Pufa Depletion

[Momado965]

Since PUFA is a toxin I decided to post my question here. What are some pufa detox/depletion symptoms and what supplements should be taken during this period? I noticed I can handle a lot more water when sodium intake is high 8-17mg sodium/day. My diet is currently: bananas, mangos, dates, pineapples, apples, sugar cane, low fat edam/full fat ghouda, coconut oil/butter, lamb, potatos, white rice, milk chocolate. I try to eat 70-100g of protein a day will add gelatin back soon. Fat is 80-100g only 3-5g is pufa keep in mind that i eat over 3000 kcal so fat is approx 30% of my kcals. Carbs are very high over 570g. I wanna slowly add eggs back to the diet. I noticed they give my a stress response when i eat them. What are some recommendations and what are som pufa detox symptoms and when do i get to see benefits. Thank You

 

[johnwester130]

I don't know what the detox symptoms are.

However,
niacinamide,
aspirin,
vitamin E,
may help with the symptoms.

Taurine and zinc may also neutralise PUFA .

 

[Momado965]

I don't know what the detox symptoms are.

However,
niacinamide,
aspirin,
vitamin E,
may help with the symptoms.

Taurine and zinc may also neutralise PUFA .

Thank you Johnwester130. Do you think I'm doing it right? Should I go lower on fat or is what im at ok? Would b3 be ok as in a b complex or should it be taken alone?

 

[Orion]

Since PUFA is a toxin I decided to post my question here. What are some pufa detox/depletion symptoms and what supplements should be taken during this period? I noticed I can handle a lot more water when sodium intake is high 8-17mg sodium/day. My diet is currently: bananas, mangos, dates, pineapples, apples, sugar cane, low fat edam/full fat ghouda, coconut oil/butter, lamb, potatos, white rice, milk chocolate. I try to eat 70-100g of protein a day will add gelatin back soon. Fat is 80-100g only 3-5g is pufa keep in mind that i eat over 3000 kcal so fat is approx 30% of my kcals. Carbs are very high over 570g. I wanna slowly add eggs back to the diet. I noticed they give my a stress response when i eat them. What are some recommendations and what are som pufa detox symptoms and when do i get to see benefits. Thank You

Eating frequently to keep blood sugar stable and stress hormones low will help keep the PUFA un-liberated for fuel. With lots of sugar and quality protein the liver can be energized to excrete the toxic PUFA via urine.

Vitamin E is probably the most important supplement, for when the PUFA is oxidized. High quality vitamin E supp could be helpful, Swansons, Haidut's and HealthNatura would be recommedations.

 

[Momado965]

Eating frequently to keep blood sugar stable and stress hormones low will help keep the PUFA un-liberated for fuel. With lots of sugar and quality protein the liver can be energized to excrete the toxic PUFA via urine.

Vitamin E is probably the most important supplement, for when the PUFA is oxidized. High quality vitamin E supp could be helpful, Swansons, Haidut's and HealthNatura would be recommedations.

Thank you Orion. I ordered vitamin E acetate prior to creating this post. Would Ve acetate be effective or was my money not well spent.

 

[Orion]

vitamin E acetate

I am not familiar with that, maybe someone else will have input.

I think B complexes should be avoided, lots of excipients and some B amounts/ratios are really high.

With B3, aspirin start with very small amounts. I had negative reactions, they are really effective at blocking FFA's, if you are reliant on stress hormones, they can cause big blood sugar drops causing adrenaline/cortisol responses to stabilize blood sugar. They are really helpful once you have good liver sugar storage.

 

[Momado965]

Thank you so much, Orion. Will defenately try aspirin and b3 at some point tho I dont know when to tell if I have good glycogen stores.

 

[Orion]

Thank you so much, Orion. Will defenately try aspirin and b3 at some point tho I dont know when to tell if I have good glycogen stores.

Sleep is your best guide here, being able to sleep deep for 7-8hrs with no wakings, would mean you have about 7-8hrs glycogen storage.

Or having a strong coffee with no jitters afterwards, or being able to go several hours without food.

 

[Momado965]

Thank you so much, Orion, this was very helpful.

 

[Momado965]

At 4200 calories a day my total pufa is 7.8g and linoliec pufa is 6.3g. Linoliec pufa accounts for 81% of my total pufa intake, the rest is dominantly saturated since I use coconut oil or butter for cooking. Do you guys think I'll deplete pufa or will my total intake of 7.8g pufa hinder the process? Thank You

 

[Constatine]

At 4200 calories a day my total pufa is 7.8g and linoliec pufa is 6.3g. Linoliec pufa accounts for 81% of my total pufa intake, the rest is dominantly saturated since I use coconut oil or butter for cooking. Do you guys think I'll deplete pufa or will my total intake of 7.8g pufa hinder the process? Thank You

I think that is too much PUFA for depletion...but it is a small enough quantity for it to not further accumulate. If you are getting the PUFA from honest sources that do have nutritional value but just a little PUFA I wouldn't worry about further reducing the numbers. However if you are being exposed to any vegetable oils or what not then obviously begin to avoid such foods. I've read of a lot of supplements that deplete PUFA from this forum but I forget what they were. I think niacinamide as well as any androgen has anti-PUFA action. Also if you are getting a lot of saturated fats then your PUFA stores should begin to deplete. Mind you I haven't heavily investigated this subject but this is what I remember from my readings.

 

[Momado965]

I think that is too much PUFA for depletion...but it is a small enough quantity for it to not further accumulate. If you are getting the PUFA from honest sources that do have nutritional value but just a little PUFA I wouldn't worry about further reducing the numbers. However if you are being exposed to any vegetable oils or what not then obviously begin to avoid such foods. I've read of a lot of supplements that deplete PUFA from this forum but I forget what they were. I think niacinamide as well as any androgen has anti-PUFA action. Also if you are getting a lot of saturated fats then your PUFA stores should begin to deplete. Mind you I haven't heavily investigated this subject but this is what I remember from my readings.

Thank you for replying, Constatine! I do agree with what you said. I would like to deplete PUFAs asap and would be very happy to read what you think should be done. The problem is if I eat at lower caloric intake I start to urinate a lot. My diet is predominantly SFA coconut oil tho used to be butter, simple sugars(fruits and sucrose), strach in the form of white rice and occational potatoes, protein mostly from dairy source(low fat edam, low fat gouda and milk chocolate) occasional lamb. I eat liver when I crave it.

 

[Constatine]

Thank you for replying, Constatine! I do agree with what you said. I would like to deplete PUFAs asap and would be very happy to read what you think should be done. The problem is if I eat at lower caloric intake I start to urinate a lot. My diet is predominantly SFA coconut oil tho used to be butter, simple sugars(fruits and sucrose), strach in the form of white rice and occational potatoes, protein mostly from dairy source(low fat edam, low fat gouda and milk chocolate) occasional lamb. I eat liver when I crave it.

First off taurine is great for lowering pufa levels in addition to supplements already posted in this thread (It was already mentioned but I just want to stress this one). I think taurine supplementation alone will be enough to deplete pufa assuming your diet avoids it. Your diet seems fine for pufa depletion. I do think you want your androgens tested on this diet though. Coconut oil and rice are pretty major 5-ar inhibitors. This might mean you have low DHT and other 5-ar derived hormones, which would be pretty bad for general well being. If your DHT levels end up being "normal" then it might be due to elevated DHT due to milk consumption. I personally think you should use butter instead of coconut oil and sorghum (kind of hard to get) instead of rice. Sorghum specifically raises 5-ar. The reason this is important is because androgens antagonize pufa to the best of my knowledge.

 

[Agent207]

Coconut oil and rice are pretty major 5-ar inhibitors.

White rice? source to this?

 

[schultz]

White rice? source to this?

I doubt this as well. From what I remember it is brown rice.

 

[Momado965]

First off taurine is great for lowering pufa levels in addition to supplements already posted in this thread (It was already mentioned but I just want to stress this one). I think taurine supplementation alone will be enough to deplete pufa assuming your diet avoids it. Your diet seems fine for pufa depletion. I do think you want your androgens tested on this diet though. Coconut oil and rice are pretty major 5-ar inhibitors. This might mean you have low DHT and other 5-ar derived hormones, which would be pretty bad for general well being. If your DHT levels end up being "normal" then it might be due to elevated DHT due to milk consumption. I personally think you should use butter instead of coconut oil and sorghum (kind of hard to get) instead of rice. Sorghum specifically raises 5-ar. The reason this is important is because androgens antagonize pufa to the best of my knowledge.

Oh wow I didn't know taurine is helpful for pufa depletion! As for rice, I read that its the bran in rice that contributes to "rice's" DHT lowering effects. Since white rice is bran-free it shouldn't have that effect. I read the study and it clearly states rice bran, but thank you Constatine. I'll run a little experiment and see how I feel rice-free. Before replacing my cooking fat source with coconut oil, my total SFA 89 and total fat intake was 156 and pufas were 9g. Now SFAs excluding luric acid is 62g not that far off from before. Total fat now is 100 or so grams and pufas as high as 7.8g whenever some meat is eaten and lower when dairy is exclusively eaten. I will definitely test my androgens as you mentioned and perhaps I'll run an experiment of a total of 6 months swapping butter for coconut oil at the end of the third month then test my androgens and retest them at the sixth month and compare the results. Thank you so much, man.

 

[Momado965]

I doubt this as well. From what I remember it is brown rice.

I agree with you, schults. I remember reading the study. It clearly points out that rice bran is whats causing 5AR suppression.

 

[Agent207]

I see 8-10gr pufa a very reasonable and safe intake. While low pufa diet is tremendously beneficial, I don't buy too much the supposed further benefits going below that low amounts when it comes from raw fresh foods.

Going down to 4gr or less daily I think its more superstition and diet cultish than anything.

 

[Constatine]

Oh wow I didn't know taurine is helpful for pufa depletion! As for rice, I read that its the bran in rice that contributes to "rice's" DHT lowering effects. Since white rice is bran-free it shouldn't have that effect. I read the study and it clearly states rice bran, but thank you Constatine. I'll run a little experiment and see how I feel rice-free. Before replacing my cooking fat source with coconut oil, my total SFA 89 and total fat intake was 156 and pufas were 9g. Now SFAs excluding luric acid is 62g not that far off from before. Total fat now is 100 or so grams and pufas as high as 7.8g whenever some meat is eaten and lower when dairy is exclusively eaten. I will definitely test my androgens as you mentioned and perhaps I'll run an experiment of a total of 6 months swapping butter for coconut oil at the end of the third month then test my androgens and retest them at the sixth month and compare the results. Thank you so much, man.

Interesting... So white rice shouldn't be a 5-ar inhibitor? Time to start eating sushi again

 

[Momado965]

I see 8-10gr pufa a very reasonable and safe intake. While low pufa diet is tremendously beneficial, I don't buy too much the supposed further benefits going below that low amounts when it comes from raw fresh foods.

Going down to 4gr or less daily I think its more superstition and diet cultish than anything.

Yup I agree totally with you, Agent207. When I tried to control it I felt deprived for some reason. It felt like dieting. I'm convinced now that Ad libitum is the way to go. My total pufa fluctuates between 6.5g to 7.8ishg; 18;2 linoliec is about 80% of total pufa. Something in the back of my head tells me I need to keep it low. Major pufa contributors to my diet are chocolate, lamb liver, white rice (0.7mg per 700g cooked). Thank you so much for your input.