. GABA agonists have been shown to also lower cortisol, so that may add to its effects on sedation. However, lowering cortisol usually makes people relaxed and not sleepy. It is the GABA agonism and NMDA antagonism that makes it sedative more than anything else.
Just my 2c.

 

[Vinero]

I thought magnesium was an NMDA antagonist. But not a GABA agonist as well? Were did you read that? Magnesium glycinate usually makes me quite energetic and wanting to do stuff. Possibly a pro-dopamine action here as well. But it also makes it easy to relax if I want to. Good stuff.

 

[Mittir]

What do you notice if carb to protein ratio is off for breakfast? Im getting very sleepy 1-2 hours after eating breakfast now and im wondering that my carb:to protein is a little to low.
Does gelatin need the same in terms of carbs for its protein ratio?
I have milk,sugar and gelatin for breakfast.

I tried to add gelatine in many different ways and it always caused some problem for me.
I stopped gelatin powder and gelatin from beef broth.
Lamb broth seems easier to digest.
I tend to get dry mouth, possibly from high blood sugar and cortisol,
even when i ate a lot of carb with gelatin.
Now i get small amount of gelatin from chicken neck soup
and it does not cause any problem.
I do not know if it is due to gelatin or endotoxin from undigested
gelatin that causing this problem.

I have noticed i have to consume a lot of calories just after waking up,
I used to drink a cup of milk with 2 tbs of sugar and 2 tsp of instant coffee.
Now i need about one and half cup of milk, 3 tbs of sugar and 2 tsp of coffee.
Then i drink more milk or juice after 1 hour of breakfast.
I feel drained if i do not have enough calories for the breakfast.

 

[DaveFoster]

Eggs definitely could be the culprit.

 

[haidut]

I thought magnesium was an NMDA antagonist. But not a GABA agonist as well? Were did you read that? Magnesium glycinate usually makes me quite energetic and wanting to do stuff. Possibly a pro-dopamine action here as well. But it also makes it easy to relax if I want to. Good stuff.

There are many studies on this, but here is one that shows magnesium is both a GABA and benzodiazepine agonist, which explains its effects on lowering anxiety.
Benzodiazepine/GABA(A) receptors are involved in magnesium-induced anxiolytic-like behavior in mice. - PubMed - NCBI