Raw Animal Product Diet

[Bogdar]

I can give my experience here.

Some background; I did not believe in "detox" stuff as it was attached to the image of 40 yo yoga-vegan-wives with marketing bs supplements. I also started as a plant-based dieter.
After reading Vonderplanitz (my diet needed to change, not feeling good) I have tried his "detox combo" with raw free-range organic eggs & raw-whole-unhomogeneised-grassfed milk.
About a hour later I'm totally tripping with lights being 10x more intense, music played by dudes in the streets being hypnotic. I was actually on my way to work but had to get back (by foot) and I've lost myself in the city, tripping and satisfied.
It was totally LSD - which I have taken months before. From this day I think it was enough for me to believe in "detox".

Anyway, further than detox, I have tried raw grass-fed and raw conventionnal beef. As written in the book, the muscle is very good in both case; however for the organs the difference is black & white. I'm not talking about organic or conventionnal, but real grass-fed sunbathed from the begenning to the end beef. I've eater pounds and pounds of liver but to this day I still have problems with conventionnal (even som organic) livers, even veal. However, a good grass-fed beef liver is one of the best meat part I have ever eaten. Sweet, kindof an alcohol touch, tender, no "beast taste" at-all, healthy attractive color and texture.

I now have even developped raw beef (muscles parts mainly) craving. I regularly have them and oh god I feel so well eating raw beef. The sensation is just pure energy boost - mental & physic. Everything seem easier after a meal of raw meat, not exaggerating. It's my own experience tho, and I'm really glad that I discovered I needed it lol - coffee & stuff never really worked for me (at the time) and I was more disposed to depression - fatigue state than average Joe.

Raw milk taste awesome - if you choose the good one. The first raw milk I have tasted was a totally grass-fed whole etc etc one. Creamy, yellow-ish, it is pure satisfaction. Also, it is awesome to rest, it switches me into a relax floating-mod like no other food, so enjoyable.
Until I had the occasion to taste other brand... 2 exactly, and these were not even close the first one. More liquids, less tasty, less creamy, and suspicious tastes. So it also totally depends on the quality, raw is not often enough.

Note that it ended up really bad for me. Since I could drink my first milk brand even 1, 2 weeks after its peremption date - it would just ferments into kefir, high quality taste and smell lol - I thought it was true as well for the other brands.
One of these other brand smelled suspicious, like cereally-ish. Someday, like 1 day or 2 after peremption date, I had only this to eat at home and couldn't buy outside (dont ask me why lol). I knew the smell was even more suspicious than usual, but ya know, still tasted not bad enough to prevent me from drinking it. Suspicious but still palatable, & I trusted the raw milk...
One night later, worse abdominal pains I've ever had, liquid diarrhea for 10 straight days, and then total dehydration symptoms that lasted for months and months with intense digestion malfunctions, and unbearable pain in a specific digestive area. For freaking months. I'm still doing exams and treatments to this day. I even have developped at the same time an uncurable blood pathology whose origin is unknown to medecin - let's call that a weird coincidence.

(regarding its taste and the absence of grassfed label, I'm 99.9% sure it was a lot grain-fed. The problem when eating raw is the quality of the food. You can't let yourself eat the milk of a sick cow.)


These foods sure have unique power and good outcome - but don't **** with them, LOL.

 

[Bogdar]

To add more:

I'm not too much into raw eggs since they often make me feel sluggish. I don't feel any specific positive boosts with them, even if I like cooked eggs or sometimes only raw yolk.

As you mentionned muscles, I have myself been amazed at how much muscular tone, definition and mass I got from this experience (before falling sick) without any special training. My legs, abs and entire chest would grow bigger. Even months after the sickness without training I still keep a very healthy and satysfying solid look - to which I often get surprised compliments from friends when I get my shirt off.

Yeah it definitely helped me a lot but I had to surrender after these medical episode. I'm pretty sure you'll get good outcome from introducing some into your diet, and listen to your body (and give more credence to your smell...)

 

[postman]

Vonderplanitz has some interesting ideas and some interesting past life experiences. Certainly fresh high quality meat is safe raw. problem for most is finding true quality fresh trim raw meat. I think the problem with primal diet is most include keto I'm sure raw meat with adequate carb intake may be very natural and healthy raw muscle organ meat raw eggs fruit raw honey carrot raw milk cooked greens cooked potatoes if need

He used to eat grocery store meat in France during the height of the mad cow disease scare. He had a very unconventional perspective on bacteria and "pathogens" in general

I've always been a huge skeptic and critical of Aajonus Vonderplanitz. Besides the diet, which isn't even the main issue as far as I'm concerned, he's said some really wacky things before. He has claimed the CIA kidnapped him once and injected him with H1N1 virus because he was spreading anti-vaccination ideas. That wasn't the only time either, he's claimed the government has poisoned him on several different occasions. BTW, I'm not saying the government doesn't kill people. What I am saying is they would have no interest in this guy, and even if they did, they wouldn't fail at killing him on that many occasions. There's also Youtube videos of people setting up a "shrine" (lack for a better term) and basically worshiping the guy, lol. Like this one, personally when I put all these factors together I can't help but come to the conclusion the guy was running a cult. All of this is irrelevant to the diet though. Weston Price noted the importance of eating some small portion of raw food. Ray Peat has even stated there's no "nutritional advantage" to cooking your foods. The main issues with the raw foodists is their desperation to believe pseudo science and questionable gurus over sound facts. It's like, if Vonderplanitz wasn't enough, now the raw meat community has sv3rige, lol. Who's definitely running a cult and calls people mentally ill who don't agree with him. One of the first things you learn about in psyche class is mentally ill people think they're the only sane ones, lmao. But I digress, point is I question the messengers not the message. There's nutritional benefits to consuming raw foods, but the trade off is less bio available calories and always the chance of bacterial contamination.

What an abhorrent post. The guy died abruptly and some of his friends and followers had a memorial for him. And before you get triggered by the word "follower" he is the one who got raw milk legalized in California, he set up raw food clubs, without him people wouldn't even be able to buy raw dairy and some other foods as well so naturally people admired and looked up to him. He was a great leader.

 

[tara]

He’s got amazing skin, and so have his friends (I can’t deny that). But his hair isn’t great (receding quite a lot). It will be interesting to see (assuming he sticks to the diet) how his hair progresses further.

There won't be any test of his longevity etc, as he died of an unfortunate accident relatively young.

Seems to me that the nutritional benefits of raw animal products as food come with their risks, as people have noted. People have come to harm from infections from raw meat and eggs and milk, and industrial production methods mean these can get widespread. But if you have a way to assess food quality and your own resilience, you can weigh up the odds and choose your risk level.

If Vonderplanitz' story of recovering from serious (he expected terminal) illness after being given rotten meat is true, possibly it was an example of the power of bacteriophages at the right time and place?

 

[RobertJM]

There won't be any test of his longevity etc, as he died of an unfortunate accident relatively young.

Seems to me that the nutritional benefits of raw animal products as food come with their risks, as people have noted. People have come to harm from infections from raw meat and eggs and milk, and industrial production methods mean these can get widespread. But if you have a way to assess food quality and your own resilience, you can weigh up the odds and choose your risk level.

If Vonderplanitz' story of recovering from serious (he expected terminal) illness after being given rotten meat is true, possibly it was an example of the power of bacteriophages at the right time and place?

I was referring to Sv3rige. His videos are on YouTube. I know Vonderplanitz is dead.

You say that but the guys who eat these diets are stating something else. Sv3rige has been eating raw animal products for years now and you’d have thought he would have caught something by now. He eats plenty of ‘high meat’ as well. Enjoy!

 

[opson123]

Sv3rige is a flat earther too. You can see from his videos that he's not a bright fellow. As someone borderline retarded, I can recognize a kin. He obviously has mental health issues. Whether not being bright is because of past lifestyle and habits or whatever, the raw animal food diet isn't obviously helping, which is the opposite of what I remember him preaching in one of his videos.

Not very kind of me, but I don't understand how anyone can take him seriously.

 

[Fractality]

I think Vonderplanitz and Peat would agree with each other that commercial/industrial pollutants and chemicals are behind 99% of modern sicknesses. After reading Vonderplanitz's books and watching his related videos, I'm most interested in the concept of raw animal products detoxifying the body of toxic chemicals. Also, the concept that bacteria/parasites are subject to the "bystander effect" like our friend cholesterol is interesting to me. This idea can be summed up like this:

"Pathogens are not the problem. The environment in which and on which pathogens feed is the problem of disease."

Perhaps raw kefir like Vonderplanitz recommends (along with the other raw foods of course) work like bacteriophages?

 

[sunraiser]

I have had this thought on more than one occasion so I figured I'd post it here.

So, through all the thick and thin of health, the biggest lesson and barrier to finding health for many is to learn to trust food cravings. For me, following cravings of whole foods and becoming an excellent chef for your own needs to create flavour and texture combos that are extremely satisfying in the moment is fundamentally important. I think the style of many modern nutritional experts to demonise food groups or look at stuff the body can easily deal with (like phytic acid) as some form of demonic entity is simply going to lead people away from health.

HOWEVER, I have also seen patterns in people healing (and I suppose myself) that reflect needing LOTS of meat when sick, but far less as they start to get in a better state of physiology. I've seen people phrase it as needing to take the "life energy" from the meat, or various other ideas, and I kind of like it as a simple way of sharing a concept.

I have also noticed a pattern in people that have recovered from shitty livers and low energy states in that it always involves amino acid intake (specifically small amounts of taurine - but this seems to require extra magnesium to tolerate it).

When our livers are in trouble there are some severe rate limiting factors to amino acid production - specifically "activation" of amino acid precursors in B2 and B6 via phosphorylation (via the liver).

Certain aminos are lost via heat (especially taurine), and it's quite common to see meat poorly digesting in low energy states, and even causing brain fog or other issues, but still being consistently craved. I wonder if the body is craving the aminos in an abundance of meat as a way to both help digest the meat itself, but also to spare sparsely available B vitamins and help methylation. There could be other factors on the "life energy" front :)

In effect, I wonder if the body can't really tell the difference between raw and cooked meat, and therefore a person is keeping themselves sick via improper digestion of cooked meat, but also NEEDING said meat to recover liver function, methylation, and protein sufficiency.

The problem is, people eating raw meat are often in a neurotic quagmire in which it's ALL they eat - either via paleo or following the dogma of some famous practitioner - and they're stuck because their diet isn't robust enough. We need carbs, we need fibres, we need to eat via craving. I personally need whole grains and love them. I'm willing to say these last sentences with brash certainty but obviously it's just my experience and opinion.

I just wanted to write down my thoughts, in that raw meat / fish + a normal human whole food diet (with some convenience food thrown in sometimes for de-stress) perhaps makes healing a lot simpler for the above reasons. Obviously this would include sunshine to craving. Once a feeling of wellbeing comes back it might be fine to eat cooked meat again as digestion and natural amino production will be normal.

Another problem is it's probably quite challenging to get clean and fresh meat - I'm not personally going to do it for now as I'm in an ok place and don't want an experience like poor @Bogdar had above!

Has anyone tried anything along these lines? Also, for anyone that wants to try - suggestions for getting good quality / very fresh meat?