Pu-erh Tea, What's The Verdict?

[Aleeri]

In terms of Peat friendly foods, tea has always seemed to be a problematic one that is worshipped in the world of natural health, but according to Peat values looks to have a bunch of negatives such as fluoride and estrogenic flavanoids.

But what about Pu -erh tea? Which is basically a fermented black tea.

I know Peat said the following about it in email exchanges but did not elaborate further as to why:

The addition of lemon or milk to tea reduces the reactivity of the tannins. In recent years, the tea industry has very commonly been adulterating the product. Pu erh is one that still seems to be o.k.

EGCG, total catechins and the alike seems to be broken down in Pu erh tea from the fermentation, basically forming theabrownin: Effects of enzymatic action on the formation of theabrownin during solid state fermentation of Pu-erh tea. - PubMed - NCBI

Yet retains the caffeine: Factors affecting the levels of tea polyphenols and caffeine in tea leaves. - PubMed - NCBI

There are some interesting properties to Pu erh such as inhibiting nitric oxide:
Pu-erh Tea Reduces Nitric Oxide Levels in Rats by Inhibiting Inducible Nitric Oxide Synthase Expression through Toll-Like Receptor 4
Protective effects of pu-erh tea on LDL oxidation and nitric oxide generation in macrophage cells - ScienceDirect

Beneficial effects on gastric function and bowel movement:
Component analysis of Pu-erh and its anti-constipation effects
Protective effect of Pu-erh tea extracts against ethanol-induced gastric mucosal damage in rats

A lipid-lowering effect in hyperlipidemic rats:
Effects of theabrownin from pu-erh tea on the metabolism of serum lipids in rats: mechanism of action. - PubMed - NCBI

Allergy:
https://genomediscovery.org/2017/04...3-rα1-and-eotaxin-expression-among-others-in/

Metabolic effects:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24399768
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4818050/
https://www.researchgate.net/public...anisms_of_weight-cutting_effect_in_Pu-erh_tea
http://pubs.sciepub.com/jfnr/2/12/22/index.html

Above is just a small assortment of what I read today. There is also a whole bunch of anti-cancer research but what I am more interested in discussing is do you guys think the benefits outweigh the negatives of this tea?

It does seem to contain amounts of kaempferol and quercetin still which is considered estrogenic here right?
https://europepmc.org/abstract/med/23947136

For example, the flavonoids, naringenin, quercetin and kaempherol (kaempherol is an antioxidant, a phytoestrogen, and a mutagen) modify the metabolism of estradiol, causing increased bioavailability of both estrone and estradiol. (W. Schubert, et al., "Inhibition of 17-beta-estradiol metabolism by grapefruit juice in ovariectomized women," Maturitas (Ireland) 30(2-3), 155-163, 1994.)

Hesperidin and naringenin are found in orange juice too which is consumed a ton here so why are people not weary of them too same as quercetin for example?

Also, cacao contains quercetin but is considered a Peaty food, recommended since it inhibits iron same as coffee but is also a good magnesium and saturated fat source.

Do the estrogenic flavanoids really matter that much or is flouride the only real threat with Pu erh tea?

 

[ecstatichamster]

Isn’t mold an issue? I’ve wondered about this.

 

[dbh25]

Pu erh is my favorite. I drink it black.

 

[Aleeri]

Isn’t mold an issue? I’ve wondered about this.

It can but a proper manufactured pu erh tea can also contain penicillin and other beneficial microorganisms. Which makes it Peaty too.

I am very interested in it if it could potentially mean a natural daily source of caffeine, theanine and penicillin, a pretty epic combination in one drink.

The Microbiome and Metabolites in Fermented Pu-erh Tea as Revealed by High-Throughput Sequencing and Quantitative Multiplex Metabolite Analysis

Aspergillus acidus from Puerh tea and black tea does not produce ochratoxin A and fumonisin B2. - PubMed - NCBI

http://www.ifrj.upm.edu.my/22 (03) 2015/(50).pdf

 

[PowertothePeatple]

I think that Pu-erh might be kind of high in fluoride. But if you are not drinking too much it is probably not a big deal. But I would hesitate to drink a lot of it.
Prevalence of Brick Tea-Type Fluorosis in the Tibet Autonomous Region

 

[paymanz]

Tea is not ideal beverage in peat view.he said pu erh is ok! But he admires coffee!

Especially if you drink lots of tea ,it becomes a bit irritating to digestive system. Those tannines ,phenoles.

Black tea is a bit estrogenic, green tea a bit anti thyroid.

I loved tea because of theanine/manganese ,but my digestion is more agree with coffee , apparently.

As long as tea is enjoyable for me i drink it, at least to get some manganese if i i dont have any other manganese rich food in a period.


Also i want add that adding a little bit lemon juice or dried lemon or milk to my tea really offsets some of bad effects it has on my digestion.

 

[paymanz]

Isn’t mold an issue? I’ve wondered about this.

Good question ,i wondering why ray suggested this type of fermented tea.

Chris masterjohn is his podcast also mentioned fermented food often is a cause of allergies.


Good points and questions @Aleeri

 

[Elephanto]

Seems to contain the Candida strain. Another fermented beverage that usually contains it is Kombucha.

Ten microbial isolates representing 6 species were recovered from a solid-state fermentation of a Pu-erh type tea. The isolates were Aspergillus tubingensis, Aspergillus marvanovae, Rhizomucor pusillus, Rhizomucor tauricus, Aspergillus fumigatus, and Candida mogii.

Fungal isolates from a Pu-erh type tea fermentation and their ability to convert tea polyphenols to theabrownins. - PubMed - NCBI

 

[ecstatichamster]

Good question ,i wondering why ray suggested this type of fermented tea.

Chris masterjohn is his podcast also mentioned fermented food often is a cause of allergies.


Good points and questions @Aleeri

Dr. Peat says this all the time. But I'm not sure I have heard of anyone with an allergy to tea. Puerhh is moldy. I've bought it, I've used a lot of it. I no longer consume it. I just think it is suspect. And I don't drink much tea anymore anyway.

 

[Elephanto]

natural daily source of penicillin

Thank you for mentioning it as I have this allergy. I wonder why it's not widely known to avoid it in people with this allergy or if it causes serious reactions.

 

[Aleeri]

I wanna bump this conversation again since it became more relevant with COVID-19: Inhibition of SARS-CoV 3C-like Protease Activity by Theaflavin-3,3′-digallate (TF3)

Above study shows Puerh tea (and black tea) antiviral effects against SARS-CoV independent of caffeine and other EGCG type flavonoids.

Looks like this has some merit in terms of unique benefits compared to green teas and coffee?

 

[Aleeri]

Antiviral activity of green tea and black tea polyphenols in prophylaxis and treatment of COVID-19: A review

 

[Aleeri]

Also adding to this further, I’ve had an interest in puerh tea specifically because it did not seem to be a COMT inhibitor same as green tea is regarded.

COMT is also the enzyme that deactivate estrogens among other things so a slower enzyme makes you more susceptible to that (although it also increases dopamine).

However, I stumbled upon this the other day too that clearly proves EGCG in tea does not inhibit COMT, it even increased its enzymatic activity: https://www.researchgate.net/public...es_of_epigallocatechin-3-gallate_EGCG_in_vivo

Hence, I would speculate that the dopamine effects are mostly from the caffeine content and that it does to affect the breakdown of estrogen.

Actually, the above would go more in line with some people using green tea for estrogen dominance as it would increase the activity of the COMT enzyme and help detox estrogens. Confusing subject this.

 

[TheBeard]

***** up your teeth.
Look at Chinese who down gallons of it a day, they all have this in common.

 

[Aleeri]

***** up your teeth.
Look at Chinese who down gallons of it a day, they all have this in common.

Not really concerned, very few things are healthy in excess like that. Coffee has stained my teeth lots as well, gone through 2 phases of whitening already in the last 10 years.

 

[Aleeri]

Another interesting find: The Microbiome and Metabolites in Fermented Pu-erh Tea as Revealed by High-Throughput Sequencing and Quantitative Multiplex Metabolite Analysis

Emodin was also found as a compound created through the fermentation. Might be too low amounts but Puerh tea is praised for its effects on digestion, something Cascara Sagrada also is containing Emodin.

Patulin and asperglaucide in largest amounts. Patulin is no good as it is toxic, but then there is also this:

The discrepancy between our finding of high patulin concentration and the healthy reputation enjoyed by Pu-erh may be explained by the modulation of patulin toxicity through the action of green tea polyphenols [77].


Asperglaucide is also known as Aurantiamide.


Aurantiamide Acetate from Baphicacanthus cusia root exhibits Anti-Inflammatory and Anti-viral Effects via inhibition of the NF-κB Signaling Pathway in Influenza A virus-infected Cells
https://www.researchgate.net/public...g_Pathway_in_Influenza_A_virus-infected_Cells

Aurantiamide Acetate, a Selective Cathepsin Inhibitor, Produced by Aspergillus penicilloides
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1271/bbb.65.1195

 

[ddjd]

anyone tried brad marshalls product ??

Pu-Erh Tea Extract. 60% Theabrownin. 500 mg. 60 Capsules.​

Theabrownin. 500 mg. 60 Capsules.

Pu-Erh tea is known for it's health giving benefits. This extract is 60% theabrownin, the compound that has proven to be the active component of the tea. In recent years theabrownin has been shown to: Reverse deleterious effects of a Western diet on bile acid metabolism while preventing weight...

fire-in-a-bottle.myshopify.com

 

[cremes]

anyone tried brad marshalls product ??

Pu-Erh Tea Extract. 60% Theabrownin. 500 mg. 60 Capsules.​

Theabrownin. 500 mg. 60 Capsules.

Pu-Erh tea is known for it's health giving benefits. This extract is 60% theabrownin, the compound that has proven to be the active component of the tea. In recent years theabrownin has been shown to: Reverse deleterious effects of a Western diet on bile acid metabolism while preventing weight...

fire-in-a-bottle.myshopify.com

I've thought about it but I'll admit to buying one or two of his other offerings and they just didn't do the trick for me. I've been drinking puerh tea off and on for years anyway and never noticed any particular weight management improvement from it.

That said, I like this "instant" variety of the tea. It's cheap, easy to make, etc.

Amazon product ASIN B06XW84324View: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XW84324?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details