Raw Dairy or None At All?

Peat's_Girl

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
543
I grew up in Ukraine where I consumed raw milk pretty much daily. I was an active albeit skinny kid.
Fastforward to now. I'm 26 and live in Canada. I've been avoiding dairy for a long time on Primal/ Paleo even though I had crazy cravings for dairy (I love the stuff). I always thought it makes me break out, not to mention the fact I'd get either diarrhea/ gas/ bloating/ some cramps or all of the above.

This is still the case... I don't think it's the lactose because lactose free milk isn't much better. I specifically think the fact it loses something in the pasteurization process that my body needs to digest the milk. Raw milk is illegal here and impossible to get so all I can have is pasteurized whole organic milk. Goat's milk? No chance in hell. It tastes like barn. The only dairy I can tolerate without symptoms is fermented. My question is: should I keep consuming dairy and build tolerance or just not have it at all? Or have it fermented? (I know Peat doesn't recommend it)
Should I supplement with calcium instead? This poses a problem since I NEVER EVER get enough protein and am considering getting a protein powder.
 

Blossom

Moderator
Forum Supporter
Joined
Nov 23, 2013
Messages
11,032
Location
Indiana USA
You could try 1/4 to 1/2 cup of milk with meals for a couple weeks to see if that helps your body begin to digest it better. In the beginning I found cheese and and homemade eggshell calcium (i still include both most days) helped me until I was able to tolerate milk again.
 

Mittir

Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2013
Messages
2,033
RP almost always uses the term " milk and cheese" when he talks about dairy.
These foods are used mainly for their protein and calcium content.
If milk is a problem whether it is raw or pasteurized then one can easily
switch to calcium. Yogurt is fine as long as it is strained yogurt, where
the lactic acid is removed. Most of the calcium is lost in strained yogurt
and other fresh cheese like cottage and farmer's cheese.
In that case one can use egg shell or oyster shell power for calcium.
One can also do non dairy version of peating ,where adding gelatine
and calcium fixes the high tryptophan and phosphorus ratio.
 

tara

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2014
Messages
10,368
I also avoided dairy for many years, despite strong cravings for it. I didn't get digestive symptoms or acne from it, though. I gradually re-introduced it, starting with smaller amounts, and now I drink 1-2 l/day and eat home made cottage cheese. I think progest-e helped me handle it again. I used oyster shell calcium before I could tolerate the milk. I still use some, but less. I think it has been helpful.

For a protein powder, you could get gelatin.
 

burtlancast

Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
3,263
Peat's_Girl said:
Goat's milk? No chance in hell. It tastes like barn..

I would like to point out that even bad-tasting goat milk is a god-send for me compared to no milk at all.
I can drink one quart per day with no symptoms whatsoever, whereas cow milk always gave me headaches , at any dose.

I suppose it's the fact goat milk contains only A2 casein.
 
OP
P

Peat's_Girl

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
543
Blossom said:
You could try 1/4 to 1/2 cup of milk with meals for a couple weeks to see if that helps your body begin to digest it better. In the beginning I found cheese and and homemade eggshell calcium (i still include both most days) helped me until I was able to tolerate milk again.
Blossom, are you saying that supplementing with calcium helps build dairy tolerance? I've never heard that before.

How do you make eggshell calcium? I don't have good quality eggs so I thought it'd be safer to buy citrate online.
What do you think? ;o
 
OP
P

Peat's_Girl

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
543
Mittir said:
RP almost always uses the term " milk and cheese" when he talks about dairy.
These foods are used mainly for their protein and calcium content.
If milk is a problem whether it is raw or pasteurized then one can easily
switch to calcium. Yogurt is fine as long as it is strained yogurt, where
the lactic acid is removed. Most of the calcium is lost in strained yogurt
and other fresh cheese like cottage and farmer's cheese.
In that case one can use egg shell or oyster shell power for calcium.
One can also do non dairy version of peating ,where adding gelatine
and calcium fixes the high tryptophan and phosphorus ratio.

Awesome info, thanks Mittir. When I think of strained yogurt I just think of like a thick Greek yogurt.
I'll add in calcium but I'm definitely hoping to consume dairy one day without problem. (I started breaking out lately...)
 
OP
P

Peat's_Girl

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
543
tara said:
I also avoided dairy for many years, despite strong cravings for it. I didn't get digestive symptoms or acne from it, though. I gradually re-introduced it, starting with smaller amounts, and now I drink 1-2 l/day and eat home made cottage cheese. I think progest-e helped me handle it again. I used oyster shell calcium before I could tolerate the milk. I still use some, but less. I think it has been helpful.

For a protein powder, you could get gelatin.

So you guys are against whey powders/ commercial protein powders?
 
OP
P

Peat's_Girl

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
543
burtlancast said:
Peat's_Girl said:
Goat's milk? No chance in hell. It tastes like barn..

I would like to point out that even bad-tasting goat milk is a god-send for me compared to no milk at all.
I can drink one quart per day with no symptoms whatsoever, whereas cow milk always gave me headaches , at any dose.

I suppose it's the fact goat milk contains only A2 casein.

:shock: No goat milk.

:lol:

All right... I used to dislike lamb for the same reason, but now I love the stuff. Things change...!
I'll try it and see if it's the caesin that's the problem for me, not the lactose.
 

Blossom

Moderator
Forum Supporter
Joined
Nov 23, 2013
Messages
11,032
Location
Indiana USA
Peat's_Girl said:
Blossom said:
You could try 1/4 to 1/2 cup of milk with meals for a couple weeks to see if that helps your body begin to digest it better. In the beginning I found cheese and and homemade eggshell calcium (i still include both most days) helped me until I was able to tolerate milk again.
Blossom, are you saying that supplementing with calcium helps build dairy tolerance? I've never heard that before.

How do you make eggshell calcium? I don't have good quality eggs so I thought it'd be safer to buy citrate online.
What do you think? ;o
I just used the eggshell calcium because it helped me have an adequate calcium intake as I gradually reintroduced milk into my diet. RP recommends eggshell or oyster shell calcium due to potentially allergenic or troublesome additives in commercial supplements. Forum member Mittir has posted about using slaked lime and that might be another option if you do not have access to adequate eggshells. I get most of my eggs from the farmer's market and boil the shells for a few minutes, drain and then dry them in the oven at 215 degrees Fahrenheit for a couple hours. I've read where others use a slightly different procedure and I've seen numerous tutorials and instructions for making eggshell calcium online. Once the shells are dry I grind them in an electric coffee grinder and store them in a glass jar in a cool dark place. Hope this helps some.
 

Mittir

Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2013
Messages
2,033
Initially i used slaked lime in OJ and asked RP about it and he said it is fine.
Slaked lime is used in making nixtamalized corn (hominy , masa harina),
these are one of the few starchy food RP recommends. Slaked lime ( calcium
hydroxide) is a strong base, it should be neutralized in acid like lemon juice,
OJ and other acidid food.Other wise it can hurt your digestive track.
 
OP
P

Peat's_Girl

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
543
Hmm... I don't wanna risk it with the lame eggs we have here in the supermarkets. I'll start with a pure calcium citrate powder until I can get good eggs.
 
OP
P

Peat's_Girl

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
543
Mittir said:
Initially i used slaked lime in OJ and asked RP about it and he said it is fine.
Slaked lime is used in making nixtamalized corn (hominy , masa harina),
these are one of the few starchy food RP recommends. Slaked lime ( calcium
hydroxide) is a strong base, it should be neutralized in acid like lemon juice,
OJ and other acidid food.Other wise it can hurt your digestive track.

No idea what you just said ;D
 

mt_dreams

Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2013
Messages
620
For the time being, you can still buy raw milk in Canada as long as you are part of a cow share program, where you own part of the cow. Recent court rulings re Michael Schmidt would suggest that Canada will side with the American thoughts on this matter, rather than the growing raw milk trend taking place in Europe.

If you don't want to join a long term cow share program, you may want to look for non-homogenized milk, and/or low temp pasteurized milk as those will be the easiest types of cow milk to digest. In Ontario, Sheldon Creek makes a nice non-homogenized milk, and Eby Manor milk is from Guernsey cows which imo is easy to digest (it's higher in beta carotene & the omegas so it's not perfect, but it's 2% tastes much sweeter & creamier than other brands whole milk). Harmony is a good brand that's organic & low temp past that's carried by many stores.

If you can tolerate cottage (farmers) cheese than you most likely do not have a casein issue. If casein is the isue, traditional ricotta cheese is made with whey (though most store brands go ahead and use reg milk). There is much less lactic acid in soft cheese when compared to regular yogurt. Well drained yogurt like greek is your best bet with regards to yogurt.

Isolated protein like whey is not recommended by Peat for most people. If you're looking for a protein powder to use, the safest option would be to go with a milk powder with no added ingredients.

When I was living away from home and could only get my hands on a general brand of milk, I experienced several common milk intolerance issues. The symptoms stopped when I started taking a milk digesting enzyme supplement along with the milk.
 
OP
P

Peat's_Girl

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
543
I live in Quebec where Vegans rule :)
I suppose there's a way to get a cow share but for the time being I'm not financially able, plus I don't drive and last time I tried to get on the cow share wagon that was the bare minimum that was needed.

I think for the time being I'll try goat/ sheep or take calcium.
 

Similar threads

Back
Top Bottom